View Poll Results: Which universe would win?

Voters
670. This poll is closed
  • Star Trek

    227 33.88%
  • Star Wars

    285 42.54%
  • Spaceballs

    51 7.61%
  • Farscape

    14 2.09%
  • Dune

    54 8.06%
  • Stargate

    39 5.82%

Thread: Star Wars vs Star Trek

  1. #3421
    Purveyor of Truth and Fact Kittamaru's Avatar
    Posts
    7,362
    Heh, tried em mate. My doctor has put me on medication that should be able to knock out a bull elephant. In a desperation move he had me try taking animal tranqs... no dice.

    I'm a modern marvel of human engineering XD

  2. #3422
    Minister of Technology
    Posts
    4,149
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittamaru View Post
    Doesnt' help mate... what's LFL? 0o'
    Lucas Film Limited

    If we went by purely plausible power supplies, star trek would win. I highly doubt it's really possible to build a hypermater reactor... what the hell does that mean though 0o' Lil wormhole inside the reactor or sommat? I dunno... least Trek clearly defines their technobabble, even if they do contradict themselves now and again XD
    Actually Hypermatter is akin to using a blackhole for power generation. However odd that sounds it beats Star Trek. For a galaxy class starcraft to generated the power it does and carry enough fuel for 1 year as spec indicate it should Half the vessel's 4 million tons would have to be Antimatter storage, and that is assuming 100% efficency in the warp core. Voyager is even worse to maintain it's warp core for the 3 years it needs between refueling the ship would have to carey three times it total mass in Antimatter.

    Besides in Science fiction arguments like this we apply suspension of disbelief. If we see it being done they must have a way of doing it. No one on the Star Wars side denies Transporters, which I am sorry is the most ridiculous thing in all of sci-fi, we just follow the rules laid out in the shows, even the slightest interference makes them practically useless.

  3. #3423
    Minister of Technology
    Posts
    4,149
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittamaru View Post
    You still forget- the Enterprise E is a mere 750 meters long. A super star destroyer had trouble hitting a freaking capital ship with some of it's "heavy" weaponry. I doubt the little anti-fighter turrets would do much to the Ent-E's shield grid. Combine that with a very high effective impulse speed, good manuverability, and the ability to disable the imperial fighters with one or two well placed shots, taking out most of their anti-ship arsenal, I think trek could win.
    Okay facts

    750 meters is three quarters of a Kilometer. This is only little less than half the length of a Star Destoyer, though a Star Destroyers superior shape and geometry makes the SW vessels much more massive than this would indicate.
    It is also 3.25 times the size of the Tantive IV which itself is a capital ship. And 37.5 times the length of a X-wing fighter. Both of these vessels were hit by the barrages of Light Turbolaser and Quadlaser fire, both of which weapons are only 20 to 40% of a Heavy Turbolaser. ISD's also carry tractor beams which are quite useful in snaring fast moving vessels and making them sitting ducks.

    As for fighters, go ahead hand 12 or 16 fighters on your pass the other 128-132 will be pouring back Kilo and meagaton level firepower right back. Oh and yes go ahead an fire at the fighters and ignore the Capaital ship and it's two escorts bearing down on you.



    Even if Wars had the sheer firepower advantage in terms of power, this "power" is meant to engage large vessles, like things the size of small moons. Not ships the size of small buildings!
    Acutally it's meant form small home size targets to colosal moons and everything in between as has been proven.

    However the only advantage is not just firepower, but shielding, armor, sensors, FTL realtime communication, superior FTL, superior manufacturing capabilities, superior ground forces, superior numbers and so on. If it were just firepower and everything else was equal, the Feds could try to jump a frieghter and do a crash program in weapons design. However that is not the case. The war would be over too quickly to even appreciate.
    .

  4. #3424
    Registered Senior Member
    Posts
    35
    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    Lucas Film Limited



    Actually Hypermatter is akin to using a blackhole for power generation. However odd that sounds it beats Star Trek. For a galaxy class starcraft to generated the power it does and carry enough fuel for 1 year as spec indicate it should Half the vessel's 4 million tons would have to be Antimatter storage, and that is assuming 100% efficency in the warp core. Voyager is even worse to maintain it's warp core for the 3 years it needs between refueling the ship would have to carey three times it total mass in Antimatter.
    The Romulans use a quantum singularity/black hole for their power supply and they don't have that much power.

