ethics standing alongside science?

Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by EmptyForceOfChi, Jun 6, 2007.

  1. EmptyForceOfChi Banned Banned

    Messages:
    10,848
    can ethics stand side by side with science, ofcourse i am talking about modern western ethics that we enforce in society. can we justify all of our ethics with scientific grounds? do many of us in the world have double standards when it comes to this issue?

    knowing the scientific nature of humans and our role in the natural eco system of planet earth, can we justify morals and ethics while holding onto a true scientific standpoint? is it acceptable to have double standards when confronting this issue?,


    peace.
     
  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    23,053
    Ahh, Empty, you asked a question that has so many sub-questions intermingled inside the main question that anyone who answers it is going to be mostly an idiot or one who is just fuckin' off.

    What ethics? Who's ethics? Which ethics? Are they written anywhere as laws? Are there any penalties for violating those ethics? Is a little, bitty violation okay, but big ones ain't?

    I think scientists should have their emotions ripped out the moment they hire on as a "scientist".

    War!

    Baron Max
     
  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. fishtail Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    915
    Science would love to get rid of aggravating variables, work it out.
     
  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. heliocentric Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,117
    We already do really, any sort of scientific study into humans or animals generally has to follow ethical guide-lines. In alot of cases these ethics guidelines arnt nearly strict enough, but they do exist and noone in the scientific community generally complains (from what ive seen).
    In terms of a 'true scientific being' such a thing doesnt really exist, although if it does it exists only in abstract - which im pretty sure is what you meant anyway though.
     
  8. EmptyForceOfChi Banned Banned

    Messages:
    10,848


    read my OP and i answered the questions you just asked. i would suggest you read more than the thread title before you post a reply lol,


    the ethics that are applied as laws for human to follow, like "men cant fight over women" thats a good example, we all know that its natural for men to fight it out over a woman,


    peace.
     
  9. EmptyForceOfChi Banned Banned

    Messages:
    10,848
    want to elaborate?


    peace.
     
  10. EmptyForceOfChi Banned Banned

    Messages:
    10,848
    the laws that are based on ethics do not suggest that we already do. our ethical guid-lines conflict with how humans act without supervision in the wild when left alone.


    we expect humans to act like we are not animals,

    peace.
     
  11. heliocentric Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,117
    True, although im not sure i see the direct correlation to science in all of this.

    I mean, i cant walk around naked if i want to go shopping, i cant piss in the street, i cant have sex in public.
    I constantly have to keep my 'animalness' well hidden at all times or suffer the long arm of the law.
    I see this more as a society-wide phenomenon than something stircly applicable to science.
     
  12. andbna Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    316
    And I think cars should have their engines ripped out the moment they are made, that would eliminate exhaust fumes.

    Emotions are the thing that drives us, according to Antonio Damasio, emotions help us to make rational decisions, and indeed without any, we could not decide at all. This has enormous applicability to science, as there are way too many variables in any given hypothesis, that emotions are needed in order to help eliminate some. Furthurmore, there is no rational way of choosing between competing theorys, according to Kuhn, it's often many un-scientific factors which determin the winning theory. And even still, most scientists are driven by their desires to be held greate, this too encourages checking your peers work for errors (because if they are wrong, you could be right) and thus, allows for scientific progress.
    So, in conclusion, emotions are one of the driving factors behind science.


    Now to try and address the actual topic...
    While I'm not sure how well we can justify our current ethics with science, It does however appear to be a good way of determining ethics (though by no means the only).
    For example we ethicaly shouldn't kill large animals in vast numbers, or start campaigns to eliminate smaller ones (ie an intentional extinction of say spiders), or use bioamplifying pesticides like DDT.
    We can come to this scientificaly because killing other animals, without controll, would resault in their extinction and thus damage to the ecosystem, which would then resault in damage to us, we can figure this out scientificaly.

    Now, as for humans acting stragely when allone, this is natural as we are meant to be sociable, and furthurmore, doesnt matter as laws are built for societys, in which case this wouldnt be a problem.
    You mentioned fighting over women as an example, and I would say that, while science may show we would naturaly do this, we are also capable of learning better methodes to deal with problems (and technicaly science shows we can learn, but thats fairly intuitive for everyone)
    Thus rather than cream the other guy, one could work it out by talking; most specificaly with the girl, as she is the one who gets to choose.

    So I would say that yes we can justify, at least partialy, our ethics in a scientific standpoint.
    -Andrew
     
  13. heliocentric Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,117
    Yep humanbeings arnt just creatures of pure cold logic nor can they be.
    The idea that we ever could was only ever really taken seriously during a very short phase of the enlightenment. Romanticsm soon put that one to bed.
     

Share This Page