************* M*W: SetiAlpha6 has challenged me to cite some astro-theological interpretations of bible verses. I've come up with a few, some may have predated the bible. I hope you all will at least find this to be interesting: Taken from Jesus Christ, Sun of God: Ancient Cosmology and Early Christian Symbolism, by David Fideler. "In early pagan Hermetic writings, wehre the sun is portrayed as the sower and reaper of souls, indeed of all life: 'The Sun is the savior and the nurse of every class. And just as the Intelligible World, holding the Sensible in its embrace, fills it (all) full, distending it with forms of every kind and shape--so, too, the Sun distendeth all in the Cosmos, affording births to all, and strengthening them. When they are weary or they fail, He takes them in His arms again.'" David Fideler states, "The number 666 is associated with the figure of traditional cosmology known as 'the magic square of the sun.'" He goes on to state, "'triple numbers' may be derived from the magic square of the sun, and for this reason, 'triple numbers' were apparently thought to have a solar significance" (i.e. the triune god). "A hymn by Origen celebrates the myster of the Ogdoad, and the conception was further developed by the other (church) fathers. Moreover, the so-called Christian Sibyllines, which purport to be pre-Christian prophecies, predict the coming of the new religion in hte following way, clearly referring to the mystic number of Jesus:" 'When the maid shall give birth to the Logos of God the Most High, but as wedded wife shall give to the Logos a name, then from the east shall a star shine forth in the midst of the day radiant and gleaming down from the heaven above, proclaiming a great sign to poor mortal men. Yea, then shall the Son of the great God come to men, clothed in flesh, like unto mortals on earth. Four vowels he has, twofold the consonants in him, and now will I declare to thee also the whole number: Eight monads, and to these as many decads, and eight hundreds also his name will show..." The number for Jesus is 888 in Greek gematria. "Christ arose from the dead on the eighth day, the day of Helios" and "this had been the first day of Creation and for the Christians it became again the first day." "In the beginning was the Logos...In him was Life, and the Life was the Light of men." ~ Prologue to the Fourth Gospel "That Light, He said, am I...the Light-Word (Logos) that appeared from Mind is Son of God." ~ Corpus Hermeticum "I am the light of the world; he who follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life." ~ Jesus (John 8:12) Franz Cumont observed in his Astrology and Religion Among the Greeks and Romans: "This coherent and magnificent theology, founded upon the discoveries of ancient astronomy in its zenith, gradually imposed on mankind the cult of the "Invincible Sun" as the master of all nature, creator and preserver of men." "...the Logos is God's Likeness, by whome the whole kosmos was fashioned." ~ Philo Judaeus Clement of Alexandria said, "the image of God is His Word, the genuine Son of Mind, the Divine Word, the archetypal light of light; and the image of the Word is the true man, the mind which is in man, who is therefore said to have been made 'in the image and likeness of God.'" In the Gospel of Thomas, Jesus says, "It is I who am the light which is above them all. It is I who am the All. From Me did the All come forth, and unto Me did the All extend. Split a piece of wood and I am there..." According to David Fideler, his comment on the 'renewal of time' is a 'rebirth of the light'. (sun) He says that "Many ancient religious festivals are connected with the idea of the renewal of time. In christianity, the two most important are Christmas, when the sun is reborn from the wintery depths, and Easter, the spring festival." "The ancient winter solstice, December 25, signifies the rebirth of the Unconquered Sun (Sol Invictus). At this point in the year the days grow longer and light re-enters the world. This festival of the reborn sun was initially associated with the solar divinity Mithras and, like so many other ancient religious customs and celebrations, was taken over by the early Christians to maintain a sense of continuity between the old and the new." In astrological aeon, "the Age of Aries, the ram, c. 2000-1BCE, corresponds with the reign of fiery Jehovah, who became angered by the Israelites' worship of the golden calaf, a throwback to the earlier age of Taurus. This same period corresponds with the rise of Amen-Ra, the ram-headed solar god in Egypt...". "Finally, the Era of Pisces, c.1-2000CE, corresponds with the birth of