10-30-01, 08:25 AM #241
Point: your ability to understandSo am I too understand that due to the complexities of conspiracies within our political & economic infrastructures, that most of the sheepole are willing to lay down & die, sacrifice their constitutional rights under a democratic-republican, or socialistic society to those who would impose, impede, or threaten them by Illegal means of Inimante domain a such? If you as a “Free Society” so to speak do not believe that you are being fooled by the biggest scam of the century, than can only I feel pity for those who.
Time, why does it matter to you what I or anyone else believes? Think about it... You've agreed (more or less) that everyone has their own perceptions. Thus, anyone--including you--wishing to claim anything can do so from now to eternity. It won't matter because they/you are never going to be believed by all. I won't be believed, you won't, nor will thecurly1... Furthermore, if so many are hopelessly fixed in their blindnesses, why bother? It's a little like beating your head up against a brick wall, isn't it?
I don't have much further to say, but if you are listening--if you are capable of understanding this much of someone else's view--please be advised that you are wasting your time by making the assumptions you have so far, and by trying to engage Counterbalance in a such a futile debate. It just ain't gonna happen, dude.
What's wrong with debate? Nothing. But what's the point of any debate or discussion when one party has already condemned the other, and has claimed (in various ways) to know what the "opposition" thinks, feels, believes, perceives--whatever. Rather a waste of time, Time...
For all of your (or other's) claims about really "knowing" what's going on out there, you're missing some very basic points about mankind and its history. About the nature of people in general. (About how to communicate when you want to be taken seriously. ) You're loaded for bear, but aiming at the wrong targets--and with the wrong ammo.
You are obviously a creative and intelligent individual. No need for me to make any unwarranted assumptions about that--you've amply demonstrated these qualities. Rather than assume that you will never be able to see the world, mankind--or America--in any other way, I choose to hope (hey, it's free!) that over time you will come to see more of the bigger picture, rather than persist in investing so much "time" and energy in a few very narrow and tainted views. After all, with so many people having so many different viewpoints, the views of those who support these conspiracy theories are but one part of the overall collection, right? (Rhetorical)
Have I assumed too much about your view? I don't think so. You've shared plenty of your anti-man outlook. Actions typically speak louder than words, but your words are clear for the most part, and your ability to say what you mean doesn't appear to be lacking.
Find a way to be at peace.
10-30-01, 10:59 AM #242
People who sacrafice civil liberties for security deserve none.
10-30-01, 10:02 PM #243
I'll concede with these thoughts in mind, we are living in the last days, and they are truly dangerous times to be living in indeed, wicked things have forever left their scars upon us, yet even more wicked things this way are comming, and in spite of our most noble attemps to combat against this hideous evil, I fear it will still come, and that the worst has yet to arrive.
10-31-01, 05:39 PM #244
[QUOTE]Originally posted by CounslerCoffee
Learn your history before you decide to use it to prove a point because the US is all good.
I do not recall ANY country being all good. We all, as individuals and as nations have responsibilities.
The USA is a great country for many reasons - all of which I would hate to see diminished. I feel the same way about my nation - Great Britain.
I am not blindly patriotic. The anti-vietnam peace movement was accused of being anti-american when it first emerged. But it actually proved to raise a consciousness that saved US soldiers in the end.
In a truly democratic country we should be able to openly criticise our governments and their actions - in fact thats part of whats being actually defended anyway.
To say that the USA has had nothing to do with causing any of the suffering in the world shows your own lack of understanding of history. I have signed petitions against some of the activities of your government and I will continue to do so if I don't agree with what they do - just as I will with my own.
If you are unaware of some of the heartless involvement of your countries leaders - go do some research of your own - you won't believe anything I say.
The trouble with a lot of the people on here mouthing their ( often macho ) opinions is that they seem to think that the only reason people would have anything against the USA is because they are born EVIL and that they simply like being terrorists. Its easier to digest that kind of cosy thinking = and it helps leaders to get on TV 'talking tough'.
The 'if you aren't with us you're against us' mentality and the simple 'good versus evil' ranting is just going to make the world an even more dangerous place than it already is.
