Can India save the world?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by kmguru, Mar 22, 2008.

  1. kmguru Staff Member

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    HINDUSTAN TIMES

    Can India save the world?

    Kishore Mahbubani
    March 21, 2008
    First Published: 23:28 IST(21/3/2008)
    Last Updated: 23:34 IST(21/3/2008)

    Humanity is embarking on a bizarre journey into the future. Subconsciously, we all believe (or would like to believe) that we live in a rational, well-ordered universe. The reality is closer to the opposite. If this sounds unbelievable, consider the following analogy. Imagine 660 passengers boarding a ship that is sailing into unchartered waters. After boarding, all 660 retreat into their cabins. No captain or crew is taking care of the ship as a whole.

    Sadly, this is a literal, not metaphorical description of how spaceship Earth is sailing into the future. Globalisation has shrunk the world. All 6.6 billion inhabitants now live in a single interdependent universe. From financial crises to health epidemics, from borderless terrorism to global warming, we are moving into a world where more global governance (not global government) is needed to manage the growing interdependence. Instead, precisely when more is needed, humanity is either shrinking or weakening global governance. This essay will explain why. It will also argue that perhaps only one country can solve this crisis — India.

    Global governance is shrinking because the West, which spun a rich web of multilateral institutions and norms after World War II, is losing faith in multilateralism. The Western powers were happy to be custodians of the main rules and processes of the global order because they were convinced that a more rules-bound universe, accompanied by greater trade liberalisation, would benefit the Western economies the most since they had the world’s most competitive economies. This conviction of economic superiority led the West to bring down trade barriers. They had no doubt that the West would win on an open economic playing field.

    John F Kennedy illustrated this confidence when he said in 1962, “A more liberal trade policy will in general benefit our most efficient and expanding industries.” The boundless optimism of Kennedy has been replaced by the boundless pessimism of Lou Dobbs, who is convinced that American workers cannot compete with Chinese or Indian workers. Sadly, Lou Dobbs is not an isolated phenomenon. Both Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama have joined the race to the bottom by declaring that each is more protectionist than the other. This reflects the new psyche of the American population. Europe is not much better.

    If both America and Europe lose confidence in their ability to compete, how can they remain custodians of the rules that ensure fairness and equity? To be fair, humanity should thank both first for creating the 1945 rules-based order at the end of World War II. To understand how visionary the Western founding fathers of this order were, just contrast what they did after World War II with what was done after World War I. After World War I, the world order forced Germany and Japan to go to war as they tried to expand their political and economic space. After World War II, both Germany and Japan significantly expanded their political and economic space without going to war.

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  3. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    India is having many problems internally now so it would be wiser to get itself on course first.

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  5. kmguru Staff Member

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    One has to deal with the external world anyway...so why not manage your policies for the long term?
     
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  7. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    That was an excellent summary of the present state of geopolitics. The premise of the title was hardly addressed, and may have been slightly overstated (that India is poised to save the world). The author didn't hardly go into that at all, but maybe we can here.

    India is the world's largest democracy, and there is no doubt that the middle and upper classes are booming. But considerable domestic challenges remain in terms of equal opportunities vs. poverty, that give me pause about whether India will lead the way. It seems to me that whether India will become a light unto the nations will depend on what solutions are found for the improvement of life not only for the presently upwardly-mobile, but also for the other Indians, who seem a neglected, invisible majority when we celebrate the stunning progress of India. What solutions India finds and implements that will reverse the desperate trend among Indian farmers, and what solutions India implements toward reducing poverty and hopelessness in general will tell. If economic divides in India continue to widen, in a reprise of the social divides of colonialism, then the same tensions and breakdowns that plague the wider world today will still plague India. If that's the case, it's doubtful India will be a catalyst for saving the world. If, on the other hand... is there reason for hope? I'd like to hear some reason for hope from Indians.
     
  8. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    No, it cannot.
     
  9. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    We have enough problems of our own to be wearing a technicolored dhoti and taking over the world. Hopefully, we can lead by example.
     
  10. hypewaders Save Changes Registered Senior Member

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    Sam: "Hopefully, we can lead by example."

    Isn't that the only way forward?

    Seems we have a largely parallel thread running. Over there, I discovered (through one of Sam's posts) the Indian system of 5-Year Plans and that seems to offer a potential for continuity of vision and policy that other nations lack (I'm thinking of US policy drift). At least on paper, India appears to have a more progressive and inclusive vision and agenda than the USA.
     
