Christian disproofs + Buddha

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by Trilairian, Nov 11, 2005.

  1. Trilairian Registered Senior Member

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    To start off here are some parallels between Jesus and Buddha that I found somewhere on the web. Though I don’t remember the site every one has a reference.

    1. Buddha and Jesus all claimed to be of royal descent:
    "The ancestry of Gautama Buddha is traced from his father, Sodhodana, through various individuals and races, all of royal dignity, to Maha Sammata, the first monarch of the world...." (Doane, p. 291.)
    Jesus' genealogy consists mostly of kings (Matthew 1:6--16), and he is traced back to Adam, the first man (Luke 3:38).

    2. Both are said to have been born of a virgin, and through the holy spirit. (Thomas Maurice, History of Hindostan (London 1798), vol. 2, p. 310; Matthew 1:18.)

    3. Both were declared divine at birth:
    Following the Buddhist tradition, (Godfred Higgins, Anacalypsis: An Inquiry into the Origin of Languages, Nations and Religions (London, 1836) vol. 1, p. 157.), Matthew records that wise men proclaimed the infant Jesus divine. (Matthew 2:1, 11).

    4. "Celestial bodies" announced both men's births. (De Bunsen, pp. 22--23, 33; Matthew 2:2.)

    5. When each was born, "angels" sang in heaven:
    For Buddha, they sang: "Today, Bodhisattva is born on earth, to give joy and peace to men and Devas [angels], to shed light on the dark places, and to give sight to the blind." (Beal, p. 56.)
    For Jesus, they sang: "Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, goodwill among men" (Luke 2:14).

    6. Upon their births, they were supposedly presented with gifts:
    Buddha received costly jewels and precious substances (De Bunsen, p. 36; Amberly Viscount, An Analysis of Religious Belief (New York, 1879), p. 231.)
    Jesus received gold, frankincense, and myrrh. (Matthew 2:11).

    7. Both were supposedly miracle workers. (Muller, Science, p. 27; Matthew 4:23.)

    8. Both were "transfigured" before witnesses:
    For Buddha and Jesus, this occurred on a mountain: "A flame of light encircled Buddha's head and shone as the sun or moon." (De Bunsen, p. 45; Beal, p. 177.)
    "And [Jesus] was transfigured before them, and his face shone like the sun, and his garments became white as light" (Matthew 17:2).

    9. Both are said to be part of a trinity. (John Francis Davis, The Chinese (New York, 1836), vol. 2, p. 104; Matthew 28:19.)

    10. They all "relieved" others of sins.
    Buddha said: "Let all the sins that were committed in this world fall on me, that the world may be delivered." (Prof. Max Muller, History of Sanskrit Literature (London, 1872), p. 80.)
    Of Jesus it was said: "In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace which he lavished upon us" (Ephesians 1:7--8).

    11. Both were acclaimed as the Creator: "Buddha, the Angel messiah, was regarded as the divinely chosen and incarnate messenger, the vicar of God, and God Himself on earth." (De Bunsen, p. 33.) "[Jesus] is the image of the invisible God, the first born of all creation; for in him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions, or principalities, or powers, all things were created through him and for him" (Colossians 1:15--16).

    12. Both will "judge" the dead. (Mons Dupuis, trans., The Origin of All Religious Worship (New Orleans, 1872) p. 366; II Timothy 4:1.)

    13. Buddha's titles were:
    Savior of the World (Child, vol. 1, p. 247.)
    God of Gods (Samuel Johnson, Oriental Religions and Their Relation to Universal Religion (India) (Boston, 1872), p. 604.)
    Anointed/Christ (De Bunsen, p. 18.)
    Messiah (Ibid.)
    and Only Begotten (Ibid.)

    14. Both Buddha and Jesus were baptized in the presence of the "spirit" of God. (De Bunsen, p. 45; Matthew 3:16.)

    15. Both went to their temples at the age of twelve, where they are said to have astonished all with their wisdom. (Ibid., p. 37; Luke 2:41--48.)

    16. Both supposedly fasted in solitude for a long time: Buddha for forty--seven days and Jesus for forty. (Arthur Lillie, Buddha and Early Buddhism (London, 1881), p. 100, Matthew 4:2.)

