is water more than the sum of its parts ?

Discussion in 'Pseudoscience Archive' started by thinking, Feb 6, 2009.

  1. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    No, it isn't a given for that's how I thought he meant it .:shrug:
     
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  3. Bishadi Banned Banned

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    no mass can combine without energy...

    so there is another part to h20

    good 'thinking'

    Yes
     
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  5. madanthonywayne Morning in America Registered Senior Member

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    One very unusual and vital property of water is that it actually expands when it freezes. Just about every other substance known to man contracts when it cools, but water expands. This is vitally important to life on earth since it means that ice floats. As a result, bodies of water tend to be covered by a sheet of ice which then serves to insulate the water underneath. Therefore, lakes very rarely freeze solid. If water were like most materials, the ice would sink to the bottom and lakes would freeze solid. This would kill most animal life in them and the frozen solid lakes would take a long time to melt which would probably alter the climate.
     
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  7. Enmos Valued Senior Member

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    Well, it contracts down to 4 degrees Celsius, below that it expands.
     
  8. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    I disagree with this statement, though most liquids contract when freezing, there are a few besides water that expand when solidified, it not an extremely different property from that of other liquids.
     
  9. Trippy ALEA IACTA EST Staff Member

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    Strong enough that you can deflect a stream of flowing water with a charged ruler.
     
  10. thinking Banned Banned

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    yet your statement does not explain what the dipole moment has to do with water being liquid a room temperature

    does it ?
     
  11. thinking Banned Banned

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    I've been told , a few yrs ago that , H2O , burns , gives off heat

    is this true ?

    if true , what is burning ?

    since atomically none of the atomics involved change , in and of themselves , then what is burning ?
     
  12. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

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    10,296
    No, that's just plain silly. The hydrogen is ALREADY burnt (oxidized), water is the oxide of hydrogen just as CO2 is the oxide of carbon - and it (CO2) doesn't burn either.

    You should have learned those simple facts WAY back in school. Did you ever attend school??????
     
  13. thinking Banned Banned

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    1,504

    so are you saying that hydrogen no longer exists ?
     
  14. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

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    Are you just a troll? No one - NOBODY - could be dumb enough to think that!

    If you truly are no more intelligent than you appear here, you need to get completely off the computer and get back into school!!!!!!!!
     
  15. thinking Banned Banned

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    1,504
    no I'm not a troll

    I'm just trying to understand what your thinking


    above
     
  16. Trippy ALEA IACTA EST Staff Member

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    You asked about the strength, and I answered that.

    As far as what it has to do with it being liquid, think about it for a minute.

    What determines the state of a substance at room temperature is the strength of the bonds between the molecules. a stronger dipole moment means stronger electrostatic attraction between molecules,and a higher bioling point.
     
  17. thinking Banned Banned

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    1,504
    okay..

    so since water is made of the oxide of hydrogen ( meaning that hydrogen is +1 and oxygen is -2 ) what still is water ?

    all you have shown is the atomic arrangemnet(s) which are present in-order for water to manifest

    yet still the question remains , " is water more than the some of its parts "

    it seems as though , water is more than the sum of its parts
     
  18. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

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    Just do as I'm doing, Trippy and ignore him. He's doing nothing but wasting our time. I'm not giving him any more of mine. All of his questions have been answered and now he's just droning.
     
  19. thinking Banned Banned

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    1,504
    so now that I have tried and understood where your coming from you cop out Read-Only ?

    and then you tell someone else what to think ?

    hmmmm...................
     
  20. thinking Banned Banned

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    1,504
    I've said this before ;

    we know what constituents water , H2O , we seem to know the chemical reaction

    yet what we don't know is why the chemicals , (2) H -hydrogen and (1) O- oxygen , together , should produce a liquid at room temperature

    ( remember H , is a liquid at -256C and O is liquid at -236C )
     
  21. Trippy ALEA IACTA EST Staff Member

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    ****MODERATOR NOTE****

    The question that is being posed has been answered.

    Why is water a liquid at room temperature? Because of a combination of its strong electric dipole moment, and ability to form multiple Hydrogen Bonds - both of which are simply products of its location on the Periodic table.

    It's a second row element meaning it has a high electron affinity (or electronegativity) this results in a strong dipole moment, because Hydrogen has a low electron affinity (demonstrated by how easily oxidized it is).

    This combines with the fact that each molecule has two lone pairs, and two protons to give water particularly strong intermolecular bonding, as can be seen by observing the trends in the surrounding hydrides.

    Any questions as to whether Water is greater than the "sum of it's parts" (whatever that actually means) are of a pseudophilosophical nature, as such, this thread has been moved to the Pseudoscience forum.
     
  22. Bishadi Banned Banned

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    2,745
    the actual item to remember is liquid H and O cannot combine

    the temp (addition of energy) must accompany the transistion to water

    H at zero

    O at zero

    plus X

    to make water.......................

    it's not extra 'electrons'

    ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

    You will not get an answer in the normal forms....

    this is on 'you' to do your homework

    go beyond the teacher!

    you are already 2 steps ahead............. :shrug:
     
  23. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

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    Pretty much the same kind of babbling we've come to expect from you!:bugeye:

    You certainly are NO rocket scientist and know nothing about that subject either - because LOX and liguid hydrogen are precisely the oxidizer and fuel used in the Space Shuttle. Those rockets fire up just as the SRB is being detached.
     

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