christianity and its prevalent fish symbolism. The apostles were known as "fishers of men," while the early christians were known as "little fishes." "For the early christians, the Greek word for "fish" was an acronym standing for "Jesus Christ, Son of God, Savior." "Jesus was both the Lamb of God whose sacrifice closed the Platonic month of Aries, and the rising sun of the Piscean Era, the Celestial Fish of the new Aeon.' "The Christian savior was born of a Virgin, and when the newly born spring sun slipped into and rose in the constellation of Pisces two thousand years ago, Virgo, the virgin, was standing on the Western horizon, for it is exactly opposite Pisces in the zodiac." Not all ancient stories were prophecies about the coming savior. A pagan text c.9BCE commemorated the Julian calendar and stated the following: "The Providence which rules over all has sfilled this man with such gifts for the salvation of the world as designate him as Savior for us and for the coming generations; of wars he will make an end, and establish all things worthily. By his appearing are the hopes of our forefathers fulfilled; not only has he surpassed the good deeds of earlier time, but it is impossible that one greater than he can ever appear. The birthday of God has brought to the world glad tidings that are bound up in him. From his birthday, a new era begins." Virgin, the Latin poet, wrote c.37BCE foretelling the coming of a divine child, a sun king, who will re-establish the Golden Age. Fideler continues, "Harpocrates, a form of the Egyptian solar divinity Hours, represents the newborn sun as an infant. This iconography of the goddess with her divine, solar child is thought by many scholars to ahve prepared the way for the Christian iconography of the "Madonna and child." Early Christians in Egypt took o9ver this symbolism and depicted Jesus, the Spiritual Sun, as Harpocrates seated on the lotus." "Jesus Christ was the Solar Logos." "In the beginning was the Logos," reports the Gospel of John and, in the words of the Logos itself, "I am the Light of the World." "The early Christians maintained that Ieous was "a name above all names." "From a cosmological perspective, the physical sun is the source of all life and light on the earth--but from a metaphysical perspective the Spiritual Sun of the Logos is the source of Life and Light as universal principles." From The Christ Conspiracy: The Greatest Story Ever Sold, by Acharya S, she describes Jesus's Physical Appearance as: "There is no physical description of Jesus in the New Testament, other than that which resembles the sun, such as his transfiguration at Matthew 17:2. "And he was transfigured before them, and his face showne like the sun, and his garments became white as light," a fitting dexcription for the "light of the world that every eye can see." In Revelation 1:13-15, she describes the 'androgynous character at "And in the midst of the seven candlesticks, one like unto the Son of Man, clothed in a garment down to the foot, and girt abut his paps [breasts]. His head and his hair were white as white wool, white as snow...". Ultimately, Jesus's physical description is unknown, and the description above is of the sun. Acharya states, "like the other epithets for "God," Baal is a title meaning "Lord" or "husband;" it is, in fact, a very old appellation for the Deity, and can be found not only in Egypt but also in India as Bala. In the ancient languages of Ireland and Sri Lanka, "Baal" means "sun." "Baal is in reality the earlier name of the character later known as Yahweh, as it stated at Hosea 2:16. (And in that day, says YHWH, you will call lme, "my husband," and no longer will you call me, "my Baal." "Old Testament Jews worshipped many baalimas past or present consorts of the Goddess Zion (Hosea 2:2-8)." In other words, Baalim was another title for ancient sun gods. Acharya explains that "another word basically the same as Baal and Adonis, which in plural is Adonai, is a term used for "Lord" over 400 times in the Hebrew bible. Adonis, like Baal and El, is an epithet for the sun." "Thus, even Yahweh was at one time plural, but "he" eventually became an all-male, sky god. This warrior god Yahweh was not only Jealous but also Zealous, as his name is rendered in Young's Literal Translation: "...for ye do not bow yourselves to another god--for Jehovah, whose name is Zealous, is a zealous God. (Exodus 34:14)" "Moses's Levitical/Yahwist law, however, evidently didn't stick, as even the exalted Hebrew patriarch Solomon set up for his foreign wives altars to the Moabite sun god Chemosh and the Tyrian sun and fire god Moloch, Molech, Melech or Melek. Although