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Orleander's Avatar Orleander
OH JOY!!!! (23,955 posts)
Old 06-01-09, 10:53 AM
 #1
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What with the environment changing and new/different things being put into the atmosphere, has there ever been a new cloud type discovered?
What is this one?
hypewaders's Avatar hypewaders
~ (11,631 posts)
Old 06-01-09, 11:52 AM
 #2
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That's a really tiny image, and hard to make out clearly. To me, it appears to be a broken layer of cumulus (becoming scattered farther from the camera) illuminated by a low sun angle. There are waves visible at that altitude (about 5k' above the camera) that are revealing the wake of upwind mountains. Judging by the period of the waves in the foreground, the winds at that level are probably between 20 and 30 knots. It's relatively cool and stable air, and a cold front with precipitation may have passed through a few hours prior.

Orleander: "has there ever been a new cloud type discovered?"

The basic cloud forms have been defined for centuries, and these are some common characterizations: flat, lumpy, rainy, lumpy-rainy, curly, and high. To standardize (and sound more impressive) it's common to use latin words for these descriptors: Stratus, cumulus, nimbus, cumulonimbus, cirrus, and alto, respectively. There are various compound words made up of these descriptors, like "cumulonimbus" (lumpy raining cloud) for example. Some less common cloud types haven't ever gotten latin names- for example, roll clouds, which are tubular indicators of rather violent rotors. Rotors are the horizontal vortices that can occur in the wake of tall terrain in high wind. Lenticulars are the standing clouds that make visible the upper part of vast atmospheric waves, and they stay in place while smooth, fast winds arc through them. Mushroom and funnel clouds are examples of plain-english descriptors of the more unusual.

It's hard to imagine new cloud types being "discovered" to science from the present. But if you do scientifically describe a significant phenomenon that lacks any established descriptor, you could possibly still put a name to it. If you browse the site below, you'll learn about all sorts of unique cloud phenomena. In general, we've been watching the moods of the sky long enough now, that just about everything you are ever likely to see up there has a name to identify it. The short-term variations in the weather are a lot more dramatic than the centuries-long cycles of climate change. Violent weather may be becoming more frequent, but it's still known phenomena. Except for man-made phenomena- like the ice crystals we paint across the sky when we fly through moist air at high altitude (contrails) and occasional large man-made heat plumes and explosions, there really isn't anything new going on, in terms of clouds.

Orleander's Avatar Orleander
OH JOY!!!! (23,955 posts)
Old 06-01-09, 02:39 PM
 #3
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yeah sorry hypewaders, I couldn't make the pic any bigger.
So its unlikely there will never be any 'new' clouds. I was thinking pollution/air traffic might change it.
thanks for the info/link!!!
hypewaders's Avatar hypewaders
~ (11,631 posts)
Old 06-01-09, 02:51 PM
 #4
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Aircraft do put aloft a lot of carbon/greenhouse gas, but contrails also reflect solar energy back to space which may mitigate their impact somewhat. The global-warming influence is probably far less proportionately than lower-level vehicular pollution, where burning hydrocarbons does not produce such volumes of reflective ice-crystals. Where there is a lot of air pollution in combination with temperature inversions (like the Los Angeles Basin) there certainly is a man-made influence on local weather. It's widely understood that deforestation is changing the atmospheric water cycle on a global scale, and accelerating desertification.
Orleander's Avatar Orleander
OH JOY!!!! (23,955 posts)
Old 06-03-09, 03:42 PM
 #5
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here it is enlarged
Orleander's Avatar Orleander
OH JOY!!!! (23,955 posts)
Old 06-03-09, 03:43 PM
 #6
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what are aspertus clouds?
eburacum45's Avatar eburacum45
Registered Senior User (1,253 posts)
Old 06-03-09, 06:40 PM
 #7
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ah yes; I recognise this. Gavin Pretor-Pinney, founder of the Cloud Appreciation society, believes he has discovered a new kind of cloud. Asperatus clouds are unusual and rare, but have appeared in photos taken all over the globe. He makes a good case, and hopefully the Royal Meteorological society will accept his new cloud type.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...ture=348217732

Enmos's Avatar Enmos
STPSB (39,226 posts)
Old 06-03-09, 06:51 PM
 #8
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And another one (same picture):



And from the same website:

A cloudspotter from Somerset believes he has identified a new type of cloud.
Gavin Pretor-Pinney, from Somerton, who also founded the Cloud Appreciation Society, wants recognition for what he has named the asperatus cloud.

