Behold the cruelty of Zionists

[otheadp]

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/914111.html

Israeli doctors perform surgeries on Iraqi kids to save them from certain deaths.

This is nothing new. The world simply prefers not to advertise this about Israel (so much for Zionist / Jewish controlled media).

More than half of the kids that are treated by this organization are "Palestinians" and or Arabs from other countries.

[otheadp]

More cruelty:

* http://www.israelnewsagency.com/israeliran10014.html
The Israeli government offered to help Iranian earth quake victims a few years ago (the mullahs refused.) This despite Iran being the biggest sponsor of terrorism inside Israel.

I predict absolutely no replies to this thread from the usual Israel-bashers. This does not fit their image of Israel as a bloodthirsty state run by bloodthirsty people, so they will mentally block this info and just ignore it.

There are many other times when Israel aided other Muslim countries (officially and unofficially since some don't recognize Israel's right to exist). Turkey and Bangladesh are just a few.

[S.A.M.]

The doctors are Zionists?

Anyway, by law, isn't the occupying force responsible for feeding and medical care?

Hows the Palestinian dieting program going?

The team, headed by the prime minister’s advisor Dov Weissglas and including the Israel Defense Forces chief of staff, the director of the Shin Bet and senior generals and officials, convened for a discussion with Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni on ways to respond to the Hamas election victory. Everyone agreed on the need to impose an economic siege on the Palestinian Authority, and Weissglas, as usual, provided the punch line: “It’s like an appointment with a dietician. The Palestinians will get a lot thinner, but won’t die,” the advisor joked, and the participants reportedly rolled with laughter. And, indeed, why not break into laughter and relax when hearing such a successful joke?

[MacGyver1968]

What's the difference between a "Zionist" and an "Isreali"? (real question)

[shichimenshyo]

one is a peopl who hold a caertain theological belief, the other is a group of people?

[S.A.M.]

What's the difference between a "Zionist" and an "Isreali"? (real question)

Zionism is an international political movement that supports a homeland for the Jewish people in the Land of Israel.[1] Although its origins are earlier, the movement was formally established by Austrian journalist Theodor Herzl in the late nineteenth century. The international movement was eventually successful in establishing the State of Israel in 1948, as the world's first and only modern Jewish State. It continues primarily as support for the state and government of Israel and its continuing status as a homeland for the Jewish people.[2] Described as a "diaspora nationalism,"[3] its proponents regard it as a national liberation movement whose aim is the self-determination of the Jewish people.[4]

It was the Zionist movement which asked for (and got) the Balfour declaration in 1917

One of the main proponents of a Jewish homeland in Palestine was Dr. Chaim Weizmann, the leading spokesman for organized Zionism in Britain. Weizmann was a chemist who had developed a process to synthesize acetone via fermentation. Acetone is required for the production of cordite, a powerful propellant explosive needed to fire ammunition without generating tell-tale smoke. Germany had cornered supplies of calcium acetate, a major source of acetone. Other pre-war processes in Britain were inadequate to meet the increased demand in the World War I, and a shortage of cordite would have severely hampered Britain's war effort. Lloyd-George, then Minister for Munitions, was grateful to Weizmann and so supported his Zionist aspirations.

During the first meeting between Weizmann and Balfour in 1906, Balfour asked what payment Weizmann would accept for use of his process and was told, "There is only one thing I want: A national home for my people." Balfour asked Weizmann why Palestine — and Palestine alone — should be the Zionist homeland. "Anything else would be idolatry", Weizmann protested, adding: "Mr. Balfour, supposing I was to offer you Paris instead of London, would you take it?" "But Dr. Weizmann", Balfour retorted, "we have London", to which Weizmann rejoined, "That is true, but we had Jerusalem when London was a marsh."[4]

Weizmann eventually received both monetary compensation for his discovery and his place in history as first President of the state of Israel

[abu_afak]

Virtually all Israelis are 'zionists'; as are virtually all Jews; (and Americans for that matter) IN THAT, they support a State of Israel where it is now.
Israel IS the result of Zionism.

