1stMay2007 The Day on which Moderation Died

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Singularity, May 3, 2007.

  1. countezero Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,590
    Yes, Meta, I think I get your point. It's the old Robin Hood story writ large, that is, it's OK to steal from people who you have decided have a lot of money. That might make you feel better than if you were to steal from some poor bugger, but it doesn't change the fact that you're stealing and you're a thief.

    Here's some more gross rationalization of immorality: "Stealing an album isn't quite the same as not paying your gardener. If you don't pay your gardener then the labour he's expended cutting your lawn is lost and can't be recovered. It's not re-usable. The same thing doesn't quite apply to stealing an album, which can be downloaded 1000s of times, over and over again, without extra labour being expended on the part of it's creator. ... So (given the reusability of the resource) we can't say for sure that the creator is 'losing' anything (either in terms of labour or profits)... can we?"

    Let me make it easy for you. Philosophically, morally and etc. there is absolutely no difference in stealing from your gardener and stealing an album. Both are theft, in which you've intentionally benefited from someone's labor without compensating them for it.

    This gets back to my whole tangible/intangible argument, which all the music to the masses internet types seem to unconsciously possess. IE: They seem to think it's OK to steal albums and movies and whatnot over the internet because all they're doing is clicking a few buttons and they never have to experience the pain and loss the person their stealing from suffers. But these same people would never go out and swipe a car or lawn mower, because that would be wrong, it could land them in jail and they would have to physically experience the theft and its consequences. Holding these views is grossly hypocritical.
     
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  3. Singularity Banned Banned

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    Gates Foundation is doing what government were supposed to do.

    Its a shame illuminati rules unquestioned.
     
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  5. Singularity Banned Banned

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    countezero

    Just chill down, no one is stealing anything, we are just making copies.
     
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  7. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

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    23,053
    Is it legal to make those copies? Don't you understand "copyright" laws at all?

    Baron Max
     
  8. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Based on this logic, all used book stores are breaking copyright laws, aren't they?
     
  9. redarmy11 Registered Senior Member

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    And eBay. And Amazon Marketplace. And similar.
     
  10. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    72,824
    I've been haunting criminal establishments:booo:
     
  11. redarmy11 Registered Senior Member

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    7,658
    Me too. Does anyone with internet access and any sense actually go into a shop and buy a CD or a book these days? Why go to all that trouble when you can have it delivered to your door for a knockdown price. :shrug:
     
  12. Singularity Banned Banned

    Messages:
    1,287
    Here we are arguing that the laws are wrong and there u r repeating the same song again.

    Its absolutely ridiculous even to say that in this era.
     
  13. Buffalo Roam Registered Senior Member

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    samcdkey

    No, I believe that there is a royalty that is paid when a book is sold second hand, it is like one for radio and TV, everv time a song is played, the artist get a few pennies in royalty fee, the same when it is used in advertising, the same happens for the movie industry, and the actors, when a movie is played a song, or speech, on TV, there is a formula by which the numbers of house holds watching is computed, and then a fee assessed against the network based on that number.
     
  14. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    O rly? Like when I sell my used books on ebay, the author gets a royalty?

    Wow! Who pays it?
     
  15. Buffalo Roam Registered Senior Member

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    Singularity

    And exactly why are the laws wrong? I consider the law of making retro active abortion illegal, as wrong, but you don't see me braking it, just because I might disagree with it.
     
  16. redarmy11 Registered Senior Member

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    7,658
    You believe wrongly, BR. You're saying that when Grubby Ken's Books buys a book off customer A and sells it customer B, Grubby Ken then sends money to the author? How does this work exactly?

    Since my understanding is that, at the end of such a transaction, Grubby Ken pockets the difference and uses it to take himself, his wife Martha and his two kids off for a fortnight in Spain.
     
  17. Buffalo Roam Registered Senior Member

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    samcdkey

    Proabily E-Bay, it is most likly part of the licensing agreement and Laws.
     
  18. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    So if I sell 40 books for a dollar and I get a dollar, ebay pays royalty on all 40 books?

    That is awesome!
     
  19. redarmy11 Registered Senior Member

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    7,658
    You wouldn't get a dollar. You'd have to pay eBay and probably PayPal out of that. Then they split, like, 8% of 8 cents between the 40 authors. Probably.
     
  20. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Thats strange, I got a dollar (not for 40 books though). Said it was a deal for a first time seller. Will they come for me d'you think? *anxiously peeking through the curtains*
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2007
  21. MetaKron Registered Senior Member

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  22. Buffalo Roam Registered Senior Member

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    redarmy11

    In this country and any other that I can think of that have a tax on business sales, you have to keep track of your sales transactions, so that you can pay the sales tax, which also means that they know what you have sold, and if it is covered under the copy write laws you have to pay the royalties for those transactions, so I do believe that I am right in my thoughts on the subject, I had a discussion with a friendly manager at Borders Books, it is for the original sale through a book store and for any other sale from a store that has to collect sales taxes.
     
  23. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    72,824
    Does that mean lending libraries are breaking copyright laws?
    If I loan a book to a friend, am I breaking copyright laws? What if I loan her a movie or some music?

    What about stuff in garage sales? Is that illegal?
     

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