Shoot the Darky

Discussion in 'Politics' started by spidergoat, Aug 6, 2010.

  1. Cowboy My Aim Is True Valued Senior Member

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    3,707
    By "context", you really mean that since Obama is part black, all of his critics are motivated by racism. But criticism of white politicians and their policies is based on legitimate, non-racial concerns.
     
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  3. Mrs.Lucysnow Valued Senior Member

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    Well it was Sherrod who admitted to having felt a tinge of racism towards white farmers at one point and then got over it and helped the family as she realized that it was between the 'haves and have nots' not between black and white though she did feel racism still does exist. It was the administration that canned her without asking to see the whole tape or even asking her for an explanation. The NAACP took their time before defending her, and strangely enough it was the rabid right wing conservative Beck who came out and defended Sherrod and said she deserved to have her job back.

    Thinks are never as 'black and white' as they seem

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  5. Black Jack Gen. "Black Jack" Pershing Registered Senior Member

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    From another forum, but if you watch the video you get the idea. Calling the entire Tea Party racist because of comments from a few outliers is ironic considering it's an accusation of generalization made by generalization.
     
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  7. Cowboy My Aim Is True Valued Senior Member

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    I've argued before that Obama is bi-racial rather than black. That argument went over like a lead balloon here at Sciforums.
     
  8. Mrs.Lucysnow Valued Senior Member

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    I also agree with that. I don't believe that a violent crime is any more violent because the person disliked the other due to race or whatever. Murder is Murder and the buck should stop there. As far as extenuating circumstances that can occur in many crimes but I don't see why murder based on a particular dislike for someones race is any different from murdering them because you hated their guts or wanted their wallet.

    I wonder if a black guy who harms another black guy while calling saying 'I'm going to kill you niggar' could be tried for a 'hate crime'

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  9. Cowboy My Aim Is True Valued Senior Member

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    Technically, yes they could.

    I actually believe that, in the long run, hate-crime laws may be more dangerous than the hate-crimes themselves. Empowering the government to dole out extra punishment based on peoples' views is a scary road to go down.
     
  10. Mrs.Lucysnow Valued Senior Member

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    You should ask Gustav whether they made Obama look like Obama or if they made him look like 'sambo'. I thought they went to a lot of trouble to make Obama look like the neat cut guy that he is:shrug:
     
  11. Mrs.Lucysnow Valued Senior Member

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    But that's what I don't understand. We have laws for violent crimes, so why does there need to be a harsher law for a violent crime that is race or religious based? Is it that the laws we have are not harsh enough? If so then change the sentence for all violent crimes by making them more severe across the board.

    We should legislate against the deed not the sentiment.
     
  12. Gustav Banned Banned

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    12,575

    grow a brain please


    to Gary Thomas Kelley, every mexican is a potential victim. you piss this guy off not by stepping on his toes but by just being who you are
     
  13. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    I agree, hate crime is thought crime. But I'm not talking about whether people should be allowed to hate.
     
  14. Giambattista sssssssssssssssssssssssss sssss Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah. I do.

    Why? Is that what you're doing? Say what you will. Call me a racist. I don't really care. People call each other everything in the book. Why would this be any different.

    Maybe you asked some questions I missed?

    Did I miss something? This thread is called "Shoot the Darky". The racist element was assumed by the title. The obviously Obama effigy was considered racist by default.

    I, and others, presented other effigies as examples, but only the Obama effigy was considered racist.

    This is a discussion about why one effigy is racist, the other not. I don't recall this discussion being about Tiassa's definition of racist imagery.

    The only real outrageous thing about the subject of this discussion is the ridiculous assertion by the people who made the drawing that it was NOT Obama. That's laughable.

    That it's undeniably racist. That's debatable.
     
  15. Giambattista sssssssssssssssssssssssss sssss Valued Senior Member

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    That's what it seems to be. As long as the skin color is white, the criticism is right.
    Racism is a freebie for anyone who is not purebred Caucasian.
    Funny. I've heard the race card being used by African-Americans towards others who are "more white" than they are. Call it the blacker-than-thou phenomenon.

    I thought the fact that they insisted it WASN'T Obama's depiction was the really hilarious thing. Maybe they were revealing a truth about alien clones???

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    Thought crimes are a problem in today's world. Many different types.

    As far as Gustav's point, criminal recidivism is a real consideration. It isn't confined to racism or other perceived hate crimes.
    There is a certain class of people who will continue to do what they do even if they have been caught and punished fairly. There are chronic liars and storytellers, kleptomaniacs, con artists, rapists, molesters, racists, etc.

    I think any label that will brand someone for life should be used sparingly and used truthfully. I would advise against this tendency to say, "Well, you committed a crime in this category, so according to us, you're going to continue committing such crimes. Maybe we'd better keep you locked up indefinitely?"

    I think that mentality is bad. Dangerous even. If someone has demonstrated a clear pattern to committing a certain crime, and they have been caught, and tried before, then sure. But simply throwing someone into a category because of free speech or because someone cried foul should not be considered a legitimate reason for blacklisting.

    My brother knew a guy who was permanently labeled a "sex offender" because he took a piss in public somewhere. Indecent exposure= sex offender. That label carries so much unintentional baggage with it, and it shouldn't be thrown around lightly.
     
  16. Giambattista sssssssssssssssssssssssss sssss Valued Senior Member

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    4,878
    You're a sex offender?!?! Gross! That's okay that you're my neighbor, just don't come near my children, okay?
     
