Australia's most senior Muslim cleric Oz women R uncovered meat & deserve to be raped

[mountainhare]

Baron:

No terrorist group or any other radical, violent group should be permitted to dictate foreign policy to any nation! That, my friend, IS terrorism! If we do that, it's nothing but surrendering to the terrorists!

I agree. The United States should not be permitted to dictate foreign policy to any nation!

[Zakariya04]

gOOD MORNING Baron,

i HOPE ALL IS WELL with you
I was not blaming anyone apart from these so called muslims, these terrorists i beleive are funded from Saudi Arabia, But as saudi Arabia is such an opaque country we will never truely know i suppose.. what is true though is that 15 of the 9-11 bombers were alledgedly from Saudi Arabia... ok but if you think that my idea for help is a load of crap and would actually help the terrorists then that is your opinion, i dont think it is abusrd and many non-muslims have expressed the same thing.

What help do you suggest non-muslims should give to help eradicate this problem then.. perhaps you think no help can/should be given if so please state. Please could you also tell me what the western powers are doing at the moment to stop terorism
With thanks

zAK

[Baron Max]

Baron: I agree. The United States should not be permitted to dictate foreign policy to any nation!

Good! Then we both agree ...is that a first?

However, just so you know, I think any nation should try to further it's own interests wherever possible, don't you? Think of it as nothing more than self-preservation or self-interest. That's not a bad thing, ya' know?

Baron Max

[Zakariya04]

My dear Baron,

hummmmmm, do you know what you just said to mountainhare!!??!!!

~~~~~~~~~~~~
As always
zak

[Baron Max]

What help do you suggest non-muslims should give to help eradicate this problem then..

Zak, Muslim terrorist are able to act and to kill ONLY because other Muslims permit it, support them or even help them!

Think of it, Zak, do you think that a radical, extremist, violent group like the Muslim terrorists could exist and operate in the USA? What do you think the Americans would do if such a group began to blow up innocent, unsuspecting men, women and children in the USA? How long do you think they could survive in the USA?

They'd be caught and/or killed within a few weeks, maybe less!

Why is that, Zak? Well, it's because we, Americans, simply will not allow such violent bullshit to exist! Yet the Muslim terrroists exist in numerous Muslim and Arab nations ...and seem to exist easily and safely. Why, Zak?

I'll tell you why! It's because the other Muslims, the citizens who live right in the same area/city, permit it to happen, permit those violent bastards to live right in their own neighborhoods!

Until Muslims decide to eradicate the extremists, the violent terrorists, then the terrorists will have a safe environment from which to operate. It's all up to the Muslims of the world, not others, and certainly not non-Muslims.

Wake up, Zak, only you and your Muslim friends and believers can stop Muslim terrorists. Do you want to stop them? Do your friends want to stop them? Well, ......?

The west is doing about all it can ...by stopping the international flow of money to those organizations. Look at the Hamas group ...without funding, they're not going to be able to operate for long. They're already having major problems. But other nations are helping, too, even some Muslim nations.

Baron Max

[Baron Max]

My dear Baron, hummmmmm, do you know what you just said to mountainhare!!??!!!

Yes, but from your post, I'd say that you don't understand what I said in reply. Read it again, Zak, read it carefully.

Baron Max

[mountainhare]

Baron:

Why is that, Zak? Well, it's because we, Americans, simply will not allow such violent bullshit to exist!

Yeah, it's not like America has ever supported or funded violent, murderous, corrupt regimes in other countries...

[Zakariya04]

Baron

just so we can have a recap of what has been said

I said this

Hi baron



If i may suggest that the west could help here by cutting off finance and support to Arab countries like Saudi arabia etc...where a lot of this extrmism stems from.

~~~~~~~~~~~~
take care
zak

you said this

Don't start, Zak!!!!!!!!!!!! Don't start blaming it on the west. That's exactly, precisely where you start acting and talking like a fuckin' radical, extremist terrorist!!! Don't start, Zak .....you know fuckin' well that what you're doing is wrong is going to get you and Muslims into more trouble.

Baron Max

I followed this up by stating the following

Good Morning Baron


Asking for help, not blaming is not acting like a radical baron, Islamic terrorism is primarily the problem for the muslims to sort out, however it effects us all, so asking for help from as many people/ institutions as possible is better than no help at all.

As i have mentioned before Islamic terrorism is the fault of the muslims for not getting their house in order etc... but asking for heklp is not laying blame either...

Muslims should educate each other on the evils of terrorism and how killing and causeing evil acts does not do anyone any good, we should voice our opion s louder and eliminate radicals preaching in mosques and islamic schools etc... We shoudl also look more closely at islmic chairties and stop the radicals exploiting them, either by disbanding the chairty or somehow cutting the links form the chairty to the radical orgainisation.

is it totally uinfair to ask non-muslims to help either?. if it is not unfair baron, how can non muslims people/institutions help??

