Poll: Guns

Thread: How do you feel about guns?

  1. #421
    Quote Originally Posted by John99
    That's terrible, the nearest city to me is like 25 miles or more.

    Neildo, Guiliani could clean your city up.
    Depends on the gang, and the power and reach of it.

  2. #422
    TimeTraveler::

    How can anyone who is rational trust a "government", or a "system"?
    You voted them in.

    How can anyone who is rational trust a complete stranger?
    Most people are not psychopaths. You can usually safely assume they won't kill you for no reason.

    Your climate of fear blows the risks of stranger attack out of all proportion.

    You have far more chance of being killed in a car accident than of being shot or otherwise killed by a stranger. Yet you have an irrational fear of strangers, and little to no fear of cars.

    It just proves my point.

    Anyone can be murdered at any time by any one for any reason, no one will go out of their way to protect you because thats how society is.
    This is paranoid. Most people do not kill "for any reason". Most need what they consider to be a good reason to kill you, and very few will consider it worth killing you, in fact.

    American's don't trust Americans, it's got nothing to do with the government, or systems, or any of that, people don't trust people unless they know them very well.
    I think it's because your media concentrates on violent crime to a ridiculous extent. So, you imagine everybody is out to get you. It just isn't true. And if it was true, your gun wouldn't help you.

    However, if I see a group of you people standing in a dark alley, I'm going to be nervous as hell, it does not matter who you are, what you look like, a group of strange people doing strange stuff at night sets off all the red flags.
    So, do you walk away from the strangers in the alley, or do you pull your gun and confront them? Which act is likely to lead to a better outcome?

    I don't know why people make me out to be paranoid, it's just how this world is, you are hated by people you've never met and loved by people you've never met, the world is basically crazy, and the only thing that maintains any sort of order, are guns, because without guns, in any country, you'd have people running around stealing and robbing, looting and plundering, going into complete pirate mode because they can. The only reason they don't do this all the time is because they fear the cops and they fear being shot down.
    This just proves my point once again. You are paranoid for no good reason. Your fears are irrational.

  3. #423
    Neildo:

    I can point all around at threats.
    They are nameless, faceless, imagined threats, like I said.

    I live near the beach. About a 10 minute walk towards the south end of town is a street that used to have the most calls for police in one day in all of the United States. About a 5 minute drive is the home neighborhood of the largest gang in my county. Just yesterday, two high school girls were walking home around the corner from my house and some 19 year old kid randomly stabbed both of them and some young kid a few feet behind them.
    What would the 19 year old kid have done if he had had a gun, I wonder?

    Not only that, but my city is 66% Mexican where I'd say a good 25% are illegal immigrants that aren't documented. Those are the ones that hate white people and believe in the whole Aztlan thing.
    Let me get this straight. They immigrate, and also hate white people? Doesn't make much sense to me.

    Also most of my friends are cops. They always have to carry a concealed weapon due to all the crazy people they bust and/or write tickets to.
    I don't have a problem with authorised people such as police carrying guns, provided strict limits are put on their use. Police sometimes need guns. The average red neck like you does not.

    Guns are a tool. You may not like them, but they serve a purpose, and some people absolutely need them such as in the case of off-duty officers.
    See above.

    What the fuck do you know about faceless fears? I can point to numerous examples of it, face and all. Go ahead and live in fantasy utopia land thinking everything is peachy keen.
    Maybe you should move to someplace where you don't live in fear. It can't be good for your long-term health.

    Or, maybe you should lobby for gun control laws, and eliminate one of your fears.

    You will find a time when your utopian fantasy crumbles and realize things aren't as perfect as you hoped and then you will have to adapt like the rest of mankind because evolution is all about survival of the fittest and none of your hopeful thinking can ever prove history wrong. You're lucky, that's all you are. And you're lucky that there are people willing to protect you when you don't even bother to do so yourself.
    Pure paranoia.

  4. #424
    Registered Senior Member redarmy11's Avatar
    Posts
    7,658
    Neildo: I don't think anyone would object to police officers (even off-duty ones) carrying guns.

    Personally I wouldn't even object to you carrying one - you seem smart and responsible enough.

    It's people like Time Traveler and Baron Max that I worry about. Frankly, I wouldn't trust them with a rolled-up newspaper, much less a loaded weapon!

