View Poll Results: Which universe would win?

Voters
670. This poll is closed
  • Star Trek

    227 33.88%
  • Star Wars

    285 42.54%
  • Spaceballs

    51 7.61%
  • Farscape

    14 2.09%
  • Dune

    54 8.06%
  • Stargate

    39 5.82%

Thread: Star Wars vs Star Trek

  1. #5001
    Very Special Senior Member USS Athens's Avatar
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    Oh yeah and hellblade8, nice avatar.

  2. #5002
    Valued Senior Member Hellblade8's Avatar
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    1,099
    Quote Originally Posted by USS Enterprise-B View Post
    Yeah, why not just take a cloaked Defiant class ship, beam a tri-cobalt device into every SW ship and run like hell. Decloak as they leave just to let the poor imperials take a few blind-shots and see what blew em' up.
    Perhaps for a raid attack, but in a full blown battle like we see in DS9, it wouldn't be all that helpful...besides, its not like Imperial ships are even going to outclass UFP ships, so its hardly worth the effort.

    And once the war reaches the point that the UFP begins to lose because the Empire is throwing so many ships into it, just send in a cloaked ship with a virus that'll destroy all the mediclorians (or whatever their called), thus, killing life everywhere thanks to the fact that no one can live without the force.

    That's what you get for letting George near your SW again.
    Last edited by Hellblade8; 06-17-07 at 11:12 PM.

  3. #5003
    Valued Senior Member Hellblade8's Avatar
    Posts
    1,099
    Quote Originally Posted by USS Enterprise-B View Post
    Oh yeah and hellblade8, nice avatar.
    Thanks, same to you.

  4. #5004
    Valued Senior Member Hellblade8's Avatar
    Posts
    1,099
    Quote Originally Posted by USS Enterprise-B View Post
    Although there was that asteroid field on ESB, coming back to that igneos thing with granite, let me tell you something most asteroids are LEFT OVER after the creation of the universe. (And regarding the sheilds on an ISD, how come it was simply destroyed in an asteroid flield if its sheilds were so good?) I don't see your sources and equations for the watt output of a turbolaser.
    Some SW fans claim that the single ion cannon damaged that paticular ship so bad that it lost its shields. And even accepting this as truth, its pretty sad that their ships are so poorly armored.

    I mean, lets go through the list of Star Wars armor failure:

    1) Lost ISD bridge due to astroid

    2) Lost Walker due to two trees crushing it like a soda can, apparently incredibly advanced civilizations with fighter that pour out low gigatons of firepower have inferior protection to a minivan.

    3) Storm Trooper Armor, where we cried as knee high teddy bears beat the living crap out of Palpy's best. These teddy bears where of course, armed with high tech weaponry such as sticks, rocks, and arrows that can barely penetrate the bark of a tree. Against such primitive technology as blasters that at their highest setting, blow holes in doors. At least the stormies had their plastic armor though, I personally think its what stopped the Ewoks from putting the troopers over their knees and spanking them.

    As for SW firepower, Han himself said that there was no way the Empire could destroy the planet, not even with the entire starfleet. He said it would take a thousand starships with more firepower than he had seen (or so we guess, he never actuallly finished what he was saying). And as much as people want to say that Han has no idea what he's talking about, I would like to remind you that he is a top smuggler before he ran into some bad luck, and to top it all off, he knew about the sensor blind spot (which apparently imperial officers are too stupid to check...) and when the ISD was going to drop their waste. Given that they also had a war about 20 years ago, the firepower seen in that war should have carried over at least, so Han would have had some idea of how powerful SW is. I know he's older than Luke, so that means he was around before Luke was born and thus had some exposure to the war, or its close after affects.

  5. #5005
    That which cannot be known Kittamaru's Avatar
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    7,967
    Thank you hellblade8

    Though, as your arguments make sense and are based on factual evidence, we can be sure Scotto will completely ignore it.

    Can we finally put this to rest? Trek wins, hands down. Firepower, Speed, Defenses, intelligence... and Trek has hot chicks that AREN'T all aliens. What does Wars have? The near incest of Luke and Leia. Padme who's now dead. And a bunch of green and blue aliens with more tenticles than I have fingers.

    So yeah. Even where it doesn't matter, Trek would win.

  6. #5006
    Valued Senior Member Hellblade8's Avatar
    Posts
    1,099
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittamaru View Post
    Thank you hellblade8

    Though, as your arguments make sense and are based on factual evidence, we can be sure Scotto will completely ignore it.
    Wel, we'll have to see. It pretty hard to argue with basic logic, but I've seen people make the claim that Storm Troopers are competent and it sound not totaly insane.

