# 9/11 Conspiracy Thread (There can be only one!)

Discussion in 'Pseudoscience Archive' started by Stryder, Aug 3, 2007.

Not open for further replies.
1. ### shaman_Registered Senior Member

Messages:
1,467
Check my post for the edit I just added.

Messages:
496

5. ### Tony SzambotiRegistered Senior Member

Messages:
634
Take a good hard look at this video

Below is a link to a video by David Chandler, the physics teacher who forced the NIST to admit that WTC 7 was in freefall for 100 feet right after it started to collapse. In this video, which was just released, Chandler shows that there is no deceleration of the North Tower upper block, which means there was no impact and no mechanism for it to overload the lower section of the tower.

7. ### FDNY AuxRegistered Member

Messages:
60
"I wonered if the Vice President was in charge. Dick Cheney was President Fords Chief of Staff when I first served in the Justice Department; I knew him and had a great confidence in him, so I was relieved to hear a women on the telephone say, Mr Mayor, the Vice President will be on the line." "My intention was to speak to the Vice president and then immediately relkay what he told me to the people of New York through the press, who were being assembled outside be memebers of Sunnys' staff. Within a second or two, the line went dead. For the moment, re-establishing that phone link tookup all my attention. So it took some time for me to realize why the phone line was disconnected. " "A few minutes after ten o'clock, we felt and heard a thunderous roar but did not know what had actually occured. Some thought the sound was a new attack, and THE WAY THE GROUND SHOOK (emf-Mine) made it feel like that. I was still on the telephone, hoping to be reconnected, when Joe Esposito yelled, "Its comming Down-everybody down!" "Since I was still in a back cubicle trying to speak to the Vice President, I didn't hit the deck. In fact, when I heard the words "Tower" and "Down", I imagined that the radio tower atop the World Trade center had fallen off."

Page 11Rudolph W. GulianiLEADERSHIP with Ken Kurson Miramax books 2002

8. ### FDNY AuxRegistered Member

Messages:
60
The Enemies of Order Strategy: "Managed Conflict"
And how does this Freemasonic sect push forward their pre-planned New World Order agenda ... how does it work? By using "managed conflict" or "crisis management" a crisis or problem is produced. Then, the crisis is "managed" and the problem is "solved" with an outcome that is invariably favorable to the goals and agendas of the Judeo-Masonic Global Power Elite.

A Terror-ible Crisis/Problem
is Produced
Then "Heroically" Managed/Solved
by Its Creators

Before The World's (Media) Stage
Picture on right: (from left to right), NY Governor George Pataki, NYC Mayor Rudolph Giuliani
and US Senator (NY) Hillary Rodman Clinton, September 2001 A.D. (New York City)
"We were operating out of there when we were told that the World Trade Center was gonna collapse in about ten to fifteen minutes."
-Words of New York Mayor Rudolph Giuliani in a live "at the scene" aired telephone interview with ABC's Peter Jennings on 09/11/01.

Mayor Giuliani admits in a live interview with Peter Jennings that he got warning that the South Tower was about to collapse.

Why is this important?

No steel framed building had ever collapsed from fire damage before in history. The event was unprecedented. To know the building was about to collapse would require inside knowledge of 'the 9/11 script' and how it was supposed to unfold on that fateful day. Remember, right before the building collapsed, firefighters (within the World Trade City Tower) reported *minimal fires in the (WTC Tower) which they could quickly and easily extinguish. *(Documented FDNY Firefighters Tapes)

Why didn't the firemen who were rushing into the building get the same warning?
Why didn't the brave *firemen and rescue workers who were rushing into the building get the same warning? Even if the warning was only communicated minutes before the collapse, countless lives could have been saved. Consider the amount of people on the lower floors, in the lobby and immediately outside that could have rushed to safety in those few minutes.

*NYC Firemen have to be and are arguably the most professional, highly trained firefighters in the world. They know when a hazardous situation (fire) is safe to be around or not. There are many accounts of NYC firefighters on September 11th describing seeing, hearing, or feeling the explosions. Here are a few firefighters recalling Detonations in the South WTC Tower, in a discussion back at the firehouse: (note: emphasis underlining/bold added by webmaster)

Eyewitness accounts (on right) from these experienced NYC Fireman who were almost killed when the South WTC Tower "Collapsed" Fireman2: We made it outside, we made it about a block.
Fireman1: We made it at least 2 blocks.
Fireman2: 2 blocks.
Fireman1: and we started runnin'
Fireman2: poch-poch-poch-poch-poch-poch-poch
Fireman1: Floor by floor it started poppin' out ..
Fireman2: It was as if as if they had detonated, det..
Fireman1: yea detonated yea
Fireman2: as if they had planned to take down a building, boom-boom-boom-boom-boom-boom-boom-boom ...