    P.S. I took a look at that report you linked to. It's a bit biased, isn't it? For instance, it asserts that UK gun control paranoia started to rear it's head after the 1987 Hungerford and 1996 Dunblane shootings. The truth, I have to tell you, is that we've always favoured gun control, since Time began. Indeed we simply don't have, and never have had, a gun-owning culture. It simply wouldn't make sense to us, after incidents like these, to head for the armament shops and stock up on howitzers. Our instincts - and I think they're the right ones - are always to make guns even harder to get hold of. The report makes it seem like gun control is a recent idea for us when the truth is that the idea of waving guns around is an alien concept.

    And this militia thing. The 'right to bear arms' thing. Yet more alien concepts. I mean, these ideas were conceived in the 1770s, weren't they (have I got my history right there?). Are they not now a bit... outdated? It seems laughable to me. Do Americans seriously envisage a day where they'll have to rise up against a corrupt government and overthrow it. If so, I'd suggest (and I know you'll agree with me, my strange, trigger-happy liberal friend) that the time to do it is now! The world cheered when you lopped off the head of Iraq's insane regime.. now do the same inside your borders! But seriously.. all this militia nonsense.. what's the modern-day thinking behind this ludicrous, outmoded crap? I'd genuinely like to know.

    Happy shootin'.

  5. #425
    Quote Originally Posted by John99
    It's not so bad:

    <a href="http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2005956162034948287"><img border="0" src="http://aycu19.webshots.com/image/3418/2005956162034948287_rs.jpg" alt="Free Image Hosting at allyoucanupload.com"/></a>
    Where are the guns?

    And yes it is bad. having a big house doesn't equal good living.

  6. #426
    Anyway. How come americans are so passive? The hungarians found out the government lied to them and they take to the streets and make a mess.

    Americans know the government lied to them and they sit at home and watch TV. Polishing their gun. Apparently they think their government is totally corrupt. Their police is totally corrupt. And they sit at home and watch TV. polishing their guns.

    Americans are never going to rise to the government. They are too selfish. They only care about themselves. You can't organize a revolt with people who only act in their own interests.

  7. #427
    Quote Originally Posted by James R
    TimeTraveler::



    You voted them in.

    Can you prove I voted them in? Also it does not really matter who you vote in, they do what they want once they get in.


    Most people are not psychopaths. You can usually safely assume they won't kill you for no reason.

    Most people aren't psychopaths, but most powerful people are psychopaths. The more powerful an individual is, the richer an individual is, the greater the chance that they are a psychopath. You have to admit, psychopaths are better at achieving and maintaining power.

    Your climate of fear blows the risks of stranger attack out of all proportion.

    Just because you have never been attacked by a wild man, or a bully, it does not mean these people do not exist, psychopath or not.

    You have far more chance of being killed in a car accident than of being shot or otherwise killed by a stranger. Yet you have an irrational fear of strangers, and little to no fear of cars.

    That depends on where you live, how you live, and what circle of friends you have. Some people do have a greater chance of being shot than getting into a car accident, in fact some people don't even live to age 21 before getting shot.

    It just proves my point.



    This is paranoid. Most people do not kill "for any reason". Most need what they consider to be a good reason to kill you, and very few will consider it worth killing you, in fact.

    Most people aren't who you have to worry about, it's the few people who don't value your life, their own life, or life itself that you have to worry about, and yes these people do exist, and yes there are some powerful people who don't care if you live or die. Hell there may be people who hate you.

    I think it's because your media concentrates on violent crime to a ridiculous extent. So, you imagine everybody is out to get you. It just isn't true. And if it was true, your gun wouldn't help you.

    I never focused on violent crime, crime is crime, murder is murder, death is death. The point is, a gun can protect you from the criminals who aren't expert hitmen. A hitman can't be stopped with a gun.

    So, do you walk away from the strangers in the alley, or do you pull your gun and confront them? Which act is likely to lead to a better outcome?

    It's not either or, if you have a gun, you don't rush to pull it out unless they try to harm you or threaten you.

    This just proves my point once again. You are paranoid for no good reason. Your fears are irrational.
    I'm not paranoid, look at the world, there are perhaps millions, maybe billions, who hate you at this very moment, who are thinking about ways to kill you, and thats not paranoid, thats fact. The world has always been filled with hateful psycho killers, terrorists, criminals, and powerful ruthless individuals. Just because you don't see them, it does not mean they can't see you.

