if god exists then..

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by fusion4577, Feb 3, 2008.

  1. fusion4577 insane, atheist, and not dead Registered Senior Member

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    sevral questions in one

    if god exsiste, then why won't he show himself and prove it?

    if god is so kind, then how can he condem millons to deth in hell just becuase there parents taught them a false religon

    how can god exsiste?

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  3. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    I guess it would scare people to much if it did appear so it keeps hidden, if you believe in that stuff.
     
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  5. fusion4577 insane, atheist, and not dead Registered Senior Member

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    but he was around for adam and eve if you belive in that, so how can it be to overwelming. hell, in the bible he talks to tons of people
     
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  7. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    Who wrote the Bible? Man. So man has a very creative way of creating things doesn't he?
     
  8. fusion4577 insane, atheist, and not dead Registered Senior Member

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    then, could the bible be filled with only metphor?
     
  9. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    The Bible is full of things man wants everyone to believe in so that those in charge of religion can fleece your pockets.

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  10. jayleew Who Cares Valued Senior Member

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    All of this thinking is warranted...religion must stop being so religious.

    I don't believe in God thanks to Chrisitanity.

    But, there might be some truth there...some hint of reality, so it's open to me...but, i'm definitely against the modern view of God, from a religious standpoint.

    It's a bit a arrogance to believe they have God figured out and can nearly heal on que with a prayer. It may be true, but I think the writers of the Bible missed the boat on that one.

    I myself am putting my feet into the water of postmodernism, in the hopes that it can help me in my quest for truth....though it really hasn't taken the form of anything aside from an attitude adjustment yet.
     
  11. pharaohmoan The illusion is you, let go. Registered Senior Member

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    If only you all realised that this world is not far removed from hell. In other words it is mostly based on greed and what people can acquire materialistically. You should also realise this world is probably so far removed from purity which is what God essentially is.

    Don't be convinced that all the good people are going to heaven, my guess is its more than that. It's probably more about whether you can be at one with a higher organism. Whether you understand true expression and pure thought, can you for example interpret harmony in reality, have you seen reality vibrating at a higher frequency? How did you react? You see people rarely think for themselves and are mostly products of sociological imprints. True individuals are hard to come by, but it is those people who are most likely to learn of Gods existence. When I mean God I don't mean God the singularity but rather the universal womb, ie God the plural.

    I don't think knowing the bible and converting others is enough to get you a pass to heaven. I don't practice religion yet I am probably more spiritual on track than most Christians.

    It's not a question of if God exists, look around do you really wholeheartedly think that reality is a fluke? I see organisation everywhere and that comes with guidance, a higher hand so to speak. Move up that chain and eventually you will reach the God head.
    Movement begets movement, the first mover is God. Movement is therefore proof of God.
     
  12. Dr Lou Natic Unnecessary Surgeon Registered Senior Member

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    Is this anything like goatse. cx?
     
  13. Leo Volont Registered Senior Member

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    You question imply your own religious assumptions.

    you assume that God cares a great deal about the different Religious Affiliations. whereas the Saints tell us that God is concerned only about Morality. No Moral Person goes to Hell.

    About God proving Himself. Well, doesn't he? Everyone Dreams. if one follows the Wise Advice given by dreams then one is lead to God. But if you are some silly stupid airhead who just cares about drugs and getting laid, then it is likely you won't be paying mucyh attention. But that is not God's fault. People who want to be pigs know what they are doing. People who have a natural spiritual aspiration also know what they are doing.

    You see, God does not CREATE people. People create people. We are the products of our mothers and fathers and their mothers and fathers. If our predessors were good and decent people with Spiritual Aspirations, then it is likely we will be also. But if you father was a drug dealing pimp and your mother was a crack whore and all you want to do is dance and get high, then you are not too likely to be actively investigating signs of Divinity in your Life and Dreams.

    If most people have reverted back to animals, its not God's fault. There are 7 Billion People on Earth now. God probably only needs about 100 Million. So Screw the 6 Billion 900 Million people who want to screw anyway.
     
  14. original sine Registered Senior Member

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    If only more people realized that this world could be a heaven! What's wrong with it? An abundance of life and land, beauty everywhere... physical, mental, and emotional pleasures... what makes Earth hell instead of heaven? Isn't Jesus supposed to establish some kind of heavenly kingdom here on Earth?
     
  15. Myles Registered Senior Member

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    I have seldom read a more facile answer.
     
  16. Leo Volont Registered Senior Member

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    My, I actually needed to look up "facile" and still have to wonder about what this means.

    Oh, re-reading my own posting, I must apologize for all of the typos... you see, one saves so much time by not doing an editorial readthrough before hitting the PUBLISH button, but it IS a bad habit...
     
  17. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    Both can be answered by this: No, there are no Gods.
     
  18. Myles Registered Senior Member

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    Iwas not referring to your typos. Sorry for making you look up facile.

    What I was getting at was the confident statements you made without a scrap of evidence to support them .Could you please try again in this manner:

    I know God only needs a given numberof people because..... ( say how you know and offer some evidence)
     
  19. SnakeLord snakeystew.com Valued Senior Member

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    I don't get it. What's wrong with wanting an iPod and a TV? How is that an indication that "this world is not far removed from hell"? All I see are poor people whining. It was the same in the bible.. a bunch of rag wearing peasants whining at the rich folk..

    It's not that they're any closer to gods or heavens, it's just that they're jealous because they're peasants and thus create some fictional nonsense to somehow try and deflate their own anger at being peasants.
     
  20. Saquist Banned Banned

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    I thing we must address is that God is not a physical being but a person of infinite energy. He has no physical form to see. But your question likely is the form of the common inquiry, "Why does God not make himself known?"

