Star Wars vs Star Trek

[TW Scott]

aye, one captured or stranded ship on eighter side and the tech differences would blend rapidly.

Actually no. SW tech is so far more advanced that it would take hundreds of years to reverse engineer it, unless you had a Wesley type genius working on it. Then it would be decades.

Now I know you'd say they would just read the computer banks. Well the banks of the average SD does not have full technical readouts, or explantions of the tech unlike their Fed counterparts.

[antaran_1979]

Remember, that invisible ship the size of a small battlestation is moving at almost half the speed of light at impulse, if not faster...

but it is also flying weapons hot, and shooting like there is no tommorow. seaing how all weapons in SF are visible (ST no exception) why no one bothered to track the weapon source dynamics and use it to predict the Scimitar location? i would have given that yellobelly a better run for the money i think. at least more phasers would have hit the target. still, even as incompetent as the feds were, they scored quite a few hits and the Scimitar's shields still held for most of the battle even when they had to use so much enery for the cloack.

[antaran_1979]

Actually, I would reckon a concentrated phaser strike from 1-2 sovereign class starships would do it - it'd be like drilling thru the Death Star to the Core and *boom*

Case in point - in Star trek, we have seen the ability for multiple ships to concentrate firepower on a single spot (First Contact for example). We never saw that in Star Wars... they just shoot AT something as much and as often as possible and hope to god it blows up before they do... if a fleet of a dozen or so ships hits the exact same point on the Death Star in quick succession (within 5 seconds) with both rapid, sustained phaser strikes (full power) and photon and quantum torpedo barrages... I doubt there would be much LEFT of that location... you'd have a small crater there. Rinse, repeat, and soon yer hitting the core

i doubt it. the DS if freaking huge. no drill (even if wasn't armored) would do. besides it has HTLs to protect it. it will fire back.

[antaran_1979]

Actually no. SW tech is so far more advanced that it would take hundreds of years to reverse engineer it, unless you had a Wesley type genius working on it. Then it would be decades.

Now I know you'd say they would just read the computer banks. Well the banks of the average SD does not have full technical readouts, or explantions of the tech unlike their Fed counterparts.

meh, who could say. we can only speculate.

[antaran_1979]

Well for starters, Ships don't go into warp to attack and than run away otherwise theyd do it all the time, so that options out.

they do that every now and then, but never on the long run, it is more a tactical then a strategic solution.

[antaran_1979]

As for point #5, you have yet to state ANYTHING that even begins to indicate a level of firepower able to penetrate a trek shield... so yeah.

look lasers might not not "penetrate" the grav.based deflector shields, but they will wear them down eventually.

[antaran_1979]

I love how you argue the fact that 95% of WH40k weaponry would miss based off of NOTHING.

in Scimitar's case it woul be so just because of the cloacking device

[antaran_1979]

Well considering that the STANDARD weaponry on a WH40k ship can destroy a planet i think were well off. No ship in ST comes with specialized planet killing weaponry STANDARD theres only a handful that can, and they cant be at a thousand battles at once.

sure there are planet killers, even star killers and star system effecting weapons, but most are not directed energy weapons.

[Lord Vasago]

Kitt you mentioned that sensors in SW can't be good because they could not detect lifesigns and stuff on the DS but yet in ST the e-e can't detecked the same things on a cloaked vessel. isn't it fair to say that the DS has some kind of 'masking' ability. Infact it took obi-one to use the force before the knew it was not a moon. It doesn't have to be cloaked , because it looks like a moon.

oh yeah euh the scimitar doesn't really need a exhaust vent does it? a good ramming would take it out just as easily. and it shields where still functional. so a few thousand fighterdroids could do the trick lol

as al torps are way slower then TL's your torps are pretty useless. otherwise the ywings just had to drop there payload

the destruction of the ds2 is just because of the emperor's self astream. he untherestamated the power of guerillia warfare. (as did a lot of us presidents lol)
if it shields would be still up, the rebellion would have been oblivarated.

as for e-e vs scimitar it is plain and simple. if it where a Romulan or Klingon instead of shinron the e-e would be squached like a cockroach. it would have taken less than 5 minutes.
the scimitar would have taken out the whole fed's fleet one by one. be glad it was the only one of his kind. imagine a fleet of those asskickers. now THAT would make ST vs SW intresting

[Lord Vasago]

look lasers might not not "penetrate" the grav.based deflector shields, but they will wear them down eventually.