  11. nirakar ( i ^ i ) Registered Senior Member

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    The problem for skilled Americans is not that Americans can not compete. The problem is that skilled Americans can not compete at these exchange rates.

    On the unskilled labor side, Americans driving cars, watching TV at night, and living in 1500 square foot houses with running water can not compete with bicycle riding people, who stand around the rubbish fire and sing together at night, live in 70 square foot shanties without electricity or plumbing, who have to defecate by the side of the road near their shanty.

    It costs a lot more money to maintain a poor American family than it does to maintain a poor Indian family.
     
  12. kmguru Staff Member

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    :thumbsup: Very well said :thumbsup:
     
  13. Mr. G reality.sys Valued Senior Member

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    More so for this thread than for humanity.

    India is able to save the world only if it offers it online data storage capacity.
     
  14. kmguru Staff Member

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    Already India is the back office of the world or will be in a few years...
     
  15. countezero Registered Senior Member

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    Is this thread a joke?
     
  16. Enmos Valued Senior Member

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    I think so..
     
  17. John99 Banned Banned

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    In U.S and AFAIK Europe thing are much more fair. We have social programs instead of isolating and beating down the poor and merely using them in servitude. Its easy to make money off human cattle. But this fairness is evident by the number of poor coming here from that particular region. I dont agree with the indoctrination i see in other countries of blaming the boogie man while giving a free pass to the real victimizers. If your cool with that then i dont want any part of it.
     
  18. nirakar ( i ^ i ) Registered Senior Member

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    I don't think the free traders and U.S. politicians understand yet that the American poor and lower middle class can not compete at any exchange rate with people who live without electricity, plumbing and health-care. The fact that we don't yet have 20% unemployment in the U.S. just means that many businesses have been have been slow to take advantage of third world "human cattle". Also the Chinese/Japanese/Saudi lending to the USA has masked the problem.

    A domestic service based economy will not be able to maintain wage levels for long.

    As the Euro replaces the Dollar as the overinflated global currency the sort of problems that the USA has been having will increasingly show up in Europe. The only advantage that Europe has is that they are not as blinded by free trade ideology. Competition is good, but you can't compete with poverty.

    The only good thing about destroying the American middle class is that destroying the American middle class might reduce global pollution.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2008
  19. John99 Banned Banned

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    oh ok. They are willing to live without electricity, plumbing and health care to support an aristocracy and the millionaires. How convenient, of course whatever you are basing this on is anyones guess. China and India's pollution dont count either huh? Boy, its amazing how well things work out when you only see what you want to.
     
  20. nirakar ( i ^ i ) Registered Senior Member

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    Changed "willing to live without" to "who live without". "Willing to" was wrong.

    A very poor person in India or China makes a lot less pollution than a lower middle class American does.
     
  21. 15ofthe19 35 year old virgin Registered Senior Member

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    Pretty much, yes. That article wandered around like a fat girl in a donut shop, but in the end tried to gloss over India's shameful human rights record by deflecting criticism toward China. India is selectively multi-lateral, at best. Honestly, that was one of the more pointless editorials I've read in quite some time.
     
  22. John99 Banned Banned

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    yes but the lower middle class people in india and china make the same pollution ans a lower middle class in U.S and a homeless person (very poor) in America makes the same as a very poor person in india and china.

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  23. nirakar ( i ^ i ) Registered Senior Member

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    Being lower middle class in India does not mean the same thing as being lower middle class in the USA. In India you can afford to have servants before you can afford a car. In the USA you can afford a car before you can afford servants.

    What middle class means is subjective. A low level customer service rep job in the USA answering phone calls about problems with your DSL service would be a lower middle class or upper working poor job. That employee would be able to afford a car.
    Ship that job to India ( as my DSL provider has done) and the job becomes a middle middle class job in India. That employee in India would probably own a motor scooter. They would probably live in a household with other people, ( maybe in their father in laws house). The household would very likely have a few scooters and a servant, but no car. Daily power outages would be likely.

    In the future a middle class person in India may pollute as much as middle class person in America does, but at this time a middle class person in India has less possessions and uses less energy than a lower middle class borderline working poor American person does.

    A lower middle class borderline working poor person in India probably does not have electricity or plumbing. If they do have electricity, they only have it for a few hours a day. They might have a scooter, and if they don't have a scooter they have a bicycle. The poorer poor in India can not afford a bicycle.
     

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