Electric cars are a pipe dream

Most of Europe.

 

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The batteries could be charged very quickly, just like getting gas:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/7938001.stm (not a good article on this, I suggest you google for more)

However, the gas station would need a fat pipe coming into it which we don't currently have the infrastructure for. New power plants would need to be built, but since we are not willing to build new nuclear plants.....

 

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Source please, you know something that shows they are doing serious planning based on personal cars not being a viable means of transportation within say the next 60 years?

Arthur

 

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They have existing rail systems which are excellent.

 

Battery changing stations are in the works now and should be implemented before long in a few trial locations.Better Place has a working prototype shown working on video.The changing out of the spent battery for a fresh one looks rather simple,not to mention it takes little time.Check out the article and video at link.

I believe once EV range is increased and changing stations are built we will have a good chance at finally putting a large number of EV's on the road.


http://tinyurl.com/q7fdqp

 

Rapid recharge batteries are quite feasible.
http://spectrum.ieee.org/energy/renewables/a-rapidrecharge-lithium-battery

If the need is there for facilities to provide that rapid recharge, and someone can make $$$ doing it, then they will appear.

Imagine an electric car equipped for rapid recharge. You go for a long drive, and two hours later your battery is getting low. You pull into a roadside cafe, and plug in, swiping your credit card to pay for it, and go inside for a nice cup of coffee. Ten minutes later, after a quick cuppa, and a toilet stop, you go out to your car and drive off with a fully charged battery.

The owner of the roadside cafe rubs his hands in glee at the dozens of customers, each spending a miserly amount, but in total adding up to a very nice business.

 

I doubt that less than 10 minute full recharge will ever be possible for EV batttery set as charging that rapidly would require considerable electric field near the elctrodes to drive the ions rapidly to (or away from) them. This lowers the efficiency and that is increased heat, which added in a short time = damaging temperature rise (warped plates, shorter battery life etc.).

The need to increase the size of power transformers, wire sizes, etc. in the electric grid can be reduced by local supper flywheels (run in vacuum with magnetic bearing for very low loss rates) at the charging stations. In their motor mode, when no one is charging their batteries, they re-spin up to store energy that can be dumped when in their generator mode. They will be cheaper than a new power grid. Perhaps even small home units can store off peak energy and thus pay for themselves in a few years in lower energy costs.

 

I think a model where we don't own the batteries is better. You can just swap out your old ones for new ones relatively quickly, like a rechargeable drill. You just lease the service.

 

That idea has actually been tossed around by a few of the Manufactures.If or when EV's take off it maybe mainstream or at least a choice between owning or fee swapping.

 

Not a big fan of the battery swap. You give them your nice new battery and they give you back a piece of crap.

 

You would never buy a new one. If the one they give you doesn't work, it's like a warranty, they will just replace it.

 

Sure, but that won't matter to you when your stuck by the side of the road.

 

The battery swap is just like how you get gas now,except instead of getting gas you get a fresh battery.Your using the battery only until you need a refreshed one,repeat over and over.There would be swapping stations like there are gas stations now.It can work now but to make it practical we need to get the EV range up so that your not having to stop every 70-100 miles for a swap. Of course the stations will need built too.Replacing gas,oil & autos etc is a very long time span no doubt.Something most of us here wont have to deal with but the kids certainly will.

 

I thought the battery swap thing would work like the propane cylinder exchange things they have in front of grocery stores in the US.
If you have a cylinder to turn in, it's one price, if not, it's double...

You just have to make the batteries standard (Japan's already doing that) of a size that can be lifted by hand, and easily removable-maybe in a sliding tray...

 

In private communities, as in the streets are private, electric cars are used all the time. Have been for a long time. They work quite well for small congested areas.

If it wasn't for restrictive laws, they would be used a lot more. Even so
http://chronicle.augusta.com/stories/latest/lat_703014.shtml

 

Yea the batteries will need to be standard or universal across the board so no matter your location or model of car,you will get a swap.In the future I see gas stations being retrofitted from gas to battery station,which seems the most logical way to go.

For now we will start out in the cities where the limited range of EV's arn't so affected.I believe Japan and Isreal and a few others are making this a reality today.It ought to be interesting!

 

I think we have just killed the title of this thread, dead.

 

So do our big cities like NY, Boston, Philly, Chicago, San Fran, DC, Portland, San Diego, Atlanta etc, but like the US they also sell millions of cars each year and few adults don't own one and need one. You know Mercedes, BMW, Fiat etc...

http://www.acea.be/index.php/news/n...hicle_production_up_15_over_9_months_in_2010/

Arthur

 

I would not be so sure, especially if the "swap out dead battery for fully charged one" is the adopted "recharge" solution.

The users of EVs must in some way pay for capital cost of ALL the batteries that exist, not just the one in their car but at least 2 more, on average, waiting for them at the battery swap stations. Effectively this at least triples the total battery cost for EVs.

I.e. the cost of only the batteries will be significantly more than the cost of the EV car. That makes it very hard for EVs to compete with sugar cane alcohol powered cars, which are at least as economical as conventional gasoline cars and have slightly negative net release of CO2, which EVs in the USA certainly do not have. (Coal makes most of the energy their batteries are recharged with.) The "green appeal" of EVs will evaporate as the facts become better known. Stopping every 100 miles or less for a battery swap is not very attractive either.

Brazil's solution makes much more sense. I doubt it even 5 EVs can be sold in Brazil each year.

SUMMARY: The title of this thread is far from dead. - It seems quite accurate to me.

 

So you believe that cars putting CO2 into the atmosphere is preferable over clean power stations, be it carbon capture (for food) or nuclear or fusion? How far forward are you thinking? Electric motors have a great life expectancy too. Electric cars are going to happen. Do you think the motor industry is building the industry on a whim? The price of batteries will fall, the cost of fuel is going to be a big consideration, look around you? Do you really think we can give up enough land? Of course there are going to be developments in alternative fuels but I think it's all going fusion within a century or two . . . roll out the leccy cars.

What is your take on changing out battery fluids, or is this not feasible with current battery specs? I don't know enough about the batteries they use to power cars.