Star Wars vs Star Trek

Discussion in 'SciFi & Fantasy' started by Pollux V, May 9, 2002.

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Which universe would win?

  1. Star Trek

    227 vote(s)
    35.5%
  2. Star Wars

    268 vote(s)
    41.9%
  3. Spaceballs

    47 vote(s)
    7.3%
  4. Farscape

    12 vote(s)
    1.9%
  5. Dune

    50 vote(s)
    7.8%
  6. Stargate

    36 vote(s)
    5.6%
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  1. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    13,938
    I see you are incapable of seeing the point, so I will leave you with this:

    What is easier? Killing a fly with a flyswatter, or killing a fly with a 25 pound sledgehammer?

    You are trying to kill a fly with a sledgehammer... yes, if you manage to connect, you will do absolutely critical, lethal damage, no exception. However, the chances of you connected, assuming the fly isn't already DEAD, are approximately zero. I say approximately because there is always that one in a quadrillion chance, but the likelyhood is, for all intensive purposes, zero.

    You have not stated a single thing Trek cannot do with much lower power outputs, so it isn't all that impressive. In fact, the fact that WH40K requires such power levels shows how primitive and basic their weapons actually are. You, however, will complain and say this isn't so - you will also know, in all honesty, that it is true. Why use a sledgehammer when a flyswatter will do. Collateral damage is NOT a good thing.

    Phasers can easily vaporize a person. They can even vaporize metric tons of rock no problem. However, you seem intent on using the lowest possible examples and ignoring EVERYTHING else. For one - we see where a full-power phaser blast doesn't instantly vaporize a person. However, if you would note, that person was infected with a parasite that made them incredibly strong and resistant to damage, requiring two phasers (a type 1 cricket and type 2 pistol) at nearly full output to simply detonate their head. Obviously the parasite did something to make the person more resistant to damage, as even in TOS, we see phasers capable of complete de-atmoization of a person within moments of impact. Not to mention overloading a simple hand phaser can result in the complete destruction of areas in excess of 200 meters. I'd provide quotes, episodes, and even videos as proof, but you'd just protest that it's a one off or some such bullshit and cry cry cry until the entire argument is dropped.

    The same goes for Impulse and Warp speeds - there are instances where Impulse drive exceeds twice the speed of light. Quite impressive, and far in excess of what SW or WH40K can do at sublight. There are times where Warp is shown to be capable of crossing immense distances in moments; at other times, it seems incapable of crossing a star system within a reasonable time. You, of course, cling to the lowest possible examples, desperate to make Trek seem as impotent as possible.

    As for planet-wiping, Trek has a multitude of methods for that. Hell, the old Connie-class Enterprise-A was able to remove all life from a planet within one hour. That's not bad for a ship that, by modern Trek standards, is little match for a Civilian Shuttlecraft...
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2010
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  3. ricrery Banned Banned

    Messages:
    1,616
    Bad analogy. More like a 25 sledgehammer with lots of little shards flying at fast directions in all speeds, constantly.

    Except this sledgehammer constantly hits mosquitoes on a daily basis, without worry.

    So? NDF based weaponry works like that. Otherwise, those Special Cyclonic Torpedoes would be in the zettatons to yottatons, but they aren't.

    Even though MOST technologies they have are equal or even superior to Trek ones? Better FTL, better cybernetic technology (has the Federation even shown this?), better land technologies as a whole, better mechanical creations (Iron Men, Servitors, and Skitarii for example), land weapons that are ludicrously above ST space ships (Genesis photon torpedoes blowing asteroids barely bigger than them to pieces.). Here's a quote.
    A Warlord Titan is nothing in comparison to an Emperor or Imperator class Titan.

    What collateral damage? They can shoot a single Lance and create a crater around a small area, not such collateral damage there is there? The flyswatter would be an annoyance to a boar, but the sledgehammer would send it to its place pretty easily.

    On maximum power, and their rate of fire is a crutch.

    Excluding that if a you fired two shots a second, you wouldn't need two Phasers? That's the problem, Phasers have such a slow rate of fire that a Las-Gun could vaporize someone several times over by the time it's done firing in a single beam.

    Yeah, like Photon Torpedoes effecting star systems, you are ALWAYS twisting the truth to benefit Star Trek. But let me fill this fact into your mind. In "Genesis" Photon Torpedoes have yields of hundreds of gigawatts tops.

    Yes... like I gave one good and one bad example for Trek and one good and one bad example for W40k. Have you ever read a W40k book ever?