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Take care
zak

you then say this

Asking for help is one thing, but suggesting that part of the cause of terrorism is the relationship between the Suadi government and the USA is a totally different issue! That you would even suggest it is basically saying that the terrorists should dictate any action by the USA (or other governments).

Think about that, Zak ....that's exactly what you're saying! That you want or expect that a few radical terrorists should have veto power over the greatest, most powerful nation on Earth. Yeah, that's asking for help alright, ....you're asking for help for the terrorists!!!!!

No terrorist group or any other radical, violent group should be permitted to dictate foreign policy to any nation! That, my friend, IS terrorism! If we do that, it's nothing but surrendering to the terrorists!

Baron Max

you go on to mention this

Zak, Muslim terrorist are able to act and to kill ONLY because other Muslims permit it, support them or even help them!

Think of it, Zak, do you think that a radical, extremist, violent group like the Muslim terrorists could exist and operate in the USA? What do you think the Americans would do if such a group began to blow up innocent, unsuspecting men, women and children in the USA? How long do you think they could survive in the USA?

They'd be caught and/or killed within a few weeks, maybe less!

Why is that, Zak? Well, it's because we, Americans, simply will not allow such violent bullshit to exist! Yet the Muslim terrroists exist in numerous Muslim and Arab nations ...and seem to exist easily and safely. Why, Zak?

I'll tell you why! It's because the other Muslims, the citizens who live right in the same area/city, permit it to happen, permit those violent bastards to live right in their own neighborhoods!

Until Muslims decide to eradicate the extremists, the violent terrorists, then the terrorists will have a safe environment from which to operate. It's all up to the Muslims of the world, not others, and certainly not non-Muslims.

Wake up, Zak, only you and your Muslim friends and believers can stop Muslim terrorists. Do you want to stop them? Do your friends want to stop them? Well, ......?

The west is doing about all it can ...by stopping the international flow of money to those organizations. Look at the Hamas group ...without funding, they're not going to be able to operate for long. They're already having major problems. But other nations are helping, too, even some Muslim nations.

Baron Max

Please look at both of the quotes in red from me and you taking into account at least 15 of the 9-11 bombers were from Saudi Arabia according to the US government.

perhaps to make it clearer to you i should have said cutting off support whether financial to governements who support terrorism and allow it to exist like saudi arabia (imo)

please dont link hamas to any of this, this group was created in the 80's out of the muslim brotherhood of egypt, israel backed them in the 80's to create another threat to arafats Plo/fatah Movement, anyway hamas has done as much damage to the USA as ETa of spain have so lets not go there at the moment...