The USA is capable of doing so much more. I wish it would do it.
They could start by kicking the doors down of a few rich florida-living drug-barons who made money drug-running and milking the arms support in places like central America for starters. yeah! Lets have a proper war on terrorism. And all the CIA members who had links with them.
Bush said terrorists had no regard for the 'sanctity of human life'.
If there was a billion dollars in a suitcase or an oil well in those Afghani villages - they would bomb more carefully than if there was a little girl near there. What comes first in value is so obvious.
Killing civilian people and children is morally wrong and will make you more enemies - guaranteed. How many is the USA prepared to kill?
Stop funding terrorism.
Stop arming terrorists.
Stop training terrorists.
Stop giving terrorists reasons to exist.
Then we might we get less hassle from them.
And less tragedy.
Down with Osamar Bin Laden.
Down with US and UK terrorist supporters.
Down with bombing people who are just trying to feed their kids.
Down with the arms trade.
Down with blind and stupid, self-destructive patriotism.
10-31-01, 07:36 PM #245
Tell these guys they shoiuld be nominated for the FICTION Pulitzer prize.
No, I still don't believe you. I don't believe these are credible sources, about the infiltration, and et cetra.
Let's get real the gov't would do this to their own people.
P.S. Time you never replied my past comment: if these groups are so powerful and indeed do exist, why would they let a small government like the Taliban dictate their policy, i.e. the supposed pipeline.
After all you claim these guys have control over the most powerful nations on Earth.
You see now that the theory has unraveled itself.
10-31-01, 08:02 PM #246
Just an afterthought... not a challenge...and in spite of our most noble attemps to combat against this hideous evil, I fear it will still come, and that the worst has yet to arrive.
Yet what good will it do anyone to live their Life in fear? Fear can be like a pair of 'clip-on' shades for one's eye-glasses, for one's view. Tinting and tainting. How you see things, how you digest it all, how you handle it, how you 'react' to it...
If we're in our last days I prefer to fill mine with finer thoughts, even while remaining realistic. When my time to die comes, I hope my heart and mind are not cluttered with fear, but with the knowledge that I lived Life to the fullest and by my own standards.
Whoever originally came up with this quote spoke truth:
"There is nothing to fear but fear itself."
Apologies for the interruption.
10-31-01, 08:35 PM #247
I think you will find that it is Russia that want's the pipeline,so that it can sell its oil,& the Saudi's have been backing the Talliban as they do not want the pipeline,as it would bring down the price of there oil.
Nothing to do with America,as all of the anti party would like us to believe.
Have a look at this!
Last edited by odin; 10-31-01 at 08:50 PM.
10-31-01, 08:53 PM #248
"The only thing we have to fear is fear itself."
Franklin D. Roosevelt, First inaugural address
Courtesy of: http://www.quoteland.com/
11-01-01, 09:05 AM #249
We began carpet bombing of Taliban locations in Afghanistan. The next step will be heavier troop movement of U.S./UK military personnel. Rooting them out in their caves and tunnels. Now we will see the resolve of the Taliban and there supporters. Now we will see who believes in what they stand for!
11-01-01, 09:31 AM #250
I see a lot of folks with doubts as to what our millatry objectives are in afganistan, i also see a few blind patriots in the group too.
If you think america is without sin then your mind is already lost to the propaganda machine and nothing or noone can help you.
If your mind is open to the idea that every nation on earth has commited atrocities then you are more likly to stumble upon the truth.
Was that time fellow implying that america was behind the terror attacks of sept11?
That is a silly idea isnt it?
Did someone say missile defense program?
Dont jump on me yet folks im only trying to broaden your view on such things, so if we turned this conflic around and afganistan was the powerful nation and america was poor and without food/water/shelter how would americans react to afgani planes dropping food with huge afgan flags all over it?
Sorry did someone say humiliating?
Let me put something of my view across, the objective lined out by both UK and US governments is to displace power from a country's standing government, fair enough but what are you going to replace it with?
The norther alliance?