Pictures of smoke plumes (see arrows) from explosives detonating within WTC 2, below the falling top portion of steel building debris
The best (honest) scientists worldwide have shown that the top portions of the Main WTC buildings (1 & 2) both fell significantly faster than the laws of gravity allow - if the inner structural integrity (tonnage of concrete flooring) of both buildings were normally intact. The only way the top portions and the rest of the buildings mass, could have fallen faster than the laws of nature to the ground, is if the reinforced concrete floors WITHIN the Twin Towers gave no resistance i.e. were instantly destroyed/pulverized. (click the image above to enlarge)

The company named Controlled Demolition Inc., the market leader in the blow up and removal of multi-floor buildings, was chosen to remove the rubble from the WTC buildings. (Such as the twisted steel columns at the base of the structures) This carefully collected material (remember the police guards always surrounding the site for months?) was then ordered to be sent promptly to China where it was melted.

View the video interview of NYC Fireman Joe Casaliggi (Engine 7) - who describes the "remains" of the contents of the Twin Towers.

After the WTC buildings were professionally demolished with high-power explosives, massive clouds of very fine
poulverized concrete and asbestos dust, arose and settled - blanketing NYC on 09/11/01 like a Winter snow storm.

9. ### Tony SzambotiRegistered Senior Member

Messages:
634

Shaman, you seem to have forgotten to answer this question which was in the same post as all the other questions you replied to above

Please provide a mechanism to have the structure collapse without a deceleration of the upper block, because there isn't one. This fact will become very public very soon.

It is now public. Did you watch David Chandler's new video on the collapse of the North tower? If not it is here http://www.youtube.com:80/watch?v=xG2y50Wyys4 and only about 3 minutes long.

By the way, asking for another example of a building having a 767 smash into it and implying it had to be the cause of collapse is a Non sequitur.

10. ### scott3xBannedBanned

Messages:
3,785
I responded to your post over in the WTC collapses thread here.

11. ### FDNY AuxRegistered Member

Messages:
60
LOL, Have you ever seen something so silly?

"I made the decision that we would work at the site all night, twenty four hous a day. I knew the odds of anyone surviving under the rubble would diminish the longer we waited, and therefore wanted to light the whole area so work at the site could continue, rather than stopping at eight at night and resuming at eight in the morning. Those twelve hour of activity could be critical; but the site was gigantic."

Page 24

Rudolph W Guiliani (LEADERSHIP with Ken Kurson)

12. ### FDNY AuxRegistered Member

Messages:
60
FLASHBACK - Bush Jokes About Search for WMD, But It's No Laughing Matter for Critics
Tags:
IRAQ

President George Bush sparked a political firestorm yesterday after making what many judged a tasteless and ill-judged joke about the failure to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.He narrated a slide show, described as the White House election year album, making hay of the administration' s reputation for secrecy and strained relations with European allies. But it was the joke about the war in Iraq that drew attacks.
--- On Tue, 1/13/09, NYC Nemesis Nemisis <nyccrashcrew@ yahoo.com> wrote:

From: NYC Nemesis Nemisis <nyccrashcrew@ yahoo.com>
Subject: [v911t] Bush: "We had FUN"
To: v911t@yahoogroups. com
Date: Tuesday, January 13, 2009, 12:22 PM

9/11, two wars, Katrina: 'We had fun', says Bush
• President emotional but ill at ease in 'exit interview'
• European hostility still rankles, he tells media
The Guardian, Tuesday 13 January 2009
Article history

Messages:
16,931
14. ### John99BannedBanned

Messages:
22,046
He did have a rough time though. The first WTC attack under Clinton ('93) was not successful and not much was done. Bush did not have much time in office before the attacks that did take the buildings out plus Katrina and other big storms.

Clinton had the Internet boom which he did nothing to bring about but was at the right place at the right time and by the time Bush became Pres. it had pretty much run it's course.

I didnt vote for Bush but facts are facts.

15. ### FDNY AuxRegistered Member

Messages:
60
9/11

Foreign Policy Journal Exclusive!

Senior Corporate Executives Warned to Leave N.Y. on 9/11: Source
November 3, 2008

by Jeremy R. Hammond

Foreign Policy Journal has learned that senior executives of a major U.S. international corporation may have been warned to leave New York on September 11, 2001.

According to an inside source, one of the senior executives of the corporation told him beforehand that “something big” was going to occur and so other corporate executives would be travelling out of New York.

The source, who spoke to the Journal on the condition of anonymity, worked at a European branch of the media giant Warner Bros. He served as the number two under the managing director of that office, a man with whom he had developed a close personal friendship. His boss was also friends with one of the senior executives at the head office in Los Angeles. According to the source, he had been told by his director that the executive in L.A. had formerly worked for the CIA and still kept in touch with the agency.

It is not an uncommon practice for the CIA to recruit business executives, particularly individuals who do a lot of international travelling and might be able to use their business contacts to gather information.

The CIA is also known to have recruited journalists and media executives. According to Carl Bernstein, the former Washington Post reporter who worked with Bob Woodward breaking open the Watergate story during the Nixon administration, executives who lent their cooperation to the CIA included Henry Luce of Time Inc., founder of Time and Life magazines. C.D. Jackson, a Time Inc. vice-president and publisher of Life magazine until his death in 1964, approved arrangements to provide the CIA with cover under Time-Life, according to an article Bernstein wrote for Rolling Stone magazine in 1977.

