View Poll Results: Which universe would win?

Voters
670. This poll is closed
  • Star Trek

    227 33.88%
  • Star Wars

    285 42.54%
  • Spaceballs

    51 7.61%
  • Farscape

    14 2.09%
  • Dune

    54 8.06%
  • Stargate

    39 5.82%

Thread: Star Wars vs Star Trek

  1. #2461
    Minister of Technology
    Posts
    4,149
    Quote Originally Posted by daylight
    I agree a small ship would not have a vast library of information but if the borg were to capture that small ship they would have access to some bit of information about the enemy they are dealing with. Lets imagine what that information might be.
    The borg could learn the battle tatics/technology of that particular unit and perhaps find a way to deal with it. Or the borg could realize that this unit has a superior whatever and add that to its technology.

    Is the pilot a clone from the empire, then the borg could learn that the empire makes entire clone armies of its finest specimins, what if the borg adapted that tech and began making drones out of the empires finest clones on the scale the empire does.
    Yes I agree the Feds have their strenghts and have managed to outwit the Borg time again and again but
    I believe the Borg have the superior information gathering abilities be it assimilation of people or computer systems. From what i've seen the SW universe depends on infiltration/spying/interrogation techinques to gather information and while that can work assimilation is vastly more efficient.

    In war information is powerful and of all the non godlike races the Borg seem to be the most efficient and effective gatherers and ulitizers of information.

    Have a nice day!!!!
    Alright so the Borg captures a lone Y-Wing fighter. As per standard operating procedure they take the pilot and gunner first and completely miss the astromech. Suddenly the Borg cube is told to go to sleep by Astromech unti and is destroyed. What did the borg gain from his encounter? A healthy respect for droids who make Data look like a moron.

    Or more like the crew of the Y-Wing understanding just what the borg mean wait until they are pulled close, use light ion cannons to disable the tractor beam, fire the entire 32 missle compliment of Proton Torpedoes and do a quick hyperpace jump away as the borg vessel finds itself suddenly smaller than 10% or it's original size. What do the Borg take away from this encounter? That even tiny bombers have enough firepower to destroy them.


    The problem is that even to Borg the SW universe might as well be using magic. They have vastly superior firepower, shielding, FTL, and armor. It's just not even fair to the ST universe.

  2. #2462
    Registered Senior Member
    Posts
    150
    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott
    Alright so the Borg captures a lone Y-Wing fighter. As per standard operating procedure they take the pilot and gunner first and completely miss the astromech.
    Which is instead dissassembled, along with the Y-Wing, being recognized as an integral part of the Y-Wing.
    Or more like the crew of the Y-Wing understanding just what the borg mean wait until they are pulled close, use light ion cannons
    Which do nothing.
    fire the entire 32 missle compliment of Proton Torpedoes
    Which do not even scratch the cube.
    and do a quick hyperpace jump away
    After ten minutes of computation, and assuming the borg release the tractor beam. Unlikely.
    That even tiny bombers have enough firepower to destroy them.
    They don't.
    They have vastly superior firepower, shielding, FTL, and armor. It's just not even fair to the ST universe.
    Repeating this over and over again doesn't make it true.

  3. #2463
    give me liberty
    Posts
    1,085
    why would the borg miss the astromech?

    and cant you take those out with a hand blaster?

    why would 200,000 drones with shields,force fields,sensors, disrupters,regeneration,and adaptive technologies have trouble with a one robot that isnt that well made to begin with?


    im not impressed,it doesnt even have thermal imaging,its canon fodder at best.
    Last edited by mars13; 04-24-06 at 12:39 PM.

  4. #2464
    Registered Senior Member
    Posts
    32
    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott
    Alright so the Borg captures a lone Y-Wing fighter. As per standard operating procedure they take the pilot and gunner first and completely miss the astromech. Suddenly the Borg cube is told to go to sleep by Astromech unti and is destroyed. What did the borg gain from his encounter? A healthy respect for droids who make Data look like a moron.

    Or more like the crew of the Y-Wing understanding just what the borg mean wait until they are pulled close, use light ion cannons to disable the tractor beam, fire the entire 32 missle compliment of Proton Torpedoes and do a quick hyperpace jump away as the borg vessel finds itself suddenly smaller than 10% or it's original size. What do the Borg take away from this encounter? That even tiny bombers have enough firepower to destroy them.


    The problem is that even to Borg the SW universe might as well be using magic. They have vastly superior firepower, shielding, FTL, and armor. It's just not even fair to the ST universe.


    I dont think putting the borg to sleep works anymore, i dont remember Voyager doing it and that timeline is after the first encounter with the borg.

