Hello all, Wa all have our believes/disbelieves. But now I'd like to post some interesting questions for people who follow Christian religion. 1.Here is something from Jim Dator's article "Does religion have a future?" 'Well, if these demographic trends continue--and there is absolutely nothing being done in terms of policy, technology, or behavior to suggest that they will not continue--so, assuming the likely scenario that these demographic trends will continue, then by the mid point of the 21st Century--only some fifty years from now--the western, white, Northern portion of the 10 to 15 billion people expected to occupy an extremely crowded and polluted planet will be only between one and five percent. Ninety-five to 99% of all humans struggling for existence on this fetid globe fifty years from now will be nonwhite, nonwestern Southerners.' 'Against such odds, what hope is there for Western Culture? And if Western culture becomes, in effect, only one tiny minority among many competing much larger cultures, what hope is their for Christianity as a world religion? Not much, in my view. And I say this in full awareness that some kinds of Christianity are experiencing an impressive spurt in popularity in some nonwestern regions.' 2.There is growing evidence that in timerame of decades-centuries Artificial Intelligence will surpass Human Capabilities.Then - no more Homo Sapiens and,hence,followers of Christianity. 3.Not to mention some possible catastrophes(meteors,global warming) - the typical lifespan of complex species is about few million years,meaning,natural lifespan of Homo Sapiens will be around 10 million years(Owen Gingerich,Stephen Jay Gould).And our Sun is supposed to live about 6 billions years more,and entire Universe about trillioins. So,to summurise: The major conception in Christianity is the The Second Coming Of Christ.Some prohesies states that entire Universe will be transformed at its end.But if in 50 years from the Christian population will be just 3-5 percent,or humans will be replaced/transformed into cyborgs,long before Sun dies Homo Sapiens extinct - what happens to Christianity THEN?And what would be a point of Christ coming/interventing into the Universe TRILLIONS of years from now,long after the last Homo Sapens ceased? Something to ponder...
What is western culture? Why does Christianity depend on it? Isn't Christianity all over the globe among many cultures? Why no worrying about cultures (and languages) that actually are dying out right now, like aboriginal cultures?
Two things: 1. Western culture must do EVERYTHING to survive and to flourish. In fact, if need be, I suggest Western culture relocates to the Moon or Mars. 2. Thou shalt not make a machine in the likeness of a man's mind. Any machine that threatens the survival of humanity must be destroyed before it can or, even better, not developed at all.
PJ believe it or not, those were the two main concerns I thought about when I first scanned this paper.
Prince_James: 1.Exactly.I am by no means racist, and respect Chinese and Indian cultures very much,but I dare to say that all major scientific developments rooted in Westernn culture.If something happens to Western culture - all our science will suffer severely 2.No too clear with machines...We might well need 'intelligent machines' for space exploration,specificaly outside of Solar System(yet we are way off)
Western culture is not dependant on westerners. The western culture has already been embraced by billions of non-Europeans in Asia, Africa and the sub continent. Christianity is a faith not a culture. There are more Christians in Africa and Asia today then there are in Europe. Its been that way for a few generations. Christianity is not dependant on any culture. Not going to happen. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Human guided history will not be allowed to continue to the ultimate ending of self extermination. God will intervene. Yeah a big meteor might indeed strike and it could lead to the extinction of the human race but God will intervene and not allow the extinction to happen. Well the true Christian population of the world much be much lower now then your future figures state. It does not matter if there are 1000 million or just 1000 Christians on the planet. All it takes is one for the faith to survive up untill the return of the Messiah Jesus. And another thing. Jesus is not coming to save Christians from death. He is coming to establish His kingdom on earth and reasurecting Christians from the dead. It matters not a jot weather there are any Christians left alive on earth when He comes. All true Christians from down through the ages will be reasurected. All Praise The Ancient Of Days
What do you mean "wouldn't allow it to happen"? According to christianity it is god himself that will make it happen... he does after all intend to exctinctify all humans and destroy the universe. Indeed revelations even mentions the star that crash lands on the planet, (and while that alone doesn't kill every single person I think it does show that your statement is unjustified).
