Do Children NEED Physical Suffering?

**Carcano** · 10-19-08, 04:27 PM

I was going to call this thread 'Does suffering build character' after reading something about how the dominant aspects of child rearing nowadays are NEGLECT and OVERINDULGENCE.

By 'physical suffering' I dont mean PAIN...I mean effort, challenge, difficulty, work!

**visceral_instinct** · 10-19-08, 04:34 PM

Definitely. Effort and challenge should not be viewed as suffering. They're not only necessary but desirable.

**superstring01** · 10-19-08, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by Carcano

By 'physical suffering' I dont mean PAIN...I mean effort, challenge, difficulty, work!

Duh. Of course they do. All people do. Without know edge and experience in the negative aspects of life, a person loses the ability to correctly judge the reality they live in. Just look at children who've been pampered: they have no clue as to what real life is about.

~String

**Carcano** · 10-19-08, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by superstring01

Just look at children who've been pampered: they have no clue as to what real life is about.

Well isnt that the majority of middle class America?

Ive noticed a trend unfolding of parents insulating their kids from anything negative...whether its household chores, bullies at school, politically incorrect ideas, or germs!

**Carcano** · 10-19-08, 05:33 PM

Originally Posted by visceral_instinct

Effort and challenge should not be viewed as suffering.

Unless youre suffering there is no REAL physical effort.

I used to be a carpenter for over a decade.

And shed tears of blood.

**visceral_instinct** · 10-19-08, 05:34 PM

I disagree re: bullies at school. Bullying is really not ok. Some disagreements and fighting are normal with young kids, but when you can't go to school without having life made hell, that's beyond the realms of just daily shit of life.

**Stryder** · 10-19-08, 05:40 PM

Get your Kid a Lawyer and Sue the Bullies

Seriously though being bullied is a Human Rights violation if of course their life is made hell, however occasionally their are whiney kids that actually cause people to retaliate against them just so they can turn round and claim their are bullied. Those ones are just little B*'ds

**superstring01** · 10-19-08, 10:59 PM

Originally Posted by Carcano

Well isnt that the majority of middle class America?

Ive noticed a trend unfolding of parents insulating their kids from anything negative...whether its household chores, bullies at school, politically incorrect ideas, or germs!

Agreed. Though, on the part about bullies, I don't think they serve a purpose that should be allowed. Now, I'm not saying that a dad shouldn't teach his son to defend himself in a fight, but "school bullies" should be dealt with administratively. There are genuinely physically weaker human beings who should not be allowed to be prayed upon by brutish assholes. But, generally speaking, kids should be allowed--and encouraged--to get dirty. I grew up on a farm, I grew up playing in the dirt, going out to get chicken eggs and feeding our loan hog we raised each year (and, subsequently took to be slaughtered). It's funny how at work people freak out about small amounts of detritus, dirt and germs, where I'm unaffected (probably because of the real mess I grew up in).

People are absolute pansies anymore. Maybe it's for the best that out technology surpasses and exterminates us one day.

~String

**Simon Anders** · 10-19-08, 11:39 PM

Originally Posted by Carcano

By 'physical suffering' I dont mean PAIN...I mean effort, challenge, difficulty, work!

It sounds like you did not mean suffering.

'I think I will go home now and make the kids suffer.'

Just does work.

**CarpetDiem** · 10-20-08, 01:19 AM

Originally Posted by Carcano

Well isnt that the majority of middle class America?

Ive noticed a trend unfolding of parents insulating their kids from anything negative...whether its household chores, bullies at school, politically incorrect ideas, or germs!

Agree totally with Germs. The rate of asthma is skyrocketing, due largely to parents completely sterilising their homes so kids don't build up antibodies to everyday allergens that we all did.

As to household chores, bullies at school and politically incorrect ideas. parents and teachers can only shield kids from so much, but the little blighters will always find a way to being exposed to such issues through their friends and enemes

**Bells** · 10-20-08, 02:24 AM

Originally Posted by superstring01

Agreed. Though, on the part about bullies, I don't think they serve a purpose that should be allowed. Now, I'm not saying that a dad shouldn't teach his son to defend himself in a fight, but "school bullies" should be dealt with administratively. There are genuinely physically weaker human beings who should not be allowed to be prayed upon by brutish assholes. But, generally speaking, kids should be allowed--and encouraged--to get dirty. I grew up on a farm, I grew up playing in the dirt, going out to get chicken eggs and feeding our loan hog we raised each year (and, subsequently took to be slaughtered). It's funny how at work people freak out about small amounts of detritus, dirt and germs, where I'm unaffected (probably because of the real mess I grew up in).

People are absolute pansies anymore. Maybe it's for the best that out technology surpasses and exterminates us one day.