    You are correct, most of the time they don't pay any attention to you because they are busy fighting their enemies, but it does not change the fact that there are people, billions, who are psychopaths, violent, and hateful, and who want to harm you and anyone else who gets in their way of getting whatever it is they want.

    You are going to say it's irrational, yes it's irrational, and religion is the cause of this behavior, not science, not logic, it's religion. If you are so brave, if you are so bold, why don't you take a walk through the middle east, into Iran, right now, and tell them you are an American, and see what happens. What about Iraq? Afganastan? Pick any country in the middle east and go visit, show me how brave you are.

    Now, realize that the world is more religiously unstable than it has ever been. There is more hate in the world right now than there has ever been. There are more sophisticated weapons in the world right now than there has ever been. There is also more wealth and income gaps in the world now than there has ever been. We are in the middle of what could be world war 3, we are worried about avian flus, natural disasters, terrorism, and the end of the world. We are worried about climate change, we are worried about poison spinach, we are worried about mad cow, we are worried about toxins in the drinking water, we are worried about all of these things, and the environment day by day only gets worse.

    You are telling me we are paranoid? If you aren't paranoid during world war 3, you are either crazy, or a religious fanatic that actually hopes for the end of the world, which is it? I myself am afraid of the end, if you want to welcome it with open arms thats your choice, but I think it's more rational to be paranoid in the least secure time in human history, than to be calm.

  8. #428
    Quote Originally Posted by spuriousmonkey
    Anyway. How come americans are so passive? The hungarians found out the government lied to them and they take to the streets and make a mess.

    Americans know the government lied to them and they sit at home and watch TV. Polishing their gun. Apparently they think their government is totally corrupt. Their police is totally corrupt. And they sit at home and watch TV. polishing their guns.

    Americans are never going to rise to the government. They are too selfish. They only care about themselves. You can't organize a revolt with people who only act in their own interests.

    Americans are not passive, we are just smart enough to know that taking it to the streets accomplishes nothing. People took it to the streets during the civil rights movement, this is not the 60s, and America is not Hungry. America is a military superpower, and if people decided to take it to the streets, they'd likely have to face tanks and military weaponry before being declared terrorists and thrown into a prison somewhere.

    Terrorism is not the answer, taking it to the streets is called hooliganism at best and terrorism at worst. Once again, it does not make the country more stable to take it to the streets. Taking it to the streets risks the destruction of the country itself. That's not in any of our best interest, we are not Hungry.

    None of us want a revolt. Stop trying to force Americans into a revolt that we don't even want. It's not going to make us feel more secure, or increase our security in any way to have a revolt. Who knows what would happen during that revolve, we could be attacked by any number of countries that want to take advantage of the chaos of a revolt. And the result of it all would likely be that America could cease to exist.

    Trust me, a revolt is not in America's best interest, or the worlds best interest. The global economy would never tolerate it, and neither would the majority of Americans. Just because you disagree with the policies of the President, it does not mean that there should be a riot. That's exactly what Al Qaeda is hoping for, Al Qaeda is hoping that Americans revolt and get into a huge riot, they want this country to collapse and so do you.

  9. #429
    Quote Originally Posted by James R
    Neildo:



    They are nameless, faceless, imagined threats, like I said.



    What would the 19 year old kid have done if he had had a gun, I wonder?



    Let me get this straight. They immigrate, and also hate white people? Doesn't make much sense to me.



    I don't have a problem with authorised people such as police carrying guns, provided strict limits are put on their use. Police sometimes need guns. The average red neck like you does not.



    See above.



    Maybe you should move to someplace where you don't live in fear. It can't be good for your long-term health.

    Or, maybe you should lobby for gun control laws, and eliminate one of your fears.



    Pure paranoia.

    Why is it that everyone who wants gun control, happens to be from Europe, and everyone advocating stuff like revolts happens to live overseas? Do people really want to see America fall apart?

    I don't get it, people want to arm the criminals, and then in another paragraph someone else is saying Americans should revolt against each other, and then another paragaph it's back to giving guns to criminals.

    Do you think this makes me less paranoid, to see universal agreement among Europeans among others that Americans should disarm themselves and give all their weapons to the criminal elements?

  10. #430
    You live in fear because of your economic system and you cannot change anything because of your economic system.

    I can only say one thing regarding this: ha ha.

