Soul as parasite

[(Q)]

The same thing that makes a person scream "SNAKE!!" when they see a rope that happens to look like a snake.

Illusion

That explains nothing. If an illusion, then it is material and can be detected, yet, nothing has been detected.

[S.A.M.]

A fair definition would be anything at all to be harmfully attached to.

It could just as well be an attachment to an aversion.

--- Ron.

But if you are attached to an aversion, is that not a twisted form of desire?

[(Q)]

In Hindu, Buddhist and Islamic philosophy, we see a dual definition of the soul:
one, which is the corporal or individual soul, also defined as the self;
second, which is the celestial or supreme soul, also defined as the impersonal consciousness.

According to Islamic philosophy, the rational soul (nafs) requires a body for definition until it separates from matter and reaches a state of purity.

In Hindu philosophy, the jiva (or individual soul) is limited from complete freedom by the three bonds of ego, action and illusion (so may be said to need a body for definition, as well).

In Buddhism, the atman (soul) is described as a mundane impermanent ego (attachment to which must be overcome) in order to attain Nirvana (or the pure blissful Self of the Buddha).

In all cases, the individual soul may be said to require a body for definition.


PS *lightgigantic, perplexity, pls correct any errors*

That's all vey nice, sam, and I think those have been brought up before, but they don't answer my questions.

[(Q)]

What if you define the soul as that which detects?

You are like a dog who wants to see how fast it has to run to bite its tail off.

--- Ron.

Even detectors can be detected.

[(Q)]

But to get to Q's original query about a living person bereft of their body, the fact that a person is living indicates tat the soul hasn't left the premises of the body - th emoment a person is dead is the moment that the soul has left, and no amount of material restoration will bring it back.

The body is long since gone and only the head remains. Does the head therefore contain the soul?

[VitalOne]

Then, the soul is NOT 100% immaterial, it is in fact material, hence we should be able to detect it, especially if there are electromagnetic fields. Yet, nothing, nada, ziltch.

you're right I wouldn't call it the soul though, its just like The Buddha says there is no soul that is the thinker of our thoughts, etc...that is the mind which is spiritual (as opposed to physical).

The true soul is unchanging, interminable, always remaining the same.

In the future consciousness or the soul will become a fact. Consciousness is made up of an ether-substance it uses the brain as a tool.

It is material, and will one day explain how the brain gains consciousness etc.....

Just give it a few 100 years

[MetaKron]

Then, the soul is NOT 100% immaterial, it is in fact material, hence we should be able to detect it, especially if there are electromagnetic fields. Yet, nothing, nada, ziltch.

I take it you know where the experiments were done.

[(Q)]

I take it you know where the experiments were done.

I'm not sure if there were experiments, however, magnetic resonance imaging should be able to detect those electromagnetic fields. Again, nothing, nada, ziltch.

[(Q)]

The true soul is unchanging, interminable, always remaining the same.

So, it's material? Why can't it be detected?

In the future consciousness or the soul will become a fact. Consciousness is made up of an ether-substance it uses the brain as a tool.

I think consciousness has already been shown to be a fact, the soul has not been shown at all.

What ether-substance do you refer, exactly?

It is material, and will one day explain how the brain gains consciousness etc.....

Again, if material, we would have already detected it or its effects.

[MetaKron]

I'm not sure if there were experiments, however, magnetic resonance imaging should be able to detect those electromagnetic fields. Again, nothing, nada, ziltch.

You're using too many negatives to be believed, Q. Not many people can dis a subject the way you do without revealing themselves that way. You're not one of them. I shall consider this contribution to be an uninformed guess.

[VitalOne]

So, it's material? Why can't it be detected?



I think consciousness has already been shown to be a fact, the soul has not been shown at all.

What ether-substance do you refer, exactly?



Again, if material, we would have already detected it or its effects.

It can and will be detected. The reason it hasn't is because science hasn't fully developed yet, there's lots of things we're unaware of, believe it or not.

