Counterproposal: Don't dress like a slut...

Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by visceral_instinct, May 22, 2008.

  1. CutsieMarie89 Zen Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,485
    That is so untrue. You get picked on or harassed when you stand out. I went to a party in a turtleneck sweater, pants, and a jacket over the turtleneck. Everyone else was in nightclub attire. And practically every guy in the room came up to me and made some retarded comment about what I was wearing and if I wanted help taking it off. I was dressed so far from skimpy the catholic church would have approved, but I stood out. And I guess the men there some how inferred that less skin must mean she wants it more.
     
  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    37,884
    This and that

    It's an interesting comedy routine, Deep, but you're going to need to polish it a bit before it even approaches the possibility of being funny. In its present form, well, I don't believe you're stupid, but the argument certainly is. People might well miss the joke entirely.

    • • •​

    You kind of opened a can of worms with the elephant crack. They'll burrow under your skin if you let them.
     
  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. Gustav Banned Banned

    Messages:
    12,575

    interesting, is the corollary then that the frump has a better chance of getting raped that the ones who have their tits and ass hanging out? is that the point you are stressing? is that the norm?

    have i been the only guy in the world to prefer ho's over frumps?
    is it just me that will take full advantage of a low cut neckline and peer down it? is it just me that ogles the ass under the miniskirt while ignoring all that are covered up?

    according to you, it certainly appears so
     
  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. Gustav Banned Banned

    Messages:
    12,575
    there are those that grudgingly acknowledge, in some fashion or another, that attire could possibly influence a rapist to commit a crime. yet it is still maintained that females should have the freedom to wear what they want, when ever and where ever. they do this in spite of knowing there is a possibility of these females being targeted and victimized. a victim of a heinous crime. a crime that could result in a death. in many deaths.

    they do this by playing a numbers game. the odds are against it
    i ask then, is this a gamble you would take with a loved one? a daughter? a sister? would one not think that one death, is one too many

    these attitudes are callous, unfeeling and barbaric
    if a crime is commited in light of this, i hold these advocates of freedom to be culpable in this crime. they are sending these women to their deaths

    /smirk
     
  8. Gustav Banned Banned

    Messages:
    12,575

    seek therapy, sniffy
    the trauma appears to be quite extensive
    you could perhaps be able to lead a normal life
    eventually


    i must confess that touched me
    i really dont know what to say
    perhaps a vacation?
    step back a few paces and reevaluate?
     
  9. Gustav Banned Banned

    Messages:
    12,575

    it turns out that no bras were actually burnt. at least none that were officially known to have been set on fire

    /surprised and amused

    I am intrigued by the fact that most (all?) of the contributions to this thread have taken it for granted that the 'bra-burning' myth is negatively charged. It's clear that it has found currency as a basis for ridiculing feminism -- but then the ridiculing of feminists has a venerable tradition, even when they're doing entirely unridiculous things like demanding the vote.

    For me, as a junior member of the '68 generation (I didn't get to Atlantic City, busy organising the movement to win girls the right to wear pants to my high school), the image of burning bras has strong positive resonances. It is a reminder, first, that the feminist critique of patriarchy has always been conscious of the power of symbols and symbolic representation both in confirming and in subverting the social order; this insistence has often been the subject of ridicule or (as in the 'Political Correctness debate') demonization. I don't think the self-conscious analogy with draft-card burning is forced or trivial; as a symbolic act, both represent refusals to collaborate in other people's appropriations of one's body. Of course having to wear a bra/a corset/a gender/caste uniform in the form of highly sexualised clothing is of a different order from being sent to die on the battlefield. But I wonder whether thirty years on we have forgotten how tyrannical the dress code for girls and women was until the 1970s, what it took to resist - for example - the pressure to put a daughter into a 'training bra' at the age of 11 or so, and how much the everyday experience of women's liberation had to do with wearing what you wanted and feeling comfortable in your clothes. So if what Robin Morgan said was that they *weren't* going to burn their bras, she was nevertheless referring to what was then a real issue in language that feminists would understand. Dress reform -- another venerable tradition in feminist history... Eve Rosenhaft dan85@liverpool.ac.uk 24 June 1998



    very excellent reading. i have become a bit more sensitive
     
  10. sniffy Banned Banned

    Messages:
    2,945
    /snicker

    Don't pretend that you don't 'get it' gustav. My poor attempts at prose are the messages that women across the ages, across continents, across cultures have rammed into them every waking day. Whatever random and not so random acts of violence are visited upon them regardless of 'precautionary' steps they might take to avert attention or avoid the violence somehow they are blamed. Well perhaps if you hadn't.......or perhaps if you'd been more.....careful...? If only you'd listened when I warned you....? Perhaps you should....re-evaluate?

