Star Wars vs Star Trek

[Lord Vasago]

It isnt just Seven's looks that I like about her. Its her Borg instincts for efficiency and perfection. It's also her overabundant wealth of knowledge she retained from her time spent in the collective.

If you don't mind, post a frickin pic of these so called super hotties. No match? Dude you're just a fuckin hater, that's all. Everything about Seven is perfect, from her regeneration cycles to her nanoprobes to her uber 1-piece body suit that stretches all the way down to her platform heels.

hey i'm not a hater in fact i love watching Startrek. but there are a lot of other scifi shows i prefer. Firefly, Farscape and andromeda for instance.

but here are some pics u asked. I used pictures that show all the caracters because it's of topic.




on the left you have the pink/purple teenage version of trance
on the right next to the magog priest you see Rommie (the avatar/droid of the warship andromeda ascendant)



from left to right you have the peacekeeper bitch (forgot her name lol)
Shikozu (with long hair)
Aeron Sun
Jool
Chiara
all of them being serious kickass, well talented and dangerous women.
be sure to check them out

[Lord Vasago]

And this is for showing u i do like Startrek.

[Lord Vasago]

[IMG][/IMG]

a nice comparison between Voyager and the Andromeda Ascendant

[Lord Vasago]

some nice footage for alpine

Andromedahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8uE-HXASuE


Farscapehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=orh5IePXv_4


Firefly/Serenityhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BvP99-Ci6k

[alpinedigital]

some nice footage for alpine

Dude, it's not like I didnt give any other show half a chance. Some shit is just way more alien than I care for. Ships with shape designs that look too molded and colorful just dont do anything for me. Overly vibrant color CGI effects make it look too much like a game.

Farscape is a joke, the captain on Andromedaa - I dont know what I remember him from but it left a lasting impression that I cant see him being a captain. Babylon's CGI is amusing but I cant see believing it no matter how graphically impressive it looks.

Serenity/Firefly - I might have liked. I think I would cuzz I seen Serenity several times and love it. Never seen the show Firefly though.

Anyway, Lord Hater. Don't even attempt to insult Seven of Nine with these bullshit comparisons. She's by far one of the greatest female characters ever, just like Summer Glau's Terminator character.

Both quite bad-asses in a fight, and self-regenerating so if their face gets hurt, their nano tech would fix it. But much of their appeal is they are both in a position to learn. They both are students of human nature and what better way for them to accomodate a persons wishes than for them to want to learn to? Also, they can be very emotionless and logical, which is perfect for a male. They can both also be as modest as you prefer.

I dont know how many women you've interacted with in your life and how much analysis you've put into the encounter or relationship, but there's very few who'd possess the traits to make it a completely original, amusing, interesting, fullfilling match-up. A betazed like Troi would just read your thoughts and if she sensed you were getting bored, she'd adapt, so she'd make life interesting for sure. Cameron would probably adapt, and Seven as well... they can sense temperature increases and subtle physical changes... they'd know if your heartrate still jumps when they enter the room.

But yeah SW vs ST women... Seven with the unfair advantage, FTW.

[Kittamaru]

hey i'm not a hater in fact i love watching Startrek. but there are a lot of other scifi shows i prefer. Firefly, Farscape and andromeda for instance.

but here are some pics u asked. I used pictures that show all the caracters because it's of topic.




on the left you have the pink/purple teenage version of trance
on the right next to the magog priest you see Rommie (the avatar/droid of the warship andromeda ascendant)



from left to right you have the peacekeeper bitch (forgot her name lol)
Shikozu (with long hair)
Aeron Sun
Jool
Chiara
all of them being serious kickass, well talented and dangerous women.
be sure to check them out

Save for Rommie... they all look like whores... I'm sorry, just my opinoin

[Kittamaru]

Dude, it's not like I didnt give any other show half a chance. Some shit is just way more alien than I care for. Ships with shape designs that look too molded and colorful just dont do anything for me. Overly vibrant color CGI effects make it look too much like a game.