    17. At the conclusion of their fasts, they both wandered to a fig tree. (Hans Joachim Schoeps, An Intelligent Person's Guide to the Religions of Mankind (London, 1967), p. 167; Matthew 21:18--19.)

    18. Both were about the same age when they began their public ministry:
    "When he [Buddha] went again to the garden he saw a monk who was calm, tranquil, self--possessed, serene, and dignified. The prince, determined to become such a monk, was led to make the great renunciation. At the time he was twenty--nine years of age...". (Encyclopedia Americana (New York: Rand McNally and Co., 1963), vol. 4, p. 672.)
    "Jesus, when he began his ministry, was about thirty years of age" (Luke 3:23).

    19. Both were tempted by the "devil" at the beginning of their ministry:
    To Buddha, he said: "Go not forth to adopt a religious life but return to your kingdom, and in seven days you shall become emperor of the world, riding over the four continents." (Moncure D. Conway, The Sacred Anthology (London, 1874), p. 173.)
    To Jesus, he said: "All these [kingdoms of the world] I will give you, if you fall down and worship me" (Matthew 4:9).
    Buddha answered the "devil": "Get you away from me." (De Bunsen, p.38)
    Jesus responded: "...be gone, Satan!" (Matthew 4:10).
    Both experienced the "supernatural" after the "devil" left:

    20. For Buddha: "The skies rained flowers, and delicious odors prevailed [in] the air." (Ibid.)
    For Jesus: "angels came and ministered to him" (Matthew 4:11).

    21. The multitudes required a sign from both in order that they might believe. (Muller, Science, p. 27; Matthew 16:1.)

    22. Both strove to establish a kingdom of heaven on earth. (Beal, p. x; Matthew 4:17.)

    23. Buddha "represented himself as a mere link in a long chain of enlightened teachers." (Muller, Science, p. 140.)
    Jesus said: "Think not that I have come to abolish the law, and the prophets; I have come not to abolish them but to fulfill them" (Matthew 5:17).

    24. According to the Somadeva (a Buddhist holy book), a Buddhist ascetic's eye once offended him, so he plucked it out and cast it away. (Ibid., p. 245)
    Jesus said: "If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out, and throw it away;" (Matthew 5:29).

    25. "Buddha taught that the motive of all our actions should be pity or love of our neighbor." (Ibid., p. 249)
    Jesus taught: "...love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you" (Matthew 5:44).

    26. Buddha said: "Hide your good deeds, and confess before the world the sins you have committed." (Ibid., p.28)
    Jesus said: "Beware of practicing your piety before men to be seen by them;" (Matthew 6:1) and "Therefore confess your sins one to another, and pray one for another, that you may be healed..." (James 5:16).

    27. Both are said to have known the thoughts of others:
    "By directing his mind to the thoughts of others, [Buddha] can know the thoughts of all beings." (R. Spence Hardy, The Legends and Theories of the Buddhists Compared with History and Science (London, 1866), p. 181.)
    "But Jesus, knowing their thoughts, said: `Why do you think evil in your hearts?' " (Matthew 9:4).

    28. After "healing" a man born blind, Buddha said: "The disease of this man originates in his sinful actions in former times." (Prof. Max Muller, ed., Sacred Books of the East (Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1879--1910), vol. 21, p. 129f.)
    "As [Jesus] passed by, he saw a man blind from his birth. And his disciples said to him: `Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?' " (John 9:1--2).

    29. Both were itinerant preachers with a close group of trustees within a larger group of disciples. (James Hastings, ed., Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics (New York: Edinburgh T. & T. Clark, 1918), vol. 6, p. 883; Matthew 26:20.)

    30. Both demanded that their disciples renounce all worldly possessions. (Hardy, Monachism, p. 6; Luke 14:33.)

    31. "The number of the disciples rapidly increased, and Gautama sent forth his monks on missionary tours hither and thither, bidding them wander everywhere, preaching the doctrine, and teaching men to order their lives with self--restraint, simplicity, and charity." (Hastings, vol. 6, p.883)
    "And [Jesus] called to him the twelve [apostles], and began to send them out two by two. So they went out and preached that men should repent" (Mark 6:7, 12).