When the managing director of the overseas Warner Bros. office passed away, the individual who spoke with the Journal was contacted by the senior executive from L.A. about the plans for the memorial service. Senior executives from the company would attend, including from the Warner Bros. parent corporation, Time Warner, headquartered in New York.

When he answered that one of the potential dates for the service was September 11, he was told that would be no good because “something big is happening that day” and the top executives from the New York office would all be travelling out of the city.

When asked further about this big event, the executive replied that it was a confidential matter and disclosed no further details, except to say that it was “not corporate”.

The source told the Journal, “I had no reason to think that the ‘event’ could be anything more than perhaps a junket, an out of town think tank exercise or whatever – I remember that these possibilities ran through my mind.”

But after 9/11, thinking back upon the conversation, he grew more curious and tried to ascertain where the board members had been that day. They had indeed been out of New York, he says, travelling not to one location, but each to their own destination. Destinations included overseas locations such as Paris, London, and Amsterdam.

Foreign Policy Journal has not been able to verify the location of individuals on 9/11 or other aspects of the story concerning any potential warning received or given by any Time Warner executives, but did confirm the source’s position at the foreign branch office, the name and position of that office’s managing director, and the name and position of the senior executive from the Los Angeles office.

There have been numerous other indications that individuals within the U.S. had foreknowledge of the 9/11 attacks.

One such indication was the evidence of insider trading in the days just prior. Short selling and trading in put options, which are essentially bets that stock will drop, skyrocketed over a period of days before 9/11 only in companies that were directly affected.

For instance, purchases were made on 4,744 put options for United Airlines between September 6 and 7. On September 10, purchases were placed on 4,516 put options for American Airlines. United and American were the two airlines that had planes hijacked and destroyed in the attacks. There was no similarly unusual trading in other airlines.

Other companies directly affected also experienced a spike in the purchase of put options, such as Morgan Stanley Dean Witter and Merril Lynch, both of which had offices in the World Trade Center.

Numerous countries around the world, including the U.S., Japan, Germany, the U.K., France, Luxembourg, Hong Kong, Switzerland, and Spain, opened investigations into what had apparently been insider trading based on foreknowledge of the attacks.

Together, these purchases were worth millions. Yet with the reports of insider trading and foreknowledge circulating in the media, whoever was responsible chose not to collect the money.

One of the banks involved in the purchases was Alex Brown, the U.S. branch of the German Deutsche Bank, which was headed until 1998 by A.B. “Buzzy” Krongard. He afterwards joined the CIA, and was Executive Director of the agency at the time of the attacks.

Trading is monitored through special software in real time by the CIA, so the agency would have been aware of the suspicious activity in the days just prior to the attacks.

Despite all this, the FBI announced that its own investigation had turned up no evidence that anyone had tried to profit from inside knowledge that the attacks would occur.

According to the 9/11 Commission Report, which echoed the conclusion of the FBI, 95 percent of the purchases on United and American Airlines shares on September 6 and 10, respectively, were made by a single U.S. based institutional investor.

Robert Baer is a former CIA case officer and author of “Sleeping with the Devil” and “See No Evil”, which served as the basis for the film “Syriana” starring George Clooney. Baer told Stewart Howe and Jeremy Rothe-Kushel of the L.A. branch of the organization We Are Change, “I know the guy that went into his broker in San Diego and said ‘cash me out, it’s going down tomorrow.’” Baer added that “his brother worked at the White House.”

Baer also indicated that the 9/11 Commission Report had been a cover-up of what really happened and questioned why certain other oddities about 9/11 had not been investigated, such as “the famous white van”, which he said was “an intriguing story” that “deserves a book”.

He was referring to the case of the five Israelis who were witnessed on 9/11 celebrating beside their white van at the sight of the smoking towers from a parking lot in New Jersey. They were later arrested and detained. Upon arrest, the driver of the van told the arresting officers, “We are Israeli. We are not your problem. Your problems are our problems. The Palestinians are the problem.”

The van was registered to an Israeli-owned company called Urban Moving Systems, whose owner immediately closed shop and fled to Israel. At least two of the five Israelis witnessed videotaping and celebrating the attacks were learned to be operatives of Mossad, the Israeli intelligence agency.

In other reporting that may or may not have been related to the five Israelis with the white van, it became known publicly that an enormous Israeli spy ring had been uncovered operating within the United States.

Reports of investigations into Israeli spying within the U.S. had emerged early in 2001. After 9/11, Fox News reported that according to investigators the Israeli intelligence operatives of a large spy ring may have gathered information in advance about the attacks of 9/11, but that the evidence for this was classified.

As part of the operation, Israelis posed as art students. Under the guise of selling art, they targeted government officials at their offices or homes, including members of the military, the DEA, the FBI, and other law enforcement and intelligence personnel.

One group of the Israeli “art students” lived at 4220 Sheridan St. in Hollywood, Florida, just down the street from the 3389 address where Mohammed Atta and three of the other 9/11 hijackers lived.

In addition, almost all the call records and billing for U.S. phone companies is handled by an Israeli-based private communications company called Amdocs Ltd. The NSA had warned other U.S. intelligence and law-enforcement agencies about the potential security breaches that this situation might make possible.