Not true. That is only a carnal interpretation of the scripture by someone who openly admits not to believe in them. Man as he is today, is just a scaled down mortal version created by careful genetic manipulation over centuries of controlled breeding and mass exterminations......to create a body, a host for the testing. Man is being restored back to his original condition. And the serpents food.....is dust. No place to be found at all for them.....neither root nor branch of it left. Where then will the legions of unbeleif find to roost? Get it now?
While your interpretation doesn't even come from the text. In either case this world, it's people and indeed this universe are destroyed because of your god. That's what the text says. It doesn't say anything about snakes and sexual intercourse, ancient nuclear weapons or anything else of the nature you tend to come out with.
Existabrent: I am definitely glad we are on the same wavelength on this topic. Smooth: Yes, precisely. Western culture has been the driving engine of human development for at least the last 500 years. Although I also respect Oriental and Indian culture, I do not think they could pick up the slack if the West goes into further decline. The problem is this: What does it mean when we have thinking machines? When we make machines, we generally make them to replace something we don't want to do. Does this mean that thinking machines will replace our desire to think? If so, we are all ready doomed. Although I am loathe to quote The Matrix, Agent Smith made an interesting point, "When we did the thinking, it really became -our- civilization, didn't it?" Adstar: Imitations are not the real McCoy. Moreover, the Western value system is far more than simply commercial capitalism. I dare say that all cultures are ultimately rooted in their people. With the decline of Western people comes the decline of Western civilization.
Jesus is called the beginning of the creation of God. There is a new heavens and new earth. A Heavens and Earth under the government of God instead of Satan. That's what is being destroyed.......and just like the other times, God is letting man do most of it himself. Man is being restored back to his original condition. And the serpents food.....is dust. There are two seeds in the kingdom of Heaven...... The wheat and the tares. This interpretation does come from the "text" In dozens of places.....every one of which when I pointed them out to you, you so eloquently replied....."it doesn't mean that". Putting your head in the sand won't make it go away, SnakeLord.
Estimated by whom using what methods? Kindly show me anywhere that I eloquently or otherwise said "it doesn't mean that". Thinking up witty one-liners while spouting the same baseless garbage over and over again doesn't make it true. Face facts Visitior, nothing, not one sentence you ever type has any merit whatsoever. At least some religious fanatics have the decency to try and support their claims using the religious tools at their disposal, (i.e the bible), but you can't even manage that - instead choosing to just make it up as you go along. Now pay attention: I'm beyond the point where I care to read anything you write - it's a waste of my time. Kindly come up with something pertinent and I will give it the time it deserves, until then consider that this particular son of whoever is bored of your tosh. The rest of your post wasn't really worth commenting on, my only curiosity right now is who estimated Adam's IQ and what methods they employed to do it. Will I get an answer or more tosh?