    32. Both had a disciple who "walked" on water:
    To convert skeptical villagers, Buddha showed them his disciple walking across a river without sinking. (Lillie, p. 140)
    "He said: `Come.' So Peter got out of the boat and walked on the water and came to Jesus, but when he saw the wind, he was afraid, and beginning to sink he cried out: `Lord, save me!' " (Matthew 14:29--30).

    33. "One day Ananda, the disciple of Buddha, after a long walk in the country, meets with Matangi, a woman of the low caste of the Kandalas, near a well, and asks her for some water. She tells him what she is, and that she must not come near him. But he replies: `My sister, I ask not for your caste or your family, I ask only for a drought of water. She afterwards became a disciple of Buddha." (Muller, Science, p. 243)
    "There came a woman of Samaria to draw water. Jesus said to her: `Give me a drink.' For his disciples had gone away into the city to buy food. The Samaritan woman said to him: `How is it that you, a Jew, ask a drink of me, a woman of Samaria?' For Jews have no dealings with Samaritans" (John 4:7--9).

    34. Each repeated a question three times:
    "The Buddha next addressed the bhikkhus and requested them three times to ask him if they had any doubt or question that they wished clarified, but they all remained silent." (Encyclopedia Britannica (New York: William and Helen Benton, 1974), vol. 2, p. 373.)
    "[Jesus] said to him the third time: `Simon, son of John, do you love me?' Peter was grieved because he said to him the third time: `Do you love me?'" (John 21:17).

    35. Both received similar receptions:
    "The people swept the pathway, the gods strewed flowers on the pathway and branches of the coral tree, the men bore branches of all manner of trees, and the Bodhisattva Sumedha spread his garments in the mire, [and] men and gods shouted: `All hail.' " (Hardy, Legends, p.134)
    "And they brought the colt to Jesus, and threw their garments on it; and he sat on it. And many spread their garments on the road, and others spread leafy branches which they had cut from the fields" (Mark 11:7--8).
    Both had an archival:

    36. "[Buddha's] chief rival was Devadatta, a cousin of the Buddha, who is represented as being jealous of his influence and popularity, and as repeatedly seeking to compass his death." (Hastings, vol. 6, p.883)
    "While [Jesus] was still speaking, Judas came, one of the twelve, and with him a great crowd with swords and clubs, from the chief priests and the elders of the people. Now the betrayer had given them a sign, saying: `The one I shall kiss is the man; seize him!' And he came up to Jesus at once, and said: `Hail, Master!' And he kissed him" (Matthew 26:47--49).

    37. Before his death, Buddha said to his disciple: "Ananda, when I am gone, you must not think there is no Buddha; the discourses I have delivered, and the precepts I have enjoined, must be my successors, or representatives, and be to you as Buddha." (Hardy, Eastern Monachism (London, 1860), p. 230.)
    Before his "ascension," Jesus said to his disciples: "Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you; and, lo, I am with you always, to the close of the age" (Matthew 28:19--20).

    38. When Buddha died: "The coverings of [his] body unrolled themselves, and the lid of his coffin was opened by supernatural powers." (De Bunsen, p. 49.)
    When Jesus died: "And behold, there was a great earthquake; for an angel of the L--rd descended from heaven and came and rolled back the stone, and sat upon it" (Matthew 28:2).

    39. "In the year 217 B.C. Buddhist missionaries were imprisoned for preaching; but an angel, genie or spirit came and opened the prison door, and liberated them." (Thomas Thornton, A History of China from the Earliest Records to the Treaty with Great Britain in 1842 (London, 1844), vol. 1, p. 341.)
    "They arrested the apostles and put them in the common prison. But at night an angel of the L--rd opened the prison doors and brought them out" (Acts 5:18--19).

    40. Both men's disciples are said to have been miracle workers. (Maria L. Child, The Progress of Religious Ideas Through Successive Ages (New York, 1855)vol. 1, p. 229, Acts 3:6--8.)

    The reason that there are so many parallels is obvious given the following origins of modern Christianity which no one has as yet provided a valid rebuttal: Both characters were given aspects of their stories from the same source, Horus of Egyptian religion.