Farscape is a joke, the captain on Andromedaa - I dont know what I remember him from but it left a lasting impression that I cant see him being a captain. Babylon's CGI is amusing but I cant see believing it no matter how graphically impressive it looks.

Serenity/Firefly - I might have liked. I think I would cuzz I seen Serenity several times and love it. Never seen the show Firefly though.

Anyway, Lord Hater. Don't even attempt to insult Seven of Nine with these bullshit comparisons. She's by far one of the greatest female characters ever, just like Summer Glau's Terminator character.
Both quite bad-asses in a fight, and self-regenerating so if their face gets hurt, their nano tech would fix it. But much of their appeal is they are both in a position to learn. They both are students of human nature and what better way for them to accomodate a persons wishes than for them to want to learn to? Also, they can be very emotionless and logical, which is perfect for a male. They can both also be as modest as you prefer.

I dont know how many women you've interacted with in your life and how much analysis you've put into the encounter or relationship, but there's very few who'd possess the traits to make it a completely original, amusing, interesting, fullfilling match-up. A betazed like Troi would just read your thoughts and if she sensed you were getting bored, she'd adapt, so she'd make life interesting for sure. Cameron would probably adapt, and Seven as well... they can sense temperature increases and subtle physical changes... they'd know if your heartrate still jumps when they enter the room.

But yeah SW vs ST women... Seven with the unfair advantage, FTW.

You have to remember... in Andromeda, they were stuck in a black hole for years, decades, maybe even centuries (can' remember off hand) - the poor cap'n was in a very, very bad position at that point, and had to make a lot of split-second, rash decisions. It was a great show though

[Lord Vasago]

You have to remember... in Andromeda, they were stuck in a black hole for years, decades, maybe even centuries (can' remember off hand) - the poor cap'n was in a very, very bad position at that point, and had to make a lot of split-second, rash decisions. It was a great show though

The andromeda ascendent was frozen in the event horizon for 300 years.
I find that Cpt Dillan Hunt is excellent choise. Just like picard he will try to find a peacefull way to end a conflict. he only relies on the destructive power of the andromeda when it is his last option. but the diference with Picard is that he is not human giving him the advantage in hand-to-hand battle

[ProphetofWisdom]

G canon > T Canon > C canon

Yours falls under the lowest one there. Nowhere in T or G do we see that stuff, not even performed by the most powerful Jedi Master; Yoda.



Why is it that SW fans run to ICS and multiple wanky Jedi feats that go against higher canon when they know full well the contradictions?

As I have posted before I have changed my stance on SW firepower.
Please, if your going to come after me could you at least read all my post?

No, they are taken down by MT weapons. You can't get anything higher with fusion level warheads. And then of course, there was that incident in Halo 3 with a falling piece of rock punching right through a Covenant cruiser like it was made of paper. Or the fact that in Halo Wars, we see that non-MT level weapon is more than enough to damage a Covenant ship and the UNSC colony ship turned warship.

First off I am going to say do not trust any numbers from Halopedia, that site is known to not even get the exact yields from the books right and even pull numbers out of thin air.

Now.

1. How do you explain the NOVA bomb? Stated in Halo: First Strike by the Admiral working on it to be a planet killer. All calcs down of the the nine fusion warheads that use a casing the increases the yield a hundredfold come out in at least he low Exaton range based on the damage to the Covenant planet in Ghost of Onyx.
The NOVA is considered to be 900 times more powerful then the standard SHIVA Warhead used by the UNSC.

2. How then do the Covenant, who use fusion, reach the TT range when they glass worlds? The glassing on p. 8 of TFoR has them boiling away the oceans in one hour.

3. I have not played Halo Wars yet, so could you post the cutscene?
I have seen the opeing cut scene that shows the GLASSING of Harvest by Covenant main weapons.

Post Nemesis sounds good.

Agreed.

Or more likely it caused a chain reaction on the ring.

Oh for the love of GOD... IDIOT! THERE WAS NO CHAIN REACTION! THE PoA DID ALL THE DAMAGE! HALO: THE FLOOD SHOWS NOTHING OF A CHAIN REACTION! THAT IS A MID DOUBLE DIGIT TO LOW TRIPPLE DIGIT TT EVENT!