    I mean it's only a discussion on a internet forum ja? lol

    Now then should we turn our attention to men. And what they can do to avert harrassment/rape/abuse/violence?

    She asked for it.

    Ooh radical pc feminazi

    Unless you want to go down the route of telling your daughters. Well dear basically you just can't trust men so put on this chastity belt and behave yourself.

    /spit
     
  11. codanblad a love of bridges Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,397
    a couple of thoughts, def not perfected, so feel free to criticise as you please.

    i'm not sure if this is what deep thought was referring to, but here's the problem i'm discussing. should a chick feel like abusing you, what recourse do you have? to publicly admit you were sexually abused by a chick, would be the most embarassing and degrading blow to your manhood and reputation. a lot of guys would think you're gay for resenting any kind of sexual encounter with a chick. and as trivial as these things might sound, the ramifications within sporty/macho male society could be huge.

    if you hit a girl, you're a girl basher. social suicide, plus boyfriends/upstanding male citizens might bash you. this is however, a typical male conflict resolution method. i understand the need to prevent violence against women, but is there a possibility its gone so far as to give women more rights than men? equality anyone?

    that's all, i'm sure there's problems with it, just contributing.
     
  12. codanblad a love of bridges Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,397
    am really glad to read your posts randwolf, i agree with what you said.

    i did notice no one disputed what you said, and that when you mocked them for being silent, sniffy's response of 'i know you are, you said you are, but what am i?' greatly amused me (post 260)

    the silence is because they were (seemingly) never interested in debating the topic anyway. if you were suggesting there are factors involved in the motivation of a percentage of rapists, they figure you're a sexist rape promoter.

    and just cos i remembered, who used the 'theres heaps of girls in bikinis at the beach, why isn't there rape there' argument? cos yeah, amongst hundreds of people in broad daylight is ideal for rape. plus the horrificly abrasive issue of sandy vaginas. farrrrk that.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2008
  13. sniffy Banned Banned

    Messages:
    2,945
    codanblad I didn't reply to randypandys posts at the time because I'm living in a completely different time zone


    sandy vaginas ha ha ha he he he

    keep laughing your jokes are sooo very funny :bravo:
     
  14. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,201
    sniffle, sniffle... I think maybe you didn't reply because you're living on a completely different planet? You know, one where logic doesn't exist?

    Anyway, let's summarize..

    Maybe we can agree on some points:
    1. Rape exists
    2. Rape is usually perpetrated on women
    3. Rape is bad
    4. Reducing the incidence of rape is good

    You with me so far?

    Now it gets dicey...

    How can society as a whole or people as individuals reduce the incidence of rape?

    Take self defense courses?
    (*everyone nods, yes good idea...*)

    Lock your doors when you're home alone?
    (*uhhhh, well, I guess, but that might infringe on a women's rights...*)

    Don't walk down innercity streets nekkid?
    (*OMG NO!, that would be unfair, why are you trying to say she asked for it? Obviously, you have transferred blame to the victim, yada yada...*)

    Don't you see a small problem here? Maybe your emotionalism and revulsion about the subject is clouding your judgement?

    Let me ask a very simple question:

    Would you advocate that it is a good idea for your daughter (girlfriend, sister, mother, etc.) to walk around a known criminal area in a bikini?

    Yes or No? If no, why not?

    And let's assume that for some reason she wants to do this, don't avoid the issue...
     
  15. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,201

    Hi CutsieMarie89, I think I might have misunderstood you here...

    Are you saying that your attire actually influenced "practically every guy in the room"'s behavior?

    OMG, no say it ain't so...

    That would mean that you could influence the probability of certain reactive behavior by what you choose to wear (or not wear). How can this be? Isn't sexual harassment just, like, totally random?
     