    Can we finally put this to rest? Trek wins, hands down. Firepower, Speed, Defenses, intelligence... and Trek has hot chicks that AREN'T all aliens. What does Wars have? The near incest of Luke and Leia. Padme who's now dead. And a bunch of green and blue aliens with more tenticles than I have fingers.
    Well, we can try. Okay, the Empire has alot of ships, alot of ships that can move over a vast area. However, given how they don't know where anything is in Star Trek, they just might run into the Borg or the Dominion as well. Of course, I don't think the Borg will care too much about them, they'd likely go find something else to assimilate.

    So faster than light speed does go to Empire, but as far as tactical battles, the Empire doesn't really seem to bother with the whole idea of moving. Strange concept. Defense is a no brainer, UFP shields are better, though for the most part SW shields don't tend to take damage while the shields are up, or at least not as much as ST shields...then again, they're also weaker in the shielding department and the lack of a rotating frequency means they have to open a small hole in their shields to fire. Intelligence is another thing that ST has, and not to mention that while in combat their only a bit better than the Empire, they actually know how to use their ships, which the Empire doesn't.

    But I guess people shouldn't be too hard on the empire, they're army is closer to the coast guard than anything else. Its all about big bad scary ships with people in scary (pastic) armor. There's no actual power behind it, save for the Death Star...which got blown up by a farmboy in a fighter (first time too if I recall). Sure he was a jedi, but he was a rookie jedi.

    As for women, lets see:

    Troi
    Dr. Crusher
    Major Kira
    Dax 1
    Dax 2
    Seven of Nine
    T'Pol

    The best human-like aliens. The best Star Wars had was Padme, who though hot, couldn't act her way out of a paper bag ("my love for you is like a loving river of loving love?" What the hell?!), and while Leia was okay in terms of looks, she did kill Jabba while in a bronze bikini, which is pretty awsome...however, not even an hour of her doing anything in a bikini of any sort can make up for the horrible smack down that the Muppet Ba-Er...Ewoks, gave to the 501st. Now way.

    So yeah. Even where it doesn't matter, Trek would win.
    Really, Technology is one of the real lesser matters. What really matters about each one is how good of a show/movie/series they are.

    The first Star Wars movies where great in terms special effects and lightsabers, not to mention Darth Vader...but that's it. There was nothing else that was great about the movies, save for perhaps Empire Strikes Back, which is the best. The story itself changes so much its disturbing. First, it was Luke was going to end up with Leia (given the indication of how they where acting, George as anyone can plainly see, was not the one to plan that far or well ahead). Darth Vader was a traitor who killed Luke's father.

    Then apparently, it seems to have changed in Empire Strikes back, to where Vader was Luke's father (which was actually pretty cool), and there was hinting that Leia may be Luke's sister. Of course, this pretty much got shot down thanks to the wonderful fact that it never actually seemed to do anything. Here we meet Master Yoda, who trained Ben.

    However, in the third movie, it all falls apart. Apparently, the Empire manages to rebuild their battlestation...rather than spend the funds on hunting down the rebels andusing the resources for more ships to patrole their galaxy, but that shows you how badly they needed the Death Star to keep order. Here apparently we learnt that Ben lied...well, he didn't really lie, he just "twisted" the truth, which seems very strange, but okay, it works to an extent. Apparently, the Emperor decides to hold a trap, and for this trap, he only brings in like 12 ISDs and VAder's Flagship, rather than the thousands of millions of ships that people claims he has, but never actually shows. We also learn that Leia had early memories of her mother. At the end of the movie, Vader kills the Emperor, and Vader dies...for some reason. Then we all get to hear the gay Ewok song at the end of the movie, just to ensure you that what you saw actually happened. The Ewoks beating the living crap out of a society with far move advanced weapons, and not just by numbers, but by skill in battle...they defined pwnd.

    Then we see Episode I. Here we see that apparently, Ben met Anakin when he was a child, not as a pilot...though he did destroy a battleship...entirely by accident. Or how apparently super scary battle droids get their ass kicked by an army of people who use spears as well as high tech weapons...lead by a moron who must have raped reality in order to win that battle...given how his side won, I believe this is what actually happened. As the movie ends, we see Anakin being taken under Ben's wing...also strange was the fact that it wasn't Master Yoda who was his trainer, but some loser with a ponytail and a name that I could care less about. Also, apparently, those hugh gigaton can't seem to do more than fry a mech droid's ass when in a fire fight...and apparently a little boy is able to build and program a droid...