he was purportedly vilified by "the Lord," Chemosh was, as Walker relates, the Hebrew form of Shamash, the sun god of Sippar and Moab, worshipped in the temple of Solomon (I Kings 11:17)" Hazelrigg states: "...Israel, meaning a belt or land of the heavens, the twelve tribes of which compare to the number of constellations that environ the ecliptic, and through which the Sun makes his annual circuit...Issa-ra-el, the kingdom of the moon (Isis), Sun (Ra), and stars (El)." My personal favorite verse: "For everything there is a season, and a time for every mater under heaven: a time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up what is planted (Ecclesiastes 3:12)" "And God (Elohim) said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day fro mthe night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years..." (Genesis 1:14) "Can you obind the chains of the Pleiades, or loose the cords of Orion? Can you lead forth the Mazzaroth in their season, or can you guide the Bear with its children? Do you know the ordinances of the heavens? Can you establish their rule on the earth?" (Job 38:31-33) The "Mazzaroth" is the Zodiac. "In Psalms 19, we hear about the heavens 'telling the glory of God...". "Astrology, or 'astrologis' in the Greek, has been considered 'the word of God," according to Acharya S. Psalms continues: "In [the heavens] he has set a tent for the sun. This 'tent' or 'tabernacle' represents a holy sanctuary or house of worship; thus theheavens are truly the temple of the sun, as well as of the other celestial bodies." Job 9 explains that God is the Divine Architect of the Zodiac "who made the Bear and Orion, the Pleiades and the chambers of the south...". Amos 9:6, "Thou has made the moon to mark the seasons; the sun to know its time." Isaiah 14:12, the Lord has "given commandments to all the stars." Psalms 147:4 shows where the stars have names given to them by "the Lord." Isaiah 13:10, "For the stars of sthe heavens and their constellations will not give their light." Isaiah 24:23, "Then the moon will be confounded, and the sun ashamed." The sun and moon are rulers of the day and night. In the Song of Solomon, he embarasses god-fearing christians with its overt sexuality. "Solomon" uses celesstial imagery to describe his beloved: "Who is this that looks forth like the dawn, fair as the moon, buright as the sun...?" (Sol. 6:10) It has been stated that Abraham's father Terah "had twelve gods of large size, made of wood and stone, after the twelve months of the year, and he served each one of them monthly." (Jasher 9:8) Abraham himself was known to worship the sun and he prayed to it. "And Abram served the sun in that day and he prayed to it...and Abram served the moon and prayed to it all that night." (Jasher 9:14-17) The Kings of Judah established sun and moon worship as found in 2 Kings 23:5, "And he deposed the idolatrous priests whom the kings of Judah had ordained to burn incense in the high places at the cities of Judah and round about Jerusalem; those also who burned incense to Baal, to the sun, and the moon, and the constellations, and all the host of heavens." The Kings of Judah were obviously sun-worshippers as made clear in 2 Kings 23:11, when Josiah "removed the hourses that the kings of Judah had dedicated to the sun...". The four-faced creature of Ezekiel's allegories are not as mysterious as the 'wheel' was nothing more than a symbol of the zodiac, four 'cherubim,' the "man," the "ox, "lion," and "eagle," representing the cardinal points and four elements: Aquarias (air), Taurus (earth), Leo (fire) and Scorpio (water). John 14:2, Jesus says, "In my Father's house there are many rooms." Translated, this means "many mansions." Acharya S. says that "these 'houses', of course, are also applicable in the story of the sun." Paul says in 1 Corinthians 15:41, "There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for star differs from star in glory." Jesus mentions the precession of the equinoxes or the change of the ages when he says to the disciples as they prepare for passover, "Behold, when you have entered the city, a man carrying a pitcher of water will meet you; follow him into the house which he enters." (Luke 22:10) An obvious passage referring to 'house' or the 'Age of Aquarius, the Water-Bearer (John the Baptist). The "upper room" where Jesus has prepared his last supper refers to the literal "heavens." Ecclesiastes 1:9, "There is nothing new under the sun." Acharya S. states about the zodiac, "As the mythos developed, it took the form of a play, with a cast of characters, including the 12 divisions of the sky called the signs or constellations