Hatfields & McCoys

Discussion in 'Art & Culture' started by KilljoyKlown, May 31, 2012.

  1. KilljoyKlown Whatever Valued Senior Member

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    Anybody else watching this series? I can't imagine any situation much sadder than two families trying to kill each other off. How can such wrong thinking like that happen? They seem like normal intelligent people except for the hatred they have for each other. Just because the heads of each family hate each other, why should the rest of the family have to suffer for it?
     
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  3. Epictetus here & now Registered Senior Member

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    Re: Romeo & Juliet. Why indeed.
     
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  5. Syzygys As a mother, I am telling you Valued Senior Member

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    Well, I enjoyed the mini series. They were pretty close to facts too. I also learnt that the Hatfields were the assholes and mostly responsible for the hostilities. If one wants to argue, the Hatfields started it twice (murder and stolen pig), they overdid the justice part and also killed innocents several times. They also killed bounty hunters, who were legally allowed to hunt bounty. Oh yes, the Hatfileds also killed unarmed prisoners.

    So if we have to put the blame, I would say 80% Hatfields, 20% McCoys.

    Most of the killings on the other side was done by a not even McCoy, federal Marshal Phillip. He actually presented the law and mostly acted according to it... The shooting in the bar (2 dead) was entirely justified.
     
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  7. Buddha12 Valued Senior Member

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    As with most families the head of the house usually sets the rules for what's going on inside the family and what it does, where it goes and what to believe in. Since the family is obligated, because they are family I guess, they must adhere to what their family leader tells them or they become the "black sheep" of the family and are usually cast adrift into the sea of humanity without regards of what becomes of them. So if the family would try to take away the right of its leader because they think he/she is wrong they are the ones who are looked at as the ones who aren't thinking right for going against the family ways is paramount to killing one of them.

    Today this isn't as common as it once was because of this incident so we can learn from others mistakes. We can now say that family members are wrong at times and can adjust our family relations as we need to. Of course this isn't taken well but we are seeing that sometimes we are wrong and our families are right but we must keep an open mind for that to take place.
     
  8. KilljoyKlown Whatever Valued Senior Member

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    Things seemed to get really serious when the 3 McCoy sons killed the Hatfield brother, and the Hatfields rounded them up and executed them. I had the feeling that had they turned them over to the law, justice would not have happened and apparently so did old man Hatfield.
     
  9. KilljoyKlown Whatever Valued Senior Member

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    I think a lot depends how strong law enforcement is. If law enforcement is weak then the families feel a great deal more pressure to take matters into their own hands. This really seemed to be the case which allowed these two families to get out of control with each other.
     
  10. Syzygys As a mother, I am telling you Valued Senior Member

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    I see his point, but they still overdid the justice part, after all only one guy shot Ellison. (although the other 2 knifed him) So assuming that the bullet wound killed him, if they execute the shooter and let's say beat up the other 2, that would have been even. Painwise, loosing 3 sons is way worse than losing a brother.

    Also, those 3 were probably drunk (I would say Ellison too), but old Hatfield did it with cold blood. Oh yes, and they got them from the constable basicly threatening the men of the law, another strike against them.

    It looked like the main instigator of the whole feud was Uncle Jim Hatfield. The New Year's Eve massacre was lead by him....
     
  11. KilljoyKlown Whatever Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, they should have left them with the law, and also backed up the law with Hatfield men to prevent the McCoys from freeing them. But no, all 3 episodes showed many bad decisions on both sides. What were they thinking would happen? Oh! they weren't thinking.
     
  12. Asguard Kiss my dark side Valued Senior Member

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    Umm what about 2 countries trying to kill eachother off? Or one group of people trying to exterminate another? Or half the world trying to kill the other half
     
  13. KilljoyKlown Whatever Valued Senior Member

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    Good question. Sometimes humans are slow learners.
     
  14. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

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    You have hit upon the REAL crux of the matter: The absolute and unquestioning obedience to the leader of the family. In old clans from that time period in the US - and STILL in other parts of the world even today! - no one ever challenged the head of the family. Not if they wanted to survive, that is. You may have noticed in this story that the leader of the Hatfield clan, played by Costner, was fully prepared to kill one of his own sons when he thought that son had betrayed an uncle.

    Keep in mind that a CLAN is a very extreme form of family. And the head of the clan is much, much more than just a leader - he is the Supreme Lawmaker of the bunch. His will IS the law and it stands above everything else. It was often considered a capital crime to even question what he ordered.
     
  15. Syzygys As a mother, I am telling you Valued Senior Member

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    Well, this was back country, and several times there were no witnesses. 2 of the McCoys actually got out of jail because the murder was called self defense, although it could have been anything.

    So when there is a dead person found in the woods with one bullet, that is one thing, it could have been accident, self defense, whatever. But when a bunch of guys execute not one but 3, that is a bit overdoing it.(and hard to deny)

    Not to mention the siege, that was way out of proportion...They were shooting at and burning the roof above women and children...
     
  16. Syzygys As a mother, I am telling you Valued Senior Member

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  17. KilljoyKlown Whatever Valued Senior Member

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    Had they not put the brain impaired kid to guard the back, none of that shit would have happened. What were they thinking?
     
  18. Syzygys As a mother, I am telling you Valued Senior Member

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    I think we don't know the full story on that one. In the film they implied this at the court case, that he was possibly told to take the blame. I am not sure he was the one who in real life shot the kid. My guess is that the Hatfields sacrified him as scapegoat....

    But anyway, they thought they would put him out of the way, but he ended up in the way. After all, people escaping would do it via the back...
     
  19. KilljoyKlown Whatever Valued Senior Member

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    Well even in this day and age it's tough growing up without all your marbles, and when somebody points the blame at you. You just can't defend yourself. I believe your right.
     
  20. R1D2 many leagues under the sea. Valued Senior Member

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    Did not get to watch this "mini" series. But from the reading I've done in this sub forum it sounds like a gang war.
     
  21. R1D2 many leagues under the sea. Valued Senior Member

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    How did the feud end? One family take out the other?
     
  22. Syzygys As a mother, I am telling you Valued Senior Member

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    The link in post #13 tells the story. (also wikipedia) The animosity just petered out after the 1888 courtcase and hanging of the disturbed boy. Some of the Hatfields got prison sentences. The 2 family leaders died of old age. The last courtcase was in 1902 I think with "womenizer" Johnse Hatfield involved.

    Well, in modern times, the feud ended with a Family Feud competition between the 2 families on TV and a signed peace treaty by 60 members in 2003 I think...
    There is still some ongoing courtcase about cemetery use....
     
  23. Syzygys As a mother, I am telling you Valued Senior Member

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