The ether-substance is kind of electromagnetic but not really, its more like a scalar wave or longituditional wave that Nikola Tesla spoke of (as opposed to a Hertzian wave). It is like thought-energy. The physical brain reacts to the energy giving it ideas, images, etc....the better physical brain you have the more you can get out of it.

Those dreams you have aren't spontaneous like science says, when ideas pop into your head it also isn't spontaneous like science says.

[(Q)]

You're using too many negatives to be believed, Q. Not many people can dis a subject the way you do without revealing themselves that way. You're not one of them. I shall consider this contribution to be an uninformed guess.

Hehe, that's rich. Of course, you don't have to believe me at all, I could care less. Have you taken the time to find out for yourself? There is over 20 years of experimental evidence.

[(Q)]

It can and will be detected. The reason it hasn't is because science hasn't fully developed yet, there's lots of things we're unaware of, believe it or not.

Believe it or not. How about not?

The ether-substance is kind of electromagnetic but not really, its more like a scalar wave or longituditional wave that Nikola Tesla spoke of (as opposed to a Hertzian wave). It is like thought-energy. The physical brain reacts to the energy giving it ideas, images, etc....the better physical brain you have the more you can get out of it.

Sounds like a lot of gibberish. I think Tom Bearden, kook extraordinaire, proposed scalar waves as a "new kind of electromagnetic wave" - one that of course hasn't yet been detected.

Those dreams you have aren't spontaneous like science says, when ideas pop into your head it also isn't spontaneous like science says.

Okey-dokey.

[MetaKron]

Hehe, that's rich. Of course, you don't have to believe me at all, I could care less. Have you taken the time to find out for yourself? There is over 20 years of experimental evidence.

And when I provide you with that evidence, you the one who acts like he knows that there is no evidence, will say that you already knew about such and such and it doesn't prove anything. Your definition of zero, zilch, and nada is different from mine. It is also inferior to mine.

[c7ityi_]

we can't see it, but we can see it's effects.

What happens to the soul if the body is comatose, perhaps from brain damage?

if the body does not function, the soul can't express itself through the body.

If a person loses most of his body and his head is left over kept alive in a jar, where does the soul go?

if the head is alive, then that person should be conscious, so the soul does not go anywhere.

If the soul is 100% immaterial and the body is 100% material, what mechanism bridges the two in order for the soul to interact with the body?

everything in the universe is made of the same kind of substance. you can call it spiritual or material.

the reason we can't detect everything with scientific tools is because the tools are yet primitive. with our mind (metaphysical tool) we can detect more ethereal things like mental waves.

when our senses evolve, we'll be able to see things we can't see now. for example, we'll be able to see through matter.

we see through things now too. we don't see air.

[(Q)]

And when I provide you with that evidence, you the one who acts like he knows that there is no evidence, will say that you already knew about such and such and it doesn't prove anything. Your definition of zero, zilch, and nada is different from mine. It is also inferior to mine.

Ok, provide the evidence that souls exist. MRI's haven't found it, based on the assertion of electromagnetic fields.

[MetaKron]

Ok, provide the evidence that souls exist. MRI's haven't found it, based on the assertion of electromagnetic fields.

Why don't you provide the evidence that you have declared to be zero, zilch, and nada?

[(Q)]

Why don't you provide the evidence that you have declared to be zero, zilch, and nada?

So, you're asking me to provide evidence that doesn't exist?

[MetaKron]

So, you're asking me to provide evidence that doesn't exist?

I know that there is a body of evidence that you are aware of that you have dismissed and that you pretend does not exist.

[VitalOne]

Believe it or not. How about not?

So you really believe that science is fully developed and knows everything there is to know? There's lots of missing gaps in science, if you believe science knows everything there is to know you're really mistaken

Sounds like a lot of gibberish. I think Tom Bearden, kook extraordinaire, proposed scalar waves as a "new kind of electromagnetic wave" - one that of course hasn't yet been detected.

Yeah I admit it sounds like a lot of gibberish, I bet if I described zero-point energy before it was confirmed in science you would also say gibberish. Or how about if I stated some quantum concepts before they were confirmed in science, gibberish right?