of the zodiac. They symbols that typified these 12 celestial secions of 30 degrees each were not based on what the constellations actually look like but represent aspects of earthly life. Thus, the ancient peoples were able to incorporate these earthly aspects into themythos and project them onto the all-important celestial screen." Psalms 113:3 states "rising of the sun to its setting." Psalms 85:11 states, "faithfulness will spring up from the ground, and righteousness will look down from the sky." Psalms 68:32-32, people are instructed to "sing praises to Jah, to him who rides in the heavens, the ancient heavens...whose majesty is over Israel, and his power is in the skies." Psalms 72:17, "May his name endure for ever,his fame continue as long as the sun...". Malachi 1:11, "For from the rising of sun to its setting my name is great among the nations." The bible, originally written and assembled by the ancients means "sun book," or "helio biblio," or "Holy Bible." Jon 38, the stars are called "sons of God;" hence, one star would be a "son of God," as well as the "son of the Sun." Thus, the son of God is the son of the Sun." Malachi 4:2, YHWH says, "But for you who fear my name the sun of righteousness shall rise, with healing on its wings." John 2, Jesus says, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up." Acts 26:13, regarding his conversion Paul states, "At midday, O king, I saw on the way a light from heaven, brighter than the sun, shining round me and those who journeyed with me." Luke 24:11-2, Jesus upon his resurrection states, "Do you have any fish?" Jesus feeds the 5,000 with five loaves and two fishes. The "two fishes" represent the Sign of Pisces. The five loaves represent the five smaller planets. These are the same five loafs requested by the priests of David in 1 Samuel 21:3. Later in the gospel myth, the number of the loaves is seven representing the seven planets used to represent the days of the week. "Jesus," the sun "breaks up" the multiplied loaves into the 12 baskets or constellations, symbolizing creation of the innumerable stars and places them in the heavens. The sun was considered to be the "fisher" of men. Judas betrays Jesus for 30 pieces of silver. He succumbs to terrible guilt and hangs himself. In Acts, Judas is said to have had his guts explode in the potter's field. Obviously, these are not historical stories. I shall have to continue this at a later time. I look forward to any questions.
************* M*W: Don't bother reading it, then. I was asked by SetiAlpha6 to cite some quotes. If you're not interested in learning more about ancient sun worship, then don't waste your time. If what I write doesn't appeal to you, then put me on ignore. Your choice to learn is your's and your's alone. My choice to teach is for anybody who wants to read what I write.
Continuation on the study of astro-theology and the bible. ************* M*W: Continuing on with the astrological influence on the bible: "And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of man will be forgiven." Luke 12:10 "Children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that antichrist is coming, so now many antichrists have come." 1 Jn. 2:18 An "antichrist" is anything that opposes "christ." The astro-theological interpretation of this is "christ" is the Sun, and any planet or heavenly body who "opposes" the sun is an antichrist. An example is when Jesus says to Peter, "Get thee behind me Satan." Jupiter was opposing the Sun making Jupiter an antichrist. BTW, Jew-Peter was Jupiter. Minucius Felix stated "As for the adoration of the cross which you (pagans) object against us (Christians)...that we neither adore crosses nor desire them; you it is, ye Pagans...who are the most likely people to adore wooden crosses...for what else are your ensigns, flags, and standards, but crosses gilt and beautiful. Your victorious trophies not only represent a simple cross, but a cross with a man on it." According to Derek Partridge, "What a cross with a circle in it..truly represents is the sun waning or dying on the zodiac, and not a man." Luke 22:10 refers to a "man carrying a pitcher of water." This was the "man" that came before "Jesus," John the Baptist, or the Sign of Aquarius. Acharya S. refers to the "sons of Noah are also not historical, as Shen was actually a title of Egyptian priests of Ra. The three sons of Noah, in fact, represent the three divisions of the heavens into 120 degrees each. As characters in the celestial mythos, Noah corresponds to the sun and Shem to the moon, appropriate since the Semitic Jews were moon-worshippers." Acharya S. says that "Abraham is held up as the patriarch of the Hebrews and Arabs, the original Abraham and Sarah were the same as the Indian god Brahma and goddess Sarasvati, the 'Queen of Heaven.'" In 2 Chronicles 9:23, it states, "allt he kings of the earth sought his (the sun's) presence." Another reference to "antichrist" refers to the sun as "Lord of the Opposite, which means a sign or constellation opposite to the sun at any given point." 