    I agree your points are valid, that the Borg are not omnipotent and can be tricked/outwitted/outmanuevered but we should think about the greater scope of this war between universes. We should understand the strengths and weakness of each side and we must understand that winning a war on a universal scale requires the coordination of many factors.

    I think its hard to say which universe has superior tech because of so many variables. The terminology and metrics seem to be different and there probably is a way to convert one metric to another but its pretty subjective since it is science fiction.I think both sides have nice toys and can blow up planets/suns/random things, but to win a war on the cosmic scale you need more then just bigger guns.
    The borg have certain traits that dont seem to have an equal in the SW universe. To win this war you would also need superior: battle tactics, intelligence gathering, resouce management, supply chain managament abilities, production of units, communications. I believe these things will be the deciding factor in a WAR OF UNIVERSES!!!.

    I dont think your arguement of the whole Y wing thing is valid because you assume the SW crew would understand the borg but that the Borg have no idea whats going on here. It would be fair to say both sides are intelligent and both sides have there way to deal with things, its just the Borg encounter new species and deal/assimilate new species for a living. The SW people are more into fighting known enemies such has Rebal forces, Death Stars, Ewoks, etc.,, they are not use to encountering Unknown species and dealing with new and unknown threats.

    War is a complex thing, to simply say I have the big gun, I have the big ship, is foolish. Our current situation in Iraq is a good example of superior tech not being quite enough to eliminate the enemy. Vietnam is another example of superior tech not being able to firebomb/carpet bomb/bombard/shoot with many many bullets the enemy into oblivion. I think US lost that one to.

    Have a nice day.

  5. #2465
    Minister of Technology
    Posts
    4,149
    Okay. first of allwe did lose the engagement in Vietnam because we could carpet bomb the whole place but didn't. Same thing with Iraq. Keeping a civilian population alive limits our optionss and give insurgents places to hide. Still, Star Wars would roll over Star Fleet and the Federation in months and that is if they dawdled. There might be some insurgency but nothing like we would see today as the Federation is a bunch of conformists.
    Last edited by TW Scott; 04-25-06 at 09:39 AM.

  6. #2466
    give me liberty
    Posts
    1,085
    conformists? you mean to say cutting edge technological leaders that most other races struggle to follow.

  7. #2467
    Registered Member
    Posts
    14
    Star Wars by a mile.

    Even when I was younger, Star Trek looked dated and lacked quality action.

    They did a bit better with ST:TNG and ST:V, but DS9 set them back an age once more...

  8. #2468
    Registered Senior Abuser thedevilsreject's Avatar
    Posts
    2,814
    go darth!!!

  9. #2469
    give me liberty
    Posts
    1,085
    those are some compelling arguments,if you havent read the last 120 pages and are 10.

  10. #2470
    STARGATE WILL OWN YOU ALL. they got a device there that destroys all life in an instant based on either: DNA structure, structure of matter, and specific objects. SG1, the pride of universe from the ancients.

  11. #2471
    Registered Senior Member
    Posts
    32
    Quote Originally Posted by TW Scott
    Okay. first of allwe did lose the engagement in Vietnam because we could carpet bomb the whole place but didn't. Same thing with Iraq. Keeping a civilian population alive limits our optionss and give insurgents places to hide. Still, Star Wars would roll over Star Fleet and the Federation in months and that is if they dawdled. There might be some insurgency but nothing like we would see today as the Federation is a bunch of conformists.

    So now you mention tactics in your arguement? You agree with me that technology isnt the only key to winning a war. With that in mind please review my previous posts about abilities and tatics the borg have that in the SW there isnt.
    The pilot of the Y wing is a clone perhaps? What things would the borg learn from a clone, perhaps how the clone can into being and where it was made? The Empire requires human capital to run its ships, armies, supply chains, labor force and it seems to me that they make clones for everything. Clones take time to grow, the borg on the other hand have the ability to convert others into borg. Clones are made in batches perhaps, maybe hundreds or thousands or even hundreds of thousands at a time, but how many years before they mature enough to be ready for use? Borg can take planets at a time, one cube for one planet.

    You mentioned earlier that a Y wing wouldnt have a vast repository of information and I agreed it wouldnt, but then you reminded me about the astromech onboard. I believe the astromech would be a goldmine of information. What things would the borg learn from an astromech? The astromech certainly has info on its mother ship, perhaps even tech data on its mother ship.

    We have all seen before how information is a powerful thing, how Luke was able to go down the vent shaft and blow up the death star. What if it was the borg that got that information instead, and instead of trying to blow up the Death Star they attempted to assimilate the Death Star. What would the Borg do with a Death Star and the, thousands of people, hundreds of ships, vast amount of technology onboard.