  16. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    37,884
    It's a difficult issue

    What you're describing a major social problem. The masculine archetype you describe, however, is something that men invite on themselves. And no, it's not right. Considering certain of Gustav's points, I wrote:

    However, I would propose that, for instance, a tremendous portion of the thousands of rapes taking place on and around American college campuses each year—mostly date rapes—could be eliminated in the future if our society and families spent more resources educating our children in the nature and necessity of basic human respect. Many date rapists simply don't understand what they've done wrong. And if they do, they find within the culture plenty of ammunition with which to defend themselves. Playing hard-to-get? You could tell by her eyes? And, yes, this or that about whatever she was wearing at the time ....

    .... As I said, these precautions are an open-ended proposition. And they fail to address the perpetuation of ideas justifying or even encouraging rape. It's like that old anti-drug commercial: "Who taught you to do this stuff?" You, alright? I learned it by watching you!

    One looks at his son and says, "What the hell were you thinking? Where the hell do those ideas come from?" And then the son replies with any number of strikingly familiar phrases. The father hears, in his son's words, his own voice.​

    What you are describing, Codanblad, is the result of a social travesty. By and large, we teach misogyny to our sons. Likewise, we teach them a perverse notion of masculinity that hides physical and sexual abuse behind a wall of silence. (Ironically, this is symptomatic of misogyny, but we can save that for another time.)

    It seems we're on the same page on this count.

    A tale of woe that might help clarify (or confuse) the issue:

    It is ironic, in a way, that I find cause to recount this story; I'm receiving soon an archival record of certain events that led to my daughter's conception. But I didn't find out right away, of course. This is a familiar story for some around here, so I would ask them to bear with me.

    One night my partner and I hopped a bus downtown and then walked several blocks to a bar called the Owl & Thistle, that we might see the final performance of a jazz band some of our friends played in. And it was a good show. Guinness and Tullamore Dew; we got ourselves good and hammered.

    When we left, we got into a bizarre fight. For some reason, my partner, who was known to whine about her diminutive stature, womanhood, and the dangers of walking in the dark—it was her excuse for keeping a gun she never carried, what if she needed it when downtown? well, it's probably going to be at home in the lock-box, since she never carried it—suddenly wanted to walk back to the bus stop a different way. Under the freeway. Where it is unlit. Where the homeless are. The very place she fears. Specifically the fight was about two Hispanic-looking men walking up the hill in the light. It seemed she wanted to avoid them. When I raised the point that they were nothing to be afraid of, she went off. "Fine!" she stormed. "You go your way." So I did. Frankly, not only was it better-lit and safer, I was drunk and wanted to hit the hill early in the walk, instead of at the end. Called on her bluff, she set off behind me, following about fifteen feet behind me.

    As we rounded the corner halfway up the hill into a well-lit alley that had become a pedestrian commercial plaza, she shouted, "Doesn't it even matter to you that I'm carrying your baby inside me?"

    And that stopped me in my tracks. Several thoughts struck at once. I was, for once, completely at a loss for words. Was she bluffing again? Was she serious? Was she just drunk ... oh, wait a minute, she's fucking loaded. And so was I, so I decided I would worry about that part in the morning.

    What came out of my mouth was, "No." And I shrugged, turned, and continued walking toward the bus stop.

    She followed. We emerged from the alley and turned up the second leg of the hill. Crossing the street, we headed north toward the bus stop. I walked in silence, listening to her footsteps behind me. When I could not hear them, I stopped and looked back.

    "Don't you ever leave me downtown again!" she stormed, and hit me as hard as she could, knocking me backward over a bicycle rack.

    In the moment of calculating my response, sprawled out over the bike rack, I watched a passing police car slow down. The cop was not looking at us. He was looking at me. Waiting to see what I did.

    I decided I would not hail him and have him arrest her for assault: there was no way I was sending the woman allegedly carrying my child to spend the night in a jail cell. I extricated myself from among the bicycles, straightened my jacket, and resumed walking without a word.

    My annoyance at the cop was gone instantly. My embarrassment before the passing faces on the street evaporated instantly. More important than the fact that I had just been thrust into the ranks of DV victims was the one thing I just couldn't fathom: The woman carrying my child was goddamned, shitfaced, unholy drunk.