Yet in Voyager you see a lasers hit the shield creating a whole ??? so a smaller vessel can fly through and ram Voyager. i admit that Chakota's ex did knew the frequencies but still they we're ages behind the FED's on terms of technologie.

In fact ST shields are just as powerfull as the protection of their frequencies.

i think one shot of a ds would wear their shields down quit easily.

[Kittamaru]

dude, E-E had no realistic hope of defeating the Scimitar while it was cloacked. the only hope they had was the fact Shinzon wanted Picard alive. c'mon man, 57 RP2 disruptor banks? 20+ photon torpedo launchers? agility of the E-E and 5+ times the size? it's like figting 5 or more warbirds at the same time. even without the fire-while-cloacked thingy it takes a tactical genious to operate/command the E-E and mediocre dudes in charge of the competition. in a free far all no limitation duel the Scimitar could destroy the E-E without the cloack i think, allthough it would largely depend on who gets the first shot. if E-E could get those quatums into the Scimitar first, they might stand achance.

I never said the E-E would WIN, but in a standing battle it would have faired a bit better if not for those things... and the firing thru cloak of course.

[Kittamaru]

Actually no. SW tech is so far more advanced that it would take hundreds of years to reverse engineer it, unless you had a Wesley type genius working on it. Then it would be decades.

Now I know you'd say they would just read the computer banks. Well the banks of the average SD does not have full technical readouts, or explantions of the tech unlike their Fed counterparts.

*chuckles* Ah me, how funny You're always good for a laugh

[Kittamaru]

but it is also flying weapons hot, and shooting like there is no tommorow. seaing how all weapons in SF are visible (ST no exception) why no one bothered to track the weapon source dynamics and use it to predict the Scimitar location? i would have given that yellobelly a better run for the money i think. at least more phasers would have hit the target. still, even as incompetent as the feds were, they scored quite a few hits and the Scimitar's shields still held for most of the battle even when they had to use so much enery for the cloack.

Problem is, without going full-computer control, you can't really use the incoming weapons fire to triangulate the position. We're talking relativisticly fast weapons... even at .25c, you only have a tenth of a second at best to see them. The Feds don't like going full-computer control because A) they've had bad experiences with that in the past (TOS: The Computer) and B) Computers don't have intellect or cunning

[Kittamaru]

i doubt it. the DS if freaking huge. no drill (even if wasn't armored) would do. besides it has HTLs to protect it. it will fire back.

I dunno mate... it took a Galaxy Class only a handful of shots at near-minimum power to drill a few hundred KM thru a planets crust... imagine what a handful of high-powered warships could do firing their phaser banks at the exact same spot (ala Star Trek: First Contact) would do to even the Death Star. I predict major damage on the scale of leaving a nicely sized crater.

[Kittamaru]

look lasers might not not "penetrate" the grav.based deflector shields, but they will wear them down eventually.

Maybe, but Meltas, Bolters, and other kinetic or projectile based weapons are going to be largely useless... leaving you with a handful of laser cannon batteries per ship.

And again, that's assuming WH40K can even track a target moving between 50%->90% the speed of light.

[Kittamaru]

Kitt you mentioned that sensors in SW can't be good because they could not detect lifesigns and stuff on the DS but yet in ST the e-e can't detecked the same things on a cloaked vessel. isn't it fair to say that the DS has some kind of 'masking' ability. Infact it took obi-one to use the force before the knew it was not a moon. It doesn't have to be cloaked , because it looks like a moon.