    Amen was originally a deity associated with the power of creation. Later priests through syncretism made him one with Ra claiming that Amen was a deity of power for which Ra and Amen would indwell each other as Amen-Ra. In one of many religious reformations, Horus replaced Ra as the sun god and Amen was said to indwell with Osiris. His fathers name was then Osiris-Amen or O' Amen for short. Horus was the reincarnation of Osiris, one with the father and so the Osiris-Amen title also applies to him. So at the beginning of prayer a Christian prays to Osiris, O' Amen, father and at the end of prayer invokes the "true" name Amen of his son Jesus, who was Horus who is also O' Amen being one with the father saying, in the name of thy son Amen. The Hebrew word amen(let it so be) wouldn't be invoked as a deity would in this manner. So the next time you Christian folk hear something you really like and want to exclaim AMEN know that you are really exclaiming a praise to Osiris.

    On another note, in much the same way as Amen-Ra or Osiris-Amen were representative of different deities said to indwell each other as a form of syncretism the Israelites did the same thing with El, one of their gods prior to Hezekiah and Josiah's religious reformations that created monotheism. For example Elohim is plural for the gods of El. The indwelling of El with Osiris is El-Osiris and the etymology then goes El-Azarus, Lazaros whom was risen from the dead in three days as was Osiris.

