Israel & Palestine (v2)

Discussion in 'Politics' started by hypewaders, Oct 23, 2009.

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  1. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    Israel & Palestine Volume 2

    a continuation of Israel & Palestine (original thread)


    Reference Links

    If you would like to contribute links for general reference here, please ask a moderator. PM Hypewaders




    Israel:

    B'Tselem:Israeli human rights group

    Ha'aretz: left leaning newspaper chronicling Israeli POV

    Zochrot [Remembering]: To educate the Nakba deniers

    ICAHD: Israeli Committee Against House Demolitions

    Machsom watch: tracking abuse at the checkpoints

    Shministim: Israeli teenagers who refuse to join the IDF

    Ometz LeSarev
    [Courage to Refuse]: IDF refuseniks

    ibn Ezra: blog of Joseph Dana from Israel, he is also part of the Ta'ayush movement for Arab-Israeli partnership


    Palestine:

    Maan News Agency: the local news source for most Palestinians

    The Palestine Chronicle: leading online magazine/blog/newspaper for Palestinian issues

    Palestine Remembered: Keeping alive the Palestinian nation

    Bi'lin: a Palestinian village, center of the nonviolent resistance

    Raising Yousuf and Noor: a mother from Gaza [although technically she is American]


    USA:

    Tikun Olam -essays on politics, culture and ideas about Israeli-Arab peace

    Electronic Intifada -news, commentary, analysis, reference materials from a Palestinian perspective

    Jewish Voice for Peace -news, commentary from peace activists inspired by Jewish tradition

    Jews sans frontieres -An Anti-Zionist blog browsing the media

    Mondoweiss -American foreign policy in the Middle East from a progressive Jewish perspective

    Ta'anit Tzedek - Jewish Fast For Gaza

    Lawrence of Cyberia: American activist Diane Mason

    Just World News: by Helen Cobban

    Israel: Balancing Demographics in the Jewish State -Migration Information Source


    U.K.

    "Chatham House" (Royal Institute of International Affairs)



    Australia:

    Antony Loewenstein -Sydney-based journalist/author blog


    Other:

    The Goldstone Report (large .pdf) -UN Human Rights Council, concerning the 2008-2009 Gaza War

    ---------------------------------------------------

    Some tired retired &or retarded threads about Israel/Palestine​

    News from Gaza; News from Gaza 2; Foreign Opinions on Israel; Is Israel in the Wrong?; A Short History; The 2 State Solution; 1 State; Does Israel Target Civilians?; "Concentration Camp"; Hummus War; Shebaa Farms; Right of Return; American Assistance to Israel; "Stolen Land"?;

    ---------------------------------------------------​
    OP /Thread Notes:

    Formerly titled The Promised Thread, the objectives here include accommodation of those who tire of the proliferation of threads on the subject, and better service and encouragement to those who have been disappointed in the curtailment and disruption of discussion and debate surrounding Israeli/Palestinian issues.


    The format of the long promised/threatened thread will be intended to follow the same pattern as would any redirection of following discussions. I hope that the most recent Israel/Palestine events may be discussed briefly in a catch-all thread, until discussion (as is typically the case) turns to revisiting an underlying issue. At that point, I (or another so-inclined fellow moderator) may direct us all to a more appropriate thread in special, well-agreed cases.


    In addition to your patience with the redirection of new threads and posts, I would ask members to scrupulously avoid even the appearance of hateful posts on this general subject. It's a blurry line between being provocative and contributing to the derailment of a discussion- so the success of this initiative will also require redoubled attention to avoiding offense, by giving that fuzzy line a wide berth.

    I'm hoping to devote particular attention as a moderator to an area of discussion that is particularly prone to getting out of hand, and I'm hoping that with some attention to continuity of discussion, we'll create clearer paths to understanding for all sides. I have no desire to implement anything as a moderator that I would find unacceptable as a member. As a member, I am interested in seeing if less tangle of Israel/Palestine threads, along with more respectful debate, may offer something more stimulating and worthwhile here.

    Salaam and Shalom.

    -hypewaders
     
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  3. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    This thread is open for discussion of any interesting political subject pertaining to Israel & Palestine.
     
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  5. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    How about Amira Hass [Israeli journalist who reports from Gaza] and her recent interview where she talks about Israel, Palestine and perceptions of occupation?