There was some evidence that wiretaps were indeed being compromised. Law enforcement officials observed that suspects under surveillance suspiciously changed their behavior after wiretaps began, according to officials who spoke to Fox News.

It’s known that the DEA had also been investigating Israeli organized crime involved the multi-billion dollar ecstasy trade.

The FBI had also been investigating Amdocs and there were fears that even the telephone lines in the White House, which were installed by Bell Atlantic and Amdocs in 1997, might have been compromised.

According to a leaked DEA report from that agency’s investigation into the Israeli spy ring, one of the “art students” who was arrested was held on a $10,000 bond that was placed by an Israeli man named Ophir Baer who was in the U.S. under employment by Amdocs. Another Israeli company, Comverse Infosys, was responsible for providing wiretapping for U.S. law enforcement. But, again, there was a fear among U.S. agencies that the wiretaps themselves could be intercepted by unauthorized parties through a back door in the Comverse system. Adding to these fears was the fact that Comverse was reimbursed for up to half of its research and development costs by the Israeli Ministry of Industry and Trade. Comverse was partnered with an Israeli messaging service company called Odigo. The Israeli paper Haaretz reported that workers at Odigo, which had offices near the World Trade Center, had received warnings on the morning of September 11 of an impending attack. The Washington Post confirmed that two employees of Odigo had “received text messages warning of an attack on the World Trade Center two hours before terrorists crashed planes into the New York landmarks.” There is no direct evidence that the Israeli government or any Israeli nationals were involved in 9/11. In fact, Mossad had reportedly warned the U.S. intelligence community of an impending attack, including the potential that it might come in the form of hijackings. The possibility remains that Israeli intelligence came across the information leading to its warnings to the U.S. during the course of the extensive operation that was broken up in 2001. There have also been several other incidents possibly related to the apparent insider trading before 9/11. In one case, a German firm, Convar, was hired to attempt to retrieve data from the hard drives of computers destroyed as a result of the attacks on the World Trade Center. In doing so, it was discovered that there had been transactions of unusually large sums of money through some systems in the WTC, leading to the suspicion that someone with insider knowledge had illegally transferred as much as$100 million through the system as the attacks unfolded.

In May 2002, the FBI raided the home of Amr Ibrahim Elgindy, who was held on charges of racketeering, extortion, and obstruction of justice. He was later convicted. According to the indictment, Elgindy had led a ring of traders that included two FBI agents, Jeffrey A. Royer and Lynn Wingate, who used their access to confidential databases to give Elgindy inside information about publicly traded companies. The prosecutor in his case said there were indications he might have had foreknowledge of the attacks, since he had predicted a huge drop in the market and ordered the sale of $300,000 worth of stock in his children’s trust fund on September 10. The compelling evidence of insider foreknowledge of the 9/11 attacks has been largely dismissed. This is perhaps most evident by the conclusions of the 9/11 Commission report itself, which also stated that there was no evidence of any involvement by any foreign government or government official and that the question of who financed the attacks is “of little practical significance”, despite reports that Mahmud Ahmed, the head of Pakistan’s Inter-Service Intelligence agency, or ISI, had been responsible for authorizing the transfer of$100,000 to hijacker Mohammed Atta. This information was received by the Commission.

Bob Graham, who co-chaired the 9/11 Joint Inquiry with Porter Goss, has also said there is evidence of the involvement of a foreign government. The 9/11 Commission made no attempt to explain or reconcile the disparity between its conclusions and those of Graham or the reports of the ISI chief’s involvement.

In another strange twist, Graham and Goss were having breakfast in Washington with General Ahmed on the morning of September 11 as the planes struck the towers. Ahmed was in Washington visiting his counterpart at the CIA, George Tenet, as well as a number of other high-level officials. Both Graham and Goss had also travelled to Pakistan where they met with the ISI chief just a couple weeks before Ahmed’s reciprocal visit.

Goss was later appointed Director of Central Intelligence.

16. ### FDNY AuxRegistered Member

Messages:
60
Subject: Warner Bros Warned Its Top Execs to Avoid NY on 9/11

Senior Corporate Executives Warned to Leave N.Y. on 9/11: Source

November 3, 2008

by Jeremy R. Hammond

http://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/articles/2008/11/03/senior_executives_warned_911.htm

Foreign Policy Journal has learned that senior executives of a major U.S. international corporation may have been warned to leave New York on September 11, 2001.

According to an inside source, one of the senior executives of the corporation told him beforehand that “something big” was going to occur and so other corporate executives would be travelling out of New York.

The source, who spoke to the Journal on the condition of anonymity, worked at a European branch of the media giant Warner Bros. He served as the number two under the managing director of that office, a man with whom he had developed a close personal friendship. His boss was also friends with one of the senior executives at the head office in Los Angeles. According to the source, he had been told by his director that the [Warners] exec in L.A. had formerly worked for the CIA and still kept in touch with the agency.

It is not an uncommon practice for the CIA to recruit business executives, particularly individuals who do a lot of international travelling and might be able to use their business contacts to gather information.