If only because SW ships pretty much do use pea shooters that rarely extend past 10 MT.

Go with the high end yields I no longer believe in and then campare that to the one hour glassing of an Earth like world down to at least 20 meters low end, 3+km high end (the 3+km bit comes fron page 100 of First Strike).

And if we want to pit uber races against each other, we can all laugh while the 31st UFP turns the Forerunner planet into a molten ball of lead centuries before they even evolve.

OH! JUST PREFECT! YOU JUST RAN INTO THE RACE KNOWN AS THE PRECURSORS BY DOING THAT! A TIER 0 RACE THAT THE FORERUNNER LOOK UPPON AS GODS! SO YOU TREKKIES ARE NOW TRYING TO TAKE ON KNOCK OFFS OF THE CULTURE BY TRYING TO TAKE OUT THE FORERUNNER AND THEN A RACE (aka the guys Forerunners think of as Gods)THAT COULD BATTLE THE Q TO A STAND STILL?

Some farther things on the Forerunner: these are the guys who normal weapons are on par with SW superweapons, or, THEIR ENGINES.
They can one shot any ship by just opeing a slipspace rift on them which will tear them apart or send then flying off into slipspace.
And wow, we see MT level explosions in TDiC, yet you claim the crust was going to be striped **, you may just be able to put a dent in the shields of what the Forerunner think of as a garbage barg using the high end for TDiC.

They took the entire output of the Enterprise D without breaking a sweat before going off to rape 39 starships. Even when sitting in orbit, their ship can generate GT level energy.

Proof, a link to Mermory Alpha will do.

Yes, and most of those planets are habited by small, dirt cities filled with thousands of people at best. Even more so, if there are so many of these planets, why are there in fact, only a few thousand senator seats in the Empire?

1. Most of the planets have at least a pop twice that of the Earth.

2. There are thousands of SECTORS which elect the senators which is why there are only a few thousand seats/
Grand Moff Tarkin states on ANH that the Empire has a million systems.

Bullshit, no SW planet has ever shown that. And sorry, but a VFX error on a planet doesn't count as a shield. Provide actual quotes of a shield, because the largest one was a theater shield.

1. Never even heard of this VFX error you speak of. I do know that the Dark Empire source books says there was no planetary shield shield on Aldderaan.

2. In the last of the three books about Grand Admiral Thrawn he dumps stealthed asteroids above Imperial Center and they had to keep the shields up or risk them hitting the planet.

No they don't. It was stated in the RotS novel that the weapons that could be seen from the planetside coiuld destroy a small town...10 Mt max. Empire Strikes Back had about .5-3 MT for their weapons against the asteroids and of course, we see that in Downfall of a Droid that Anakin's plan of eradicating Grievous's asteroid field defense plan doesn't consist of just shooting at them, since using asteroids to protect yourself against 200 GT firepower is like using a box of sparkles and tossing them in the way of a tank shell.

Nor do we see such power in Jedi Crash, where the bolts are exploding in the atmosphere and we in fact see both clones, droids, and jedi fighting in open atmosphere with no horrible side effects that one would normally attribute to multi-gt weapons going off in the atmosphere.

Agreed. Once again, if you had read all of my post you would have notice I had stated I do not believe on those yields any longer.

The UFP has about 60,000+ capital ships.

Explain then why the lost of around 312 ships was seen as a massive loss then. Based off that low end is 10,000 ships, high is 30,000.
Either give the quotes and your sources you draw these numbers from or concede they don't more then 30,000 max.

The Borg's "slow ass warp" allowed Voyager to cross 20,000 LY in what is no more than a day. And their network of transwarp hubs allow them to cross about 25,000 LY in minutes.

Proof on that speed, from what I know of normal non Hub Transwarp it takes months and Hub Transwarp a few weeks.

Yes, an RTS game means your an expert in warefare.

If you got the kill ratios I get in most battles you would to. I don't consider myself a true expert, but I could sure as hell do better then the Empire.

We've seen the Borg use them at least a few times without problem. Seven even points one at Chakotay in Scorpion. Another firest at 8472 in the same episode and damages the wall behind it.