    Quote Originally Posted by TimeTraveler
    Americans are not passive, we are just smart enough to know that taking it to the streets accomplishes nothing. People took it to the streets during the civil rights movement, this is not the 60s, and America is not Hungry. America is a military superpower, and if people decided to take it to the streets, they'd likely have to face tanks and military weaponry before being declared terrorists and thrown into a prison somewhere.

    Terrorism is not the answer, taking it to the streets is called hooliganism at best and terrorism at worst. Once again, it does not make the country more stable to take it to the streets. Taking it to the streets risks the destruction of the country itself. That's not in any of our best interest, we are not Hungry.

    None of us want a revolt. Stop trying to force Americans into a revolt that we don't even want. It's not going to make us feel more secure, or increase our security in any way to have a revolt. Who knows what would happen during that revolve, we could be attacked by any number of countries that want to take advantage of the chaos of a revolt. And the result of it all would likely be that America could cease to exist.

    Trust me, a revolt is not in America's best interest, or the worlds best interest. The global economy would never tolerate it, and neither would the majority of Americans. Just because you disagree with the policies of the President, it does not mean that there should be a riot. That's exactly what Al Qaeda is hoping for, Al Qaeda is hoping that Americans revolt and get into a huge riot, they want this country to collapse and so do you.

  11. #431
    Quote Originally Posted by samcdkey
    Yes but without any form of gun control there is no restriction on access to guns.

    Did you know that women undergo an average of 30 incidents of abuse before they report one?

    Cases of reported abuse:





    It is not necessary to kill someone to make a point.

    I would not want these people to have easy access to guns. Would you?

    PS. Please read the link I posted earlier.

    As for the bombs, we in India have them for self-defense.

    A lot of countries fearing attack would like the same privilege.

    Sam don't you get it, with gun control, in AMERICA, the criminals with their uzis will take over the streets to the point where the police will be afraid of them, or there just won't be enough police to handle it. Gun control does not decrease the access to guns, it actually makes guns cheaper and more accessable because when gun control is in, the black market steps up shipments, this is why in the inner cities where theres gun control, you have all the latest military technologies and guns. Nothing stops a man from just going into the inner city and buying an uzi from an underground gun dealer.

    This is not the same as a nuclear bomb. At this point a nuclear bomb is difficult enough to make and expensive enough so that only states can buy and make them. Gun's are a different situation.

    Gun control will have the police going after anyone who owns a gun, good or bad. So this way the criminals and the police will work in teams to arrest the citizens who own illegal guns, because you know, the criminals need their fresh supply of victims and we can't have victi er citizens defending themselves can we?

  12. #432
    Quote Originally Posted by spuriousmonkey
    You live in fear because of your economic system and you cannot change anything because of your economic system.

    I can only say one thing regarding this: ha ha.
    You are capitalist too, you act like you are communist. You chose capitalism for the same reason we Americans choose it. You have buyers remorse now? Well there's no other system. The economy is global now, it's globally capitalist.

    I'm convinced you hate America. I bet you hate Americans too. You want to arm the criminals, you want there to be riots in the streets, I bet you enjoyed watching hurricane Katrina, and you like to watch Americans suffer. You want to take away our guns out of hate, not to make us more secure. It's not even rational to take away our guns to make us more secure, how exactly can you convince a person that taking their gun makes them more secure?

  13. #433
    Quote Originally Posted by TimeTraveler
    I'm not paranoid....Now, realize that the world is more religiously unstable than it has ever been. There is more hate in the world right now than there has ever been. There are more sophisticated weapons in the world right now than there has ever been. There is also more wealth and income gaps in the world now than there has ever been. We are in the middle of what could be world war 3, we are worried about avian flus, natural disasters, terrorism, and the end of the world. We are worried about climate change, we are worried about poison spinach, we are worried about mad cow, we are worried about toxins in the drinking water, we are worried about all of these things, and the environment day by day only gets worse.....You are telling me we are paranoid?
    Yes!

  14. #434
    Quote Originally Posted by spuriousmonkey
    Anyway. How come americans are so passive? The hungarians found out the government lied to them and they take to the streets and make a mess.

    Americans know the government lied to them and they sit at home and watch TV. Polishing their gun. Apparently they think their government is totally corrupt. Their police is totally corrupt. And they sit at home and watch TV. polishing their guns.