  5. #3425
    Registered Senior Member
    Posts
    35
    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    Okay facts


    However the only advantage is not just firepower, but shielding, armor, sensors, FTL realtime communication, superior FTL, superior manufacturing capabilities, superior ground forces, superior numbers and so on.
    .


    All those advantages were no match for logs, rocks, and little teddy bears!?!?!?
    Superior armor, but yet in the movies those Star Destroyers were taking damage from fighters crashing into them? Surely a fighter crashing doesn't have the impact of all these superweapons!
    Empire ground forces couldn't resist the impact of logs, but yet supposed to take fire from phasers and disruptors and survive?

  6. #3426
    Purveyor of Truth and Fact Kittamaru's Avatar
    Posts
    7,362
    In star wars a figher 1/100th the size of a star destroyer did significant damage upon impact.

    In Star Trek, a piece of a Romulan Velatar class ship (jsut as big as the Ent-E) only rocked the ship and caused some minor shorts even though it banged off of a (relatively) vulnerable Warp Nacel

    As for using a black hole to generate power, no. No no no no no! That makes absolutely no sense. If they could harness the power of a black hole, then WHY WERE THE DOVAL BASINS OF THE YUZENVONG SO HARD TO DEFEAT?

    If you could pour out the power of a black hole on command, then yeah. Another reason? If the ship kept containment, every time one was destroyed the black hole would suck up everything around it!

    That and I forgot about the length of a KM... I was never taught metric to be honest... US Primary Schools don't find it necessary to teach it... a dumb move if I may say.

  7. #3427
    Minister of Technology
    Posts
    4,149
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittamaru View Post
    In star wars a figher 1/100th the size of a star destroyer did significant damage upon impact.

    In Star Trek, a piece of a Romulan Velatar class ship (jsut as big as the Ent-E) only rocked the ship and caused some minor shorts even though it banged off of a (relatively) vulnerable Warp Nacel
    That Warp nacelle (learn to spell) is heavily armored and quite a bit of structural integrity field goes to protecting that. Nacelles are not as vulnerable as you think. Meanswhile the piece of the Romulan ship was not very large as you are implying and the hit was a glancing one.

    The A-wing that helped bring down the Executor had the incredible luck of not having to deal with shields and in crashing into a 6 inch thick section of transparisteel at extreme speed and dead on. The result was taking out the bridge and shorting controls for thirty second making the Executor crash into the Death Star, which i might add only rocked a tiny bit.

    As for using a black hole to generate power, no. No no no no no! That makes absolutely no sense. If they could harness the power of a black hole, then WHY WERE THE DOVAL BASINS OF THE YUZENVONG SO HARD TO DEFEAT?

    If you could pour out the power of a black hole on command, then yeah. Another reason? If the ship kept containment, every time one was destroyed the black hole would suck up everything around it!
    I said it was like a black hole but that is best guess. The densities they describe in some books and power levels seems to indicate black holes level material. Hell, given that we are just told what it produces the power plant could use some sort of klystron klein bottle effect create a tempory black hole and somehow make energy by expending energy....We simply do not know nor does it matter


    As for the example of the Dovin Basals, just becuase you have the tech to handle something that you plan for does not mean you can handle that same thing when it pops up with no warning.


    That and I forgot about the length of a KM... I was never taught metric to be honest... US Primary Schools don't find it necessary to teach it... a dumb move if I may say.
    Hey, I learned it in Elementary and Hight schol almost twenty years ago in a backwater hick town so you have no excuse.

  8. #3428
    Minister of Technology
    Posts
    4,149
    Quote Originally Posted by grimlockprime View Post
    The Romulans use a quantum singularity/black hole for their power supply and they don't have that much power.
    They haven't had 25,000 plus years to refine it either have they?