If they take power in afganistan the region will never see peace as muslims from other factions (the taliban but to name one) will see it as a western invastion on there soil (much as americans saw the destruction of the WTC as a personnal attack) and will fight to the last man left alive to take it back.
When they eventually kill ossma bin ladden there going to have to do the biggest propoganda event of all time to stop the guy becoming a myrta.
Lets face it that guy will never stand trial for the terror attacks of september the 11th just in case an international tribunal finds him "not gulity".
This all comes around again and we sat talking about "due process" which is either used or not used depending on weather it suites the governments needs.
Sorry did someone say democracy?
11-01-01, 10:45 AM #251
Benji ...... how would americans react to afgani planes dropping food with huge afgan flags all over it?
11-01-01, 11:19 AM #252
11-01-01, 12:05 PM #253
Doubt that any of our 'decision makers' were either knowledgeable nor sensitive enough to consider it.
But what the hell, they'd be glad to eat cat food if we dropped it on them. Some of our oldsters do pretty well surviving on it.
11-01-01, 02:37 PM #254
Senator Rockefeller answers questions at news conference following the 100-0 passage of the Senate Aviation Security Bill.
(October 11, 2001)
Click "Legislative Center"--Senate Veterans Affairs Committee --John D. Rockefeller, WV (More Interesting News From Capital Hill"
Has anyone read this one yet?
Another question is why are our bombings moreso accurate around oil fields than innocent bystanders/victims?
"Capital Hill" doesn't "Capital" refer to economic resources?
now why would oil wells be so important over human lives?
(as if it has to do with anything) ...Coincidence?
Last edited by TIME02112; 11-01-01 at 10:19 PM.
11-01-01, 04:31 PM #255
Who is Heinlein?
Last edited by TIME02112; 11-01-01 at 10:18 PM.
11-01-01, 11:22 PM #256
Re: Counterbalance ...Originally posted by Chagur
"The only thing we have to fear is fear itself."
Franklin D. Roosevelt, First inaugural address
Courtesy of: http://www.quoteland.com/
A vague memory had me thinking it was first said by a well-known Roman--who, apparently, is not so well-known to me any longer! Probably mistaken.
Appreciate the link.
11-01-01, 11:26 PM #257Originally posted by TIME02112
Who is Heinlein?
Robert A. Heinlein?
11-02-01, 10:00 AM #258
Let them eat ...
Seems that unexploded bomblettes (from the cluster bombs we've started using) are the same color as the 'food' packets we've been dropping ... and have been since it caused a bit of a problem in Kosovo!
Great planning ... along with the bombing, twice, of Red Cross relief supplies.
Do you need any more proof that we're a 'caring, sharing nation'?
11-13-01, 09:58 PM #259
I would bet on Pres. Busch's own unruly cabinet "Smith & Jones" of military shadow GVT before blaming "Abdul Osmana & Co." Why? think about it for a moment they want this damned martial law so badly they won't stop at nothing including creating an enemy to pose a threat so they can pen everyone inside the boarders so tight they can put the squeeze on their civil liberties in exchang to aleveate their fear by providing security, a wolfe in sheep's clothing, a trojan horse to get the public to accept the idea they need this out of fear they gain being tricked into bying into this hoax!
If they declare martial law outright, the people would generate too much civil unrest & riotry, but if you sell them on the idea of a threat, slowly get them to allow the troops to gather around first in airports, then bridges, and latter schools, colleges & Universities, community centers, National monuments, & forests, parks & etc. after it's all said & done, you could latter tell the public that "Oh by the way, we're officialy declaring martial law" or better yet why bother, it would be redundant!
They still get their way either way you look at it, they win, the people LOOSE! they being shadow GVT & NWO not the lie they try to shove down your neck!
it's the oldest trick in the book, it's like the crooked security companies scam you to buy their contract by breaking & entering, stealing & vandalizing your property and paying thugs to do this to create a threat that terrorizes you enough to buy into this lie!
I really am not closed to dismiss this as a good possibility that the same thing is going on in the good US of A-----------
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11-15-01, 07:51 PM #260
Why do our own governments want to hurt us?
That's what I gather you are saying Time.