There has been an attempt to Demonize 'Zionist/Zionism' by many- many who use it as if it meant "Aggressive Jew".

I have posted on many Arab/Muslim boards and virtually anything they don't like is "Zionist Propaganda" even if it has nothing to do with Israel.

It's part of the vast (but vague) Jewish conspiracy that also includes the way Some, not all, people use the term 'Neocon'; those shadowy, "nefarious people like Perle and Wolfowitz who really control the country.. and planet."

[S.A.M.]

Hmm are you sure? I know many Jewsih people who are anti-Zionists

http://www.google.com/search?q=anti-...ient=firefox-a

For American Jews, Dissent Against Israel Has Become Mainstream

By Tony Karon, Tomdispatch.com. Posted September 15, 2007.

The exceedingly narrow range of "correct opinion" on Israel for American Jews isn't holding together like it used to. Is a Jewish glasnost coming to America?
http://www.alternet.org/story/62618/?page=entire

[MacGyver1968]

Thank you sam and abu for the replies.

[abu_afak]

MacGyver, I'd hold that "thanks" for Disinfo S.A.M.

Hmm are you sure? I know many Jewsih people who are anti-Zionists

http://www.google.com/search?q=anti-...ient=firefox-a

Complete Baloney.
There are Few anti-zionist Jews.
The main result of your search 'Netureia Karta', an Ultra-Othodox Kool Aid KULT who are indeed anti-zionist- but in no way representative. The maintain a few 'antizionist' websites.. $15 each.

They were pals with Arafat and showed up in AhmadinJihad's Holocaust Denial Conference.

I'm kinda doubting Sam knows any of them

For American Jews, Dissent Against Israel Has Become Mainstream

By Tony Karon, Tomdispatch.com. Posted September 15, 2007.

The exceedingly narrow range of "correct opinion" on Israel for American Jews isn't holding together like it used to. Is a Jewish glasnost coming to America?
http://www.alternet.org/story/62618/?page=entire

Then of Course we have from counterculture 'alternet' and 'tomsdispatch' Tony Karon. Who says Dissent among American Jews is "Mainstream" but shows Very Little Dissent - except his own.

[abu_afak]

What Occupation?

Commentary Magazine
Jul/Aug 2002;
Efraim Karsh

Few subjects have been falsified so thoroughly as the recent history of the West Bank and Gaza. The history of Israel's so-called "occupation" of Palestinian lands and the ways in which Palestinians and Arabs have distorted Israeli actions in the West Bank and Gaza are discussed.
[.....]

THE BRITISH proved to be prescient. Neither Egypt nor Jordan ever allowed Palestinian self-determination in Gaza and the West Bank-- which were, respectively, the parts of Palestine conquered by them during the 1948-49 war.
Indeed, even UN Security Council Resolution 242, which after the Six-Day war of 1967 established the principle of "land for peace" as the cornerstone of future Arab-Israeli peace negotiations, did not envisage the creation of a Palestinian state.
To the contrary: since the Palestinians were still NOT viewed as a distinct nation, it was assumed that any territories evacuated by Israel, would be returned to their pre-1967 Arab occupiers-Gaza to Egypt, and the West Bank to Jordan.
The resolution did not even mention the Palestinians by name, affirming instead the necessity "for achieving a just settlement of the refugee problem"-a clause that applied not just to the Palestinians but to the hundreds of thousands of Jews expelled from the Arab states following the 1948 war.