  9. #3429
    Minister of Technology
    Posts
    4,149
    Quote Originally Posted by grimlockprime View Post
    All those advantages were no match for logs, rocks, and little teddy bears!?!?!?
    Hmmm, you underestimate a race that has survived and kept it's territory free from second sentiet race that not unlike vicious silverback gorillas. Managed to build working catapults and gliders without the use of metal. And outnumbered the troopers 7.5. Not to mention you still had 50 rebell commandos (Navy SEALS)


    Superior armor, but yet in the movies those Star Destroyers were taking damage from fighters crashing into them? Surely a fighter crashing doesn't have the impact of all these superweapons!
    A fighter made of the same material traveling at upto .2c and carrying a hypermatter reactor and in some cases 32 proton torpedo warheads. And you'll not only in one case did the fighter impact result in a destroyed vessel. And in that case it was merely loss Cammand and Control that cuased the vessel to crash and be destroyed. You'll also note that the vessel in question had taken several minutes of concetrated barrage fire from the Rebel fleet.


    Empire ground forces couldn't resist the impact of logs, but yet supposed to take fire from phasers and disruptors and survive?
    First think of how big the logs were, their weight, speed, and momentum and then remeber and AT-ST is a scout vehicle.

  10. #3430
    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    That Warp nacelle (learn to spell) is heavily armored and quite a bit of structural integrity field goes to protecting that. Nacelles are not as vulnerable as you think. Meanswhile the piece of the Romulan ship was not very large as you are implying and the hit was a glancing one.
    (Learn honesty)
    You lie when it suits you and I'll be all over it when you do.

    The A-wing that helped bring down the Executor had the incredible luck of not having to deal with shields and in crashing into a 6 inch thick section of transparisteel at extreme speed and dead on. The result was taking out the bridge and shorting controls for thirty second making the Executor crash into the Death Star, which i might add only rocked a tiny bit.
    You act like it fact but its not it's pure speculations. The truth is Star Trek doesn't have the problem of "shorting out" steering controls.

    The Executor went down because it lost control completely...not a short out. The relative speed of objects hitting the command towere thus far is quite low. The tower is incredibly vunerable to physical strikes.

    As for the example of the Dovin Basals, just becuase you have the tech to handle something that you plan for does not mean you can handle that same thing when it pops up with no warning.
    The never learned how to defeat the dovin basals directly. The strategy the whole way through the series.

    Hey, I learned it in Elementary and Hight schol almost twenty years ago in a backwater hick town so you have no excuse.
    Kitamaru, instead of comparing my drasctily different life to yours and implying that our motives are the same as TWSCOTT has...I'm going to give you a few easy trek pointers.

    1 meter is 3.28 feet

    Sovereign is 685 meters or 2246.8 feet which is about 43% of a mile meaning less than half a mile. So two Sovereigns would make nearly a mile long.

    One Mile is longer than One Kilometer.

    So just used starship lengths from here...The Orignal Enterprise and Voyager are close to 300 meters...half the the length of the Sovereign and since sovereign close to half a mile at almost 700 meters we conclude that 300 meters is short of a 1/4 mile.

    Trek actually helped me figure out those lenghts. It's the need to know kind of strategy...If find that you need to know find out.

  11. #3431
    Purveyor of Truth and Fact Kittamaru's Avatar
    Posts
    7,362
    I actually did not know it was a loss of control that resulted in the destruction of the ship. Sorry about that.

    As for the nacelle (sorry, spelling is not my strong point), they are relatively vulnerable if only by how small the connection to their ship was. After Nemesis, the nacelles were muchly strengthened yes, but at the time they were not. Also, while the piece of the Velator that hit was "relatively" small, it was almost a fifth the size of the whole nacelle in length and at least twice as wide. Though you are right about the structural integrity field, do not forget that where it impacted is where the bussard collectors are, which is a potentially weak area.

    I have a feeling the fighters of Star Wars are NOT powered by the same kind of reactors as the capital ships are. Maybe the same basic principal, but still their power output is nothing compared to a cap ship.

    As for learning metric in elementary school- do realize, I went to Central Dauphin school district, which was voted the second worst school district in Pennsylvania.