Keyword a "few" times. They just don' understand how supressing fire to pin the enemy in place will shambling along even though we know they can run.

And is loss within a black hole.

Of course, the UFP can pretty much blow apart stars thanks to a certain scientist, and they can do it with their standard torpedo cases. No special ship required.

no I was away almost all day. I just didnt get time to read it all except to see SW fanboys getting asses handed to them.

Yes, lets take a look at that. Assuming about a 50/50 spread on each side with the turbolasers, that's about 2,500 HTLs. However, the way HTLs are built is going to limit it to a few* hundred, say 200. However, we see that these ships easily miss half the time at slower slug ships. In fact, we saw three Venators perform an all out assault upon the bridge of the slow moving Malevolence and they only hit twice out of a dozen barrages. With that sort of accuracy, a ship like the Enterprise E is probably only going to be recieving only a few hits, probaly 20 at best (sorry, but when each ship has 8 HTLs firing for 48 bolts per second and only 2 actually hit the bridge in front of them, it's pretty bad), so probably about 200 MTs, no more than one or two torpedoes. And with a less concentrated energy per hit, the damage to the ship is also going to be a great deal less.

One problem with that: this class of SSD has a super laser, which in itself says "shields powerful enough to ram anything that gets in its way".

And on Trek firepower "The Die is Cast" is not the answer, we only see MT on the surface, no striping of the crust there.
Then you have Riker stating it would take half of the Ent torps to blow up a hollow asteroid, damn, can't remember the name of the epsiode right now.

And before I forget to the post about using the Hyper cannon form EAW:
Play F-15 Strike Eagle II, and in that game, an F-15 can take a half-dozen direct hits from SAM's before it goes down "in reality, one proximity hit will kill it easily). Can we agree it's silly to use computer gameplay as a basis for comparing things?

[Lord Vasago]

Dude, it's not like I didnt give any other show half a chance. Some shit is just way more alien than I care for. Ships with shape designs that look too molded and colorful just dont do anything for me. Overly vibrant color CGI effects make it look too much like a game.

Farscape is a joke, the captain on Andromedaa - I dont know what I remember him from but it left a lasting impression that I cant see him being a captain. Babylon's CGI is amusing but I cant see believing it no matter how graphically impressive it looks.

Serenity/Firefly - I might have liked. I think I would cuzz I seen Serenity several times and love it. Never seen the show Firefly though.

Anyway, Lord Hater. Don't even attempt to insult Seven of Nine with these bullshit comparisons. She's by far one of the greatest female characters ever, just like Summer Glau's Terminator character.

Both quite bad-asses in a fight, and self-regenerating so if their face gets hurt, their nano tech would fix it. But much of their appeal is they are both in a position to learn. They both are students of human nature and what better way for them to accomodate a persons wishes than for them to want to learn to? Also, they can be very emotionless and logical, which is perfect for a male. They can both also be as modest as you prefer.

I dont know how many women you've interacted with in your life and how much analysis you've put into the encounter or relationship, but there's very few who'd possess the traits to make it a completely original, amusing, interesting, fullfilling match-up. A betazed like Troi would just read your thoughts and if she sensed you were getting bored, she'd adapt, so she'd make life interesting for sure. Cameron would probably adapt, and Seven as well... they can sense temperature increases and subtle physical changes... they'd know if your heartrate still jumps when they enter the room.

But yeah SW vs ST women... Seven with the unfair advantage, FTW.

1. Lord Hater ???? very mature, looking at your post i would say that name fits you perfectly hating everything that is not star trek. i did expect you to fall this deep.

2. Indeed Summer glau is kickass

3. Rommies nanobots are so beyond Sevens

4. Insulting my taste in women is insulting my wife. who makes my life interesting, is a chef-cook by job, is able to control and manage our familybudget perfectly, has a healthy sexdrive, and is allways eager to learn. since she is with me she'd learned electricity, mechanics and construction.
but ok i understand that you prefer women that adapt to your needs. show some respect for the ladies first.