At this time-we are speaking of the late 1960's-- Palestinian nationhood was rejected by the entire international community, including the Western democracies, the Soviet Union (the foremost supporter of radical Arabism), and the Arab world itself. "Moderate" Arab rulers like the Hashemites in Jordan viewed an independent Palestinian state as a mortal threat to their own kingdom, while the Saudis saw it as a potential source of extremism and instability. Pan-Arab nationalists were no less adamantly opposed, having their own purposes in mind for the region. As late as 1974, Syrian President Hafez alAssad openly referred to Palestine as "not only a part of the Arab homeland but a basic part of southern Syria"; there is no reason to think he had changed his mind by the time of his death in 2000. Nor, for that matter, did the populace of the West Bank and Gaza regard itself as a distinct nation.."
[.....]
Thus it happened that, at the end of the conflict, Israel Unexpectedly found itself in control of some One million Palestinians, with no definite idea about their future status and lacking any concrete policy for their administration.
[...]
..The larger part, still untold in all its detail, is of the Astounding social and economic progress made by the Palestinian Arabs under Israeli "oppression." At the inception of the occupation, conditions in the territories were quite dire. Life expectancy was low; malnutrition, infectious diseases, and child mortality were rife; and the level of education was very poor.
Prior to the 1967 war, fewer than 60% of all male adults had been employed, with unemployment among refugees running as high as 83%. Within a brief period after the war, Israeli occupation had led to dramatic improvements in general well-being, placing the population of the territories ahead of most of their Arab neighbors. In the economic sphere, most of this progress was the result of access to the far larger and more advanced Israeli economy: the number of Palestinians working in Israel rose from zero in 1967 to 66,000 in 1975 and 109,000 by 1986, accounting for 35% of the employed population of the West Bank and 45% in Gaza. Close to 2,000 industrial plants, employing almost half of the work force, were established in the territories under Israeli rule.

During the 1970's, the West Bank and Gaza constituted the fourth fastest-growing economy in the world-ahead of such "wonders" as Singapore, Hong Kong, and Korea, and substantially ahead of Israel itself.
Although GNP per capita grew somewhat more slowly, the rate was still high by international standards, with per-capita GNP expanding tenfold between 1968 and 1991 from $165 to $1,715 (compared with Jordan's $1,050, Egypt's $600, Turkey's $1,630, and Tunisia's $1,440).
By 1999, Palestinian per-capita income was nearly double Syria's, more than four times Yemen's, and 10% higher than Jordan's (one of the better off Arab states). Only the oil-rich Gulf states and Lebanon were more affluent.

Under Israeli rule, the Palestinians also made vast progress in social welfare. Perhaps most significantly, mortality rates in the West Bank and Gaza fell by more than two-thirds between 1970 and 1990, while life expectancy rose from 48 years in 1967 to 72 in 2000 (compared with an average of 68 years for all the countries of the Middle East and North Africa).
Israeli medical programs reduced the infant-mortality rate of 60 per 1,000 live births in 1968 to 15 per 1,000 in 2000 (in Iraq the rate is 64, in Egypt 40, in Jordan 23, in Syria 22). And under a systematic program of inoculation, childhood diseases like polio, whooping cough, tetanus, and measles were eradicated.

No less remarkable were advances in the Palestinians' standard of living.
By 1986, 92.8% of the population in the West Bank and Gaza had electricity around the clock, as compared to 20.5% in 1967;
85% had running water in dwellings, as compared to 16% in 1967;
83.5% had electric or gas ranges for cooking, as compared to 4% in 1967;
and so on for refrigerators, televisions, and cars.

Finally, and perhaps most strikingly, during the two decades preceding the intifada of the late 1980's, the number of schoolchildren in the territories grew by 102%, and the number of classes by 99%, though the population itself had grown by only 28%.
Even more dramatic was the progress in higher education. At the time of the Israeli occupation of Gaza and the West Bank, not a single university existed in these territories. By the early 1990's, there were Seven such institutions, boasting some 16,500 students.
Illiteracy rates dropped to 14% of adults over age 15, compared with 69% in Morocco, 61% in Egypt, 45% in Tunisia, and 44% in Syria.

ALL THIS, as I have noted, took place against the backdrop of Israel's hands-off policy in the political and administrative spheres. Indeed, even as the PLO (until 1982 headquartered in Lebanon and thereafter in Tunisia) proclaimed its ongoing commitment to the destruction of the Jewish state, the Israelis did surprisingly little to limit its political influence in the territories.."

and the rest at:
http://www.palestinefacts.org/what_occupation.html

[spidergoat]

What's with that phrase?

Behold,
http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=72618

I have merged these threads.

[abu_afak]

What's with that phrase?

Behold,
http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=72618

I have merged these threads.