Most cloaks aren't that thorough Also, wouldn't a quick comparison with a standard navigational star chart tell you that that huge battlestation isn't a moon... since there aren't any moons around here? Or do moons in Star Wars sometimes just... go out for a sunday job?

oh yeah euh the scimitar doesn't really need a exhaust vent does it? a good ramming would take it out just as easily. and it shields where still functional. so a few thousand fighterdroids could do the trick lol

Not entirely sure what you're getting at - if your main weapons batteries wouldn't penetrate our shields, how could tiny little fighters do it... and if you meant the buzz-droids, they'd vaporize upon contact with our shield grid

as al torps are way slower then TL's your torps are pretty useless. otherwise the ywings just had to drop there payload

Uhm... what? Pardon me - last time I checked, TurboLasers were slower than light... and we have seen torpedoe's used at warp and against targets millions of kilometers away... one was even used to bring a klingon diplomat to the enterprise, traveling at nearly Warp 8 for 3 days... I wouldn't call that "slow" by any means.

the destruction of the ds2 is just because of the emperor's self astream. he untherestamated the power of guerillia warfare. (as did a lot of us presidents lol)
if it shields would be still up, the rebellion would have been oblivarated.

Perhaps... but that just proves my point. Incompetent officers keep ruining your day

as for e-e vs scimitar it is plain and simple. if it where a Romulan or Klingon instead of shinron the e-e would be squached like a cockroach. it would have taken less than 5 minutes.
the scimitar would have taken out the whole fed's fleet one by one. be glad it was the only one of his kind. imagine a fleet of those asskickers. now THAT would make ST vs SW intresting

Again, I don't think the Ent-E could beat the Scimitar 1v1... but if it were ANY other captain on the Scimitar, I think Picard could have fair'ed far, far better. For starters, he wouldn't be so worried about having a little clone of himself running around

[Kittamaru]

Yet in Voyager you see a lasers hit the shield creating a whole ??? so a smaller vessel can fly through and ram Voyager. i admit that Chakota's ex did knew the frequencies but still they we're ages behind the FED's on terms of technologie.

In fact ST shields are just as powerfull as the protection of their frequencies.

i think one shot of a ds would wear their shields down quit easily.

One shot of a Death Star would never HIT a Trek ship... lol. They'd detect that massive power buildup, see the Laser charge, and micro-warp jump out of the way in a heartbeat.

[fedr808]

Okay how bout this for an arguement for the shield capability of a WH40k ship. The planet destroyer in TOS obliterated enemy ships left or right, regardless of shields. No trek weapon could even touch the damned thing.

Yet, when the WH40k ships squared off against a real planet killer, one the size of a fucking planet, They resisted that destructive power not only through their shields but also their fucking hull.

Now in reality, it doesnt matter if a planet destroying device is a super laser, radiation, or just a ton of gauss cannons, or even lascannons, it takes an amount of energy to destroy a planet, And radiation, and even lascannons are just different manifestations of energy. And the fact is that if a ST ship can hardly even repel that much energy yet a WH40k ship chews it up and spits it out, than who do you think has superior shields?

If a ST ship faces off against a WH40k ship, they would be facing the firepower that would destroy planets without a sweat.

Imagine taking two scimitars and having them duke it out against one another, that is around the same amount of firepower as two battleships in WH40k. So tell me, if the federation could hardly fend off one scimitar, how exactly is it going to face off against 39,000?

P.S. A frigate could rip your little defiant to pieces in seconds, theyre specialized anti fighter and fast destroyer ships.

[fedr808]

sure there are planet killers, even star killers and star system effecting weapons, but most are not directed energy weapons.

A few of mine are, im pretty damn sure there arent that many ST shields in existance that can take that sort of punishment.

[fedr808]

I dunno mate... it took a Galaxy Class only a handful of shots at near-minimum power to drill a few hundred KM thru a planets crust... imagine what a handful of high-powered warships could do firing their phaser banks at the exact same spot (ala Star Trek: First Contact) would do to even the Death Star. I predict major damage on the scale of leaving a nicely sized crater.

Well for starters, planets aren't made out of metal, or armor, and two they only have to drill a few miles before reaching magma and than it is all downhill from their.