5. but i must agree with you that Seven is indeed hotter than anyone SW has to offer

[Lord Vasago]

Save for Rommie... they all look like whores... I'm sorry, just my opinoin

I know kitt , but this being off topic i wasn't willing to post pics seperatly.
and you have to see them on-screen. I didn't meen just their looks i ment the way they behave that makes them so damn sexy. espacialy Sukozu and Chiara.
The peacekeaper bitch is just like you say a Whore lol

[Kittamaru]

Explain then why the lost of around 312 ships was seen as a massive loss then. Based off that low end is 10,000 ships, high is 30,000.
Either give the quotes and your sources you draw these numbers from or concede they don't more then 30,000 max.

The reason this was a massive loss was because of the loss of life... the loss of even ONE capital starship is a massive loss of life, because they aren't just mindless clones or droids... we're talking sentient beings.

[fedr808]

Explain then why the lost of around 312 ships was seen as a massive loss then. Based off that low end is 10,000 ships, high is 30,000.
Either give the quotes and your sources you draw these numbers from or concede they don't more then 30,000 max.

The reason this was a massive loss was because of the loss of life... the loss of even ONE capital starship is a massive loss of life, because they aren't just mindless clones or droids... we're talking sentient beings.

BECAUSE KITTAMARU, the logic behind star wars is FLAWED, THEIR OWN AIR BRAKES ON THEIR SHIPS CAN TEAR THEIR HULLS IN TWO, AND THERES NO FUCKING AIR!

[alpinedigital]

Explain then why the lost of around 312 ships was seen as a massive loss then. Based off that low end is 10,000 ships, high is 30,000.
Either give the quotes and your sources you draw these numbers from or concede they don't more then 30,000 max.

The ships being replaceable, it wouldn't be about the ships but about the people on them. You cant just rebuild years of experience that captains have.

That's one reason Borg are really wicked. Not too many key personnel, no moral lost by killing specific Borg. On the other hand, if they focus just on specific ships and take out key people, their opponents moral would sink fast.

[alpinedigital]

1. Lord Hater ???? very mature, looking at your post i would say that name fits you perfectly hating everything that is not star trek. i did expect you to fall this deep.

2. Indeed Summer glau is kickass

3. Rommies nanobots are so beyond Sevens

4. Insulting my taste in women is insulting my wife. who makes my life interesting, is a chef-cook by job, is able to control and manage our familybudget perfectly, has a healthy sexdrive, and is allways eager to learn. since she is with me she'd learned electricity, mechanics and construction.
but ok i understand that you prefer women that adapt to your needs. show some respect for the ladies first.

5. but i must agree with you that Seven is indeed hotter than anyone SW has to offer

1. The Lord Hater comment was just kidding around with you. And 'hate' is a very strong word. I don't HATE them just because I say they're a joke. So don't try putting words in my mouth.

2. Summer should get another role as a tough ass bitch, like the Resident Evil chicks, or even a Martial Arts fighting style like Kristin Kreuk did.

3. Good for Rommie and her nanobots. That statement don't mean anything if you don't include an example.

4. No, you interpret my comment as an insult to your taste in women and then translated it into an insult to your wife. You again try to put words in my mouth. My first impulse was to tell you I'll accept the charges and commit the act by saying 'Fuck you and your stupid wife, she's a dumbass by association' but rather than saying I won't or I didn't say it, I'd rather just tell you to stop putting words in my mouth because I damn sure never disrespected your wife or women in general.

5. I could try to think of a character that could compare, or exceed the reasons Seven rates highest that I can think of right at the moment. I am open to the possibility there's one I would rate higher... just dont consider it probable.

Sorry about #4, its harsh but I don't like being condemned for shit I didnt say or do.

Now, please... enjoy the show.

[fedr808]

The ships being replaceable, it wouldn't be about the ships but about the people on them. You cant just rebuild years of experience that captains have.

What experiance? They couldnt and didnt find the millenium falcon if it were ATTACHED TO THEIR ASSES.

[ProphetofWisdom]

Explain then why the lost of around 312 ships was seen as a massive loss then. Based off that low end is 10,000 ships, high is 30,000.
Either give the quotes and your sources you draw these numbers from or concede they don't more then 30,000 max.