You should know Smooth, that no one can predict the future, we can rationalize though, however this Dator guy is way off! as shown by Adstar. For once I agree with this guy! Make that twice now! Well we couldn't go for threePlease Register or Log in to view the hidden image! God didn't intervene in the Tsunami, nor did he do didly squat for Pearl Harbor, WWI & II, nor 9-11, I suppose the big guy was on vacation? That's what the Dinos thought as well, the only difference is that they were not aware of the Big one coming, we are! And being that the worlds politicians got their head stuck up their ass, we are doomed if it does come . And to avoid panic and destruction! our government perhaps won't even worn us that a meteor is on it's way! Well first identify what the hell is a "true christian" there are 34000 different sects and all believe that they are the "true christian" Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! But the less of any mystic, delusional, irrational, theist that there are, the better humanity will fare out.. And then you woke up, on your death bed, and hope this bull shit is truePlease Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Good luck, fairy tales is not a good way to make a living, unless you are writing FICTION!! **…But there is worse to come. `Say what you like' we shall be told, `the apocalyptic beliefs of the first Christians have been proved to be false. It is clear from the New Testament that they all expected the Second Coming in their own lifetime. And, worse still, they had a reason, and one which you will find very embarrassing. Their Master had told them so. He shared, and indeed created, their delusion. He said in so many words, this generation shall not pass till all these things be done. And he was wrong. He clearly knew no more about the end of the world than anyone else.' It is certainly the most embarrassing verse in the Bible. …The one exhibition of error and the one confession of ignorance grow side by side. …The facts, then, are these: that Jesus professed himself (in some sense) ignorant, and within a moment showed that he really was so."**C.S. Lewis. http://jcnot4me.com/Items/theology/Second Coming stuff/jesus-liar_fraud.htm
Jesus said (about His second coming): "Will the son of man find any faith when he comes?". The Bible say that in the last days, both children and old will see visions, as knowledge increases so will the knowledge of God increase in these days, I think the Bible talks about the last days when it says that people will be afraid of the air around them, and terrible dreams will frighten them, people will hide in caves, and hope the mountain falls upon them to hide them from God, and they will blame God for the loss of their people - those days no one will turn away from their sins. It is not a happy day, it's the day of Gods wrath. But at the sight of the son of man, those righteous will be glad, cause they are finally saved.
Yes i believe there will be a meteor strike and that it will directly destroy one third of the surface of planet earth. I did not say that God was going to stop the meteor strike i said He will stop that meteor strike from totally exterminating the entire world population. So God will allow the strike, it is a part of His wrath and vengeance against those who have rejected Him and persecuted His children on earth. But he will prevent it from destroying all humans on earth. Matthew 24 22 And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened. All Praise The Ancient Of Days
No God allowed them all to happen. Natural disasters are an outcome of the rebellion against God that Adam and Eve entered into when they aligned themselves with satan. From that time on they had to face the world without protection. But God will never allow a natural disaster to destroy the total population of this world. Even in the Tsunami God saved some of His followers by using the persecution of the worldly population around them to good effect. The other disasters are man-made disasters and God rarely intervenes when men seek to follow other men into acts of mass murder and mayhem. But God does intervene with individuals saving some from the fire. Well there is one on the way called Apophis and they did warn us that it would strike in 2029 but they have since made the call that it will not And yes they are working on plans to move it out of the way. But there is no rush they have decades to play with don't they? Of course that can all change very quickly if WW3 happens and all the space engineers and their facilities go up in a MAD fireball. I suppose then no one will have the ability or resources to stop aphopis Media release about measures to move Apophis LOL why spend time and resources working on repelling an asteroid when everyone has been told that it will not hit the earth Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! LOL Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Yeeeeahhh...right. Humanity is doomed under its own guidance. We have self destruction built in to our selves, Only a self delusional would believe that we can make it under our own guidance. And it does not matter if there where 100,000 different sects if there is just one that is right then then their truth will determine eternity. Its not about making a living its about making eternity with God. LOL How desperately the worldly want to be free from God and how deeply they fear the ultimate reality of Gods existence. How devastating to they’re minds to find out and deal with the revelation that they are a created being... Better to grasp on to any denials they can find and desperately throw it out there in a vain attempt to hide beneath it. But the ultimate reality will not be denied forever and no man who shoves his head in the sand will survive the revelation of God. All Praise The Ancient Of Days
