The holiest site in Judaism.

[Mr.Spock]

Yeah, but I don't trust the IDF not to do a little creative cut and paste editing.

blame it on the jews, why wont you.

[S.A.M.]

blame it on the jews, why wont you.

See?

[Mr.Spock]

See?

see what? that you can compete with Patrick star?

[S.A.M.]

Back to the Dome of the Rock

Here are some views of the masjid.

Outside:



Compound:



Close up of the Dome

[S.A.M.]

Inside:






The masjid can hold 400,000 people

[Challenger78]

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...cle%2FShowFull




Another question: why hasn't the world shown more support towards Jewish claims to the site?

Wasn't the very creation of Israel centred around increased immigration to that site ?.

[S.A.M.]

Animal sacrifice, eh?
Lovely.
Back to the caves, everyone. It's God's will.

You're all crazy.

Missed your post.

Blood sacrifice is ritualistic in Talmudic law.

MISHNAH. … The slaughtering of the bullock and the he-goat
… their blood requires sprinkling between the staves [of the ark],
on the veil, and on the golden altar …

— Babylonian Talmud, Tractate Zebahim 47a
Soncino 1961 Edition, page 238

It is especially significant here because it is the ritual that has kept alive the connection to the temple after its destruction.

The Gemara on the 'Order' Kodashim is a testimony to the strong interest which the teachers of the Palestinian and Babylonian schools continued to take in the sacrificial cult even after its cessation with the destruction of the Temple. This interest was more than merely historical and academic. It was based on strictly practical considerations. There were in fact two motives that kept alive the study of the Seder Kodashim even after its laws had fallen into disuse. One sprang from the unquenchable hope that the Temple would sooner or later be rebuilt, involving the restoration of the sacrificial cult, so that the knowledge of its laws would once again become essential. The other was the belief that the study of the sacrificial laws could serve as a surrogate for the Temple cult and was no less efficacious than the actual offering of the sacrifice itself. These motives lay behind the unceasing intellectual activity that centered around the Seder Kodashim throughout the intervening centuries to the present day, and which has crystallized itself in a mass of commentaries on the 'Order'; and in our own times the conviction that has seized many minds that we are witnessing the Athhalta de-Geulah ('beginning of redemption') has led to the assiduous study of Seder Kodashim in many of the higher schools of learning in the Holy Land.- Rabbi Dr. Epstein
Babylonian Talmud, Seder Kodashim, Vol. I, pages xix, xx available at http://www.come-and-hear.com/talmud/kodashim.html#xix

Apparently the ritual is very involved.

-Prayers to Revive Sacrificial Cult
-Killing the Animals and Sprinkling the Blood
-He-Goats of New Moons Sacrificed in the North
-Slaughterer and Blood Sprinkler Chosen by Lot
-Sacrifice Is Trussed
-Killing on Correct Side of Altar
-Casting Blood on Correct Side of Altar
-Ritual Dismemberment
-Blood Wrung from Heart
-Priests Assigned Body Parts
-Priests All Standing with Limbs in Their Hands
-Sprinkling the Blood of Birds
-Certain Fingers Used To Smear Blood
-Washing Blood from the HandsBlood Drained Into Brook
-Wealth Displayed in Sacrificial Chamber (thats vessels containing the blood)


http://www.come-and-hear.com/editor/br_2.html

Hmm can we get ringside seats?

[otheadp]

The Prophet himself merely described his dream. I don't know if he ever came to Jerusalem.

No. He's never visited.

Re: "Jews helped build the Aqsa mosque", you make it sound like Jews welcomed the heavily armed invaders with open arms and gladly assimilated with out fear or threat of certain death...

I know there are different perspective, and from the Islamic perspective it's probably taught that yes, everywhere the Islamic armies went they were welcomed as Bringers of Truth or whatever. I know more or less for a billion percent that it wasn't so in Jerusalem.

Yes, the building is very pretty. I think the Jordanian king added the gold into the dome a few decades ago.

[otheadp]

Blood sacrifice is ritualistic in Talmudic law.


It is especially significant here because it is the ritual that has kept alive the connection to the temple after its destruction.





Apparently the ritual is very involved.
...
Hmm can we get ringside seats?

I am very tempted to post links to some of the very interesting Islamic rituals

[S.A.M.]

I am very tempted to post links to some of the very interesting Islamic rituals

Please do. I find all this stuff very cool.

Whats the origin for this ritual? It sounds very like the Kali stuff they do in India.



<what can I say, I chop rodents for a living, maybe I will do it the Talmudic way the next time >

[S.A.M.]

No. He's never visited.

