2016 U.S. General Election Day Notes

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Tiassa, Nov 8, 2016.

  1. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    22,910
    It's a great day for white nationalists, but for everyone else, not so much. It's proof evolution goes both ways.
     
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  3. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    Obama's executive orders are very few, and kind of popular - Trump's base doesn't actually know what they are, (https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/executive-orders ) and he'd run into trouble for repealing them if they found out. My guess is he's not going to do anything like that - he's not a stupid man.

    And the bit about "replacing" Obamacare is a joke - not a chance. They can wreck it, but they can't replace it - they haven't got the skill set, and they've talked themselves into a corner with no access to good alternatives.
     
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  5. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Very high chances those executive orders are forgoteen as well as his promises to undo them

    As for Obamacare, I put good bets Trump will make some modifications and call it "Trumpcare" instead. On the other hand I'm all for him abolishing it, love to see how that works out

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    and when we democrats take over again we will try for full public option instead.
     
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  7. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, he has promised a lot of things. He is good at promising; he promised a lot to all the companies he's started and taken over. And then went bankrupt six times, and managed to get lots of money out of each company before it folded.

    Think he will be able to do the same thing with the US?
     
  8. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    22,910
    Indeed he has and he is good at promising things. Now he has to deliver. He promised to deport 12 million illegal aliens. In order to do that he needs to begin immediately building a huge deportation task force. He has to hire and train policemen and judges. Then he has to deport them. Deporting 11 - 12 million illegals isn't easy or inexpensive or without adverse economic consequences.

    Then he is going to spend a half trillion to a trillion dollars building infrastructure, something Democrats have been trying to do for the last 8 years but have been met with unprecedented Republican obstruction. Perhaps now that a Republican president wants to do it congressional Republicans will have magically lost their will to obstruct. So he should be able to get this done.

    And he has to build his wall and get Mexico to pay for it and renegotiate a more favorable NAFTA agreement without starting a trade war. I'd like to see how he accomplishes this one. Remember, he's going to bring manufacturing jobs back. That's another promise. He's also going to bring back the coal industry.

    He is going to repeal and replace Obamacare with something better, a market based alternative; never mind the fact Obamacare is a market based healthcare option. Now how Trump replaces Obamacare which serves 20 million people with something better is bit of a mystery. He has made a lot of hay about Obamacare premiums; it's difficult to see how his ill defined plan would be any better. I imagine current Obamacare recipients will not be pleased with whatever alternative Trump comes up with; I suspect it will be significantly less than what Obamacare offers and much more expensive. Frankly, based on statements he made on the campaign trail, I don't think he has much knowledge of Obamacare or knows how it works and what it does.

    When Trump offers his alternative to Obamacare, it will bear his name. It will be Trumpcare, and if it is worse than Obamcare, if it doesn't bring premiums down for comparable coverage, then it will be hung around his narcissistic neck in 4 years as Republicans have done with Obamacare.

    And he's going to renegotiate the Iran deal which Iran has no interest in doing. How he does this is like everything else with Trump a bit of a mystery. But if he's not careful, he could put Iran back on the path to building nuclear weapons if he fails to honor the agreement.

    Then he is going to bomb ISIS, something we are already doing, and he is going to take their oil. So that would mean the US need to assign troops to take and hold ISIS's oil wells and build and guard the infrastructure necessary to export the oil. Aside from violating international law, the effort probably wouldn't pay for itself especially given the fact the world is in the midst of a global oil glut. But hey, Trump has never been one for facts or reason.

    And he's going to renegotiate the US debt, i.e. default on US debt, because that's how he handles his debt problems. He doesn't appear to know the difference between personal debt and public debt. That's pretty damn scary.

    And the list goes on.

    Trump's promises are nightmares just waiting to happen. Now how much he can get away with, who knows? His followers are pretty ignorant. Trump has made a lot of promises which he cannot deliver.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2016
  9. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    37,888
    ¿Scared Skittless?

    The syntactical progression is funnier than you think.
     
  10. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    All he has to do is set it up so it's somebody else's fault when he can't deliver - then he can turn to prosecuting them, cleaning house of these traitors and obstacles, etc., and ignore the lack of accomplishment.