    Remember from my previous post i said the Borg are good at dealing with new and unknown people and the SW are use to dealing with a known enemy. How would stroomtroopers react to borg assimilating Death Star staff members, how would they react to Death Star computer systems hacked by Borg, if an astromech can hack a Death Star comp i'm sure a borg could. What would the Borg do if they got control of life support, Stormtroopers need to breath i think. What would the Borg do if they had control of internal defenses, would the borg isolate the stromtroopers by closing all blast doors so the Borg could assimilate one group of stormtroopers at a time. Or would the Borg just open as many bay doors as possible and have the vacuum of space do the killing.

    I think the most important resouce from a DeathStar or any capital ship is the information it contains. You would learn the battletactics, history of conflicts, bio of important people, navigational information, manufactoring techinques and centers, you would know how your enemy thinks and how it acts.

    Then the assimilation of the Empire will begin with one clone pilot and its astromech.

    Bring it on!!!

  12. #2472
    Registered Senior Abuser thedevilsreject's Avatar
    Posts
    2,814
    i Said Go Darth Mother Fucker

  13. #2473
    Registered Senior Member
    Posts
    32
    Quote Originally Posted by thedevilsreject
    i Said Go Darth Mother Fucker


    I dont get it?

  14. #2474
    Hellenistic polytheist Hapsburg's Avatar
    Posts
    4,990
    Even if ST has some slight tactical advantages, they will lose in the long run. As stated earlier, pretty much all of them have shitty strategic and logistical planning. Resource gathering and management, industrial production capabilities, long-range communication; The Empire has these capabilities, several times better than ST. If we make it a war of universes, you're also totaling in the Rebels, the CSA, the Chiss, the Ssi-Ruuk, the Rakata, the New Jedi Order, the Yuuzhan Vong, and god knows how many other factions in the GFFA and rival nations.

  15. #2475
    StarGate, the real winner amongst them all

  16. #2476
    Hellenistic polytheist Hapsburg's Avatar
    Posts
    4,990
    Quote Originally Posted by spurious_monkey
    [FONT=Book Antiqua]StarGate, the real winner amongst them all...
    ...until they get vaporized by Imperial and Galactic Alliance star destroyers of all shapes and sizes, and Earth gets vongformed by Yuuzhan Vong worldships.

  17. #2477
    Registered Senior Member
    Posts
    32
    Quote Originally Posted by Hapsburg
    Even if ST has some slight tactical advantages, they will lose in the long run. As stated earlier, pretty much all of them have shitty strategic and logistical planning. Resource gathering and management, industrial production capabilities, long-range communication; The Empire has these capabilities, several times better than ST. If we make it a war of universes, you're also totaling in the Rebels, the CSA, the Chiss, the Ssi-Ruuk, the Rakata, the New Jedi Order, the Yuuzhan Vong, and god knows how many other factions in the GFFA and rival nations.

    The Borg have traits that allow them the unique ability to wage war on a universal scale, they can make drones out of the enemy, they can think with a singular mind, a single borg can communicate with all borg, and they can adapt to new and unknown threats easier then any other race.

    I think it in the long run the borg will have the advantage because of assimilation of new species will increase their capabilities. The Borg will see these new races as opportunities in reach perfection and their goal will be to incorporate these new races into the collective. The borg will become a greater foe to those that remain. All the strengths of those races could get incorporated into the Borg collective. All those races are potential drones, and all those races will help the Borg become a more perfect creation. That is what the Borg do.

    I think the abilities of the races are most important, what they can contribute to the battle? What makes the races you mention special, what thing about them will help them win this war. If they have nothing to resist with then they will be nothing but drones for the Borg. Is there any one ability out of all those races that would make SW superior, that would give SW an edge in universal war?

  18. #2478
    give me liberty
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    1,085
    after getting hit by one TL they would be essentialy immune,after getting hit by one blaster they would essentialy be immune.

    and since they would just aprear out of thin air[sw doesnt have transporters],those poor stormies are screwed.

  19. #2479
    Registered Member
    Posts
    14
    Quote Originally Posted by mars13
    those are some compelling arguments,if you havent read the last 120 pages and are 10.
    Read a 120 pages as to why Star Wars is better than Star Trek

  20. #2480
    give me liberty
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    1,085
    not quite,its about 120 pages of warsie wanking followed by factual assesments of both sides.

    opinion means nothing in an assesment.


    500 borg cubed vs 1 SD.

    sd gets pwned.

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