    If the armor of a SSD at that point is so weak, why would the rebels concentrate fire anywhere else? They should go in lasers quad-linked at full power and fire a concentrated strike at one point, following up with proton torps. After that just fire thru the weakened shields untill you impact the bridge, at which point you light it up with a final volly of torpedos.

    As Star Trek appears to have a much higher possible refire rate, even with somewhat lower weapon warhead payloads (which, if star wars weapons are so much more powerful, they would examine and use to better their own), they would be able to use superior accuracy of the phaser weapons (after all, they are able to fire at specific co-ordinates without manuvering of the ship, you have to concede that point) they could punch a hole thru the shield grid large enough for the torpedos to breach and detonate upon contact with the view-windows.That and ion pulses from ships like the uhm... crap. The small scout ship from Insurrecton... I forget it's name... and the Danube classes can do that too, those would be useful to disrupt the shield grids of the large capital ships- I doubt they would hit a ship that is less than 7 meters long too well.

  12. #3432
    Minister of Technology
    Posts
    4,149
    Quote Originally Posted by Saquist View Post
    (Learn honesty)
    You lie when it suits you and I'll be all over it when you do.
    You've jumped all over what you claim is lies, and in all but one case have you been completely wrong and even in one case you had been marginally right you were the one who had lied describing the scene. Those fighters had not left one at a time andthe first fighter had not even been fired on...

    You act like it fact but its not it's pure speculations. The truth is Star Trek doesn't have the problem of "shorting out" steering controls.
    Actually the events I stated have been novelized and that qualifies as Canon under LFL so it is fact so suck it up. Oh and yes the Star Trek is vulnerable to shorts. Ion Storms, computer viruses, jamming devices, drunk guys, relatively minor collisions among a myriad of other things have rendered Star Trek vessels nonresponsive

    The Executor went down because it lost control completely...not a short out
    .

    Like any capital vessels the Executor has more than one bridge. However the crews on the other bridges were unable to sort out command in the last moments of the ship. Them's the breaks sometimes.

    The relative speed of objects hitting the command towere thus far is quite low.
    .2c is not slow by any ones definition

    The tower is incredibly vunerable to physical strikes.
    Cite proof. Oh right you can't becuase you're wrong.


    The never learned how to defeat the dovin basals directly. The strategy the whole way through the series.
    Actually they knew how to render them relatively useless. Using projectile weapons, overloading them with lower power shots and cloaked torpedoes.


    And 300 meters is 984 feet or less than a 1/5th of a mile. 700 meters is 2,296 feet or a little over 2/5th of a mile.

  13. #3433
    Oh it's no claim. I hammer the point home because both you and I know you lied and it was a desperate lie and you're lying now about not lying. In fact TWScott I don't think you've stopped lying since you've been on this thread. I think you're incapable of telling the truth once caught in a lie.

    Frankly, it's pinnacle of hillarilty to observe you consuling another on education and honesty after the folds and mountains of lies you're dished out just for the express meaningless purpose of winning this sad pathetic debate. It shows you have no morals but that's self evident with the evil Sian who is a cliche in every respect.

    Actually just because its canon doesn't mean it's a fact. A fact would mean that it's absolute and our man on the inside of Star Wars says that only the films generated by Lucas are absolute.

    And you're right .2 of c is not slow but the rock that hit the command center was not traveling at point 2 of lightspeed and neither was the A wing that took out the bridge. That is thereby proof of your fraggile tower construction despite what ever the Keel is made of.

    And no they didn't know how to render them relatively useless. You really need to read the books to know that, you can't learn everything online, Scotty.

    They used proton torpedos that proximity detonate before.
    Yuuzahn Vong Countered with extending the reach of the voids.

    They used stutter fire: short low energy burst that confussed the dovin basals to create low absorbtion voids and then pumped up the fire power.
    The Yuuzahn Vong stopped falling for that.

    They used Shadow Bombs: Proton torpedos with the guidance system removed and the proppelant removed and guided by the Jedi to target so the Vong could not detect their path. Loaded with extra power these were effective only untill they learned to look for the bombs.