    That's fucking funny, why is it Subspace weapons are planet destroying in your wording, but in "Generations" they don't even destroy the windows that the impact does? Oh right, you wanking to high levels. W40k is ABOVE ST so hard that's it's not funny. If Hellblade8 says W40k ships do kilotons-megatons when shown otherwise with leveling continents, fine, but I'll use the 400 gigawatts defeating shields and low end-mid end weaponry from "Survivors" and "Genesis" as seen and heard.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2010
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  5. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    Uhm... Generations doesn't use subspace weapons you nutfuck... good god. And you can claim survivors all you want - evidence has been given to you to show why it is so incredibly wrong, and you clinging to it simply shows how pathetic and desperate you really are

    *shrugs*

    The honest, hard truth is, I have not twisted or wanked out anything - I have taken the simple things we have seen on screen and presented them to you, and you have kicked, screamed, and cried "wank wank wank" while gently stroking yourself with your other hand to SW porn. It's sad that you have to resort to such pathetic and immature measures to try to prove what I would assume is a point yet said points seems vaguely absent in all your posts.

    Go away little troll... let those with real evidence and real opinions debate. You can go play imagination with Barney and Friends somewhere else... we don't want to see it here.
     
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  7. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    Oh, and how, exactly, does a continuous beam weapon have a SLOW RATE OF FIRE?

    Need to kill one thing? You push the button once.

    Need to kill a lot of things? You set it to wide angle, and push the button once.

    Need to kill a shitake load of things? You set it to wide angle, maximum output, push the button, hold it down, and sweep it around in an arc.
     
  8. Shogun Bleed White and Blue! Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    7,635
    Yes, so does SSDs

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    . It is the same situation as a F-16 destroying a Nimitz. The SSD have every capability to destroy the fighters. On a side note, if a nuclear weapon is intercepted close enough, it can still deal a great deal of damage.
     
  9. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    Not really Shogun - most (if not all) nuclear warheads will NOT go nuclear after being struck by an anti missile system. This is because of how nuclear fission works - without the primer elements being shot into the core of the warhead, no nuclear fission, and thus, no nuclear blast

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    And the CVN-65 is not a Nimitz class carrier. It's an Enterprise class, and the only ship of her class IS the CVN-65 USS Enterprise

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  10. ricrery Banned Banned

    Messages:
    1,616
    Right... this is powerful? HA! A megaton level nuke would be a bigger threat to the Enterprise.

    Really?

    Kittamaru's Myth's:
    *Enterprise Tractor Beam moved small with no sweat.
    *Enterprise Tractor Beam moved neutron star.
    *Subspace weaponry can destroy planets.
    *Borg can adapt to projectiles.
    *Borg have the ability to move stars.
    *Borg can capture a figure that has teleportation and subatomic weapons.
    *31st century Feds could beat Xeelee (he conceded due to the flaming he was getting)

    Facts:
    *Enterprise only stopped it on maximum warp for a few seconds, and it continued moving.
    *Enterprise had a far more advanced Tractor Technology then, and they barely moved it.
    *Subspace weaponry is a minor threat for a ship that can take and deal a few kilotons in an entire fight.
    *Borg technology has never done so.
    *They have never shown this ability and if they struggle against a shitty 642 meter ship, then their "star moving" is impossible.
    *A single ship of theirs can destroy the entire Borg.
    *A single Xeelee ship could defeat the entire Starfleet of that time without a scratch. In fact, there would be a movie where the galaxy combines to try in beat it before being eradicated.

    He's always lyin', you know what I'm sayin'?

    Well, if you weren't so busy giving Kirk a heads up, you'd figure out I don't like SW.

    Really? Like all of those events you twist beyond possibility because you know ST can't win otherwise? Face it, a single Necron ship beats the entire Borg. Wait, so could an Eldar ship, well, anything WH40k could.

    Wow, everyone from Spacebattles was saying that about you, and you are constantly making bullshit up. You actually 31st century Feds could beat Xeelee, as did Hellblade8, and you're saying I have no real opinion? You are crazy, do you know that?
     
  11. Shogun Bleed White and Blue! Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    7,635
    If the fail-safe gates are released, then it will explode.
     
  12. Shogun Bleed White and Blue! Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    7,635
    Nimitz is the Enterprise-class' successor.
     
