Thread: What exactly is atheism?

  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Jan Ardena View Post
    Yes, on both counts.
    What is your point exactly?

    jan.
    Explain ?

  2. #102
    Life, The universe, and e... Tht1Gy!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Myles View Post
    Now that's what I call a sloppy post. You failed to address the question of appleness and bananess.
    Ice Cream and Bananas. Mmmm. Add some nuts and chocolate sauce, mmmm.

    Baked Alaska. Mmmmm.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by jan
    Tell that to the general run of theists on this forum.

    I cannot see how any theist could get this wrong, perhaps you can give a few examples.
    Well, just backing up a page or two in this thread, we hit this:

    Quote Originally Posted by theist
    To lack belief would, in my opinion, imply the absence of any preconception. For that a person would have to lose all sense of perspective or definition.
    And we have an entire thread entitled "Atheism is a belief" in the General Philosophy section.

    And so forth. Probably the single most common general assertion by theists about atheists, actually - that atheists have a belief based in faith, just as theists do.

  4. #104
    Valued Senior Member Jan Ardena's Avatar
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    greenberg,

    Oddly enough, I've had a similar experience recently. My whole life, I've had this idea that eating spicy food, especially eating food seasoned with black pepper is bad and riles up the senses. I felt bad whenever I ate anything spicy, especially when seasoned with black pepper. Then recently, I've learned to make a sauce of green peppers, tomatoes, ground red paprika, and soy bits, seasoned with salt and black pepper. Served with mashed potatoes or softly cooked and mild rice. My, is that yummy! And my passions didn't get riled up, even though I was eating such spicy food.
    It was a really strange experience, very pleasurable, but strange.
    I wouldn't say that was a similar experience, as you weren't told by authorities that you hate spicy food.
    That is more like the atheist position, without the surrender.

    "Belief" isn't very reliable, is it? We believe all sorts of things ... and then after some time, we believe some other things ...
    The pursiut of understanding requires belief.

    What do you think - which things should be accepted on faith, and which should not? What would be the criteria for such acceptance?
    Things that we cannot be known directly via the senses, off the top of my head.

    Do you mean that a spirit-soul can possibly be an "in-betweeny"??
    A conditioned spirit-soul, yes, according to scriptoral authority.

    1. What scriptoral reference do you have for that suggestion?
    BG.ch14, Verse 5.

    Material nature consists of the three modes--goodness, passion and ignorance. When the living entity comes in contact with nature, he becomes conditioned by these modes.

    PURPORT

    The living entity, because he is transcendental, has nothing to do with this material nature. Still, because he has become conditioned by the material world, he is acting under the spell of the three modes of material nature. Because living entities have different kinds of bodies, in terms of the different aspects of nature, they are induced to act according to that nature. This is the cause of the varieties of happiness and distress.

    2. It appears that an "in-betweeny" cannot be truly happy, ever. If a spirit- soul is an "in-betweeny" and the spirit-soul is part an parcel of God, and an "in-betweeny" can never be truly happy, then parts of God are never truly happy. -??
    The reason we are in-betweenies is because we desire to become separate to God. Once we understand our true position we become blissful.
    Does that make sense?

    I want to be enlightened sooner than you!!
    Last one to enlightenment doesn't get any ice cream.
    On your marks........get set.......!

    Jan.

  5. #105
    Valued Senior Member Jan Ardena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by (Q) View Post
    Aliens on the planet Vulcan lack a belief in your god, Jan. Does that meant they are atheists and claim to NOT believe in your god?
    What do you think?

    jan.

  6. #106
    Valued Senior Member Jan Ardena's Avatar
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    greenberg,

    Excuse me, I haven't eaten ice cream in ages. What would be the essential quality of ice cream? Or apples or bananas for that matter?
    Ask anyone who loves it.

    But they had the opportunity to spend time with Krishna. For real.
    If I go to tend cows, will there be a beautiful young man with bluish skin?
    But they didn't know he was God, and quite frankly couldn't give a monkeys, but their position was one that despite their lustful tendancies, their percieved lack of scientific, philosophic knowledge, and faith in God, their senses were attracted to God in the form of Govinda.