I can cite references from scripture. I have alread cited Matthew 24 Matthew 24 22 And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened. Most of chapter 24 deals with the great destruction that will happen before the coming of the Messiah Jesus. Chapter 22 states clearly that not all flesh will be destroyed. Therefore humans will survive in their flesh state during the 1000 year reagin of the Messiah Jesus. As for the chunk of space rock/iron meteor/asteroid whatever you like to describe it as that is also mentioned in scriptures. And it is only in these latter days that scientists have come to understand the effects of a massive meter strike so that new we can see that the book of Revelation was clearly inspired: http://www.astronomynotes.com/solfluf/s5.htm Revelation 8 8 Then the second angel sounded: And something like a great mountain burning with fire was thrown into the sea, and a third of the sea became blood. 9And a third of the living creatures in the sea died, and a third of the ships were destroyed. See how John says it is "Like a great mountain burning with fire", if it was an actual mountain he sure would have identified it as such but he states it is like a burning mountain. Now lets look for the reference to the stars falling from the sky: Revelation 6 12 I looked when He opened the sixth seal, and behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood. Now what do you think the effect would be of a massive meteor strike on the earth surface. A massive shock wave travelling around the world causing the greatest earth quake the world has ever seen? And think of the massive amounts of debris kicked up into the atmosphere and also ejected into lower earth orbit, making the sun darken and the moon turn blood red like it is shining through iron dust maybe? Revelation 6 13And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. 14Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place. Now the stars falling to the earth? looks like a good first century description of a massive debris shower re-entering the earth’s atmosphere as the matter kicked up from the impact of the meteor comes back to earth. What do people call little pieces of space rock that enters into our atmosphere? that’s right a falling star. As for the " sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up " i have heard this interpreted as the nuclear mushroom cloud when it ascends into the upper atmosphere it is seen to roll like a scroll. But that is only over a limited area isn't it. Imagine what the massive mushroom cloud of a meteorite impact would look like from the ground? like the whole sky rolling away like a scroll into darkness? Revelation 8 10 Then the third angel sounded: And a great star fell from heaven, burning like a torch, and it fell on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water. 11 The name of the star is Wormwood. A third of the waters became wormwood, and many men died from the water, because it was made bitter. Scientist know that one of the after effects of an asteroid strike is acid rain. sourced from http://www.astronomynotes.com/solfluf/s5.htm Yes many men will die because they will be forced to drink the water and it will all be contaminated by nitric acid. Revelation 16 8The fourth angel poured out his bowl on the sun, and the sun was given power to scorch people with fire. 9They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him. Yes the after effects of a asteroid strike will be the partial destruction of the Ozone layer and a rapid greenhouse effect that will make life hell on earth. sourced from http://www.astronomynotes.com/solfluf/s5.htm "too warm for comfort for a while"..... what an understatement. And "The carbon dioxide level rises because the plants are burned and most of the plankton are wiped out." yes indeed just as the book of Revelation predicts: Revelation 8 7The first angel sounded his trumpet, and there came hail and fire mixed with blood, and it was hurled down upon the earth. A third of the earth was burned up, a third of the trees were burned up, and all the green grass was burned up. Also 8The second angel sounded his trumpet, and something like a huge mountain, all ablaze, was thrown into the sea. A third of the sea turned into blood, 9 a third of the living creatures in the sea died, and a third of the ships were destroyed. Yes as the scriptures say a hail of fire will fall to the earth that is the re-entry of ejected matter caused by the impact of the asteroid. it will hail fire and brimstone on 1 third of the earths surface and it will burn and scorch 1 third of the worlds surface. Revelation 6 15And the kings of the earth, the great men, the rich men, the commanders, the mighty men, every slave and every free man, hid themselves in the caves and in the rocks of the mountains, 16and said to the mountains and rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?" Well the great men of the world have indeed made their great bunkers in the mountains in the best granite rock for protection against nuclear attack. and i bet they will run for their privileged places when this thing strikes. But of course their well stocked and reinforced underground complexes will become their tombs... eventually. All Praise The Ancient Of Days
There are many variables that strengthen/develop religion within society, but the most common one is suffering (that is the view, that regardless of one's material station of life, suffering is a given - like for instance its not like hurricanes bypass the houses of billion aires or that well educated people know how to circumvent the problems of old age or that beautiful people are more resistant to disease, sickness and injury) - in other words for as long as human society is in a suffering condition of life, religion (of some sort or other) will be manifest - if one holds that the job description of materialistic advancement is to supercede religion, then it will have to prove itself by finding the solution to remove the suffering condition of life. (nb - most scriptures quite clearly state there is no material solution for such sufferings)
