the trolling issue

[GeoffP]

Not to overreact, but, er...

Sock puppet! Sock puppet! Sock puppet!! Exterminate! Exterminate! Exterminate!

[hypewaders]

[R1D2]

We have a new policy of troll discouragement, and as one might expect in new situations, the standards appear to be fuzzy.

Perhaps concrete examples might help. The following is a very common kind of trolling response:

Note the features: the troll discovers "implications" not overtly visible in someone's post, and the discovered implications are of a specific kind: they are an imputation of deliberate, intentional evil, evil as a goal; which the troll then declares ridiculous, and uses to attack the poster for harboring such ideas.

Common encounters:

Someone says the US is killing too many civilians in Iraq, shooting too many pregnant women at checkpoints, etc. The troll replies that accusing the US of intentionally killing civilians such as pregnant women in Iraq is ridiculous, demands evidence of such intent.

Someone says too many black men are being jailed, and it is wrecking he black communities n the US. The troll replies that accusing the police departments in the US of intentionally destroying local black communities is ridiculous.

And so forth.

This is one of the most common rhetorical means of deflecting a thread into inflamed and off topic argument. Perhaps we could use it as a touchstone to guide policy toward such deflections?

I found some of the parts of what I read interesting.
Any one wish to comment?

[BWE1]

Is that an official policy of this site? Where did the quote come from?

[Gremmie]

Geez, be honest...

If it weren't for trolls this would be a very dull place.

[BWE1]

Never mind. I just figured out that this is an old thread. It came up in my new posts.

[BWE1]

Er.. Perhaps what you mean is that being verbally assaulted and devalued for posting a thought, a belief or a claim, even if it may not be quite as steady in the face of efforts to test it through the method of risky predictions as some, makes it a game of trying to shove truths down people's throats rather than a game of presenting the best reasoning you have for a hypothesis and taking your conclusions off the air so to speak?

It's a tough line in a world where evangelists of any sort mix with the regulars. It is very difficult for many people to set aside their desire that others use the right truths in their lives before they discuss which truths are right because conflicts lead to attempts to make the world be what we want it to be which means ultimately making people hold the right truths.

To the point where right action is only possible from someone who holds right truth and and only right if it aligns with those truths as judged by the most best truth person knower.

The other way to deal with it is not to hold truths so tightly that the character assaults find anything to connect with on the other end. It doesn't work for everyone but I just find that when people's heads go all splody that they just need a little TLC. Sometimes expectations just can't be met. It's a sad thing but unavoidable sometimes.

[Ripley]

I'm surprised I haven't been banned for trolling—although I was banned for having the Wanderer's "similarly configured" IP addresses.

My "trolling" is a futuristic phase of web-social-interaction whereupon people wander into forums as they do night clubs.

[BWE1]

I was suspended once here!

I'm humble about it and all but it was pretty funny.

[James R]

Moderator note: Several posts on paranormal testing have been split to a new thread, which can be found here:

A scientific test of paranormal ability, right here on sciforums!

[kwhilborn]

If you look at the opening post of the new thread you will see a fair argument on the subject of trolling. I did not change the subject, but it was changed by trolls. The subject of this thread was trolling.

The Title of that new thread was sarcastic in nature and was created by site administrator James R. I will not participate in that thread. I have not started a paranormal thread in years. I am a Licensed Engineer and am not focused on proving anything to anyone. I have provided information for those interested.

@ James R,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZeQG...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kD163...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=id3Pu...feature=fvwrel

(This is James Randi on his famous "skeptic show". I am showing these because you seem to not be aware of his showman status. James Randi has toured with Alice Cooper.)

He grew up just down the street from where I live now, and was known as "The Amazing Randi" for most of his career. He has posed as a psychic and a professional astrologer during his career.

I have no idea where he got his guests from, but I think broadcasting thoughts for the most part involve a lot of repetition and time which I do not see present on his show.

@ James R,
I was discussing Trolls in the paranormal thread. If you wish to start a new thread promising psychic demonstrations you are on your own as I am leaving for my cottage tomorrow morning for the remainder of June (at least), and will be offline.

The fact that this troll topic was pulled off topic by trolls (including the website admin) is a tribute to that, and speaks volumes about why it is not sensible to attempt any serious discussions there.

Trolling has a purpose, but when you need to read through 20 trolling posts to find one good idea it becomes tedious. When people brainstorm you must push the issue that there are no bad ideas or people withhold speaking. It would be nice to hear theories no matter how absurd imo, as there may be one aspect of their view that fits. There are better forums for thas sort of discussion, but I think everything has a root in science and would be nice to discuss here.

[Syzygys]

Hehe, I was banned for trolling, (not by definition though) but that is water under the bridge.
The important difference for me is this: Is the troll actually engages in serious conversation? Does he debate by using logic and facts? Because if he is/does, then it ain't no trolling babe...

We have different styles. I personally hold up my right to ridicule anyone who doesn't have basic logic skills or jumps into a debate without knowing basic facts. Then my friend, you are fair game.

A true troll never acknowledges when they had a valid point against his case. So once you find a poster like that, he might be a troll....

[James R]

kwhilborn:

The Title of that new thread was sarcastic in nature and was created by site administrator James R. I will not participate in that thread.

I think you're wimping out because you know you will fail any fair test of your supposed psychic abilities.

I did not create that thread with sarcasm in mind. I am genuinely interested in anybody who says they have psychic powers that are even close to 100% reliable. Such powers should be easy to show under controlled conditions.

I have not started a paranormal thread in years. I am a Licensed Engineer and am not focused on proving anything to anyone.

That's a standard cop-out for people who are offered the opportunity to apply for James Randi's million dollar challenge. "I don't need the money! I have nothing to prove" Well, then, why not donate it to a worthy charity that could use $1million? You'll be doing a great good with your special powers. Proving something to somebody is beside the point (although why claim a power if you can't demonstrate it?).

(This is James Randi on his famous "skeptic show". I am showing these because you seem to not be aware of his showman status. James Randi has toured with Alice Cooper.)

I am quite familiar with Randi, I assure you, and quite a fan, too.

He grew up just down the street from where I live now, and was known as "The Amazing Randi" for most of his career. He has posed as a psychic and a professional astrologer during his career.

He never claimed to have special powers (even magical ones). He has always been up front that his shows are an entertainment that rely on mundane trickery.

I was discussing Trolls in the paranormal thread. If you wish to start a new thread promising psychic demonstrations you are on your own as I am leaving for my cottage tomorrow morning for the remainder of June (at least), and will be offline.

I already started a new thread. It's ok. The world will go on without you. If you're at all interested you can revisit this when you get back. If not, so be it.

[Trippy]

I think you're wimping out because you know you will fail any fair test of your supposed psychic abilities.

I had an idea based on what he has claimed, what I lack is the information and the inclination.

[Stoniphi]

I have a hard enough time reading my own mind, let alone somebody else's.

[Hipparchia]

It is sad that I had to wade through 134 posts before finding one that was worth reading. Thank you for making the effort worthwile, Stoniphi.

[GeoffP]

My search took me all the way to 137.

[Stoniphi]

You are most welcome, Hipparchia.

Sorry, GeoffP.

[GeoffP]

Lol.

[Syzygys]

So I am going to count the days until Steampunk is banned for eternity...

1....