~String

I agree 100%. Bullies are a completely different thing to getting dirty. I don't know how it would even be possible to stop children from getting dirty and playing in dirt to be honest. You bathe them and within 5 minutes they are outside digging in the stuff..

We have completely refused to go by the massive disinfection route.. eg. disinfecting soaps, baby washes, etc. It's dangerous. Kids need to build up a healthy immune system. If a child has a disease like leukemia, then I can understand wanting to prevent them getting sick by going to such extremes. God.. whatever happened to kids picking up worms and playing in dirt and mud?.. I only put my foot down when my kids decide to bring the slimy wildlife into the house.. like when my 18 month old picks up a slug and brings it inside like it's a trophy.

Ugh..

Edit..

Kids also need to learn the value of work.. doing chores is a great way for them to start and it should be encouraged from a very early age. Hell, my 3 year old thinks it's a treat when we let him vacuum and he's also starting to learn how to do dishes (plastic cups, plates and spoons, etc), but it's a start. By the time he's 5 we're hoping he'll do all the housework while we wallow..

Kidding..

**Zakariya04** · 10-20-08, 02:39 AM

Originally Posted by Bells

By the time he's 5 we're hoping he'll do all the housework while we wallow..

Kidding..

bells you are slacking... my oldest is only 4 and a half and he does all the house work, cooking and washes the car too!!!!

**lucifers angel** · 10-20-08, 06:58 AM

Originally Posted by Stryder

Get your Kid a Lawyer and Sue the Bullies

Seriously though being bullied is a Human Rights violation if of course their life is made hell, however occasionally their are whiney kids that actually cause people to retaliate against them just so they can turn round and claim their are bullied. Those ones are just little B*'ds

i got the police involved when my son was being bullied at school and out of school, in fact i am waiting to see the police right now because my son was attacked on saturday and the police didnt have any appointments left (i was not aware the police ran an appointment schedule)

**cosmictraveler** · 10-20-08, 07:26 AM

Originally Posted by Carcano

Unless youre suffering there is no REAL physical effort.

I used to be a carpenter for over a decade.

And shed tears of blood.

You must have been one really bad carpenter then for only after a year or so I never shed much blood myself!

**Challenger78** · 10-20-08, 07:26 AM

Originally Posted by Carcano

I was going to call this thread 'Does suffering build character' after reading something about how the dominant aspects of child rearing nowadays are NEGLECT and OVERINDULGENCE.

By 'physical suffering' I dont mean PAIN...I mean effort, challenge, difficulty, work!

Yes. Children need it in order to be able to survive.
However, make sure it's in things that they like doing.

On a side note: Primary school kids in Asian countries don't have much of a problem with overindulgence, it's pretty rare there. Hell, theres a suicide rate for 12 year olds.

**cosmictraveler** · 10-20-08, 07:37 AM

Children are given "chores" to do by many parents. Sometimes, if the parents are nice, the children are given money for doing those chores. I was paid a nickle for mowing the yard, a dime for doing the dishes for a week and a quarter to keep my bedroom neat and clean weekly. That way I had incentive to do stuff which otherwise I really wouldn't have liked to do very much. I don't know if I would not have done those things for free so can't say how I would have turned out any differently that who I am today. I think children should be paid to do stuff myself, not allot , but a little so as to show them that working does have benefits.

**Zakariya04** · 10-20-08, 08:10 AM

Originally Posted by lucifers angel

i got the police involved when my son was being bullied at school and out of school, in fact i am waiting to see the police right now because my son was attacked on saturday and the police didnt have any appointments left (i was not aware the police ran an appointment schedule)

thats bloming rubbish what sort of police are they??? Appointments indeed!! Its not like you arent paying their salary or anything!!

you should write to your MP or local paper!!

**lucifers angel** · 10-20-08, 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by Zakariya04

thats bloming rubbish what sort of police are they??? Appointments indeed!! Its not like you arent paying their salary or anything!!

you should write to your MP or local paper!!

the police are crap, i know that from expiernce anyway

**Stryder** · 10-20-08, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by lucifers angel

i got the police involved when my son was being bullied at school and out of school, in fact i am waiting to see the police right now because my son was attacked on saturday and the police didnt have any appointments left (i was not aware the police ran an appointment schedule)

The police like to maintain they are busy, although my past experiences have proved them to be cocky, manipulative and to not take things as seriously as they should in some instances.

They weren't of course always like that, back when their were village Bobbies on Bicycles acting as Community liaisons the atmosphere was somewhat different. (That's back when they could slap a kid round the back of the head for being a cheeky so and so, or deal with bullies)

Nowadays everything's evolved to be more bureaucratic, if bullies are a problem then in honesty it's a legal matter. If you can't afford a lawyer consider talking to the Citizens Advice Bureau about how to obtain one.