    In Episode II, we get to watch as some sort of romance buds between a woman who was around 25 in Episode I, now at least 35, rob the Jedi crib as she does the nasty with a 20 something (is he even that old?!). We also get to watch as Anakin visits his old home, kill people we don't care about, watch as about a hundred Jedi get pwnd, watch the worst romantic acting ever seen before the release of Episode III, and feel lost as to how a sweet inocent boy goes emo with no explination at all. Oh, and watch as George recycles how Luke loses his hand.

    Finally Episode III, supposedly the best of all three of these new ones, is perhaps one of the worst and most confusing thigns ever seen. Apparently they go to get the Emperor back (who, is of course, apparently evil). Watch as Anakin bitches as how he doesn't get a vote on the council, despite being new and the youngest Master ever, as well as the fact that he only got the position because his rich evil friend forced it upon the council. Then watch as more canon is left in shambles as Padme dies after childbirth, so thus that means that Leia needs to cut down on the pills, of course, the worst part of all, is that Padme dies...of a broken heart...which is actually impossible given the fact that there was physically nothing wrong with her.


    Star Trek, on the other hand, while its had its problems with Voyager and Enterprise, has stayed far from the crap that George pushed out, and at least Roddenberry was dead and thus had nothing to do with it. And for all of that special effects in Star Wars, DS9 still had better space battles even when working with stock footage, models, and worse special effects. And still, they have time to give a compelling story (most of the time) that teaches you something that doesn't sound like an after school special.

    That, and they have the Defiant, Akira, and Soverign class starships, how more badass can you get than that. Oh, and at least most Star Trek movies don't suck, sure 9, 3, and 7 where sub-par, but they did alright. Movies 2, 4, 6and 8 where awsome, with 1 and 5 being kinda crappy.

    Still, better than anything Lucas puts out.

  7. #5007
    Quote Originally Posted by Fettman View Post
    25,000 bby
    In Attack of the Clones, one of the Naboo advisors to Queen Jamillia says that there have been no major wars since the formation of teh Republic. Since movies are "higher" canon, any war involving teh Republic that is major in any way (Mandalorian, Jedi Civil War, Exar Kun, etc.) before AOTC is non-canon.

  8. #5008
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellblade8 View Post
    Wel, we'll have to see. It pretty hard to argue with basic logic, but I've seen people make the claim that Storm Troopers are competent and it sound not totaly insane.
    Exactly. BEFORE Vader knew Luke/Han were rescuing Leia, the Storm Troopers couldnt hit them worth shit. Thus, Storm Troopers suck.

  9. #5009
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellblade8 View Post
    2) Lost Walker due to two trees crushing it like a soda can, apparently incredibly advanced civilizations with fighter that pour out low gigatons of firepower have inferior protection to a minivan.
    Not only that, but the Chicken Walker blew up like it was HOLLOW and the papier mache armor on the outside just bent...
    I mean, ST has a TV budget and has better effects than Lucas and his movie budget...

  10. #5010
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellblade8 View Post
    Perhaps for a raid attack, but in a full blown battle like we see in DS9, it wouldn't be all that helpful...besides, its not like Imperial ships are even going to outclass UFP ships, so its hardly worth the effort.

    And once the war reaches the point that the UFP begins to lose because the Empire is throwing so many ships into it, just send in a cloaked ship with a virus that'll destroy all the mediclorians (or whatever their called), thus, killing life everywhere thanks to the fact that no one can live without the force.

    That's what you get for letting George near your SW again.
    Or... since the SW universe is so far away from STs, the humans there will have different genetic markers than out Humans (ST). So, create a virus that kills their humans and not ours... (The downside is that the factions in ST who are willing to do this wont mind killing our Humans too).
    And the Empire wont be able to get a cure to everyone so quickly. Its a huge empire, and it has to go through the corrupt bureaucracy and the Empire isnt exactly generous... if the Federation is hit by the virus, they will make priority #1 a cure.

  11. #5011
    That which cannot be known Kittamaru's Avatar
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    7,967
    All very valid points

    I mean, for GODS sake, Luke had to take refuge in a giant CAMEL! What the FUCK? They don't have heaters? Christ.

  12. #5012
    With Trek, you would be able to beam him out.
    Movie wise Trek movies are way way more funny than any Wars movie.
    Take Star Trek IV for example, man the sight of the great kirk befuddled in 1980s San Fransisco .. that is funny.