1 Peter 5:8 "Antichrist" does not mean "absolute evil being," it simply means "adversary." An interesting admission about the "father of lies." "If a prophet is deceived, I the Lord deceived that prophet." Ezekiel Paul states in Hebrews 9:24 "For Christ has entered, not into a sanctuary made with hands, a COPY of the TRUE ONE, but into heaven itself...". Matthew 12:40 declares "For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the whale, so will the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." When Jesus is asked by the Pharisees and Sadducees for a 'sign from heaven,' he enigmatically answers, "An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign, but no sign shall be given to it except the sign of Jonah (Matthew 16:4) "The sign, of course, is the sun." Paul states in 1 Corinthians 15:17, "if Christ hath not been raised, your faith is vain." The sun also rises. In 2 Kings 22-23, worship of the Sun was performed by Jews in their temple. Matthew 25:31-46, "the Lord of Spirits seated the Elect One on the throne of his glory...". Matthew reads, "When the Son of man shall come in his glory...then shall he sit on the throne of his glory."
This point of view, as you may agree, "seems" pretty radical for most people like me who have never been exposed to it before, M*W, but I will read and consider it. Thank You!
No, the Bible calls Jesus "The Sun of Righteousness" and the "Bright and Morning Star". Malachi 4:2 But to you who fear My name The Sun of Righteousness shall arise With healing in His wings; And you shall go out And grow fat like stall-fed calves. (New King James Version) Revelation 22:16 “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star.” (New King James Version)
*********** M*W: Yes, I know, and I apologize for its length. I know how annoying this is. I created a continuing thread and kept it specific to bible verse.
Malachi 4:2 "But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves in the stall." It doesn't say "my name The Sun of Righteousness," if you're going to quote it, quote it right, otherwise, it makes you look like a charlatan, and you don't want that, do you?
Is there some conclusion we're supposed to arrive at or some meaning we're supposed to derrive beyond that these are not historical stories? ~Raithere
The New American Standard Edition does, however. So your criticism is a bit misplaced. M*W, perhaps you could clarify for us what version of the bible you're using. Do each of the verses come from the same version? In order to get the correct context, it might be helpful if comparisons are made with the original texts (Hebrew in Malachi's case).
Much of it does make sense considering at the time the ancient hebrews had migrated out of southern egypt around 1250 B.C (correct me if I'm wrong here MW) had been living under the rule of Akhenaten. A short interval of monotheism (Atenism) occurred under the reign of Akhenaten, focused on the Egyptian sun deity Aten. Akhenaten outlawed the worship of any other god and built a new capital (Amarna) with temples for Aten. The religious change survived only until the death of Akhenaten, and the old religion was quickly restored during the reign of Tutankhamun, most likely Akhenaten's son by a minor wife. The hebrews no doubt found living under the rule of Akhenaten in-tolerable considering their xenophobic nature and hence the flight out of southern egypt to the "so called promised land". Not too hard to see where much of their religous system was derived from.
Ahkenaten took the capital upriver because lower Egypt was dried out because the Ice Age had ended, see the Ipuwer Papyrus. The Exodus occurred when the Ice Age ended, when Santorini and Etna were going off, and the sea level was rising, to submerge Menouthis and Herakleion of Egypt.
Both of those events took place long, long after the last glacial maximum. Post any more pseudoscience and it'll be deleted.
Unfortunately, Med Woman thinks that Solomon and David came before the Exodus. So when do you say David and Solomon lived, Med Woman, and why did the Hebrews supposedly get it wrong, as they supposedly copied everything?
************* M*W: I already gave you this information along with references. I'm not going to research it again for you.