  13. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    13,938
    Actually, I had a fair number of PM's stating what an outright idiot you were and how I shouldn't stoop to your level trying to refute the bullshit you put out. As I recall, even people on your own SIDE were calling you an idiot... I could take screenshots and post them here if you wish, but you'd probably try to say I photoshopped them

    As a final point on the Xeelee - I was arguing against them before doing any real research on them beyond the all-too-common wanked-out bullshit you spout. As such, I didn't believe a word you say - however, after reading up on them, I have only this to say:

    Holy fuck batman, someone was on CRACK when they designed them.

    And to think, they are LOOSING? Against fucking BIRDS? REALLY? What the HELL man? If they are such utter masters of time travel, reality-warping, and construction, why don't they just trap the goddamned universe/reality/galaxy/whatever those Phontino birds came from in a quasi-dimensional rift that crushes it and prevents said universe/reality/galaxy from ever expanding enough to cool to the point of supporting any kind of life?

    I mean shitake, those Xeelee are pre-wanked for your jerkoff pleasure! The only thing that could stand a chance is an omnipotent-allpowerful being such as Q/possible Time Lords (assuming they actually have CONTROL over time and space, and not just the ability to traverse it) and a few others. This is because they would, quite simply, prevent the Xeelee universe from ever have existing - not simply wipe the universe out (as that would not work thanks to the *cough*wank*cough* Xeelee's own use of Time Travel Paradox's to make themselves as powerful as their utmost form from the moment they existed) but simply make it so that universe NEVER existed.

    And before you complain, Riceroni:

    The Q have control over space, matter, and time. (VOY: "Q2")

    That is stated, quite simply, bluntly, and without exaggeration or dishonesty, in the series.

    It's also interesting to note that in The Q and the Grey, baby Q is able to "knock small planets out of their orbit" before he's even capable of walking. Interestingly enough, it seems that the Q Continuum has been around for billions of millenia despite the fact that not a single child has been born this entire time - this proves, quite simply, their immortality to anything and everything excepting themselves.
     
  14. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    No no no, you misunderstand - in a nuclear warhead, if the warhead is destroyed before the Fission Trigger sets off the pre-explosive charge (usually Plutonium or some other such material) there will simply not be enough force to actually cause nuclear fission, and thus the only hazard the warhead will pose is a radiation threat.
     
  15. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    13,938
    While this is true, the Enterprise class is superior in almost every respect, including speed and agility (with eight reactors powering steam turbines on four different props along with four rudders, compared to the nimitz classes 2 reactors (of the exact same type) and four turbines, 4 shafts, and 2 rudders). The Nimitz superseded the Enterprise only because of construction cost issues, a damn shame considering the Enterprise is, literally, the single fastest nuclear powered carrier in the world (its even her motto - "Ready on Arrival; The First, the Finest; Eight Reactors, None Faster)

    Its a shame they want to decon her in 2013... it amuses me as well that the Big-E's top speed is stated as 33 knots... trust me, she can do that BACKWARDS - her real top speed is classified, but IIRC it is somewhere above 50 knots given the fact that she can outpace a Mk48 ADCAP torpedo.
     
  16. ricrery Banned Banned

    Messages:
    1,616
    PROVE IT. It says that NO WHERE. But it's clear your wank would make that out to be.

    You are SUCH a liar, you know that? They were INCAPABLE of moving it, oh for fucks sake, why did they require Q's intelligence then?

    Quote it.

    You are a fool. Phasers use ENERGY FREQUENCIES DUR DUR DUR. The Borg could have BILLIONS of projectiles hitting them and not adapt. Oh fuck, constant Phaser fire is out of their ability to adapt to.

    Yeah, like because Romulans use mini black holes, they are capable of moving stars? Your debating skills are so shitty.

    Woohoo! They will MAGICALLY adapt to weapons that casually move past shields? YEAH RIGHT! If they DID adapt, the Gauss Gun would rip those shields apart and go through anyway. As for teleportation, W40k teleportation is not stopped by anything, including shields and neutronium.

    Too bad they are from the Big Bang. They could just erase the galaxy the Federation is from with ZERO effort, I mean, galaxies are BULLETS to them.

    No they weren't and couldn't. Geordi's statement proves it.

    Oh... at 11% more power, the Photon Torpedoes only blew up HALF an asteroid a few dozen meters in MILLIONS OF PIECES. Photon Torpedoes = LOW gigawatt range weaponry. So, even a Borg Cube would be LUCKY to survive a kiloton.

    Woohoo! They can't adapt to energy weapons completely, let alone PROJECTILES.

    "Captain, we are incredibly slowly moving towards the ship"

    "Fire low gigawatt yield phasers and photons, those blow us all the time!"