  13. #5013
    That which cannot be known Kittamaru's Avatar
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    7,967
    By The Way - does anyone remember what happened when the Omega Particle was destroyed?

    3 light years area of subspace was destroyed. Everything else within half a light year was utterly vaporized.

    And that was a single molecule of the Omega particle...

  14. #5014
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellblade8 View Post
    Wel, we'll have to see. It pretty hard to argue with basic logic, but I've seen people make the claim that Storm Troopers are competent and it sound not totaly insane.



    Well, we can try. Okay, the Empire has alot of ships, alot of ships that can move over a vast area. However, given how they don't know where anything is in Star Trek, they just might run into the Borg or the Dominion as well. Of course, I don't think the Borg will care too much about them, they'd likely go find something else to assimilate.

    So faster than light speed does go to Empire, but as far as tactical battles, the Empire doesn't really seem to bother with the whole idea of moving. Strange concept. Defense is a no brainer, UFP shields are better, though for the most part SW shields don't tend to take damage while the shields are up, or at least not as much as ST shields...then again, they're also weaker in the shielding department and the lack of a rotating frequency means they have to open a small hole in their shields to fire. Intelligence is another thing that ST has, and not to mention that while in combat their only a bit better than the Empire, they actually know how to use their ships, which the Empire doesn't.

    But I guess people shouldn't be too hard on the empire, they're army is closer to the coast guard than anything else. Its all about big bad scary ships with people in scary (pastic) armor. There's no actual power behind it, save for the Death Star...which got blown up by a farmboy in a fighter (first time too if I recall). Sure he was a jedi, but he was a rookie jedi.

    As for women, lets see:

    Troi
    Dr. Crusher
    Major Kira
    Dax 1
    Dax 2
    Seven of Nine
    T'Pol

    The best human-like aliens. The best Star Wars had was Padme, who though hot, couldn't act her way out of a paper bag ("my love for you is like a loving river of loving love?" What the hell?!), and while Leia was okay in terms of looks, she did kill Jabba while in a bronze bikini, which is pretty awsome...however, not even an hour of her doing anything in a bikini of any sort can make up for the horrible smack down that the Muppet Ba-Er...Ewoks, gave to the 501st. Now way.



    Really, Technology is one of the real lesser matters. What really matters about each one is how good of a show/movie/series they are.

    The first Star Wars movies where great in terms special effects and lightsabers, not to mention Darth Vader...but that's it. There was nothing else that was great about the movies, save for perhaps Empire Strikes Back, which is the best. The story itself changes so much its disturbing. First, it was Luke was going to end up with Leia (given the indication of how they where acting, George as anyone can plainly see, was not the one to plan that far or well ahead). Darth Vader was a traitor who killed Luke's father.

    Then apparently, it seems to have changed in Empire Strikes back, to where Vader was Luke's father (which was actually pretty cool), and there was hinting that Leia may be Luke's sister. Of course, this pretty much got shot down thanks to the wonderful fact that it never actually seemed to do anything. Here we meet Master Yoda, who trained Ben.

    However, in the third movie, it all falls apart. Apparently, the Empire manages to rebuild their battlestation...rather than spend the funds on hunting down the rebels andusing the resources for more ships to patrole their galaxy, but that shows you how badly they needed the Death Star to keep order. Here apparently we learnt that Ben lied...well, he didn't really lie, he just "twisted" the truth, which seems very strange, but okay, it works to an extent. Apparently, the Emperor decides to hold a trap, and for this trap, he only brings in like 12 ISDs and VAder's Flagship, rather than the thousands of millions of ships that people claims he has, but never actually shows. We also learn that Leia had early memories of her mother. At the end of the movie, Vader kills the Emperor, and Vader dies...for some reason. Then we all get to hear the gay Ewok song at the end of the movie, just to ensure you that what you saw actually happened. The Ewoks beating the living crap out of a society with far move advanced weapons, and not just by numbers, but by skill in battle...they defined pwnd.

    Then we see Episode I. Here we see that apparently, Ben met Anakin when he was a child, not as a pilot...though he did destroy a battleship...entirely by accident. Or how apparently super scary battle droids get their ass kicked by an army of people who use spears as well as high tech weapons...lead by a moron who must have raped reality in order to win that battle...given how his side won, I believe this is what actually happened. As the movie ends, we see Anakin being taken under Ben's wing...also strange was the fact that it wasn't Master Yoda who was his trainer, but some loser with a ponytail and a name that I could care less about. Also, apparently, those hugh gigaton can't seem to do more than fry a mech droid's ass when in a fire fight...and apparently a little boy is able to build and program a droid...