    He needs to give his base something to do, anyway - if he lets them hang around stewing and frustrated in a mob, they'll be a danger to him. So targeting the enemies who prevented him from accomplishing his goals serves multiple purposes.
     
  11. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

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    4,201
    After being physically sick Tuesday night I spent Wednesday sobering up - and shedding not a few tears. Not for me, I'm an affluent, white, straight male - once again even more a part of the privileged class. I cried because this didn't have to happen. The suffering that is quite likely to come wasn't preordained. We did this - to ourselves. I could go on and on, but since I'm also a lazy affluent, white, straight male I'll let someone else do the work. Apologies for so much copy and paste but I couldn't say it better if I spent a week trying.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    If, like me, you woke this morning with a twisted, acidic, contempt-filled knot in your stomach and a head that feels like it’s caught in a vice, don’t panic. It’s called common sense. You obviously have the foresight to recognize what we’re in for, for at least the next four years, if not much, much longer. If, on the other hand, you woke feeling euphoric, with a false sense of the security and prosperity you think you’re about to experience just around the corner, this letter is for you.

    I barely got any sleep last night. It wasn’t because the outcome of this election made me realize how many morons populate this country, I already knew that. It’s that trying to come to grips with the fact that a good portion of you, the people I know and like and respect, some of whom I even love, and whom I consider of above average intelligence, just shocked the shit out of me. Bottom line, I had no idea you were that selfish. No idea you were/are that stubborn, obtuse and so apathetic you’d happily sacrifice what’s left of our respect for each other, and our nation, just to prove a point. I’m literally speechless.

    Unlike elections past, there’s nothing to feel good about today, as more than a few of you, my friends and relatives, cast your vote for a man who’s made clear his first order of business is to kick half his country’s citizens to the curb. This was not a win based on “Democrat” or “Republican.” This was a win based on hatred, discrimination and division. You just helped put in the highest office in the land, a man who’s been endorsed by members of the KKK, a man who’s demonstrated every trait we’ve been taught to despise since kindergarten ― lying, cheating, hatefulness, pettiness, name-calling, selfishness, bigotry, bravado, etc., etc. ― and a man who cares about nothing but himself. Basically, the exact opposite of what we’re taught a president should be, let alone a human being.
    And, why? For my part, the only conclusion I can draw, when you get right down to it, is you, too, only care about yourselves. You only care about your taxes being lowered and/or your business saving a few bucks on health insurance ― if that’s even going to be possible at this point. What other reason is there?

    Believe me, I’m no fan of Hillary, either. I, too, feel that 90 percent of our current politicians/leaders are corrupt and/or incompetent ― just look at what a power-hungry dipshit James Comey turned out to be, and this guy runs one of the most powerful agencies on earth. I get it. But, if you think your voting for Trump did anything to improve your quality of life, or, more importantly, your children’s quality of life, going forward, I feel sorry for you.

    Do you really think that by casting your vote for Trump you’ve made anything better? Aren’t you the least bit concerned you just helped elect a man to the Presidency, whom, aside from being void of basic class and decency, seeks to abolish a woman’s right to choose? Maybe you don’t give a shit about gay/lesbian rights, either? Perhaps you’re willing to look the other way when it comes to civil rights and the rights of naturalized citizens? Maybe you have no interest in the preservation of our planet and its lands? How about a desire to move away from fossil fuels and towards clean/green natural resources? Do you not believe in climate change and global warming?

    Are you seriously ― and it’s horrific if you are ― looking forward to another ”Scalia” sitting on the Supreme Court? Do you agree with Citizens United and corporations being treated as individuals? Do you support putting more guns in the hands of out-of-control psychopaths? Do you believe that spending $80 billion dollars on a few more F-15’s is how to defeat an ideology as determined as ISIS? Do you not think that that money would be better spent strengthening our schools? Do you want your children to grow up in a country that considers every person of color a “suspect?” Well, you must. Because, if you have any concept of what a Republican president ― especially this guy ― with a republican-controlled House and Senate means in this day and age, you just signed your name - and mine - to a contract there’s no going back on. And for what? Lower taxes?