    And yes, there is a selfish part of me that still resents the fact that she had to get so drunk before she could tell me she was pregnant. But she was pregnant, and she was drunk. Quite frankly, I felt like I had bigger things to worry about than the fact that she'd just taken a swing at me.​

    The moral of the story, if there is one to be had, is that for some reason I have managed to escape most of the bonds of the masculine myth in American culture; not knowing yet whether she would abort or keep the child, I chose to worry about my daughter. And to this day I believe that was the right decision. I will probably believe so for the rest of my life. And for me, it was because I have somehow escaped those parts of the masculine myth that I was able to decide as I did.

    We teach our sons into sickness. And, yes, as you have pointed out, the result is tragic.

    Must sleep. I will refer you to an argument I posted earlier this year in a fairly bizarre discussion of equality between the sexes. Please understand that the tone of the excerpt does not reflect on you, but rather the discussion at the time:

    Now, just stop and think about all the history that goes into the social conditions that compel men to not report domestic violence. Just think about it for a minute. Because that isn't "women's fault". It's all of our faults. So instead of getting pissed off about the Violence Against Women Act, which responded to specific problems in society, start asking about why men, and also society in general have not taken certain steps. It's not because NOW or any other group of women are holding back such efforts. So stop blaming them for our inadequacy. Stop blaming our mothers for our fathers' doing (or lack thereof). (#1764572/73)​

    We can work out any rough patches, or anything I've missed, later.
     
  17. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,201
    Let's see... First of all, I completely agree with everything stated here. However, let's think about the cost/benefit ratio...

    1. Dress appropriately - cost: some inconvenience, perhaps even minor loss of freedom. benefit: oh, I don't know, the prevention of even one rape?
    (Again, appropriately is stressed, as I have tried to say before, it is not necessarily the scantiness of clothing at issue here, at least not for me. It is more a matter of simply acknowledging that behavior, in this case choice of attire, can affect outcome. Wear a bikini to the beach, evening clothes to a cocktail party, sexy clothes to the nightclub, conservative clothes to the office, etc.) Now, I don't consider this view misogynist, or even sexist, because I advocate the exact same thing for males!

    2. ...separating female children from male family members - cost: Complete disintegration (for good or bad) of the nuclear family. Loss of many enriching experiences while growing up. Lack of appreciation for others viewpoints. An even larger gap in understanding between the sexes. Perhaps, an even greater occurence of "stranger" rapes later on in life, because we tend to attack that which we do not understand... benefit: The prevention of several rapes.

    This part of your argument seems reactionary in its own right. Try this analogy - I will lock my doors at night because it is very easy for me to do, and will help prevent burglary. I will not surround my house with a moat, a ten foot high brickwall topped with concertina wire, and post armed guards about the grounds. Why not? Isn't it obvious that these measures would probably eliminate a far greater percentage of home invasions than a $2.00 latch? Well, maybe, but at what cost? I hope this clarifies things a little...


    Huh? I'm not following this... "Evenly around this argument?" What are you going on about? I draw on whatever I think might aid in conveying a point of view, whatever is expedient.


    Who here, or anywhere else has "advocated" rape, explicitly or de facto? Isn't this position founded on an implicite interpretation of a particular post? I highly doubt anyone is condoning rape. Of course, you can argue that "they don't know they are doing it, it's subconcious", but I just don't buy it. Where is your evidence of this "advocacy of rape", de facto or otherwise?


    Strictly speaking, I suppose you are right, our lives will be diminished to some extent. This does not change the fact that precautions may reduce the chance of sexual assault. Some sort of balance is called for, this aspect of the world is no different than any other - life is a tradeoff.


    Hey, I love topless beaches. The more the better...


    sto·ic:
    n.
    1. One who is seemingly indifferent to or unaffected by joy, grief, pleasure, or pain.
    2. A member of an originally Greek school of philosophy, founded by Zeno about 308 B.C., believing that God determined everything for the best and that virtue is sufficient for happiness.

    Who said anything about women being expected to be stoic? And what does this have to do with anything? Furthermore, I thought the concept of whether precautions and prudence offered anything more than "an illusion of safety" was the whole issue here. What if it is not an illusion? What then? What if it is real in at least some cases? Why would we throw out the idea? Is the cost/benefit ratio too low? Are we simply unable to discuss the topic because of the "de facto" implications? Maybe?