    In Episode II, we get to watch as some sort of romance buds between a woman who was around 25 in Episode I, now at least 35, rob the Jedi crib as she does the nasty with a 20 something (is he even that old?!). We also get to watch as Anakin visits his old home, kill people we don't care about, watch as about a hundred Jedi get pwnd, watch the worst romantic acting ever seen before the release of Episode III, and feel lost as to how a sweet inocent boy goes emo with no explination at all. Oh, and watch as George recycles how Luke loses his hand.

    Finally Episode III, supposedly the best of all three of these new ones, is perhaps one of the worst and most confusing thigns ever seen. Apparently they go to get the Emperor back (who, is of course, apparently evil). Watch as Anakin bitches as how he doesn't get a vote on the council, despite being new and the youngest Master ever, as well as the fact that he only got the position because his rich evil friend forced it upon the council. Then watch as more canon is left in shambles as Padme dies after childbirth, so thus that means that Leia needs to cut down on the pills, of course, the worst part of all, is that Padme dies...of a broken heart...which is actually impossible given the fact that there was physically nothing wrong with her.


    Star Trek, on the other hand, while its had its problems with Voyager and Enterprise, has stayed far from the crap that George pushed out, and at least Roddenberry was dead and thus had nothing to do with it. And for all of that special effects in Star Wars, DS9 still had better space battles even when working with stock footage, models, and worse special effects. And still, they have time to give a compelling story (most of the time) that teaches you something that doesn't sound like an after school special.

    That, and they have the Defiant, Akira, and Soverign class starships, how more badass can you get than that. Oh, and at least most Star Trek movies don't suck, sure 9, 3, and 7 where sub-par, but they did alright. Movies 2, 4, 6and 8 where awsome, with 1 and 5 being kinda crappy.

    Still, better than anything Lucas puts out.
    I'm have no desire to take this hole post into a debate but would you really what's the movies again, please. and if you don't get it watch them again and again. Allthough I admit (being a huge sw fan) there are a lot of flaws in the movies I think you better pay attention when watching a movie, and let your grey cells work for a change.

  15. #5015
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittamaru View Post
    All very valid points

    I mean, for GODS sake, Luke had to take refuge in a giant CAMEL! What the FUCK? They don't have heaters? Christ.
    I though it was a well found idea, as al equipment froze. altough i ask myself where the hell Han was during the night. Must be hell of a tent.

  16. #5016
    That which cannot be known Kittamaru's Avatar
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    7,967
    Not just that, but if you're equipment can withstand the cold of space, why can't it withstand a few degrees below zero?

  17. #5017
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittamaru View Post
    Not just that, but if you're equipment can withstand the cold of space, why can't it withstand a few degrees below zero?
    I know what you mean but i think that that has to do with the fact of water. I don't know but yes you have a point there.

    These mistakes in plot do occur in ST too you know.
    It's like you referred earlier that voyager can withstand nova gravity in one episode and has trouble to escape a planet's gravitation pull in an other episode.

    Still with these flaws in plot i still love both

    I don't mind people like yourself pointing out a mistake in the plot because i found many flaws in almost every movie i've watched. but i do mind people like hellblade8 blabing on on mistakes that aren't there, just because they can't see past the special effects en really see the story behind it.
    Last edited by Lord Vasago; 06-18-07 at 04:58 AM.

  18. #5018
    That which cannot be known Kittamaru's Avatar
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    7,967
    Actually, there was a reason for that if I recall.

    Escaping gravity from being "nearby", escaping gravity from "orbit", and escaping gravity from the surface are three very different things. I believe Voyager was also damaged for some reason thus giving them trouble.

  19. #5019
    That which cannot be known Kittamaru's Avatar
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    7,967
    And I must say Hellboy pointed out many very good mistakes, though some of them are kind of nitpicking.

  20. #5020
    I'm back! Warp 8 Mr. Worf! Enterprise-D's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    Excuse me, but this is where you fail. Didn't you notice the point about the special comparative gravity sensors. If Trek can't find a damn ship inside a magnetic pole, then they don't have the refinement in sensor techology needed to find these ships. Hell in the thrawn trlogy Thrawn sent two light cruisers inside an atmospshere and they still were complelely undetectable.
    Crap! I'll get you the episodes

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