The Use of 'Behold' again was my making an Intentional Echo-string.
But whatever makes you happy- makes us happy.

[S.A.M.]

MacGyver, I'd hold that "thanks" for Disinfo S.A.M.


Complete Baloney.
There are Few anti-zionist Jews

I know several of them; they attend the same peace activist meetings as I do. They also tell us what is really happening in Israel, since they come from there, or visit there for academic purposes.

[abu_afak]

I know several of them; they attend the same peace activist meetings as I do. They also tell us what is really happening in Israel, since they come from there, or visit there for academic purposes.

You know several of WHAT?

They are against the existance of the State of Israel?

Or against Some of it's policies?

Many people in Israel (and every other Free country) criticize their countries policies. This does NOT make you against the EXISTANCE of the country as Neturei Karta is.

[S.A.M.]

You know several of WHAT?

They are against the existance of the State of Israel?

Or against Some of it's policies?

Many people in Israel (and every other Free country) criticize their countries policies. This does NOT make you against the EXISTANCE of the country as Neturei Karta is.

I know which is which.

http://www.masada2000.org/dirt-list.html

http://www.masada2000.org/Rat-Fink.html

[abu_afak]

Cheap shot/Avoidance reply.
I asked you a Legimate question and made a BIG distinction/Shredded your previous semantic shenanigans.

You know several of WHAT?

They are against the existance of the State of Israel?

Or against Some of it's policies?

Many people in Israel (and every other Free country) criticize their countries policies. This does NOT make you against the EXISTANCE of the country as Neturei Karta is.

You Fanned on it.

What's your answer?


Board Members:
this is a common attempt by anti-Israelers (and occasionally anti-semites) to say Jews are against the Existence of the state of Israel/Antizionists because they disagree with some of it's policies.
(Perhaps 2/3 of Americans would also fit in the latter category but are not against america's existence)
S.A.M. in an Underhanded attempt, lumping those with policy disagreements in with those Fringe Freaks like Neturei Karta.
Ooops.

[S.A.M.]

The pattern has been emerging over a long time now:

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/r...istSrc=Y&art=1

There's no reason to be surprised by the new study (Steven Cohen of Hebrew Union College's Jewish Institute of Religion, and Ari Kelman, sociologist at the University of California, Davis) revealing that young North American Jews aren't as attached to Israel as one would have want them to be. Previous studies showed this pattern consistently, including other studies sponsored by the Andrea and Charles Bronfman Philanthropies.

Take a look at this study, by pollster Frank Luntz:

Older Jews who grew up with the establishment of the state of Israel and the Six Day War witnessed a remarkable record of achievement. The reality of young Jews is informed by Rabin's assassination and the second intifada. The impact of this is immediately evident in their use of the word "they" rather than "us" when they talk about Israel. The Jewish state is tangible and emotional for most Jewish organizations but is an abstraction for many younger Jews.

2.

Still, the new study brings to the fore the extent to which young Jews (not Orthodox though, which might be misleading as it doesn't show the one group that's totally different) are alienated from the Jewish State. One example: less than half of such Jews who are 35 and under believe that Israel's destruction would constitute a personal tragedy for them, And more: only small part of them believe that caring about Israel was an important part of their Judaism (40% of older Jews were rated in the study as highly attached to Israel, just 20% of younger Jews fit this category). Many of them (more than half) just don't feel comfortable with the whole idea of a Jewish state.

Most of the younger generation of American Jews do not want to be associated with Israeli actions and hence, do not want to be associated with Israel.

If you attend any peace activist group in your locality, you will likely meet many of them

[abu_afak]

As I said above, Many (maybe even Most) Americans are against america's policies and actions and don't want to be associated with Bush or even Clinton for that matter.. But still believe in the Existence of this country. Unlike Neturei Karta.

You know several of WHAT?

They are against the existance of the State of Israel?

Or against Some of it's policies?

Many people in Israel (and every other Free country) criticize their countries policies. This does NOT make you against the EXISTANCE of the country as Neturei Karta is.

Still waiting.

[S.A.M.]

Your lack of comprehension is not my problem.