The CIA is also known to have recruited journalists and media executives. According to Carl Bernstein, the former Washington Post reporter who worked with Bob Woodward breaking open the Watergate story during the Nixon administration, executives who lent their cooperation to the CIA included Henry Luce of Time Inc., founder of Time and Life magazines. C.D. Jackson, a Time Inc. vice-president and publisher of Life magazine until his death in 1964, approved arrangements to provide the CIA with cover under Time-Life, according to an article Bernstein wrote for Rolling Stone magazine in 1977.

When the managing director of the overseas Warner Bros. office passed away, the individual who spoke with the Journal was contacted by the senior executive from L.A. about the plans for the memorial service. Senior executives from the company would attend, including from the Warner Bros. parent corporation, Time Warner, headquartered in New York.

When he answered that one of the potential dates for the service was September 11, he was told that would be no good because “something big is happening that day” and the top executives from the New York office would all be travelling out of the city.

When asked further about this big event, the executive replied that it was a confidential matter and disclosed no further details, except to say that it was “not corporate”.

The source told the Journal, “I had no reason to think that the ‘event’ could be anything more than perhaps a junket, an out of town think tank exercise or whatever – I remember that these possibilities ran through my mind.”

But after 9/11, thinking back upon the conversation, he grew more curious and tried to ascertain where the board members had been that day. They had indeed been out of New York, he says, travelling not to one location, but each to their own destination. Destinations included overseas locations such as Paris, London, and Amsterdam.

Foreign Policy Journal has not been able to verify the location of individuals on 9/11 or other aspects of the story concerning any potential warning received or given by any Time Warner executives, but did confirm the source’s position at the foreign branch office, the name and position of that office’s managing director, and the name and position of the senior executive from the Los Angeles office.

There have been numerous other indications that individuals within the U.S. had foreknowledge of the 9/11 attacks.

One such indication was the evidence of insider trading in the days just prior. Short selling and trading in put options, which are essentially bets that stock will drop, skyrocketed over a period of days before 9/11 only in companies that were directly affected.

For instance, purchases were made on 4,744 put options for United Airlines between September 6 and 7. On September 10, purchases were placed on 4,516 put options for American Airlines. United and American were the two airlines that had planes hijacked and destroyed in the attacks. There was no similarly unusual trading in other airlines.

Other companies directly affected also experienced a spike in the purchase of put options, such as Morgan Stanley Dean Witter and Merril Lynch, both of which had offices in the World Trade Center.

Numerous countries around the world, including the U.S., Japan, Germany, the U.K., France, Luxembourg, Hong Kong, Switzerland, and Spain, opened investigations into what had apparently been insider trading based on foreknowledge of the attacks.

Together, these purchases were worth millions. Yet with the reports of insider trading and foreknowledge circulating in the media, whoever was responsible chose not to collect the money.

One of the banks involved in the purchases was Alex Brown, the U.S. branch of the German Deutsche Bank, which was headed until 1998 by A.B. “Buzzy” Krongard. He afterwards joined the CIA, and was Executive Director of the agency at the time of the attacks.

Trading is monitored through special software in real time by the CIA, so the agency would have been aware of the suspicious activity in the days just prior to the attacks.

Despite all this, the FBI announced that its own investigation had turned up no evidence that anyone had tried to profit from inside knowledge that the attacks would occur.

According to the 9/11 Commission Report, which echoed the conclusion of the FBI, 95 percent of the purchases on United and American Airlines shares on September 6 and 10, respectively, were made by a single U.S. based institutional investor.

Robert Baer is a former CIA case officer and author of “Sleeping with the Devil” and “See No Evil”, which served as the basis for the film “Syriana” starring George Clooney. Baer told Stewart Howe and Jeremy Rothe-Kushel of the L.A. branch of the organization We Are Change, “I know the guy that went into his broker in San Diego and said ‘cash me out, it’s going down tomorrow.’” Baer added that “his brother worked at the White House.”

Baer also indicated that the 9/11 Commission Report had been a cover- up of what really happened and questioned why certain other oddities about 9/11 had not been investigated, such as “the famous white van”, which he said was “an intriguing story” that “deserves a book”.

He was referring to the case of the five Israelis who were witnessed on 9/11 celebrating beside their white van at the sight of the smoking towers from a parking lot in New Jersey. They were later arrested and detained. Upon arrest, the driver of the van told the arresting officers, “We are Israeli. We are not your problem. Your problems are our problems. The Palestinians are the problem.”

The van was registered to an Israeli-owned company called Urban Moving Systems, whose owner immediately closed shop and fled to Israel. At least two of the five Israelis witnessed videotaping and celebrating the attacks were learned to be operatives of Mossad, the Israeli intelligence agency.

In other reporting that may or may not have been related to the five Israelis with the white van, it became known publicly that an enormous Israeli spy ring had been uncovered operating within the United States.

Reports of investigations into Israeli spying within the U.S. had emerged early in 2001. After 9/11, Fox News reported that according to investigators the Israeli intelligence operatives of a large spy ring may have gathered information in advance about the attacks of 9/11, but that the evidence for this was classified.

As part of the operation, Israelis posed as art students. Under the guise of selling art, they targeted government officials at their offices or homes, including members of the military, the DEA, the FBI, and other law enforcement and intelligence personnel.