Re: "Jews helped build the Aqsa mosque", you make it sound like Jews welcomed the heavily armed invaders with open arms and gladly assimilated with out fear or threat of certain death...

I know there are different perspective, and from the Islamic perspective it's probably taught that yes, everywhere the Islamic armies went they were welcomed as Bringers of Truth or whatever. I know more or less for a billion percent that it wasn't so in Jerusalem.

Yes, the building is very pretty. I think the Jordanian king added the gold into the dome a few decades ago.

I would be very surprised if the Jews were not happy, considering that they were not allowed to stay there by the Christians and were invited back everytime Jerusalem fell into Muslim hands. In fact, the Jews fought against the Crusaders on the side of the Muslims.

[otheadp]

I would be very surprised if the Jews were not happy, considering that they were not allowed to stay there by the Christians and were invited back everytime Jerusalem fell into Muslim hands. In fact, the Jews fought against the Crusaders on the side of the Muslims.

Even if all of it was 100% true (and some of it might be), they would not want to convert.

[S.A.M.]

Even if all of it was 100% true (and some of it might be), they would not want to convert.

Then it was very fortunate they did not need to.

[otheadp]

Then it was very fortunate they did not need to.

The only thing they had to do was build an abomination (though a very beautiful abomination) on their holiest of holies.

I know it's not very nice to call the Aqsa mosque an abomination, but for many Jews (maybe most) that's exactly what it is. The equivallent of building a huge church on top of that cube that stands in Mecca.

[S.A.M.]

The only thing they had to do was build an abomination (though a very beautiful abomination) on their holiest of holies.

I know it's not very nice to call the Aqsa mosque an abomination, but for many Jews (maybe most) that's exactly what it is. The equivallent of building a huge church on top of that cube that stands in Mecca.

Ah but there was no temple at the site when it was built.

It had been destroyed by the Romans a long time ago. Also the mosque is built on the storehouse.

The site of the Mosque originally contained the Chanuyot storehouse for the Temple in Jerusalem. The Chanuyot was destroyed along with the Temple by Roman Emperor (then General) Titus in 70 CE.

Which is why I asked about the statute on limitations on a site.

In the 16th century, Ottoman Sultan Suleiman the Magnificent permitted the Jews to make the Western Wall their official holy place and had his court architect Sinan build an oratory for them there.

[otheadp]

How nice of the Sultan for permitting Jews to worship their holiest site...

[otheadp]

I wonder if that Sultan had the same opinion as the head of the Israeli Islamic Movement's northern branch's former head, by the way. (Read the OP).

[S.A.M.]

How nice of the Sultan for permitting Jews to worship their holiest site...

And inviting them from Spain following the Spanish Inquisition.

The greatest influx of Jews into Asia Minor and the Ottoman Empire, however, occurred during the reign of Mehmed's successor, Beyazid II (1481-1512), after the expulsion of the Jews from Spain and Portugal. The sultan issued a formal invitation to Jews expelled from Spain and Portugal, and they started arriving in the empire in great numbers.

I wonder if that Sultan had the same opinion as the head of the Israeli Islamic Movement's northern branch's former head, by the way.

Yes, there must have obviously been dire reasoning for assigning his personal architect to build an oratory for Jews at the Wall.

The sultan is said to have exclaimed thus at the Spanish monarch's lack of wisdom: "Ye call Ferdinand a wise king he who makes his land poor and ours rich!"

Now compare that to Muslims living under Israeli occupation.

Jewish settler groups are digging an extensive tunnel network under Muslim areas of Jerusalem's Old City while building a ring of settlements around it to bolster their claim to the disputed city in any future peace deal, anti-settlement campaigners have told The Times.

One group, the Israeli Committee Against House Demolitions, said that settler tunnels could one day extend under the al-Aqsa mosque, Islam's third-holiest site, and claimed that extremists could use the access route to attack the structure in an attempt to prevent the creation of a Palestinian state. Settler groups flatly deny such allegations.

“The settlers are very interested in connecting the dots,” he said. “The intention is clear, to be able to enter the old city from the northern wall near the Damascus Gate, traverse the Old City without encountering a single Palestinian, emerge at the Western Wall, saunter across the plaza, re-enter the burrow and exit at Silwan.”

Jewish settlers have managed to lay claim to large tracts of the West Bank by building towns that are, under international law, illegal, establishing what they call “facts on the ground”. Now, it is claimed, they are trying to establish facts under the ground as well.

Ir Amin compares the illegal tunnelling under Palestinian homes to the excavations of the Western Wall, or Hasmonean, tunnel in 1996, which was so close to the Muslim holy sites that it triggered riots, the first big conflict to rock the Oslo peace process