    Cite your source... Even in your opinion, what does "infintesimal" mean? How "infintesimal" is the effect to the rape victim(s) in question?


    This is obviously an opinion, and one that I disagree with. If we can gain consensus on the basic idea that behavior can alter the likelihood of sexual assault, perhaps we can move on to a discussion of what is prudent in this area. I have tried to head this debate in that direction several times. Problem is, this line of reasoning gets sidetracked and bogged down in the whole "transferring blame /responsibilty" and "misogyny" issue. That doesn't not seem constructive to me, but I am at loss as how to proceed. Do you have any ideas on how to "move on", so to speak?


    Personally, I think the choice of the words "asking for it" was certainly not a wise one. However inappropriate those words may have been though, I would hope that people are mature enough to look past this and focus on the actual issue. Can a woman's behavior influence her likelihood of being sexually assaulted / raped? If so, what measures make sense? Could we just try addressing these questions without the inflammator rhetoric prevalent thus far? Like, please?


    Tiassa, perhaps we are frustrated, can you blame us? As far as "personal pride" is concerned, I'm afraid you have lost me again. (Not an unheard of state for me...

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    )


    No, but neither is burying your head in the sand and ignoring the central issue. Can a woman's behavior (attire if you prefer) alter the probability of sexual assault? If so, what sensible steps can be taken to mitigate the risk? Aren't these the real questions? As far as specifics, I can't even seem to get consensus that it is not a good idea to walk naked down certain city streets, let alone the advisibility of wearing a turleneck sweater to a cocktail party. That's ... well, it's not exactly helpful, is it?


    OK, and...?


    Theoretically, yes. But, and it is a big but, is that advisable? What are the costs / benefits?


    No, it doesn't "transfer the responsibility". If anything, it would seem to empower women. Wouldn't you rather have some control of your destiny than simply be told "deal with it, that's life"?


    How does prudence preclude implementation of any other valid methods of preventing rape?


    It seems to me that paranoia is rampant on both sides of this discussion. That's ... well, it's not exactly helpful, is it?


    What exactly are you getting at here? It seems to smack of determinism. Are you proposing that there are a "fixed" number of rapes that are going to occur regardless? That if one person reduces their chances of being sexually assaulted, it increases someone else's chance? Perhaps I misunderstood your point...


    It persists because it intuitively seems to have merit. And, if there is any validity to the "precautionary" argument, it certainly is not going to be "insignificant" to the individual who's destiny is altered by taking those precautions.


    We are in complete agreement here.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2008
  18. Gustav Banned Banned

    Messages:
    12,575
    nice
    it is nice to see all simply just getting along
    however, a cautionary note to the feminazis
    if the lynch mob reassembles, i will hammer in the points with a sledgehammer
    the ridicule will not be pretty
     
  19. sniffy Banned Banned

    Messages:
    2,945
    Ok lets play

    Randwolf et al:

    I used to live in a big old city. Buzzing! Very cosmopolitan, great nightlife. I went out clubbing/socialising most weekend with friends; a mixed bunch; good fun had by all. Live and let live. I was probably the most street wise of the group because I actually lived in the city and had done for years whereas most of my pals lived in the 'burbs.

    Hey! I lived in the city so I took the 'precautions'. I was fit and could run fast and I never wore shoes that would stop me from running. Anyway if ever i did wear shoes that would make it difficult to run I figured I could kick them off and run like hell or even use them as a weapon.

    OK. So when the clubs were out we never hung around with the drunks cos we knew it could easily 'kick off' usually over some trivial matter. We didn't drink too much you see cos that's very risky isn't it? And we didn't have that much money to spend anyway. OK. So I would ALWAYS walk home as it wasn't that far. Sometimes people would sleep over and we'd all walk home together.

    How many precautions is that now? Anyway...another thing I always did was wear a long double-breasted coat which buttoned up the front. This was a concession to my Mother who years before had said:

    "You're not going out dressed like that are you." (yes she really said it!) Well as a teenager I did go out 'dressed like that' to spite her of course but as I got a BIT older and moved into the city I could see the sense. So long coat of an indescript brownish colour (not black because black has a funny effect on some people, doesn't it)?. Buttoned up at the front. Collar up.