I think you are actually twisting my words here baron, so i would politely ask you not too.

~~~~~~~~~~~~
atke care zak

[Baron Max]

Please look at both of the quotes in red from me and you taking into account at least 15 of the 9-11 bombers were from Saudi Arabia according to the US government.

That doesn't mean that the Saudi government had anything to do with the 9-11 attacks! Just because someone was born in some nation, doesn't make that nation responsible for all of their actions. What kind of garbage are you talking about?

perhaps to make it clearer to you i should have said cutting off support whether financial to governements who support terrorism and allow it to exist like saudi arabia (imo)

So ...a few radical, violent extremist should dictate who and how the USA is to support it's friends? That's exactly what you're saying, Zak ...that if a terrorist happens to be born in Saudi Arabia, then the USA should automatically condemn the Saudi government and turn our backs on that nation. Ie., the terrorists dictate what the USA does?! Bullshit!

I think you are actually twisting my words here baron, so i would politely ask you not too.

Nope, I don't think so, Zak. As I read it, you're suggesting that a few Saudi terrorists should dictate the foreign policy of the USA. Not only is that suggestion stupid and irresponsible, but it's actually supporting the terrorist!!!

Baron Max

[Zakariya04]

Dear Baron

thank you for your response and the time taken to copmpose it.

once i have digested everything you have said i will reply with my thoughts..

Just a quick thought though baron, as you know Saudi Arabia is a dicatatorship and its institutions and security forces have virtually total control over all of saudi life.... In other words they can clamp down on things hard or turn a blind eye too, but they know what is going on....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
take care
zak

[Baron Max]

...Saudi Arabia is a dicatatorship and its institutions and security forces have virtually total control over all of saudi life.... In other words they can clamp down on things hard or turn a blind eye too, but they know what is going on....

There have been terrorist acts in Saudi, too. If they have such all-seeing control, then that couldn't have happened, right?

Zak, in even the tightest, most harsh dictatorship, no one can see everything that's going on. I.e., there are numerous revolts throughout history that prove what you're saying is wrong.

But that doesn't matter anyway, Zak. Can you imagine the problems that would occur if nations began to do whatever the terrrorist demanded? If the terrorists don't want the USA to be friends with Saudis, then we should just stop??? Is that how you'd treat your own friends?

Baron Max

[mountainhare]

Baron:

If the terrorists don't want the USA to be friends with Saudis, then we should just stop??? Is that how you'd treat your own friends?

That's how you treated your South Vietnamese 'friends'...

[Zakariya04]

Dear baron, Good Morning

I am sorry but i am still trying to respond to you comments above, but i am having some difficulties.. I do see your point that these terrorist knumbskulls should not dictate Us policy, however they kind of have anyway as the primary foriegn policy of the US is the war on terror, which came about immediately after 9-11 which was a terrorist act and a crime against humanity. so they basically have already dictated US policy, as the US has troops tied up in Iraq and afghanistan, which are bogging down resources but not defeating the terrorists.. these divckhead terrorists want the US to fight battle in Afghanistan and Iraq as they know it will motivate the population of the countries against the US, and thus more recruits.. Iraq could be such a force for good, potentially a very powerful country now just look at the mess their in .. the bloody teorrists have got the Us fighting in Iraq with the population of Iraq fighting amongst themselves....

I am not saying that Saudi is not of value to the US in strategic terms etc,,, but the Saudi Royal family has about 2000 (could be 5000)members all with dodgey links to various chairties linked to various terrorist cells/orgainisations..

You are right the Saudis dont like bin laden, in fact they are shit scared of him and that is the reason why they did not want him extradited from Afghanistan in the late 90's and effectively paid the taleban to keep him there. they are scared primary of an islamic reviolution bearing in mind what happened to the shah,i am not saying that it would be a shiite revolution though but a sunni Islamic revolution.

As far as the Us is concerned yes they would prefer the house of saud in charge of Arabia as the alternative, which is an islamic sunni state run by clerics would be far worse in their opinion so they are perhaps stuck in a difficult situation, kind of like picking the best of 2 evils in their case...

I really dont know what else to suggest at the moment as the whabiist have such control over Saudi arabia at the moment, we will have to think of a third way.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

anyway take care
baron and thanks for reading Zak

[Baron Max]

Baron: That's how you treated your South Vietnamese 'friends'...

Yeah, I know we did .....and I'm damned ashamed of it, too!

You, on the other hand, seem quite happy about it. Makes me wonder how you treat your own friends and family.

Baron Max

[Baron Max]

so they basically have already dictated US policy, ...

Well, if you see it that way, Zak, then....?

I really dont know what else to suggest at the moment ....

Well, perhaps another way is for all western nations to just lie down and surrender to the Muslim terrorist? ...beg for forgiveness of the Muslim terrorists? ...all western people to force their people to take up Islam as our religious faith?

Baron Max

[Zakariya04]

Well, if you see it that way, Zak, then....?

Hi Baron
Thank you for your comments

I dont get what you mean here please expand if you would.

Well, perhaps another way is for all western nations to just lie down and surrender to the Muslim terrorist? ...beg for forgiveness of the Muslim terrorists? ...all western people to force their people to take up Islam as our religious faith?

Baron Max

Baron why do you waste your time typing this mumbo jumbo when we both dont want this to happen and is not a a plausable solution.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
take care
zak

[Baron Max]

Baron why do you waste your time typing this mumbo jumbo when we both dont want this to happen and is not a a plausable solution.

Didn't say anything about wanting it, Zak, but it's not mumbo-jumbo. In my opinion, as soon as the next president is elected, the USA will pull out of Iraq. You can call it anything that you want, but it's basically surrendering to the Muslim terrorists.

We did it in Vietnam, we'll do it again in Iraq and in Afghanistan. You can call it "strategic withdrawal" or whatever you want, but in reality, it's nothing but surrendering to the violent extremists. That's not mumbo-jumbo, Zak.

Baron Max

[Zakariya04]

dear Baron,

Thank you for your comments
Were we not talking about Saudi arabia not iraq or Afghanistan... What the hell did Iraq have to do with Alqueda under Saddam God Only knows.....

~~~~~~~~~

Take care
zak

[Baron Max]

Were we not talking about Saudi arabia ...

Same thing, Zak, we'll withdraw our friendship to Saudi, which is nothing but surrendering to the dictates of the Muslim terrorists. It's all the same, Zak.

When the next president is elected, we'll abandon any of our friends in the same way if the terrrorists demand it. I suspect that we'll also abandon our longtime friendship with Israel, too.

Baron Max

[Zakariya04]

Good Morning Baron

Thank you for your comments.

tghe hous eof Saud are the most corrupt fuckers in the arab world, they help fund terrorism though the various chairty and madrass's around the world. The royal family of Saudi arabia, love to enforce extereme islamic laws but they drink wine, gamble and have women on tap.. but to make things worse the hypocrite bastards force their whabbism on the population of Saudi Arabia,

The House of Saud have craeted a cult they can not control and are even still part of too an extent.... However if the house of saud was to fall then God knows who wikll be in charge of Saudi arabia...

I am afriad this is the problem, america is forced into holding a relationship with these idiots through fear of the consequences...

thats pretty shit if you ask me...

~~~~~~~~~~~~
take care
zak