    These are not the days of the Reagan republicans. There’s about as much chance of the Reagan-era republican making a comeback as Elvis. The last thing republicans represent these days is you and me. Rather, they seek simply to maintain the status quo on behalf of industry while proudly wearing the moniker of spiteful, back-stabbing, hypocritical, petty infants who would rather see this country involved in another civil war than be a part of real change. If you think otherwise, why are we even friends?

    My friends know the difference between right and wrong. They have the capacity to reason. They know facts when they see them. They definitely don’t believe in using The Bible as an excuse to exclude and discriminate. And, unlike our new president, they believe in helping their fellow man, not kicking him when he’s down. If you’re willing to ignore all this, and look the other way, simply for the mere possibility of increasing your portfolio, again, why are we friends? It’s amazing the difference one day makes.

    And, FYI, for those of you who cast your vote for Trump because you wanted to “send a message,” because you believe our current leaders don’t give a shit about me or you, I hope you see the irony in electing the one guy whose sense of self-importance and ego dwarfs that of even the most selfish politicians. You really believe a guy who buys things for himself, using money taken from his own charity, is going to do something for you? I’m sorry, but that’s just laughable.

    Trust me, I want to shake up the system as badly as you. But at what cost? We just handed The Philistines the keys to the kingdom. The inevitable trade-offs and setbacks we’re now going to be forced to suffer as a nation, in so many sensitive areas and on so many critical fronts, just to demonstrate our dissatisfaction with the way things are, is epically disproportionate to the reward.

    Granted, we’ve been through plenty of tough times as a nation; The Civil War, Vietnam, etc. But, correct me if I’m wrong, we’ve never seen anything like what we’re currently experiencing. Abroad (and here), religious zealots seek to wreak havoc on us at any expense. And, if the last fifteen years has taught us anything, it’s that more bombs won’t solve the problem. Yet, our new president thinks it will. Our new President thinks closing our borders and expelling undesirables, will stop terrorism. And, what about here?

    At home, our streets, shopping malls and schools are filled, not with Islamist extremists, but with thousands of despondent, disgruntled citizens, so bent on ending their own miserable suffering, and causing as much chaos in the process, they have no problem opening fire on a group of children. Our new President thinks more guns is the answer. Do you?

    But, okay, fine. It’s done. Now, you say, we need to “come together” and “heal” this utterly divided nation, blah, blah, blah, etc. etc. But, here’s the $99k Question: How, exactly, do we do that?

    Speaking just for myself, my respect for those around me has now dropped to an all-time low, and I’m not sure how to get it back. It’s quite possible you feel the same towards me? How will we react towards each other going forward if respect for those we actually know is all but gone? Magnify this feeling a few hundred million times and perhaps you see the problem. Maybe it will dissipate with time? I hope it does. For, if it gets worse, we’re really in for it.

    United We Stand... is not just a catchy saying. When we are this far apart in our beliefs/ideologies, we lose and our enemies win. It’s exactly what they hoped for, and, with each passing day, we seem to be more and more hell bent on handing it to them on a silver platter.

    We are heading further and further down the rabbit hole, folks, and the only ones we have to blame are ourselves. So, congratulations. Unless you’re currently a white, ultra-conservative multi-millionaire, you just fucked yourself, along with the rest of us, for some time to come.

    We now have a megalomaniacal reality show star as president. Life is about to imitate art right before our eyes, and we ― correction, you ― asked for it.​

     
    Magical Realist likes this.
  12. birch Valued Senior Member

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    5,077
    I doubt he is going to do that. That would have to employ marshal law. That would be like some surreal movie.

    I think he will just deport the ones who have a criminal record or gradually as they become apparent as well as tightening border security/penalties as well as stricter immigration laws. And perhaps that wall too. i can't disagree with the illegal immigration though or anchor babies. People should obey the law, otherwise what is the point of having a border? Then mexico and america should just become one country. I don't see that happening anytime soon.

    But then again, who knows what he would do.
     

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