    Christianity didn’t just incorporate paganism. Christianity is paganism ultimately traceable to Egyptian religion. Paganism meaning religion of the villagers. This is what gave birth to modern Christianity:
    King Herod is an actual historical figure who lived about 73 BC - 4 BC. His death occurred at the beginning of a Passover that was some time preceded by a lunar eclipse that happened the night he executed Rabbis Judas and Matthias and their pupils who had smashed the golden bird symbol for Rome which he had placed on the temple he had restored. This is according to the historian, Joseph Ben Matthias also known as Flavius Josephus (37/38 AD --around 100 AD).
    Ernest Martin located a full eclipse on January 10, 1 BC that occurred 12 1/2 weeks prior to Passover. However, Herod's successors Antipas, Philip, and Archelaus all appear to have taken their reigns in 4 BC and the chronology of datable events in the Roman Empire best fit with Josephus' description of the circumstances of Herod's death given a death date of 4 BC. There was a 40% partial eclipse March 13, 4 BC which would have been difficult to see, but could have possibly been calculated in those days and either seen or calculated, used by Josephus to reference the death date.
    Jupiter(the planet of royalty) and Saturn(protector of Israel) underwent three conjunctions in 7 BC in the constellation Pisces (associated by ancient Babylonian or Persian magi with the nation of Israel), not of which would have appeared as a bright star, but the astronomical events would have caught the eye of any attentive magi of the time and as their definition of a star would have differed from the scientific definition of today, they may have referred to the astronomical events as stars. The two planets were found again in the constellation Pisces as well as Mars on Feb 6, 6 BC.
    Michael Molnar found that Jupiter underwent an occultation with the moon in the constellation Aries on April 17, 6 BC and again on December 19, 6 BC. Aries is a ram/lamb which would be associated with Israel due to their sacrifices or with Jesus later by Christians. The April 17 occultation occurred near the sun during the day and wouldn't have been seen, but given greater attention due to the previous astronomical events any good magi following Jupiter and tracking the moon would have known that this would occur and that on April 17 when this would occur, it would be "in the east". August 23 Jupiter reversed its apparent motion and "went before" anyone following it until it "stood over" being stationary in the transition of its apparent motion right on the second occultation of December 19.
    William's Comet Catalog of 1871 identifies a comet visible in 5 BC. It was visible from Mar 10 to Apr 27. Such a comet would disappear and reappear as it moved behind the sun which does correspond to Matthew witch inferred that it did so.
    Finally, Chinese astronomers recorded a new star, a nova, in the constellation Capricorn visible March to April of 5 BC, for over 70 days.
    Herod was an evil warmongering king that had many of his own family killed including two of his sons Aristobulus in 7 BC and Antipater in 4 BC. The later may also have sought the life of any prophesied king of Israel accounting for Matthew’s statement that those who had sought the life of Jesus had died.
    However, the slaughter of the babies under two years by Herod old has no basis in history. It is utterly mythical and can be traced back to Krishna, another former Christ story.
    There was also no great taxation of Israel wherein folks had to return to their birthplaces and the only census by Quirinius when he was the actual governor of Syria was conducted in (6 - 7)AD. On the other hand he did established a seat of government in Syria, including Palestine, from 10 BC to 7 BC in which he would have been responsible for the census of Romans, not Jews, that took place in 7 BC. The new testament gives two contradictory genealogies for Joseph. If they are fictitious and Joseph was a Roman then he could have taken part in a census, but such a census still would not have required the participants to return to their homeland and would have been finished prior to the (6-5)BC astronomical events. Apparently the nativity is also a fiction. It can be traced to the Egyptian mythology where Meh(Meri, Mary) whose consort was Seb (lord or god - Seb, Yo-Seb, Joseph) had Horus in a cave or manger amongst the beasts under a star, were visited by three magi bearing gifts, and then fled from the serpent Herrut.
    It appears that someone drawing on the similarity between the evil of Herrut and the evil of Herod and the similarity of their names and given the astrological signs decided to fabricate a reason that such a Horus/Krishna/Christ type being would be born amongst beasts about that time. Recalling that there was a census conducted around that time and such were related to taxes, the Horus story was recreated in terms of an Israeli Messiah born in a manger due to no room during a tax. Here we find the birth of modern Christianity.
    Originally Mehet-Weret, Nut, and Hathor were separate cow goddesses. Mehet-Weret was the Nile goddess, Hathor was the mother of Horus, and Nut was the mother of Ra. Mythically the Nile was connected to the sky through the underworld. Mehet-Weret would therefor be the one who would help the pharaoh and Ra reach the sky. In a way it makes sense that they would think this because the rainwater must get up there somehow. For this assistance Mehet-Weret became known as the right eye of Ra. Nut, being the mother of Ra was thought to give daily birth to the sun, but since Mehet-Weret was also thought to deliver Ra the sun god to the sky, through syncretism the identity of Nut was absorbed into Mehet-Weret. The name of Mehet-Weret changed from one generation to another. The etymology down to the book of the dead was
    .................................................. ......Mehet-Weret
    ................................Mehetweret........ .............................Mehit-Weret
    .................................................. ......................................Mehitwer
    ................................Mehueret.......... ...............................Methyer
    ................................Mehturt
    ................................Meh-Urt
    and from there to the mother and wife of Jesus and possibly to Miriam celebration leader:
    ................................Meh
    ................................Meri
    ..Mary moth. of Jesus,..Mary Magdalene,.....Miriam(Exodus 15:20)
    Horus, sun of Hathor inherits the sun from Ra, and in doing so Meh-Urt who was known as the right eye of Ra became the right Eye of Horus, but also Nut who was absorbed into Meh-Urt gave birth to the sun daily so Meh-Urt then became the birth mother of Horus who was then the sun god and the identity of Hathor was then absorbed into Meh-Urt as well through syncretism. Since Meh-Urt was Horus's right eye which eye represented the sun, the moon then was represented by Horus's left eye and his adoptive father Seb became the speckled cow, the left eye of Horus in the book of the dead, because he was consort of Meh-Urt.
    Meh-Urt becomes Mary through etymology and Yo-Seb becomes Joseph just the same. So we know where Mary came from and we know were Joseph came from and we know that the birth of modern Christianity was inspired by astronomical events near the end of the life of Herod that struck a resemblance in someone’s mind to Herrut. So next lets look at how Horus became Jesus.