    The record of Israel in the bible exemplified that miracles and manifestations had only a temporary effect. They were displays of power and invoked fear. Fear wears away but according to the 2 Cor 13:8 "love never fails."

    Simply put there is enough information for us to ascertain the truth. We don't need signs and portents to deduce the truth. Secondly this is the time which was set aside to determine what is the truth without interference from God. That time will not last forever though.

    ------

    Hell is not Fire and Brimstone. That's a misconception produced by Dante's Inferno which was loosely based on the Bible. The Bible describes death and Hell just as science records it, inactivity, the loss of life's energy, unconsciousness. We know the bibles view is that all deserver death.

    Jesus's sacrificed provided and escape for that.

    Thus the bible says there will be "a resurrection of the righteous and the unrighteous." Thus rest assured from the biblical perspective, not all "bad" or unrighteous people will be destroyed forever. They'll be given an opportunity to learn otherwise in a much better enviroment.

    But you gotta hang in there.
    The first thing that must be settled according to scripture is who is in charge. God, Satan, or us.....
     
  21. Myles Registered Senior Member

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    The answer to all your questions is that there is not a shred of evidence that god exists. People who do not see the need for empirical evidence are wont to make all sorts of statements about god and, in so doing, mislead others.

    If you talk to Christians, for example, the answers you get will vary depending on who you are talking to. Ask about hell. If you ask Adstar, he will tell you that hell is a lake of fire into which sinners will be cast for all eternity. Ask a Jesuit, as I have done, and he will probably tell you that god does not send anyone to hell. His answer is that hell is simply not being in god's presence; if we die in a state of sin, we cannot bear to be in god's presence so we exile ourselves. You will be given lots of answers but no evidence other than references to the Bible and what people believe.

    So the first difficulty you will have is deciding who has the right answer. Remember they all base their beliefs on the Bible but they interpret it in various ways.

    Muslims will quote the Koran and , as far as I can make out, their beliefs are more consistent than those of Christians. I think the same could be said of Judaism but I am not certain as my knowlege of that religion is very limited.

    To see how the hoax works, let me give you an example.

    I tell you that there is a place called Oz where a powerful wizard lives. You ask me how I know that and I tell you all the proof you need is to be found in a book. Now ask me why I believe the book and I will say I know Oz exists because a girl called Dorothy has been there, Now ask how can Dorothy knows and I will tell you the wizard sent her a dream. Why should you believe her dream ? Because the wizard has chosen her as his messenger to tell the world about Oz, Dorothy is unique because the wizard has not sent that dream to anyone else. Do you get my drift ?

    If I told you that I knew there were elephants on mars would you take my word for it or would you ask for evidence.Most people would do so. Now I can give you a range of answers depending on the circumstances, such as,

    I have been there and seen them. I got to Mars and back in a way unknown to scientists because their outllook is materialistic rather than spiritual,

    I cannot show you a picture of Martian elephants because they are invisible to non-believers. However if you follow my instructions you may ,in time ,get to see the elephants.

    If you continue to question me I can play my trump card; I can say, well you prove that they don't exist. For somebody who has an understanding of philosophical debate. it will be obvious that I am trying to put you on the spot by asking you to do the impossible.No one can prove that something does not exist. In a rational debate the onus is on me to prove to the satisfaction of others that there are elephants on Mars. That is the only way a debate can be conducted because otherwise people can say anything, however stupid, and blame you for not agreeing with them.

    If you question those who tell you about what god wants us to do, why is he so wonderful, why we cannot see him and so on ASK FOR PROOF. And that proof needs to me more than telling you it is written in some book.

    Try asking someone who tells you that we cannot see god ,how that person knows god exists. And in listening to their answer, remember what I said about the wizard of Oz.

    I you have any further questions or would like me to comment on anything you have read or been told, please feel free to ask and I will do mu best to oblige. The one thing I will not do is to ask you to believe what I say just because I said so. Why should you ?
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2008
  22. chuuush Registered Senior Member

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    You should first address this issue: Do you not believe in the existence of a God or you do not WANT to believe so?
    Why should God show Himself to you if you are just so blind not too see the logical necessity for His existence all around you. How can this vast infinite universe be there without an intelligenct creator. If your logic accepts this, go on then...

    And who told you God condemns millions to death just because there parents chose a wrong religion. These are the lies mindless fanatics only believe. No one knows who will be admitted into the paradise and who will not. I do not believe that paradise is exclusive to members of one religion only; Instead I think that anybody who believes in him with a sincere heart and does good deeds will be rewarded with eternal bounties indifferent of their religion. It is not necessarily correct that x goes to paradise because he is a muslim and y goes to the hell because he is a jew. It all depends on your deeds in this world. And by the way God has given people intelligence and logic to reason for themselves and find the correct way, religion included.
     
  23. pharaohmoan The illusion is you, let go. Registered Senior Member

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    I wholeheartidly agree with you, yet there are many who think that their consciousness and what has gone before ie creation is a fluke. To me that is illogical and flies in the face of common sense. My guess is God for some unknown reason wanted us to have faith and with that faith make other leaps of faith, now if you pile faith upon faith the same happens as when you pile infomation on information you get a whole new view of reality a much more etherically intellectual view that allows one to see for the first time to breath a real breath and receive a response from nature and the world around. Yes I believe that without faith in a higher organation and lets face it even the quantum world look organised, then you can't make assumpstions that lead to question which are not yet answerable or may never be answerable, that doesn't mean they are not real. those who yel prove this and prove that are either dogmatically scared of the unknown or get this cannot employ new paramaters into thier belief system. In other words they have structured their mind in such a way so as to bring in new factors not based on the known causes a breakdown of their normal opperating system and functions.

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