More: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/e...et/8077787.stm


Picture from: http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...1/2?lightbox=1

Last edited by Enmos; 06-04-09 at 05:04 AM..
eburacum45's Avatar eburacum45
Registered Senior User (1,253 posts)
Old 06-03-09, 06:54 PM
 #9
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The last new cloud type to be accepted was cirrus intortus, in 1951

another possible asperatus
Orleander's Avatar Orleander
OH JOY!!!! (23,955 posts)
Old 06-03-09, 06:54 PM
 #10
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Originally Posted by eburacum45
ah yes; I recognise this. Gavin Pretor-Pinney, founder of the Cloud Appreciation society, believes he has discovered a new kind of cloud. Asperatus clouds are unusual and rare, but have appeared in photos taken all over the globe. He makes a good case, and hopefully the Royal Meteorological society will accept his new cloud type.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...ture=348217732

how often do they meet? Is there an American version of this society? What is they approve of this new cloud formation first?
eburacum45's Avatar eburacum45
Registered Senior User (1,253 posts)
Old 06-03-09, 07:02 PM
 #11
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Here's the American equivalent
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/America...ogical_Society

The Cloud Appreciation Society is, on the otherhand, worldwide
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud_Appreciation_Society
http://cloudappreciationsociety.org/
hypewaders's Avatar hypewaders
~ (11,631 posts)
Old 06-03-09, 09:41 PM
 #12
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Wow- interesting images here. I'm sure I overgeneralize when I've called similar forms cumulus mamma (my fancy language for "oh shit are the planes tied down!?). Post 8 was full of surprises for me- at full size, that is nothing like I had perceived from the smaller version. And the second image is really something else, Enmos! Truly amazing and scary skies. Nice links everyone, I've added them to my meteorology bookmarks.

I very much enjoyed the CAS story about the Morning Glory.
Enmos's Avatar Enmos
STPSB (39,226 posts)
Old 06-04-09, 05:05 AM
 #13
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Originally Posted by hypewaders
Wow- interesting images here. I'm sure I overgeneralize when I've called similar forms cumulus mamma (my fancy language for "oh shit are the planes tied down!?). Post 8 was full of surprises for me- at full size, that is nothing like I had perceived from the smaller version. And the second image is really something else, Enmos! Truly amazing and scary skies. Nice links everyone, I've added them to my meteorology bookmarks.

I very much enjoyed the CAS story about the Morning Glory.
I found a larger picture of the second one, and updated the post
Daena
Registered User (2 posts)
Old 06-09-09, 06:50 AM
 #14
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I really like reading this one. I love clouds.
Giambattista's Avatar Giambattista
Improved Mum-Lizard (3,845 posts)
Old 06-16-09, 05:46 AM
 #15
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Originally Posted by eburacum45
The last new cloud type to be accepted was cirrus intortus, in 1951

another possible asperatus
Thanks for the larger picture. I just came across this article at http://www.physorg.com/news163990239.html

I was going to start a new thread, but I guess it's already been done for me!

Interesting. Not something you think about happening though (new cloud classification).
Giambattista's Avatar Giambattista
Improved Mum-Lizard (3,845 posts)
Old 06-16-09, 05:48 AM
 #16
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Originally Posted by Enmos
I found a larger picture of the second one, and updated the post
Nice pictures, Enmos! That second one (the orange swirls) looks almost like some type of water erosion in a cave or something.
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