    Have I mentioned the long hair yet? Ohh yes lovely wavy locks right down my back. Ahh but some people are funny about long hair aren't they? So when I put on my coat I tucked the hair in so in the dim night it just looked like short hair. Ok now another thing I've always hated handbags and would NEVER carry one cos they were an easy target for theft and identified you as a bit girlie (feminazi!). I would only ever take out money stashed in pockets , door keys and a comb - the latter two of course that any self respecting self defence teacher would tell you can be used as weapons. So whenever I walked along I always kept a hand on my keys with one of them primed for a good eye gouging.

    Now the other thing a self defence teacher will tell you, you know as we are on the subject, is about attitude and eye contact. Funnily enough dog handlers will tell you the same thing but I guess that is irrelevant. What they tell you is this; Keep to well lit areas and main roads where possible; don't take short cuts; walk tough and swiftly as if you are have somewhere to get to. Don't engage anyone in eye contact as eye contact can act as a trigger. If you hear footsteps behind you cross to the other side of the road, if footsteps persist and you feel threatened go to a brightly lit house and hammer on the door; shout, scream, shout "no" or "help", although bear in mind that this can agitate a potential assailant and actually precipitate an attack.

    Right. We there was this one night. Went out, largish group. Usual precautions taken but there was someone new that night. Friend of a friend not from the city; just visiting.

    "God" she said " You're not walking home on your own are you? Do you know how dangerous that is? You're crazy!"

    Before you know it the whole lot of them joined in. You know the noobs from the burbs. Had been 'letting' me walk home alone for years "Pity anyone who tries to mess with you sorta thing". Any way the taxi was summoned. They even clubbed togehter to pay. Awww...how sweet!

    Now there's a whole set of rules about taxis isn't there. Phone a reputable company, don't hail one from the street, take the car number, etc etc. Don't talk to them. Don't engage them in eye contact via their rear view mirror. Don't let them drop you right at outside your door (next door is safer), have money and keys ready. etc etc

    So I get's in the taxi. It was only ten minutes by car. We get just a few doors from my house. He stops the car. He barks the fee and turns around to collect it ("keep the change" I says). His eyes were very watery and bloodshot I remember thinking "shit this guys as high as a kite".


    Just out of interest. What do you think happened next?
     
  20. sniffy Banned Banned

    Messages:
    2,945

    /screams runs away
     
  21. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,201
    Duhhhh, Idaknow, something bad?

    I suppose if you had not taken these 15 precautions, you would have been better off? Do you no longer take these precautions? Why or why not?

    Did you ever consider the possibility that these precautions might have prevented unpleasant encounters prior to your fateful taxi ride?

    Are you telling other people (or women if you prefer, I've lost track of which is the PC way to ask...) not to take these same precautions? If so, why? What's the downside?
     
  22. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,201
    Oh, and by the way sniffy...


    Care to actually address these questions, or can we just look forward to some more anecdotes?
     
  23. visceral_instinct Monkey see, monkey denigrate Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    7,913
    Ok, as that split hair means so much to you, I'll replace the word rape with sexual assault. Now answer my question. And I'm not little, I'm slightly over average height, just for the record y'know?

    Bollocks. If someone takes one look at my leather jacket and camouflage pants and thinks 'destructive violent mosher girl' that's their problem, not mine.

    Damn. How am I supposed to go mountain biking in one of those? All that flapping fabric would get caught up in the gears and fucking kill me...

    Ok, sarcasm over. It's actually not a funny subject.

    Women in burkas do get raped. I heard of a woman in some far eastern country who got assaulted, I think, because the wind blew the burka close to her body so the outline of her breasts was visible. (sorry, it was ages ago, I can't provide a link.)

    I won't try and argue exactly how insane it is to expect a woman to wear one of those, because every time I try and do that it goes over your head.

    EARTHQUAKES DO NOT CHOOSE TO HAPPEN! RAPISTS CHOOSE TO RAPE!

    DT, I feel the need to ask you something. If you saw a scantily dressed woman out at night, would you actually rape her?
     

Share This Page