    Then the Jedi used a Force light to distract the Vong from the bombs...
    That too lasted only so long.

    The truth is they never defeated the dovin bassal. They did learn how to jam their war coordinators locate them and destroy them in the Yuuzahn Vong fleet. That was the only countermeasure that worked consistently against the enemy.

    Vector Prime: the First book of the series showed that X- Wings B-Wings and Y-Wings...in Kyp's Avengers all were superior in fire power and shielding to the coral skippers. Yet his entire flight went down except for him.

    Untill the B wing had it's shields stripped it took many volleys of rocks and projectiles. And Kyp's fighter was penetrated by an insect...with his shields up. Two insects...one burrowed into the wing...and he closed the S foils on it but it didn't die. The Other went for the cockpit and sublight drive...

    Kyp barely survived... One thing I took from it was that Star fighters are vunerable to flying rocks with no special properties at all...

  14. #3434
    Purveyor of Truth and Fact Kittamaru's Avatar
    Posts
    7,362
    I have to back saquist up on this- in the few SW books I have read (as you make a claim saying they are all cannon) the Basins were a constant problem that they never completely mitigated. The force detecting creatures the 'Vong had were also a terrible problem and it killed or maimed many Jedi. Ani Jr had to sacrifice himself if I'm not mistaken, so the others could escape, and Chewie died to something along those lines.

  15. #3435
    Registered Senior Member
    Posts
    51
    You know it funny, i kept coming on here week after i posted, and never really realised their has ben two pages added.

    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    Heh, so you claim to be going by the universe, but single handedly reject what the Universe creator himself has decided constitutes Star Wars canon? Boy if that isn't like trying to breath in vacuum I don't know what is. The EU is canon unles the movies DIRECTLY dispute it. Only once has anyone said all the Jedi were extinct and (obi-one kenobi created by george lucas) was a pompous ass who had the common sense of a gnat.

    You contradicted your own movies, wow your the one that is a pompous ass with the common sense of a gnat, and your conversation has been forfeited. Thank you for letting trek win with your stupidy.

    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    Wel, since it is Paramount who decides Star Trek Canon now and they have taken the hardline stance of Shows and Movies, everything else is just junk.
    For good reason, they have more smarts then entire star wars team, which let their own fan contradict their own show, make up absurd facts and then call it cannon. I will just proved why trek is cooler. We care for how cannon it is, and if it fit in to Gene Roddenberry's dream. Star wars fan throw cannon out the window when ever it suits them. Only thing i find cannon is what george lucas says in his films. Not what some pencil neck paper pusher say is ok to be cannon.



    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    TNG Riker made the comment after hearing that there was a 2 terrawatt communications system broadcasting from the planet. He was amazed at the power levels indicated.

    In TNG: "The Dauphin",

    Data: "Sir, sensors indicate the communication originated from a terawatt source on the planet."
    Riker: "That's more power than our entire ship can generate."
    Wow that proves only one thing, their entire ship can't generate terawatt, which changes by time of voyager, which by time of future all ship are using power in terrera range. Any way proves treck isn't absurd about it's powerlevels. Even george lucas an't that dum, he never gave his gun power level, so becuase of that, i find your info on star wars false and lies.



    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    No you haven't. In that episode alone they had to use the phasing cloak to escape. Don't lie, it just makes real Trekkies mad

    If they used phaser the floating debris would have damage or destroyed the ship,photon torpedo could have destroyed the ship along with asteroid.



    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    Yeah no kidding which is exactly like the ones you see used in Wrath of Khan, Undiscovered Country and so on. Not once do you see a normal photon torpedo do anything more impressive than a modern day 155mm howitzer shell
    One used in Wrath of Khan, Undiscovered Country and so on are high yeild, used in ship to ship combat, the other ones are low yeild for ground combat. If they had fired the regular ones, it would be like dropping a nuke on the away team.

    Star wars commander "fire the 12.5 gigaton laser cannon to cover are storm trooper in the city."

    The star destroyer fire one lazer cannon completely destroying the city killing all inhabitants, 5000 thousand storm troopers, and 12 imperial officer.