    A NECRON SHIP. Christ you have bad memory.

    You don't even KNOW the meaning of WANKED. If I said W40k could destroy galaxies, that would be WANKING or WANK. If the Xeelee can destroy galaxies as proven, then it is a POWERHOUSE. Xeelee are just stronger than Star Trek, but fanboys like YOU get butthurt and call anything that beats Trek wank.

    A. Bettik says otherwise.

    That milk coming out of you shouldn't, as 31st century Feds could not beat the Xeelee. I am not even close to having a happy moment when talking about Necrons vs Borg.

    Really? A. Bettik calls you an idiot. Daniel calls you an idiot. Jedi Matt is sympathetic with me getting banned. Rama calls you an idiot when I PM the bullshit you say here. Yeah... people calling me an idiot... Yeah... let me guess, Mith? Oraghan? They don't count. Plus, weren't we debating over SP and Peanuts?

    If you weren't too LAZY to read other people's posts, you'd figure out that there is no known thing about the Photino's Birds outside that they're made of Dark Matter and live in stars.

    They aren't wanked. Q has never even destroyed a galaxy, let alone a universe spanning empire. Q use technology (Q WAR ANYONE?), Xeelee use technology. Xeelee have all the knowledge of the baryonic and tachyonic universe, therefor, they can't be overpowered technologically. No one agrees with your Q being omnipotent bullshit. BECAUSE Q AREN'T OMNIPOTENT YOU FRAKING FOOL!

    Is that why they aren't omnipotent or invincible to even each other? Right? Is that why when time traveling, they actually go to parallel universes, RIGHT? Is that why they can't do things instantaneously (Q Who). Yeah, you're wanking them to omnipotence, while knowing *jack shit* about its meaning.

    Like Q accidentally destroy galaxies when not in their intention? Like how we've never seen a baby Xeelee or even a Xeelee? This means shit.

    "The continuum is not omnipotent, no matter what they say..."
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2010
  17. Shogun Bleed White and Blue! Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    7,635
    If all but one fail-safe gates are released before hand, it will cut the time down considerably.
     
  18. Shogun Bleed White and Blue! Valued Senior Member

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    7,635
    They deconed the SR-71 even thought it is still one of the best, if not THE best.
     
  19. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    Your post is full of fail in so many ways... I wish to God I could meet you face to face, sit you in front of a computer, and show you the nearly infinite ways you are wrong. I'd even go so far as to give you my address if I thought you'd actually come over, but as you're a minor still, I doubt you're allowed to leave the house on your own or be out past curfew...
     
  20. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    Wait, I'm confused - time has nothing to do with it mate. You understand how nuclear warheads work, right?

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    There is, in essence, three explosions to a nuclear bomb - the primary, conventional explosive that triggers the trigger material, causing a small nuclear reaction. This small reaction essentially collides with the bulk of the detonation material, inciting the main nuclear reaction.

    Without the trigger fission, there will be absolutely no nuclear explosion. I'm not sure what fail-safe gates you are referring to.
     
  21. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    13,938
    The SR-71 had a lot of problems, most notably the inability to carry fuel while on the ground.

    Due to the intense heat generated by super-sonic flight at the speeds that craft reached, the entire plane had to be designed to expand. As a result, the plane leaked fuel like a sieve while on the ground, and had to refuel mid-air after everything expanded and sealed up.

    Additional problems included extensive maintenance being required after each flight, the loss of multiple aircraft due to mechanical failures and/or pilot error, and the advancement of orbital surveillance.

    Ultimately, it was politics that doomed the SR-71, as Bill Clinton's 1997 line veto of the $100 million allocated in 1994 to re-activate the SR-71 (which was later determined to have been unconstitutional) allowed the Air-Force to divert that money to other pet projects, sealing the SR-71's fate.

    It was a damn good bird... but I reckon super-cruise aircraft, newer S2A missiles, and the advent of the SCRAMJET engine would have made the SR-71 obsolete anyway. There are theories that the two that remain (officially given to NASA) may still be in use... but there's no proof either way.
     
  22. Shogun Bleed White and Blue! Valued Senior Member

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    7,635
    The are safety mechanisms put into place in the event of an accidental drop and kinda acts as proximity mechanisms, once all the gates are released, it starts the trigger material and it goes boom.
     
  23. Shogun Bleed White and Blue! Valued Senior Member

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    7,635
    They are still the fastest in the world. Scramjet is not applicable in modern aircraft, due to the intense speed, it can only be 1 use.
     
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