Aah, let's get into technicalities here. How do you define "demonstration?"
You do know that Randi's offer is as fraudulent as a three dollar bill and
any psi is now leary such offers (though I do wish Wolf Messing was still
alive. Sigh...)?

The Doctor

look at it thisa way. you cant have an outside without an inside

the inside is feeling and is more and more a connectedness with the deepness or reality

the outties are --if you like--the present paradgmists who fervently, fudaMENTlistically believe that reality is mechanical, and this justifies their commodification of it, and such awful behaviour such as animal vivisection are also part of this mindset

but really madly deeply, reality ISN'T mechanical. it's ALIVE

IF the mechanistic outties got a handle on this inner (which actually the CIA has/is trying to do)...what the...do you think they'd wanna USE it for? for good. for good of Nature?....? yeah, SURE! No it'd be used just like all the other unethical shit they do

under this insight could it not be understood that the very capriciousness of
paraphenomena is entirely due to the scheming mind that wants to nail it?...if u know what i mean

Oh I am very capable of doing a google seach. I am very capable of lookin up telekinesis just as Im capable of lookin up proof of a molten lava god living in a man's anus. Just cause its on google doesn't make it true so unless you can come up with proof that telekinesis exist along with a reliable source then no ones going to waste their time and you've shown that you don't want to waste yours so what does that say?

What it says is that I am a fool for wasting my time with a moron who
doesn't know his elbow from his asshole, and that I am gonna stop
doing it. Believe in little elves or believe in nothing if it suits your
level of comprehension, but I for one am not going to waste any
more time with you. There are fools, and then there are close-minded
fools ; guess whic catagory you're in.

The Doctor

"Psychokinetics- sometimes called psychodynamics or telekenetics- is a subject to which very few nonpsis have given serious consideration. Nothing worthwhile concerning it is in general circulation, since it can be handled only in the esoteric symbology of paraphysics and paramechanics: both of which
disciplines are closed books to nonpsionic minds."

E.E. Smith

Doc, what is the problem with Randi's tests? Why do you consider them unfair? Has'nt Randi said to anybody that all they have to do is turn up and do there thing. If he see's its not a con they get the cash. Why has nobody took him up on the offer of easy money. If you or i could actually do something psi it should'nt matter what controls are put in place, if you have a psi skill you should be able to perform. It gives a huge amount of credence to Randi that nobody has tried to win the cash. What is anybody scared of? That what Randi say's is the truth, everybody who claims these skills is a fraud?

I believe many have tried to win the cash. None have succeeded. Psychic powers have a tendency to disappear under proper test conditions.

To true. So Doc, over too you ...

is that challenge only closed to TK experimentation? or can someone display clairvoyance to you? like maintaining an 80% guessing rate with playing cards?

if so, ill do it.

So Doc, still waiting for a reply. Or does your silence speak volumes?

exactly as i thought.
no response when i took crunchy cat up on his offer.
*shakes head* dont say it unless you mean it.

and, please no criticism on the 80% figure i gave.
to ask someone to have 100% is like shooting an icbm missile from kansas, and having it pass through a basketball hoop in china without touching the metal rim.

I'm still waiting for a reply Doc. Or having read some of the threads around here have you realised the truth, nobody has any of these powers that they claim?

Not true! I have awesome slacking powers!

LOL but these are powers that can be measured in some way. Not some mystic psyco bollox. I too have an impressive power of slacking, for instance i should be at work now, not here on sciforums

i want my 5000$ by default.

its been weeks since i posted my response to your challenge.

I've been away from this conversation because I realized how totally
self-defeating it is to get into with skeptics, who are incapable of
looking at the situation objectively.

I wouldn't bother answering now if there weren't a half-dozen notifications
in my Inbox. So here goes:

That offer has been around for eighteen years and that fact alone
should tell somebody that something is wrong with it, when there has been
hundreds of thousands of cases of reported ESP experiences; some one
should have collected by now-- if the offer was valid. That's just common
basic common sense. But skeptics lack even that.

Second, a lawyer, Victor Zammit

http://www.victorzammit.com/skeptics/index.html

has looked at that "offer" and has found that the way it's written, Randi never has to pay a damn cent to anyone, ever. Probably the only psi that could've collected, if he was alive today, was the "pusher" Wolf Messing who once "robbed" a Russian bank by making the teller write out a million rubel (sp?) check as a demonstration to Stalin, who at first, didn't believe in Messings power of telepathic hypnosis.

Messing wasn't given some cutsey, crappy offer, rather, Messing was placed in a high-security prison and told to escape from that prison using his
unique wild talents or stay there permanently. Within a half hour Messing
walked out of the prison with an escort of the guards besides him. He had
made the warden and the guards think that he was a VIP from the State.
After that, Stalin was finally convinced that Messing indeed had terrific
mental abilities.

Now if Randi could indeed fake any psychic abilities, I would like to see
him placed in a secure prison, stripped butt-naked, and let's see
him walk out of prison. But that's not something his Mightiness won't
do. His dumbass supporters will say that he doesn't have to prove anything,
but to somebody even remotely objective, it's clear that Randi is a coward
and is only in control over circumstanaces that he alone can control.

Now it doesn't take a gift of prophecy to know that you won't believe any
of this, so don't bother me anymore. As I said elsewhere, I don't waste my
time with skeptics anymore (the boy said politefully but really means close-minded fools, and idiots who waste my time with always the same old
answers).

The Doctor

Sorry Doc,

I didn't keep up with the thread and missed this post (my bad). Thanks
for responding, I appreciate it. I think it's important that we agree on what a
demonstration would entail (I don't want to be the exclusive rule setter).

I don't know a whole lot about the history of the Randi offer so I really
can't comment on how legitimate or fradulant the offer is; however, I
am not Randi and he is not me.

What could be potentially demonstrated to me of the telekenetic persuasion?
Just to give you an idea of what I would consider a demo, if I place a tennis
ball on the floor in a room and it jumps off the floor, flys through the air, and heads right to my open palm then I would consider that a good demo.

I have witnessed hypnosis and seen alot of great results from it. It's
very real, it can be learned by most anyone, and there is nothing
telepathic about it.

Well Doc, you carry on living in your fantasy world. Nobody has picked up randis money for 18 years because its fixed? or more likely nobody at all has any " powers" whatsoever. I suppose we will have to agree to disagree- but i know i'm right