    Dontai "well this is why you dont uses 12.5 gigaton laser cannon, their inaccurate has shit. This also why federation Doesn't use them. Try to hit a barn and nothing els and you end up destroying 10 mile radias around the barn."




    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    Armor? Hello you can see from crew quarters that armor is at best eight inches thick. A modern day nuclear weapon would have left only dust of a 700 meter starship.
    It not thickness, it the quality. Shows you know nothing of armor. Put a nuke inside star destroyer it would be destroyed, put on out side it would take sever damage.



    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    There are MILLIONS of those weapons. The 12.5 gigaton weapon is question comes on hundreds of thousands of Starwars vessels in batteries of 1 to over a thousand.
    Says you, not george lucas. So Your questing george lucas? Either way i hate to be the stormtrooper ...




    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    Actually complete opposite. The Q can be seperated from their technology rather easily, Force Users cannot be seperated from their powers except by very rare animals that Q have no idea exist. Even then get outside the animals sphere of influence and the powers come back.
    What technology? Their omnipotent nearly immortals being that evolved past need of technology, second, they can control force as well, but judging from this you know nothing of star trek and shouldn't even be arguing for star wars.


    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    Hell, ST redshirts (which is the secuirity and infantry) can't even survive a stiff wind most days. How are they going to challenge Wookies, Noghri, Vong, StormTrooper, Rebel troops, and Battle droids?
    How many of your storm trooper got killed in first few min of first star wars movie? Or how about rebel troopers? You call are red shirts bad. Red shirt are nothing compare to storm trooper lack of survivability.



    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    Watch Empirre Strikes back again and then ask someone who knows even an inkling of physics or chemistry how much power it would take to vaporize 100meter Asteroids with one shot. Calculate how much energy it takes to break planetary dbris free of local gravity. Then after you pick you jaw back up check you can apologize for being dumber than a post.
    They weren't 100, they were barely 12 meter at best.

    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott View Post
    the explosion of the torpedo is hardly more than a few dozen meters.
    In episode Q who? They used the highest yeild photon torpedoes, the explosion was larger than the Enterprise and exsplosion did damage to them more then 50 meters away. Few dozen meters? Eh ok,
    Enterprise length + 50 meters = hmm more then Few dozen meters. Blast radius is around 580 metters at least. Watch Q who (favorit epsiode). Ten of these torpedos would have completely engulfed a star destroyer in massive antimatter explosion.

    In conclusion your a poor star wars fan who cares nothing of cannon, even calling one of main character that has driven the story line, is crucial role and if not for him jedi would have gone extinct permanently as said by george lucas, a "pompous ass who had the common sense of a gnat". So infact your calling George Lucas a "pompous ass who had the common sense of a gnat" which is true. You are infact the worse star wars fan i have ever heard of and you make me ashamed to even call my self star wars fan. It people like you that give us star war guys a bad name.
    Last edited by Dontai; 03-27-07 at 05:22 PM.

  16. #3436
    Purveyor of Truth and Fact Kittamaru's Avatar
    Posts
    7,362
    Do not forget the way the quantum torpedo works- instead of increasing payload size, it simply increases effectiveness, twisting it thru an eleven dimensional matrix inside a zero point clean vacuum which allows for incredible power output with precise control.

  17. #3437
    Registered Senior Member
    Posts
    51
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittamaru View Post
    Do not forget the way the quantum torpedo works- instead of increasing payload size, it simply increases effectiveness, twisting it thru an eleven dimensional matrix inside a zero point clean vacuum which allows for incredible power output with precise control.
    Exactly ...

  18. #3438
    Purveyor of Truth and Fact Kittamaru's Avatar
    Posts
    7,362
    Don't quote me on the specifics (eg, numbers) because I'd need to look that up.

  19. #3439
    Minister of Technology
    Posts
    4,149
    Quote Originally Posted by Dontai View Post
    You contradicted your own movies, wow your the one that is a pompous ass with the common sense of a gnat, and your conversation has been forfeited. Thank you for letting trek win with your stupidy.
    Is that the delusion you are suffering now. Show me where I have contradicted the movies. Oh that is right you won't becuase you can't. Trek Lost long before the conversation ever started and the intelligent Star trek fans understood this already.