The reason this was a massive loss was because of the loss of life... the loss of even ONE capital starship is a massive loss of life, because they aren't just mindless clones or droids... we're talking sentient beings.

Yes, I know that. My point stands that if they had 60,000+ ships (like say the Covenant who could shurg off the lose of 500+ ships and a 30km station without a dent in their forces) where are they?
If the numbers were right there should be hundreds of ships in the Sol system or nearby, yet there are never more then a few dozen ships at a time which makes it clear that their forces are spread thin and not more then 30,000 ships...on the other hand they don't all have to be combat ships like GCS so for normal combat ships 30,000 is good, non-combat can be another 30,000.

[alpinedigital]

What experiance? They couldnt and didnt find the millenium falcon if it were ATTACHED TO THEIR ASSES.

I was talking about the 'massive loss' statement. Its only a massive loss in Trek if its a loss of captains and other ranking officers of the Federation. I don't think it had anything to do with the loss of the ships.

[alpinedigital]

Yes, I know that. My point stands that if they had 60,000+ ships (like say the Covenant who could shurg off the lose of 500+ ships and a 30km station without a dent in their forces) where are they?
If the numbers were right there should be hundreds of ships in the Sol system or nearby, yet there are never more then a few dozen ships at a time which makes it clear that their forces are spread thin and not more then 30,000 ships...on the other hand they don't all have to be combat ships like GCS so for normal combat ships 30,000 is good, non-combat can be another 30,000.

Prophet your point is irrelevant anyway. For one, HAVING so many ships doesn't exactly matter. Having the coin to GET ships does. They can easily go trade for Ferengi vessels if they want or round up a shitload from any species they care to.

Either way arguing this point has proven ineffective anyway since you cant base your figures on a statement of 'loss' whit no further reference, especially about ships. It could even have 312 of the best ships, or most powerful ships, and there could still be 59,688 slightly less powerful ships. The point is if you cant be certain to what this loss is in reference to, you're better off not making a fool of yourself by arguing about it.

[ProphetofWisdom]

Prophet your point is irrelevant anyway. For one, HAVING so many ships doesn't exactly matter. Having the coin to GET ships does. They can easily go trade for Ferengi vessels if they want or round up a shitload from any species they care to.

Either way arguing this point has proven ineffective anyway since you cant base your figures on a statement of 'loss' whit no further reference, especially about ships. It could even have 312 of the best ships, or most powerful ships, and there could still be 59,688 slightly less powerful ships. The point is if you cant be certain to what this loss is in reference to, you're better off not making a fool of yourself by arguing about it.

Will lets see...lose of 40 ships in THe Best of Both Worlds part II (correct me if wrong) was a heavy loss to the fleet, lose of 111 out 112 ships in DS9 was a heavy loss, then the loss of about 312 ships.
I think its says somewhere on Memory Alpha that it would take time for starfleet to recover from the lost at Wolf 359 to the Borg.

Now some more details on the Forerunner before any one says Trek can beat them.

1. The 90,000-100,000 kilometer across megastructure known as "The Ark" was built in secret during the last few years of the Forerunner-Flood War and then transport with the sun built for it out to 260,000 light light years from the galactic core, beyond the range of the "Halo Effect" as the Forerunners called it.

2. The Ark is not even the most impressive thing they seem to have built in secret during the end of the War when their industrial strength was a shadow of what it was at the start.
They built high end 7 true Shield Worlds (high since this would go with 7 rings), each of them is built out of trillions of Onyx drones, thousands linked together can blast unshielded Covenant warships away with ease.
At the center of these worlds are Slipspace rifts 2 meters across that house the Micro Dyson Sphere, which is 150,000 kilometers aross, or about 2 AU.

3. Even during the end of the War 10,000 ships was still consider a 'surgical' strike. They also built fleets of thousands of standard non-Keyship Dreadnoughts with ease even when building their megastructures.

Looking over all of this, it can be said that the Forerunner could easily over-run Trek high end and Wars high end without even breaking a sweat.