One group of the Israeli “art students” lived at 4220 Sheridan St. in Hollywood, Florida, just down the street from the 3389 address where Mohammed Atta and three of the other 9/11 hijackers lived.

In addition, almost all the call records and billing for U.S. phone companies is handled by an Israeli-based private communications company called Amdocs Ltd. The NSA had warned other U.S. intelligence and law-enforcement agencies about the potential security breaches that this situation might make possible.

There was some evidence that wiretaps were indeed being compromised. Law enforcement officials observed that suspects under surveillance suspiciously changed their behavior after wiretaps began, according to officials who spoke to Fox News.

It’s known that the DEA had also been investigating Israeli organized crime involved the multi-billion dollar ecstasy trade.

The FBI had also been investigating Amdocs and there were fears that even the telephone lines in the White House, which were installed by Bell Atlantic and Amdocs in 1997, might have been compromised.

According to a leaked DEA report from that agency’s investigation into the Israeli spy ring, one of the “art students” who was arrested was held on a $10,000 bond that was placed by an Israeli man named Ophir Baer who was in the U.S. under employment by Amdocs. Another Israeli company, Comverse Infosys, was responsible for providing wiretapping for U.S. law enforcement. But, again, there was a fear among U.S. agencies that the wiretaps themselves could be intercepted by unauthorized parties through a back door in the Comverse system. Adding to these fears was the fact that Comverse was reimbursed for up to half of its research and development costs by the Israeli Ministry of Industry and Trade. Comverse was partnered with an Israeli messaging service company called Odigo. The Israeli paper Haaretz reported that workers at Odigo, which had offices near the World Trade Center, had received warnings on the morning of September 11 of an impending attack. The Washington Post confirmed that two employees of Odigo had “received text messages warning of an attack on the World Trade Center two hours before terrorists crashed planes into the New York landmarks.” There is no direct evidence that the Israeli government or any Israeli nationals were involved in 9/11. In fact, Mossad had reportedly warned the U.S. intelligence community of an impending attack, including the potential that it might come in the form of hijackings. The possibility remains that Israeli intelligence came across the information leading to its warnings to the U.S. during the course of the extensive operation that was broken up in 2001. There have also been several other incidents possibly related to the apparent insider trading before 9/11. In one case, a German firm, Convar, was hired to attempt to retrieve data from the hard drives of computers destroyed as a result of the attacks on the World Trade Center. In doing so, it was discovered that there had been transactions of unusually large sums of money through some systems in the WTC, leading to the suspicion that someone with insider knowledge had illegally transferred as much as$100 million through the system as the attacks unfolded.

In May 2002, the FBI raided the home of Amr Ibrahim Elgindy, who was held on charges of racketeering, extortion, and obstruction of justice. He was later convicted. According to the indictment, Elgindy had led a ring of traders that included two FBI agents, Jeffrey A. Royer and Lynn Wingate, who used their access to confidential databases to give Elgindy inside information about publicly traded companies. The prosecutor in his case said there were indications he might have had foreknowledge of the attacks, since he had predicted a huge drop in the market and ordered the sale of $300,000 worth of stock in his children’s trust fund on September 10. The compelling evidence of insider foreknowledge of the 9/11 attacks has been largely dismissed. This is perhaps most evident by the conclusions of the 9/11 Commission report itself, which also stated that there was no evidence of any involvement by any foreign government or government official and that the question of who financed the attacks is “of little practical significance”, despite reports that Mahmud Ahmed, the head of Pakistan’s Inter-Service Intelligence agency, or ISI, had been responsible for authorizing the transfer of$100,000 to hijacker Mohammed Atta. This information was received by the Commission.

Bob Graham, who co-chaired the 9/11 Joint Inquiry with Porter Goss, has also said there is evidence of the involvement of a foreign government. The 9/11 Commission made no attempt to explain or reconcile the disparity between its conclusions and those of Graham or the reports of the ISI chief’s involvement.

In another strange twist, Graham and Goss were having breakfast in Washington with General Ahmed on the morning of September 11 as the planes struck the towers. Ahmed was in Washington visiting his counterpart at the CIA, George Tenet, as well as a number of other high-level officials. Both Graham and Goss had also travelled to Pakistan where they met with the ISI chief just a couple weeks before Ahmed’s reciprocal visit.

Goss was later appointed Director of Central Intelligence.

Jeremy R. Hammond is the editor of Foreign Policy Journal, a website dedicated to providing news, critical analysis, and opinion commentary on U.S. foreign policy from outside of the standard framework offered by government officials and the mainstream corporate media, particularly with regard to the "war on terrorism" and events in the Middle East. He has also written for numerous other online publications.

------------

http://www.timewarner.com/corp/management/board_directors/

Richard D. Parsons
Chairman of the Board, Time Warner

From May 2002 to December 2007, Mr. Parsons served as Time Warner's Chief Executive Officer. He became Chairman of the Board in May 2003. In its January 2005 report on America's Best CEOs, Institutional Investor magazine named Mr. Parsons the top CEO in the entertainment industry.