    It isn’t impossible that there was an actual person whose name would have been Yeshua that served as an inspiration for modern Christianity. In fact I think that this would have been the case as Yeshua would have been a common name and given the previous events the people would have been on the look out for their expected Messiah in such an extent that it became a self fulfilling prophesy. I think that Yeshua saw the parallel between the Meh-Horus-Osiris deities and Ashera-Yahweh-El and realizing then the Egyptian influence on Judah’s own religion decided to recreate the religion with himself as Yahweh/Horus. For what we know now is that the myth had it that El and Ashera were consorts who gave birth to one of the baals, we don’t know who for sure. But, Yahweh was originally a baal and Ashera also became his consort. It looks like this particular baal son was then Yahweh. This seems to strike a parallel with Meh-Horus-Osiris. It wouldn’t be the first time Israel adopted Egyptian religion. Even seven of the ten commandments were taken from the book of the Dead.
    Osiris was the spouse of Isis in the Ennead. Set(a gay female goddess probably corresponding to Satan) Kill's Osiris who is resurrected with the magic of Isis(who eventually corresponds to the presence of Mary Magdalene at the resurrection of Jesus). Before her magic wore off and he returned to the land of the dead she conceives Horus(the son of god) by Osiris(the heavenly father). Through syncretism Meh becomes Isis. Since Osiris returns to the dead prior to birth it makes it possible for Horus to be the reincarnation of the father. Thus the son became one with the father god which is the literal meaning of the word atonement. Osiris-Horus then was the life-death-rebirth deity celebrated at the time of the yearly harvest. Horus being Osiris and therefore both the husband and son of Isis who absorbed the identity of Meh is why Mary the mother of Jesus and Mary Magdalene the wife of Jesus had the same name. It appears that Isis, Horus, and Osiris was the for runner then of both the Israelites Ashera-Yahweh-El and of the Christian trinity where Meh/Isis is now replaced by the holy spirit which was not worshipped in early Christianity back when Mary was. In fact some religions still worship/prayto Mary. I think she got written out as a Goddess at the time of the Nicene creed.
    Horus had some titles that may sound familiar as well: The lamb, the light of the world, the good shepherd, the way, the truth, the life, the anointed one - which is Christos in Greek. As you may have noticed certain God's identities seemed to be absorbed by others. This was apparently a common political practice intended to unify peoples belief systems which is called syncretism. The Egyptian dying rising godman mythology spread like wildfire to surrounding regions through syncretism and so many godman cults shared parallels with Osiris and therefore with Jesus who was a syncretism of these religions that the common dying rising godman theme is called just Osiris-Dionysus. If Jesus was an actual man and not just a complete political fabrication through syncretism I find it to be too much a coincidence that the place Mary was supposed to have fled was Egypt itself wherein if it was a place he spent any later portion of his life in he would have been free to explore these religions and then institute such in his homeland later in life.
    When Set killed Osiris she broke his body into pieces and scattered them across the land. Isis response was the same as Mary Magdalene, weeping that they had taken her lord and she knew not where they put him. After tracking down the pieces she placed him in a coffin where he remained enclosed for three days leading to the Egyptian institution of baptism wherein one is enclosed by water. The Egyptians then instituted a sacrament. The broken bread and wine was made into bits of the broken body and blood of Osiris. The resurrecting magic of Isis would then apply to those who took the sacrament to give them eternal life after death. So titles of Horus being Osiris included the way and the life and no one would come to the father but by him.
    Horus was a sun god. The sun god or the sun was represented by many by the Celtic cross which may go back as much as 10 thousand years having been originally an actual device used to navigate based on shadows case by it from the sun. So early crucifixions were probably and actual human sacrifice to the sun god. So Horus Christo(Christo was a title for Horus) variations such as Harry Krishna were sometimes depicted as an ascending person in a crucified posture corresponding to a symbol for the rising sun. Krishna is at times depicted as Crucified with an arrow(which is a small spear) piercing his torso the same as Yeshua-Horus(Yes-us, Jesus). As far as I can tell the only thing that is unique about the Jesus resurrection -ascension is that he had a crown of thorns. Horus in particular is often depicted as a Hawk or *Dove* with wings spread to form of a cross. This explains the Dove in the Jesus Baptism story.
    Here are a LOT of other parallels Jesus got from Horus.
    http://www.theosophical.ca/AncientEgyptAppendix.htm
    Ever wonder what Jesus middle name was as in Jesus H. Christ?
    The popular Christian apology has it that the H comes from the H in
    IHC
    and that this is derived from
    IHS
    which are then claimed as a Greek abbreviation for Jesus. Iota Eta Sigma Omicron Upsilon Sigma. Now here is the pagan origin:
    IHS
    I = ISIS
    H = Horus
    S = Seb
    This is then the portrait of Horus and H does stand for ***Horus***
    If you combine the Yes from Yes-ua with the us from Hor-us you do get Jesus as it would be said today. It appears the name Jesus was a transliteration specifically and carefully chosen to reflect Horus in the end and in the abbreviation as well as to yield a Greek Gematria of 888.
    So next time you think of swearing and exclaiming Jesus H. Christ you can do it right and exclaim Jesus HORUS Christ!
    The evidence is overwhelming, but I’ll be flexible and at first say this seems to leave me with two possible conclusions.
    1. The Jesus story is a complete rip off of what is ultimately Egyptian mythology and modern Christianity is an evolution of paganism based on Catholicism, nothing more than a collection of the pagan religions of Osiris-Dionysis.
    2. All this correspondence was somehow prophetic.
    Having been generous with the latter I will say that it seems ludicrous to believe that the what Christianity holds as the opponents of Israel or God, Egypt, would receive such detailed revelation when those which modern Christianity proposes were the chosen of God, Judaism, did not. You may propose Abraham who was supposedly a prophet in Egypt or a descendent down to Moses instigated all this, but this level of prophetic correspondence is not biblically founded. I must therefore conclude that the weight of evidence is for the first conclusion, and where the weight of evidence lay is the only rational conclusion on which to base my faith.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2005
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  3. water the sea Registered Senior Member