    Excerpts:

    Full interview: link
     
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  7. otheadp Banned Banned

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    Hype, in your OP you haven't included a single pro-Israel link. In fact you included only extreme-left organizations under your "Israel" heading. Doubleyou tee eff?
     
  8. CheskiChips Banned Banned

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    It's representative of the internet's distribution of pro and anti Israel websites. Which is fortunately unrepresentative of actual popular opinion.
     
  9. Mrs.Lucysnow Valued Senior Member

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    Water. An Amnesty International report says that Israel is denying Palestinians access to water.
    I don't find this report particularly interesting as water access has been an issue for many years and it makes it look as if it is a 'new' problem when expansionism has always been related to control of this precious resource.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8327188.stm

    http://www.amnesty.org/en/news-and-updates/report/israel-rations-palestinians-trickle-water-20091027

    Israel has denied the reports accuracy.
     
  10. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

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    6,706
    Why does it have to be Israel versus Palestine?

    Were all humans, and the fact is that violence while it may be in our nature, is not our first instinct, it is maybe number 40 on the list. Our first instinct is to come together.

    A girl in my school has a T-shirt that said "arms are for hugs"

    It shouldnt be Israel vs. Palestine, or Palestine vs. Israel, it should be Israel and Palestine, or Palestine and Israel.
     
  11. otheadp Banned Banned

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    Spoken like a typical Israeli --- yearning for peace, hoping it'll catch on on the other side, the side that is bloodthirsty on the grassroots level, unfortunately.

    As for the NGO reports, they aren't worth the paper on which they're printed.
     
  12. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    How would you characterize actual popular opinion regarding Israel, český?
     
  13. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    The typical Israeli that supported the Gaza massacre, occupies Palestine, is a recent immigrant to a Jewish state in Palestine and who ignores the fact that for a Palestinian to exist, he/she must be registered with Israel but is not a citizen and does not have the same rights as an American Jew in Israel?
     
  14. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    why because they show what you would rather keep hidden?

    If Israelis want peace why aren't they willing to do the things required for peace?
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2009
  15. mike47 Banned Banned

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    My position is very clear : Palestinians should have their own country with their own rules, laws, police and armed forces . Israel has the support of the US and NATO countries because the Jewish lobby is very strong there .
    Those who say the Muslim Palestinians are dangerous I remind them that Hitler and Mussolini were both Christinians ......etc .
     
  16. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    That is also my position, and the position of most Israel supporters.
     
  17. StrawDog disseminated primatemaia Valued Senior Member

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    I like your sentiment Fed. I am hopeful that one day the leaders of Israel/Palestine may unite as - "we". Then we will surely see a truly great nation, as both Israel and Palestine have the potential to be.
    Shalom.
     
  18. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    and yet you refuse to be willing to support the required actions to bring it to be. You cannot treat a people as a fairy tale if you want peace with them.
     
  19. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

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    Well my first point is that im not Israeli.

    I like the idea of peace not just for the fact that we will all like each other. But that we all will work together. Working seperately, we went from wooden gliders to stealth fighters and boeing 747's in about 100 years. Imagine, we couldve done that in 25 if the whole world had been working together.

    We could advance so much more rapidly if we sat our asses down, threw out our differences, and worked together.
     
  20. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

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    Because of the fact that they believe that the instant they let down their guard the Palestinians will kill them all.

    And the Palestinians believe that the moment they let down their guard Israel will kill them all.

    Hell, we even believe it.

    There wont be peace until they both realize that they both want security, peace, and prosperity.
     
  21. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    fedr8o8: "There wont be peace until they both realize that they both want security, peace, and prosperity."

    The universal desire for security, peace, and prosperity is simple to understand. The greater obstacle to peace and progress there is Israeli apartheid. Greater inter-ethnic understanding in the Levant cannot flourish until that peculiar institution comes to an end.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2009
  22. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

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    Your right. The fact is that they see each other as totally alien and believe firmly that the other side wants to destroy them.

    Its like the stalemate of the cold war, it took 4 decades for the sides to figure out that:

    russia will only launch nukes for the defense

    US will only launch nukes for the defense.

    Realizing you have a problem is the first step to a solution.
     
  23. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    What actions would that be?
     
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