  17. madanthonywayne Morning in America Registered Senior Member

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    Obama Effigy Replaced by Hillary and Bush
    Bad News:
    Another Carnival had people an effigy of Obama, this time people were throwing balls at it:

    Good News:
    They've replaced it with a Hillary and Bush effigy!
     
  18. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    At least they aren't disrespecting our dear leader.
     
  19. Giambattista sssssssssssssssssssssssss sssss Valued Senior Member

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    4,878
    Yeah, you don't want to disrespect them while they are the sitting president, right?

    I'm sure you never even thought of disrespecting our last prez until he got out of office.
     
  20. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    If you say so

    If you say so. To the other, I suppose it is an answer.

    Frankly, I don't understand why you or anyone else arguing a similar position are so determined to avoid the point upon which the talk of racism is founded.

    Bells, Clusteringflux, and myself, at least, have noted a specific point about the game that you, Cowboy, Madanthonywayne, and others have chosen to ignore; or else you're responding to the thread without paying attention to what's on the record.

    I would dispute that. Please review the posts Bells and I have exchanged, and Clusteringflux's early post in this thread. "Default" is a term which, in this case, ignores a certain point on the record.

    You have given no reason why anyone would have denounced even the other Obama effigies as racist. And I'm pretty sure I asked about that. Perhaps I forgot to.

    So other people's reason for suggesting racism has nothing to do with the fact that you dispute their outlook? Suddenly the word "default", as you have applied it, makes a bit more sense. I mean, it's not like Bells and I were being subtle about it.

    I would say your use of the word "default" might qualify as outrageous, or at least "ridiculous". Then again, your low esteem for the reasons on record why some people see racism starts to explain that.

    Then debate the point. Don't just ignore people's arguments because they are inconvenient to your complaint.
     
  21. madanthonywayne Morning in America Registered Senior Member

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    A review of the above quoted posts would suggest that you are referring to the antennae of the Obama effigy? Is that correct?

    That seems a pretty thin basis upon which to hang a charge of racism. The game is called "Alien Attack". It was not created specifically as an opportunity to shoot at an effigy of Obama, but rather as a generic shooting game which has featured various celebrities (movie stars) over the years (although the article does not make clear whether said celebrities were also portrayed with antennae).
    Alien Attack has previously featured movie stars, but not presidents, and will soon be changed to a pirate theme to attract more kids, Good said.
    .
    If anything, I'd imagine that putting antennae on the Obama effigy was done to make him fit into the "alien attack" theme, not in some sort of subtle reference to his purported status as a non-citizen (these are Carnies for Pete's sake).

    Another reason for the antennae is to provide a fig leaf for the proprietor to point to in an attempt to claim that the image was not really Obama (perhaps for fear he'd run afoul of the Secret Service):
    Irvin L. Good Jr., the president of Goodtime Amusements, of Hellertown, said the game wasn't meant to depict President Barack Obama. But he acknowledged he's received two complaints since the game debuted in April, including one complaint at the Big Time.

    "Yes, a woman talked to me about it," Good said Tuesday. "She said she was offended by it. I said if you are, you might want to be. But you're interpreting it as being Obama.

    "We're not interpreting it as Obama. The name of the game is Alien Leader. If you're offended, that's fine, we duly note that."
     
  22. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    37,884
    Not quite, but thanks for "trying"

    Nope. Strangely, we were a bit more explicit about our concern. Obviously, not enough so, since you missed it.

    There you go.

    In what way are celebrities "alien"? Movie stars? Hollywood is often described as a world unto itseld, both by those within and without. Obama? Well, much the same can be said of the Beltway culture. However, even some of those who might agree with your defense against charges of racism have already disagreed with what comes next:

    It is easy enough to defer to naivete in some cases. Not this one. The pathetic excuse that this was not Obama undermines the "celebrity" notion for reasons already dicussed in this thread.

    Every once in a while individuals, and sometimes bodies politic are quite clear in their actions. And sometimes, there are some who would blindly defend those actions. Some might wonder why, but in this case there isn't much question. One who perpetually defends low behavior of Republicans and racists alike defends with anemic excuses the stupidity of racism directed against the very face of what he opposes politically. There is no mystery here, except for those who wonder at the blindness of the excuse. Some might resent the idea that the defense is calculated stupidity, while others might wonder what, if anything, they owe such a character who would posit such a perverse, naive, and silly argument.

    To believe that the depiction was not Obama requires crippling naivete, or else supremely cynical calculation and belligerence.
     
  23. madanthonywayne Morning in America Registered Senior Member

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    Indeed. Perhaps you then have your answer regarding why no one has responded to whatever the hell it is you're talking about.
    You did note that I questioned whether the movie stars were also featured with antennae, didn't you? That's because I was wondering the same thing. On the other hand, would it be that hard to believe that, say, Tom Cruise was an alien?
    Which is why I referred to that claim as "a fig leaf"? Of course the effigy was Obama.
    The argument was made by the proprietor of the game and was his direct response to a complaint about the game, so it is certainly relevant to our discussion.

    Despite the fact that the argument is clearly BS, he may well have believed it would shield him legally from trouble with the Secret Service in the same way that many companies get away with counter fitting designer brands by making some slight change:
    For instance, it’s still possible to find knock-offs of Coach’s popular demi bag despite the company’s fight; the fakes replace the trademarked Cs, adorning the small canvas bags, with Gs. The same goes for Burberry; although the company makes its stance about the trademarked plaid quite clear in communication materials, replicas of Burberry purses and scarves using variations of the colors are popular knock-off items.
     

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