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    So what? What is your point with this "disproval"?
    If you don't want to believe something, then you don't have to. It's that easy.
     
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  5. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    If you don't want to believe something, then you don't have to. It's that easy.

    You believe in Santa Claus, don't you?
     
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  7. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    There are parallels between the philosophy of Jesus and Buddha, but few of the ones you mentioned are very interesting or credible, with the possible exception of the fasting.

    Both left normal society for spiritual cultivation, they had a revelation, and preached to the masses. Both postulated that our separateness from the devine or the all is an illusion. Both advocated a compassionate set of moral values. There is a great book about this, I'll try and find the title.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2005
  8. water the sea Registered Senior Member

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    Good old Q ...
     
  9. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    I believe in Santa.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  10. Trilairian Registered Senior Member

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    Its not just philosophy that parallels. There is too much to be coincidence. Both stories had drawn characteristics from a common source. They both ultimately stole parts of the Horus story.
     
  11. Trilairian Registered Senior Member

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    Also this wouldn't have been the first time. Krishna, and even Tutankhamun the latter of which is an actual historical figure did the same. This is what led Ahmed Osman to the conclusion that Yeshua/Jesus was derived from the Joshua under Moses character and that he was actually Tutankhamun.
     
  12. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    54,036
    Perhaps the Horus story is just another reflection of human nature, like Joseph Cambell's Hero With A Thousand Faces. Ultimately, the mythology about (not of) Jesus and Buddha isn't the vital essence of their teaching.
     
  13. Trilairian Registered Senior Member

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    I am discussing their historical invalidity, not what they taught. I believe more of what Jesus taught than any Christian I know. Unfortunately dressing up your philosophical message of morality with a false mythology ultimately serves to undermine the message itself.
     
  14. water the sea Registered Senior Member

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    What would be a true mythology?

    (A contradiction in terms ...)
     
  15. Trilairian Registered Senior Member

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    Yes, the same as a true religion.
     
  16. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    Most mythology is false, but it's like an interesting story that entertains people. It's the advertising for a religion before they had TV. You can't take it seriously.

    They say that there was no one person called Lao Tse, which only means venerable old man in Chinese, but that doesn't take away from the message one iota.
     
  17. Trilairian Registered Senior Member

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    It undermines the message. If the entire story on how a message was received was a lie then how can you trust the message itself? If you want to teach the Jesus message then teach the Jesus message, but don't perpetuate the lie that places God almighty being born as a human durring the reign of Herod.
     
  18. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    There's a difference between a lie and a myth.
     
  19. Medicine*Woman Jesus: Mythstory--Not History! Valued Senior Member

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    *************
    M*W: Do myths eventually become lies?

    Do lies eventually become myths?

    Does truth eventually become myth?

    Does myth eventually become truth?

    Does truth eventually remain truth?

    Can any of this be proven?
     
  20. Trilairian Registered Senior Member

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    Yeah I guess a myth is a subset of lies.
     
  21. water the sea Registered Senior Member

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    Do you know the truth?
    What is it?
     
  22. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    20,855
    Do you know the truth?
    What is it?


    Simple, we exist. What more truth do you need?
     
  23. c7ityi_ Registered Senior Member

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    1,924
    You people should be nice or santa won't give you any presents, instead he will give you suffering. Yes, santa does exist, he lives in our souls and gives spiritual gifts (like happiness) to us if we are nice.

    Most mythology is true.
     

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