A challenge for Geistkiesel

Take points R, S and E

Earth is at point E.

a stationary Space station is at point S.

Point R is near S and both are at equal distance from E.

A rocket is approaching at tremendous velocity at point R and towards E.

At the instance when the rocket reaches R, both the rocket and the spacestation simultaneously flash a powerful destructive laser beam ( may be a few meters in length ) towards E.

Now, the rocket being at a very high speed, whoes flash will reach E first ?

 

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If the beams are emitted at the same time and distance from earth, the beams will arirve at earth simultaneously. The motion of light is indenpendent of the motion of the source of the light.The light moves at constant velocity which is the same for both beams, The light moves in straight lines until actied on by external forces.

Thee will be Doppler considrations wrt the light emitted from the fast ship but the speeds are not perturbed.

One muight consider the mass of theship has reached a large "apparent mass" which some have alluded to a increasing the gravitational attraction of the ship wrt the emitted ;ight and "hold it back:", but this isn't an observed phenomenon as all the stars in the universe would be emitting lighta t different velocities, which is not the observed case.

Geistkiesel ​

 

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OK, I think that is the answer.

But, what if E is very far away. And the space station starts accelerating towards E after firing the laser and then quickly showing its raw power matches the speed and starts flying with the rocket ?

Will it not decrease the speed of already fired lasers that havent yet reached E with respect to the space ship now that it has come closer to the rocket ?

I know you will answer this too, but I am unable to guess how.

 

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Anomalous,

Let me try......Both flashes will reach the Earth at the same time because both the rocket and the spaceship are in the Earth's gravitational field, and the speed of light is always equal to c relative to the gravitational field that it is passing through, right??

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There is no gravity yet in my second question Right ?

 

Anomalous,

There's always gravity. In your second question, the light would be travelling at c relative to the Sun (because of the Sun's gravity), and as it approached the Earth it would slow down, or speed up, so that its speed would be c relative to the Earth (because of the Earth's gravity).

Note: The relation between gravitational fields and light is my idea, and there is no physical evidence yet that it is correct.

 

isn't the speed of light the same from all frames of reference? since we are talking about space, it would be C. so, I see no possible way for one laser to go faster than another. if they were fired at the same time, from the same distance, through the same medium, then they would have to get there at the same time, right?

 

You seem to be confused, poor soul. Assume that there is nothing in the universe other than the three point I have told.

 

the first question was already answered by Geistkiesel, now move on to the next one buddy.

 

No, I see no change in velocity of the emitted laser beam. Basically as long as there are no physical barriers to the emitted light the lightcontnues unimpeded.
The stratement: The light will movioe isotropically and independent of the motion of source of the light at the constant speed c until acted on by an external force.. This says the light will continue.in a straihht-line forever, potentially.

Before I submit this let me make one slight adjustment. Light does not deserve the special handling it receives from some well meaning theories, however, for the objects accelerating from behind the wave fronts the "relatiive velocity" of frame and photon will change, but the absolute motion of the light speed with respect to V = 0 is invariant.
Geistkiesel ​

 

Are you including the change in velocity direction due to gravity exclusively as the "change in the speed of light", or are you referring to the absolute linear speed that is changing?
Geistkiesel ​

 

geistkiesel,

I am talking about absolute linear speed change. I'm claiming that photons are particles with dipolar gravitational fields that are accelerated to c by the gravitational fields that they pass through. In other words, photons only travel at c relative to the gravitational field that they are travelling through at any given moment.

As a result, an observer that is stationairy on the surface of the Earth, and is therefore stationairy in the Earth's gravitational field, will always measure the omnidirectional speed of light to be equal to c (minus the effects of the Sun's and Moon's gravitational fields on the light). However, an observer that is moving through a gravitational field will measure a change in the speed of light equal to the speed that the observer is moving through the field. This change in the speed of light is what causes atomic clocks that are travelling at high speeds to tick slower, and particles travelling through our atmosphere to decay at a slower rate, and not time dilation.

 

Anomalous,

If there's nothing in the universe, then I assume your implying that there's no gravity as well. If this was the case then the beams of light would not move at all since there would be nothing to propel them.

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One other point to make that everyone seems to be missing. All forms of electromagnetic radiation travels through a VACUUM at the same speed. All EM
radiation does not travel through a medium, the Earth's atmosphere at the same speed. More energetic EM radiation travels through a medium faster than less energetic
EM radiation. Although both 'destructive laser beams' may reach Earth's upper atmosphere at exactly the same time, they will not reach Earth's surface at EXACTLY
the same time. The laser beam from the very fast moving spaceship will be blue shifted
(more energetic) than the laser beam from a source relatively stationary to the Earth.
Also geistkiesel, SR's prediction is that the speed of light is independent of the velocity
of the source OR THE RECEIVER. Prosoothus, I have long held the same view as you that the speed of light is relative to the gravitational potential of the region of space
it is traveling through. This view is supported by the fact that clocks in orbit (where
the gravitational potential is less) beat faster than clocks on the Earth's surface.

 

2inquisitive,

I believe that the speed of light is always equal to c relative to the gravitational field that the light is passing through, regardless of the strength or potential of the field. However, I'm not negating the possibility that that there may be a secondary reaction between the field and the photon that might influence the photon's speed. I'm just concentrating on invalidating SR before I start invalidating GR.

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I feel there is some half assed physics happening here =]

 

You all were supposed to answer the bold part of the above question. But all of your smartness seem to lie in dodging the question, Hats of to U all, choice was yours.

I didnt expect this from U Geistkiesel, I.e. If you are real living breathing person, U Bot.

 

You are correct of course, but one should not confuse the reality that the relative velocity of frame and photon is c - v or c + v, which is used by SRT as decreases or increases in the speed of light when it is convenient for SRT to do so.
Geistkiesel ​

 

There is a common trigger point external to both. There, both lasers fired simultaneiously. This is what some ,many conmplain of you James R, straw man debating and sbstituting one set of facts for another to suit your opinion.
Geistkiesel​