    For good reason, they have more smarts then entire star wars team, which let their own fan contradict their own show, make up absurd facts and then call it cannon. I will just proved why trek is cooler. We care for how cannon it is, and if it fit in to Gene Roddenberry's dream. Star wars fan throw cannon out the window when ever it suits them. Only thing i find cannon is what george lucas says in his films. Not what some pencil neck paper pusher say is ok to be cannon.
    Excuse me but Lucas himself says the EU is canon unless it directly disputes the movies, your opinion is not even worth noting in this argument.


    Wow that proves only one thing, their entire ship can't generate terawatt, which changes by time of voyager, which by time of future all ship are using power in terrera range. Any way proves treck isn't absurd about it's powerlevels. Even george lucas an't that dum, he never gave his gun power level, so becuase of that, i find your info on star wars false and lies.
    You can "find' anything you want. Since you have NO SAY in what is canon and even less command of spelling a grammar nobody is listening to you.


    If they used phaser the floating debris would have damage or destroyed the ship,photon torpedo could have destroyed the ship along with asteroid.
    Bullshit, they had to use the Phasing Cloak becuase it would have taken EVERY PHOTON TORPEDO ON THE BLOODY SHIP to blow apart a 5km wide hollow rock. Did you listen?

    One used in Wrath of Khan, Undiscovered Country and so on are high yeild, used in ship to ship combat, the other ones are low yeild for ground combat. If they had fired the regular ones, it would be like dropping a nuke on the away team.
    Okay so the ones used point blank on Reliant and the ones fired from the cloaked Bird of Prey were high yeild? Okay so effective blast radius of a few dozen meters, if it explodes at all. The one that penetrated the Shields in Undiscovered Country crashed in like a solid projectile. So basically you trying to defend footage that shows these shells as little more than high impulse speed kinetic penetrators.

    Star wars commander "fire the 12.5 gigaton laser cannon to cover are storm trooper in the city."

    The star destroyer fire one lazer cannon completely destroying the city killing all inhabitants, 5000 thousand storm troopers, and 12 imperial officer.

    Dontai "well this is why you dont uses 12.5 gigaton laser cannon, their inaccurate has shit. This also why federation Doesn't use them. Try to hit a barn and nothing els and you end up destroying 10 mile radias around the barn."
    Man your grasp of the actuall use of a 12.5 gigaton beam weapon and it's effect is amazing. First off you don't use heavy lasers during a infantry invasion. You pulverize the area before. If your troops get in trouble, pinpoint concussion or photon torpedo support is a much better choice. Second Beam Weapons for the most part do not explode when they strike a target. the 12.5 gigatons is to give a person a visual clue. After all 1.25x10^19 calories is a little hard to wrap your mind around.



    It not thickness, it the quality. Shows you know nothing of armor. Put a nuke inside star destroyer it would be destroyed, put on out side it would take sever damage.
    I understand armor better than you think. I've studied it extensively. I'm going to tell you something, a Star Ship hull that is Eight inches thick, even of some miracle metal is not nearly enough to be considered armored. A Star Wars does have the winner for type as well, Durasteel and Dura Armor include Nuetronium in it's construction.

    Depends on the size of the Nuke a 4 Kiloton termal detonator may do some cosmetic damage on the inside, kill some troops and damage a few pieces of non vital equip. On the outside that better be at least a 12.5 gigaton nuke to even think about light damage.


    Says you, not george lucas. So Your questing george lucas? Either way i hate to be the stormtrooper ...
    Excuse me but it was George Lucas himself that said there were 25,000 Imperial Class Star Destroyers and each of them carries at least 20 of those weapons and there many many different types of capital ships. I'm not questioning Lucas at all. You're questioning a person who has done the research. And as Par for course for people who never understood Star trek or Star Wars you have shown your ignorance time and time again.