    Americans are never going to rise to the government. They are too selfish. They only care about themselves. You can't organize a revolt with people who only act in their own interests.
    Isn't that image beautifull? ....but it's not my house LOL.

    I thought i made a good case when i stated criminals are going to get gun's anyway.......

    Who want's to rise up against the government? for what purpose?

    Revolt? NEVER.

  15. #435
    Registered Senior Member redarmy11's Avatar
    Posts
    7,658
    Quote Originally Posted by TimeTraveler
    Americans are not passive, we are just smart enough to know that taking it to the streets accomplishes nothing. People took it to the streets during the civil rights movement, this is not the 60s, and America is not Hungry. America is a military superpower, and if people decided to take it to the streets, they'd likely have to face tanks and military weaponry before being declared terrorists and thrown into a prison somewhere.

    Terrorism is not the answer, taking it to the streets is called hooliganism at best and terrorism at worst. Once again, it does not make the country more stable to take it to the streets. Taking it to the streets risks the destruction of the country itself. That's not in any of our best interest, we are not Hungry.

    None of us want a revolt. Stop trying to force Americans into a revolt that we don't even want. It's not going to make us feel more secure, or increase our security in any way to have a revolt. Who knows what would happen during that revolve, we could be attacked by any number of countries that want to take advantage of the chaos of a revolt. And the result of it all would likely be that America could cease to exist.

    Trust me, a revolt is not in America's best interest, or the worlds best interest. The global economy would never tolerate it, and neither would the majority of Americans. Just because you disagree with the policies of the President, it does not mean that there should be a riot. That's exactly what Al Qaeda is hoping for, Al Qaeda is hoping that Americans revolt and get into a huge riot, they want this country to collapse and so do you.
    Then you support the right to bear arms against... who? Your own people? Wouldn't they be better aimed against the government that serves you, and America, so badly? Isn't retaining a gun in order to shoot your fellow citizens a sickening distortion of the original intent?

  16. #436
    Quote Originally Posted by TimeTraveler
    You are capitalist too, you act like you are communist. You chose capitalism for the same reason we Americans choose it. You have buyers remorse now? Well there's no other system. The economy is global now, it's globally capitalist.
    I live in a social democracy actually. Despite being capitalist in nature there is plenty of room for socialist values in a society. And not surprisingly it works much better than in the USA. I do not need a gun for instance. I can walk drunk on any street of the capital in the middle of the night. I can let my children play on the street unsupervised. I do not have to fear anything.

    It's heaven.

    Quote Originally Posted by TimeTraveler
    I'm convinced you hate America. I bet you hate Americans too. You want to arm the criminals, you want there to be riots in the streets, I bet you enjoyed watching hurricane Katrina, and you like to watch Americans suffer. You want to take away our guns out of hate, not to make us more secure. It's not even rational to take away our guns to make us more secure, how exactly can you convince a person that taking their gun makes them more secure?
    You seem to be a xenophobe. You seem to hate everybody who is not american. You think everybody is out there to get you. My son is american. Why would I hate him? I do not hate leopold (although we often disagree totally to a point of annoyance). I do not hate my american friends in real life. I don't actually care about your guns. Stick your gun up your ass if you want to and give it a good shine. It's all ok to me.

    What I do protest to is when people like you defend the unnatural life you lead and proclaim it is normal. And what is worse you want to spread you way of life and your ideas into the world.

    Guns are not safe. Guns are not needed for protection. If you have a gun in holland you are obliged to lock it away. Not keep it next to your bed with a cell phone and a flashlight.

    The same in Switserland. They don't keep guns at home for self defense. They are locked away safely.

  17. #437
    Quote Originally Posted by James R
    Maybe you should move to someplace where you don't live in fear. It can't be good for your long-term health.
    That won't work. Apparently the only reason why some of us don't live in fear is because we are oblivious to the dangers around us. Ignorance and bliss and all that.....apparently.
    Last edited by Nickelodeon; 09-25-06 at 06:07 AM. Reason: Missed out important word.

  18. #438
    uniquely dreadful S.A.M.'s Avatar
    Posts
    72,822
    I'm not paranoid, look at the world, there are perhaps millions, maybe billions, who hate you at this very moment, who are thinking about ways to kill you, and thats not paranoid, thats fact.
    LOL

  19. #439
    I don't know how I'd feel if billions of people hated me.

  20. #440
    I would be worried sick because I cannot afford billions of bullets.

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