    Sure, but it is a very general faith - namely the faith that if you apply yourself and seek to be as rational as possible, this will yield positive results.
    As opposed to, for example, the faith that acting in line with the Catholic doctrines will yield positive results, even though you currently do not find those doctrines very meaningful or don't know whether they are true.
    Faith is apparent, according to the individual. The trouble with people whose faith is situated at extreme ends of the spectrum is that they have become extremists and cannot see anything outside of their own position.
    But the rest of us can discuss the issues of God, religion, and spirituality in a rational manner.

    If you doubt whether Jesus existed, or if you have not come into contact with the essence, then putting faith in either Jesus or that essence is a gamble.
    Why would you doubt Jesus' existence?
    There is no way you can not have come into contact with the essence of Jesus' words and deeds, if you have read and understood them. You would simply be in a state of non-belief for whatever reason.

    The type of person who would put their faith into something they do not believe in, or does not exist (in their mind), is either controlled by some force, or, does not exist.

    jan.

  7. #107
    Valued Senior Member Jan Ardena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enmos View Post
    Explain ?
    It's simple;

    A are you an athiest

    B yes


    C why?


    D because god does not exist


    jan.

  8. #108
    Valued Senior Member Jan Ardena's Avatar
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    iceaura

    And we have an entire thread entitled "Atheism is a belief" in the General Philosophy section.
    This is not a definition of atheism, but an opinion about atheists.

    Jan.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Jan Ardena View Post
    It's simple;

    A are you an athiest

    B yes


    C why?


    D because god does not exist


    jan.
    Wrong.

    Because it's unlikely in the extreme that God exists.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by jan
    This is not a definition of atheism, but an opinion about atheists.
    It is both. It is an opinion of what defines someone as an atheist. And it is very common among theists, here and everywhere.

  11. #111
    Valued Senior Member Jan Ardena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enmos View Post
    Wrong.

    Because it's unlikely in the extreme that God exists.
    Not to the atheist who believes God does not exist.

    jan.

  12. #112
    Valued Senior Member Jan Ardena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iceaura View Post
    It is both. It is an opinion of what defines someone as an atheist. And it is very common among theists, here and everywhere.

    The op in the thread you mentioned describes atheism as; the belief that there is no god.

    jan.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Jan Ardena View Post
    Not to the atheist who believes God does not exist.

    jan.
    I am not aware of any though..

  14. #114
    Valued Senior Member Jan Ardena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enmos View Post
    I am not aware of any though..
    I see your predicament.

    jan.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by Jan Ardena View Post
    I see your predicament.

    jan.
    What's the predicament ? I simply don't believe in any god, I don't necessarily identify with other atheists..

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by jan
    The op in the thread you mentioned describes atheism as; the belief that there is no god.
    Yep. So, as I pointed out, that is very common among theists; what you describe as something obvious and simple is denied by many - at least a large minority - theists.

  17. #117
    Registered Senior Member Myles's Avatar
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    A message to Jan,

    I can honestly say I have seldom read a greater load of tripe that your post 104.

    You make the most outrageous statements without offering any supporting evidence.

    Read your post a para. at a time and explain what each one means and how you know it to be true. I'm particularly interested in what we can know without the senses.

    I have come to the conclusion that you are a troll. Your recent threads ask the same things about atheism in different ways. You are merely seeking a platform to promote your belief in so-called Eastern wisdom. Can I suggest you start some more threads such as what colour is atheism ?, what does atheism taste like?. how can an atheist be sure he is an atheist ?, do atheists eat babies ? and so on.

    Then you can treat us to dissertations on souls, transendence, gross material as opposed to spiritual nauures. You should also address the deep question of whether god eats curry.

    Do you ever worry that you may be an atheist in your next incarnation ?

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enmos View Post
    I'm glad you eventually figured that out yourself.
    a lot of people in my country are depressed because they teach evolution in school. everyone thinks they're just animals without souls and when they die they rot in the ground and their life has no meaning.

    but the same could be said about christianity and islam... they also cause people to become sad. for example many people fear hell because of chrsitianty.

  19. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by Yorda View Post
    a lot of people in my country are depressed because they teach evolution in school. everyone thinks they're just animals without souls and when they die they rot in the ground and their life has no meaning.

    but the same could be said about christianity and islam... because of those religions, many people are afraid of hell.
    Where do you live ?

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enmos View Post
    Where do you live ?
    sweden.

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