Before joining Time Warner, Mr. Parsons was the managing partner of the New York law firm Patterson, Belknap, Webb & Tyler. Prior to that, he held various positions in state and federal government, as counsel for Nelson Rockefeller and as a senior White House aide under President Gerald Ford.

Jessica P. Einhorn

• Dean of the Paul H. Nitze School of Advanced International Studies (SAIS) at The Johns Hopkins University – June 2002 to present.

• Prior Professional Experience: Previously, Ms. Einhorn served in the following positions:

- Visiting fellow, International Monetary Fund – 1998 to 1999.

- Executive positions at The World Bank, an international economic development organization – 1978 to 1979 and 1981 to 1999, including Managing Director for Finance and Resource Mobilization – 1996 to 1998.

• Other Directorships: Ms. Einhorn is also a trustee for the Rockefeller Brothers Fund and a director of the Institute for International Economics, the Center for Global Development, and the National Bureau of Economic Research.

Frank J. Caufield

• Co-Founder and Partner, Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers, one of the largest venture capital firms in the U.S.

• Mr. Caufield is a Director of the Council on Foreign Relations and the U.S. Russian Investment Fund.

Paul T. Cappuccio
Executive Vice President and General Counsel, Time Warner

Mr. Cappuccio is the chief legal officer at Time Warner. In that capacity, he oversees the worldwide management of Time Warner's legal functions, collaborating with all of its operating businesses.

Before joining AOL, Mr. Cappuccio was a partner at the Washington, D.C., office of Kirkland & Ellis, one of the world's premier litigation and transactional law firms, where he specialized in telecommunications law, appellate litigation and negotiation with government agencies.

From 1991-1993, Mr. Cappuccio was Associate Deputy Attorney General at the United States Department of Justice, where he advised Attorney General William P. Barr on matters relating to judicial selection, civil litigation, antitrust and civil rights.

Prior to his service at the Justice Department, Mr. Cappuccio served as a law clerk at the Supreme Court of the United States, first for Justice Antonin Scalia (1987-1988) and later for Justice Anthony M. Kennedy (1988-1989). .

Mr. Cappuccio is a 1986 graduate of Harvard Law School and a 1983 graduate of Georgetown University.

17. ### fedr8081100101Valued Senior Member

Messages:
6,706
im sorry but a fireman is about as much an explosives expert as an aeronautical engineer is an astronaut

18. ### FDNY AuxRegistered Member

Messages:
60
"im sorry but a fireman is about as much an explosives expert as an aeronautical engineer is an astronaut"

That may be true,but as an Mass Murder investigator researching the murder of fellow americans and innocent people killed in a mysterious event,

I kick ass for sure.

As we were moving toward the building we saw the top begin to blow out in a plume of smoke and we heard the noise associated with an implosion." WMV video download (120kB)
Evidence of Demolition Charges In WTC 2 http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/wtc2_cutter. html Before proceeding with this page let me explain a little something about explosives and how people perceive them. I work in special effects. In films, great use is made of low velocity explosives such as untamped black powder and ANFO because they are low velocity explosives. With a great whoosh and roar they belch forth with fire and smoke in a manner that has caused folks to drop their popcorn in matinees ever since sound came in. Movies have conditioned people to expect a certain look and sound to explosions, all based on very low velocity explosives. In a stunning ironic twist, moviegoers seem to perceive the slower explosions as more powerful. Demolition experts will tell you that high brissive or high velocity explosives actually are more powerful, as they build up a powerful shock wave. Here's what demolition experts use in steel framed buildings, the linear shaped charge ... It generates around 3,000,000 psi pressure ... at a speed in excess of 27,000 feet per second ... There are over 1000 different types of explosive ... With the use of delays we can control ... where the debris lands ... vibration ... noise level. WMV video download (680kB)
The job of a shaped charge is to cut steel H-beams. "The way we do this is by cutting the beam at an angle which through a series of beams cut at the same angle will tend to make the building shift over and 'walk'" WMV video download (670kB)
If a "progressive collapse" is required the beams are cut at opposite angles:

However, except for actually collapsing a structure, such explosives are unsuitable for film. The blast is over so quickly it can be missed while the film is moving between one frame and the next. There is very little visible smoke and flash, and the "crack" of a C-4 cutter charge is downright disappointing to hear. Thus, the average person's awareness of what an explosion is supposed to look and sound like is based on the movies and low velocity explosives only. In not knowing what high velocity explosives sound like or feel like (as the shock wave moves through the earth), many people might not understand what they heard or felt on 9/11. With the above in mind lets take a look at the collapse of World Trade Center 2... Click to join catapultthepropagan da http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/catapultth epropaganda/ join
Click to join openmindopencodenew s http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/openmindop encodenews/ join "...and then all of a sudden it started like... it sounded like gunfire... you know, bang, bang, bang, and then all of a sudden three big explosions." WMV video download (231kB)