    What technology? Their omnipotent nearly immortals being that evolved past need of technology, second, they can control force as well, but judging from this you know nothing of star trek and shouldn't even be arguing for star wars.
    Where did it say they evolved past technology, oh that is right nowhere. Where did it say their powers were magic, oh that is right nowhere. Where does it say they are omnipotent, oh that is right nowhere. It's obvious form Firepoint, Q who?, and True Q that the Q as indeed super technological. After all if they were magic why is Q AFRAID of Guinan who we know is not omnipotent, even slightly.


    How many of your storm trooper got killed in first few min of first star wars movie? Or how about rebel troopers? You call are red shirts bad. Red shirt are nothing compare to storm trooper lack of survivability.
    Well, we see about 12 dead stormtroopers when they clean the aisle ways and I assume the entire fifty man contigent of Rebels is dead. If we go one for one that is 50 and 50, but that is a straight up frontal assault versus and bottle neck ambush. Casualties are expected to be high.

    They weren't 100, they were barely 12 meter at best.
    Now I know you are an ignoramous. 12 meters at best. You do realize the Millenium Flacon was 25 meters long and was dwarfed by a majority of the Asteroid belt.


    In episode Q who? They used the highest yeild photon torpedoes, the explosion was larger than the Enterprise and exsplosion did damage to them more then 50 meters away. Few dozen meters? Eh ok,
    Enterprise length + 50 meters = hmm more then Few dozen meters. Blast radius is around 580 metters at least. Watch Q who (favorit epsiode). Ten of these torpedos would have completely engulfed a star destroyer in massive antimatter explosion.
    So, I can make a gunpwder explosion that is 600 meters wide and believe me it wouldn't harm an M1 Abrams. Ten Photon torpedoes may cuase a huge explosion, but hardly a powerful one, not in Star Wars Captial Ship weaponry terms.


    In conclusion your a poor star wars fan who cares nothing of cannon, even calling one of main character that has driven the story line, is crucial role and if not for him jedi would have gone extinct permanently as said by george lucas, a "pompous ass who had the common sense of a gnat". So infact your calling George Lucas a "pompous ass who had the common sense of a gnat" which is true. You are infact the worse star wars fan i have ever heard of and you make me ashamed to even call my self star wars fan. It people like you that give us star war guys a bad name.
    In conclusion you are just a over heated ignoramous who hasn't added anything to this conversation and in fact taken much away. You're probably the poorest excuse for a debater here. In fact in cmparison you make Mars13 look like a stand up guy. And you are not fooling anyone, you are not a Star Wars fan, you are a Star Trek dweeb, not even fit to be called a fan, trekkie or trekker. As for understanding Star Wars and Star Trek, I may not be perfect, but my cat does a better job than you.
    Last edited by TW Scott; 03-28-07 at 09:58 AM.

  20. #3440
    Registered Senior Member
    Posts
    150
    So, I can make a gunpwder explosion that is 600 meters wide and believe me it wouldn't harm an M1 Abrams.
    Actually, if you had enough gunpowder in a single explosive to create an explosion 600 meters wide, it would indeed harm an Abrams.

    And that is hardly the only case we've seen torpedos with a blast radius. If anything, that's one of the smallest blast radiuses seen. Others, such as in "Skin of Evil," "The Die is Cast," "Workforce," etc, are considerably larger.
    Ten Photon torpedoes may cuase a huge explosion, but hardly a powerful one, not is Star Wars terms.
    Actually, it is quite powerful in Star Wars terms. A weapon capable of turning a town into a smoking crater is respectable by Star Wars standards according to all the references.

    And yes, none of the asteroids actually blown up were much larger (if any) than the Falcon.

Similar Threads

  1. By Fettman in forum SciFi & Fantasy
    Last Post: 10-18-11, 02:02 PM
    Replies: 33
  2. By USS Athens in forum SciFi & Fantasy
    Last Post: 03-16-10, 04:47 PM
    Replies: 291
  3. By superstring01 in forum SciFi & Fantasy
    Last Post: 03-11-10, 01:57 PM
    Replies: 60
  4. By Orleander in forum SciFi & Fantasy
    Last Post: 07-11-09, 08:33 PM
    Replies: 27
  5. By Asguard in forum Computer Science & Culture
    Last Post: 09-13-08, 02:15 AM
    Replies: 0

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •