Holocaust Documentary in Arabic

**~~CheskiChips~~** · 11-24-09, 04:31 PM

I was reading an article someone sent me here... http://www.aish.com/sp/so/70138567.html

I read this specific passage:

Another issue I’m trying to address is how the Arab world is filled with Holocaust denial. This past summer I went to Auschwitz, and I am working to produce the first-ever Arabic documentary about the Holocaust. I want to explain to Muslims in their own language exactly what happened.

Is this true? Has there really never been a documentary in Arabic? Do any of the Arab members know?

**Fraggle Rocker** · 11-24-09, 04:51 PM

* * * * NOTE FROM THE MODERATOR * * * *

I wonder if you'd be more likely to get a response if this were posted in History. I'll give it some time and if not, I'll move it. I understand your reluctance to post it in World Events. There's no scholarship there, just a bunch of people yelling, "I'm right and you're wrong!" It's like reading six blogs at once.

**Mrs.Lucysnow** · 11-25-09, 02:52 AM

Originally Posted by CheskiChips

Is this true? Has there really never been a documentary in Arabic? Do any of the Arab members know?

Does this surprise you really? In Asia there are many who also have never heard of the holocaust or know anything about WW2 in terms of Western history. There are people in Cambodia who think that they experienced the worst genocide in history. When you go on to talk to them about the holocaust they look at you dumbfounded, they have no knowledge of the even nor have they ever heard of 'the jews'.

**Fraggle Rocker** · 11-27-09, 07:13 AM

If the Arabs don't know about the Holocaust, then there's a huge gap in their understanding of Western history. They won't be able to understand why, after the thousand years of antisemitism that was one of the defining traits of European Christianity, there were so many Jewish refugees after WWII--vastly out of proportion to their percentage of the population. And they certainly won't be able to understand why they didn't just go back to their hometowns and scrabble out a fresh start, like the Christian refugees.

In other words, they can't understand how and why Israel ended up in their midst.

**S.A.M.** · 11-29-09, 01:29 AM

I'm not sure that teaching them about the Holocaust will make any difference. Does teaching Americans about the massacre of natives make any concrete difference?

**~~CheskiChips~~** · 11-29-09, 01:33 AM

Originally Posted by Lucysnow

Does this surprise you really? In Asia there are many who also have never heard of the holocaust or know anything about WW2 in terms of Western history. There are people in Cambodia who think that they experienced the worst genocide in history. When you go on to talk to them about the holocaust they look at you dumbfounded, they have no knowledge of the even nor have they ever heard of 'the jews'.

Originally Posted by Lucysnow

Does this surprise you really? In Asia there are many who also have never heard of the holocaust or know anything about WW2 in terms of Western history. There are people in Cambodia who think that they experienced the worst genocide in history. When you go on to talk to them about the holocaust they look at you dumbfounded, they have no knowledge of the even nor have they ever heard of 'the jews'.

There's reason to believe this in 3rd world countries. But most 1st and 2nd world countries have to this point basically disseminated the history of the world through someones eyes. The English have history of the Chinese dynasties, the Americans of the colonialism that existed in India. The South Africans are aware of Kashmir and the Canadians know of the pogroms.

There's no simply reason to explain why an entire area of the world doesn't have even a simple written or video documentary of one of the most genocidal events in history - especially when I occurred less than 1 century ago.

Originally Posted by S.A.M.

I'm not sure that teaching them about the Holocaust will make any difference. Does teaching Americans about the massacre of natives make any concrete difference?

Americans learn throughout grade school the varying opinions on Native Americans. Some choose to fight for their rights to this day, some believe America was in the right. We're talking about 12million person strong population that was cut in half by one genocidal man out of pure unadulterated hatred.

**S.A.M.** · 11-29-09, 01:34 AM

There's no simply reason to explain why an entire area of the world doesn't have even a simple written or video documentary of one of the most genocidal events in history - especially when I occurred less than 1 century ago.

It may be important to you, but outside the west, its not really a big event. I don't think we have an Indian language documentary either.

And although we have Jews in India, I'm sure there are people in Mumbai who have no clue what Jews are. Except for the Muslims and Christians.

In fact, in the context of the British Raj, they would probably see such a documentary as white people killing other white people. In some distant foreign land. Most Arabs would also see it that way.

**~~CheskiChips~~** · 11-29-09, 01:40 AM

And Napolean isn't a huge deal to me either, nor was the Hu Dynasty - the documentaries still exist.

You think there might be a transcendent lesson in such a tale. You know, we watch movies to learn moral lessons, moral principals complexly philosophical or basic. Yet, when the world provides us with a man whose hatred was so genuine and real - the Arabic world turns away in seclusionism?

**S.A.M.** · 11-29-09, 01:42 AM

Its a matter of colonial context. For Asians and Arabs, white atrocities are a matter of history. That they also did it in other places and to other white people is simply an extension of what is currently happening in Iraq and Afghanistan. And Palestine. Israelis are also another white people to most of us.

**~~CheskiChips~~** · 11-29-09, 01:44 AM

So you're saying the documentaries don't exist because the 'non-white-world' doesn't have the mental capacity to distinguish one "white person" from another?

**S.A.M.** · 11-29-09, 01:46 AM

No I'm saying its not as important as issues like poverty, child marriage, malnutrition and globalisation.

People only look to the history of others when they have made peace with their own. How many documentaries on Indian issues have you seen?

**~~CheskiChips~~** · 11-29-09, 01:48 AM

Quite a few that discuss the caste-system. I've also seen a couple that discuss the current Rural --> Urban migration patterns resulting in shanty towns, one which specifically discussed one built in a trash dump which collapsed upon them in the rain killing hundreds. I also think there was a Hollywood movie that directly discussed the issue, Slumdog Millionaires?

**S.A.M.** · 11-29-09, 01:50 AM

Then clearly you should be able to see why we may still not be interested in what some Germans did to Jews 60 years ago?
We're barely able to recognise that its not okay to force people to drink from a well after a dead dog was found in it, because they are low caste.

Such people may "understand" why the Nazis behaved as they did.

**~~CheskiChips~~** · 11-29-09, 01:52 AM

The OP was Holocaust Documentary in Arabic not Holocaust Documentary in Hindi As far as I know, the United Arab Emirates, Iran, Saudi Arabia, and a couple other countries are pretty well off financially. Well enough to make documentaries I imagine.

**S.A.M.** · 11-29-09, 01:53 AM

I've lived in Saudi Arabia, I've even met Jews there. None of them are remotely interested in WWII [forget about Israel]. They are too busy discovering themselves. The Holocaust for them is on the same level as Genghis Khans adventures. For most of them, Israel is about the Palestinian nakba. It would be like going to a native American village and telling them about the history of Pilgrim persecution in England. Or going to Israel and teaching them about Christian persecution of Muslims.

Wow, they've even studied this:

This article examines whether a change has taken place in the attitude of Arab teachers in Israel towards Holocaust education following an in-service study course. The research findings show that after the course the teachers had a better understanding of what took place during the Holocaust and their willingness to know about the tragedy that befell the Jewish people in the Holocaust increased. Nevertheless, the study indicates that the major difficulty with Holocaust education for Arab teachers derives from the Israeli–Palestinian conflict, and from the teachers’ difficulty in ceasing to view the Holocaust and the ‘Nakba’ [the Arab downfall in 1948] as equivalent tragedies.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...b478d1a8c1de58

**~~CheskiChips~~** · 11-29-09, 02:06 AM

The native Americans learn US History. How about you read the opening posts link before saying thinks like "None of them are remotely interested in WWII [forget about Israel]" and stop f*cking bringing up Israel in every damn thread.

There's no inexorable link between Jewish and Israeli history, one is 2000 years old - the other 61. It's your own nations who equated Zionism to Racism, completely separating it from Judaism. The same people who aren't making an Arabic-Documentary about JEWS.

There's legitimacy in claiming that "documentaries don't exist because Arabs believe it's equivalent to the Palestinian oppression" - if so, you're basically saying they care about Palestinians more because they are racist. That is...since the Holocaust ended not too long before the 1948 war. If that's you're answer, be done with it and stop.

**S.A.M.** · 11-29-09, 02:07 AM

If you note, I was responding to Fraggles post. I think most people see their own tragedies as more relevant. The existence of Israel means that for Arabs the Holocaust will always be the reason for the nakba, which will always be more important to them than the Holocaust. So any documentary about the Holocaust will be an explanation of the nakba and will be about the nakba. It could not be otherwise, same as Israelis who make a documentary about WWII would not exclude the holocuast.

I think the guy in the OP is an opportunist. He's probably moved to Israel and converted to Judaism. Hardly the typical Arab. The article is posted on Aish Hatorah for Gods sakes.

The Holocaust museum started by the Palestinian in Nazareth is probably more sincere and less Israeli propaganda

**PsychoTropicPuppy** · 11-29-09, 10:21 AM

Well, considering that 2nd World War didn't just happen on European grounds...and the consequences of said war didn't reach just the West, but also the East I'd say that it's a good idea?

So, because people are too busy with themselves it's pointless to create the "first" Holocaust documentary in Arabic? Obviously they have enough time to bitch about Israel, the UK, the USA, etc., yet they don't seem to have enough time to watch something that would help them to also see the other side? That's an incomprehensible argument for me. But okay, be that way, lets stay ignorant.

**S.A.M.** · 11-29-09, 10:24 AM

Originally Posted by PsychoTropicPuppy

Well, considering that 2nd World War didn't just happen on European grounds...and the consequences of said war didn't reach just the West, but also the East I'd say that it's a good idea?

So, because people are too busy with themselves it's pointless to create the "first" Holocaust documentary in Arabic? Obviously they have enough time to bitch about Israel, the UK, the USA, etc., yet they don't seem to have enough time to watch something that would help them to also see the other side? That's an incomprehensible argument for me. But okay, be that way, lets stay ignorant.

Its not so much about seeing the other side, as having a different perspective. Notice how movies about Vietnam in the US are always about the suffering of American soldiers feeling conscience stricken about the actions of other American soldiers? Now imagine there are no American soldiers in the picture, what would the American perspective be? Who would they identify with? The communists in North Vietnam?

**PsychoTropicPuppy** · 11-29-09, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by S.A.M.

Its not so much about seeing the other side, as having a different perspective. Notice how movies about Vietnam in the US are always about the suffering of American soldiers feeling conscience stricken about the actions of other American soldiers? Now imagine there are no American soldiers in the picture, what would the American perspective be? Who would they identify with? The communists in North Vietnam?

I understand what you mean, but we're speaking of documentaries. Not films. I dislike war films because it's all about this emo war shit, and is biased.
Documentaries are more neutral, and more about facts, more about bringing knowledge, information to us. At least I've never come across documentaries that were biased, and I've watched several from different European countries. Documentaries that portray the 'other' side as I've mentioned such as showing us, the 'White folk', how other nations, cultures live, and what their history is about.