"It [WTC 2] started exploding," said Ross Milanytch, 57, who works at nearby Chase Manhattan Bank. "It was about the 70th floor. And each second another floor exploded out for about eight floors, before the cloud obscured it all." [ASNE] "I saw small explosions on each floor." [Wing TV] "It actually gave at a lower floor, not the floor where the plane hit, because we originally had thought there was like an internal detonation explosives because it went in succession, boom, boom, boom, boom, and then the tower came down." [Ed Cachia - Firefighter [Engine 53]] One eyewitness whose office is near the World Trade Center told AFP that he was standing among a crowd of people on Church Street, about two-and-a-half blocks from the South tower, when he saw "a number of brief light sources being emitted from inside the building between floors 10 and 15." He saw about six of these brief flashes, accompanied by "a crackling sound" before the tower collapsed. Each tower had six central support columns. [American Free Press] "We were there I don't know, maybe 10, 15 minutes and then I just remember there was just an explosion. It seemed like on television they blow up these buildings. It seemed like it was going all the way around like a belt, all these explosions." [Rich Banaciski - Firefighter (F.D.N.Y.)] "When I looked in the direction of the Trade Center before it came down, before No. 2 came down, ..I saw low-level flashes. In my conversation with Lieutenant Evangelista, never mentioning this to him, he questioned me and asked me if I saw low-level flashes in front of the building, and I agreed with him because I thought -- at that time I didn't know what it was. I mean, it could have been as a result of the building collapsing, things exploding, but I saw a flash flash flash and then it looked like the building came down."

Q. "Was that on the lower level of the building or up where the fire was?"

A. "No, the lower level of the building. You know like when they demolish a building, how when they blow up a building, when it falls down? That's what I thought I saw. And I didn't broach the topic to him, but he asked me. He said I don't know if I'm crazy, but I just wanted to ask you because you were standing right next to me?He said did you see any flashes? I said, yes, well, I thought it was just me. He said no, I saw them, too." [Stephen Gregory - Assistant Commissioner (F.D.N.Y.)] "Somewhere around the middle of the World Trade Center, there was this orange and red flash coming out. Initially it was just one flash. Then this flash just kept popping all the way around the building and that building had started to explode. The popping sound, and with each popping sound it was initially an orange and then a red flash came out of the building and then it would just go all around the building on both sides as far as I could see. These popping sounds and the explosions were getting bigger, going both up and down and then all around the building." [Karin Deshore - Captain (E.M.S.)] Video showing the collapse of World Trade Center 2. Note the "pops".WMV video download (447kB)

"It was a frigging noise. At first I thought it was -- do you ever see professional demolition where they set the charges on certain floors and then you hear "Pop, pop, pop, pop, pop" That's exactly what -- because I thought it was that. When I heard that frigging noise, that's when I saw the building coming down." [Daniel Rivera - Paramedic (E.M.S.)] As we are looking up at the building, what I saw was, it looked like the building was blowing out on all four sides. We actually heard the pops. Didn't realize it was the falling -- you know, you heard the pops of the building. You thought it was just blowing out. [Joseph Meola - Firefighter (F.D.N.Y.)] The sight of the jumpers was horrible and the turning around and seeing that first tower come down was unbelievable. The sound it made. As I said I thought the terrorists planted explosives somewhere in the building. That's how loud it was, crackling explosive, a wall. That's about it. Any questions? [James Drury - Assistant Commissioner (F.D.N.Y.)] The demolition of the Landmark Tower in Fort Worth, Texas - 3/18/2006 Different technique, same result? Note the flashes and dust.WMV video download (507kB)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"You have two hundred and ten story office buildings. You don't find a desk. You don't find a chair. You don't find a telephone, a computer. The biggest piece of a telephone I found was half of the keypad. The building collapsed to dust." WMV video download (907kB)
Peter Tully, president of [Tully Construction] , was, notably, the only person willing to speak openly with AFP about his work at the WTC site. ... “Think of the thousands of file cabinets, computers, and telephones in those towers—I never saw one—every thing was pulverized,? Tully said. “Everything that was above grade—above the 6th and 7th floor—disintegrated . . . it was like an explosion.?Tully Construction specializes in concrete. AFP asked Tully if he had ever seen concrete pulverized as it was at the WTC. “No—never,?he said. [AFP]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

19. ### EndLightEndThis too shall pass.Registered Senior Member

Messages:
1,301
Heres an interesting video I found on Youtube of a demolitions failure.

The energy of the entirety of the building (not just the top floors) falls upon the base of this building, and it does not collapse. And does all the dust remind you of anything?

20. ### Tony SzambotiRegistered Senior Member

Messages:
634
It looks like they didn't do a sufficient analysis and determine just how much of an impulse they would need and the amount of momentum needed to crush the upper section of the building at impact. They probably needed to take out a larger number of lower floors and have it fall from a greater height.

The demolition of WTC 7 used a 100 foot freefall (the eight 12.5 foot high stories from the 7th floor to the 14th were blown out) to develop the momentum needed.

Of course, demolitions need to be engineered and the fall height determined depending on weight of the upper section, the strength of the building, and what it is falling on, as too much of the energy can be absorbed if the impacted area below is too soft.

Last edited: Jan 17, 2009
21. ### StryderKeeper of "good" ideas.Valued Senior Member

Messages:
13,101
This thread is being terminated. Too many 9/11 threads with the same lunacy cycle.