Wikipedia protest shutdown

**adoucette** · 01-19-12, 10:32 AM

Originally Posted by parmalee

Actually, MOST content creators sign no such contract--where on earth are you getting your information?

The ones selling reasonable quantities of DVDs and CDs do.

**gmilam** · 01-19-12, 10:32 AM

Originally Posted by Asguard

Actually its the distributors that most people have a problem with, they are the ones in breach of the trade practices act, they are the ones in breach of the US Australian Free trade agreement, they are the ones in breach of every other free trade agreement that Australia has.

Don't know nor care about any any trade practices act. I'm simply looking at it from the perspective of a musician/songwriter. We are going to write and record songs, it's what we do. But with the public feeling like they should have it for free, and club owners acting like we should feel privileged that they allow us to play in their club for tips - it's amazing that anyone tries to make a living in music anymore.

Once again, if you like an artist's work - make sure they are compensated for it.

**parmalee** · 01-19-12, 10:37 AM

Originally Posted by adoucette

The ones selling reasonable quantities of DVDs and CDs do.

BULLSHIT.

Most musicians sign to independent labels, and very, very few independents employ contracts. AT most, there is a verbal agreement--if anything at all.

STOP FUCKING LYING and prove your claim, lest I report you.

**adoucette** · 01-19-12, 10:38 AM

Originally Posted by parmalee

Because they are seldom, in fact, associations of artists--have you ever bothered to investigate?

Yes.

http://www.cmaworld.com/membership/membership-levels

Then there are groups like the Independent Music Association, which is clearly intimately associated and supported by content creators.

Here's their statement in support of SOPA:

Independent music labels embrace the Internet as the Internet has been the great equalizer… on the ability to market, promote, monetize and introduce new music. The Internet has opened up countless opportunities for us. Why would we do anything to jeopardize that? A2IM, on behalf of our member community has spent a great deal of time speaking with, hearing from, and reading testimony from legal experts, constitutional experts and technological experts that refute the mis-information campaign that has so many concerned that these bills would suppress free speech, legal innovation or the security of the Internet.

* The time and capital investment required for our community of like-minded, but proudly independent, small business people to monitor the web for infringement and take subsequent legal action simply does not exist. A2IM member music labels simply do not have the financial means or resources to house a stable of systems people and lawyers to monitor the Internet and bombard sites with DMCA takedown notices for seemingly endless illegal links to our music (especially when even successfully removing illegal links is temporary at best as almost all reappear often within seconds). We do not have the financial means to bankroll field offices in far-flung countries abroad with weak copyright laws. Our members have limited budgets, and whatever living they can eke out is often promptly reinvested back into finding the next new artist or the marketing campaign of an artist already on their roster.

**parmalee** · 01-19-12, 10:40 AM

Originally Posted by adoucette

Yes.

http://www.cmaworld.com/membership/membership-levels

Then there are groups like the Independent Music Association, which is clearly intimately associated and supported by content creators.

Here's their statement in support of SOPA:

How are they "clearly intimately associated and supported by content creators"?

And, PROVE YOUR FUCKING CLAIM or SHUT THE FUCK UP.

(Simply employing one of your tacks, Arthur)

**adoucette** · 01-19-12, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by parmalee

BULLSHIT.

Most musicians sign to independent labels, and very, very few independents employ contracts. AT most, there is a verbal agreement--if anything at all.

STOP FUCKING LYING and prove your claim, lest I report you.

LOL

I'm quivering in my boots.

No lies.

American Association of Independent Music (A2IM) was one of the groups I listed.

http://a2im.org/

And no, I don't believe you that the artists that work with these independents don't typically sign contracts, just make verbal agreements.

**parmalee** · 01-19-12, 10:42 AM

And what exactly is that stupid link supposed to establish? Are you telling me to join CMA? WTF??!!

**parmalee** · 01-19-12, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by adoucette

LOL

I'm quivering in my boots.

No lies.

American Association of Independent Music (A2IM) was one of the groups I listed.

http://a2im.org/

And no, I don't believe you that the artists that work with these independents don't typically sign contracts, just make verbal agreements.

Point being?

And how 'bout trying to establish your claim?

And are you accusing me of lying now? I've never signed a contract, and of the thousands of people I know, perhaps a few dozen or so have signed contracts.

**adoucette** · 01-19-12, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by parmalee

How are they "clearly intimately associated and supported by content creators"?

And, PROVE YOUR FUCKING CLAIM or SHUT THE FUCK UP.

(Simply employing one of your tacks, Arthur)

Easy

http://a2im.org/contents/?taxonomy=c...term=associate

**adoucette** · 01-19-12, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by parmalee

And what exactly is that stupid link supposed to establish? Are you telling me to join CMA? WTF??!!

No, I'm pointing out that the CMA has individual memberships.

You think Country musicians aren't members?

**parmalee** · 01-19-12, 10:45 AM

Originally Posted by adoucette

Easy

http://a2im.org/contents/?taxonomy=c...term=associate

Sorry, but again, what is your point here?

**parmalee** · 01-19-12, 10:46 AM

Originally Posted by adoucette

No, I'm pointing out that the CMA has individual memberships.

You think Country musicians aren't members?

Do you read your links, Arthur? What on earth does CMA World have to do with "Country musicians" specifically? And where did I say anything about Country musicians?

**adoucette** · 01-19-12, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by parmalee

Point being?

And how 'bout trying to establish your claim?

And are you accusing me of lying now? I've never signed a contract, and of the thousands of people I know, perhaps a few dozen or so have signed contracts.

So?

Who are you that I'm supposed to believe that you know most of the people in the independent music business?

I also doubt that most people in the music business today get their work produced and distributed based on a verbal agreement.

Call me old fashioned.

**parmalee** · 01-19-12, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by adoucette

So?

Who are you that I'm supposed to believe that you know most of the people in the independent music business?

I also doubt that most people in the music business today get their work produced and distributed based on a verbal agreement.

Call me old fashioned.

Did I claim that I know most people?

And you made a ludicrous claim; consequently, it is your obligation to prove it.

Not necessarily old-fashioned, just completely out of touch with reality and with a bizarre hard-on for corporate America and cops.

**adoucette** · 01-19-12, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by parmalee

Do you read your links, Arthur? What on earth does CMA World have to do with "Country musicians" specifically? And where did I say anything about Country musicians?

You don't think the Country Music Association has anything to do with representing the best interests of Country Music Musicians?

LOL

**parmalee** · 01-19-12, 10:50 AM

Anyhows, goodbye Troll.

I need a new chew-toy.

**adoucette** · 01-19-12, 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by parmalee

Did I claim that I know most people?

Yeah, it's embodied in your claim that you know what most independents artists do in their contracts (or lack of same).

Originally Posted by parmalee

And you made a ludicrous claim; consequently, it is your obligation to prove it.

You made the only ludicrous claim.

Originally Posted by parmalee

very, very few independents employ contracts. AT most, there is a verbal agreement--if anything at all.

**parmalee** · 01-19-12, 10:53 AM

Originally Posted by adoucette

You don't think the Country Music Association has anything to do with representing the best interests of Country Music Musicians?

LOL

I only looked at the page to which you linked. Just says CMA over and over, nothing about Country? Am I obliged to peruse the website thoroughly, so that I can glean the true meaning of the acronym CMA?

**adoucette** · 01-19-12, 10:58 AM

Originally Posted by parmalee

I only looked at the page to which you linked. Just says CMA over and over, nothing about Country? Am I obliged to peruse the website thoroughly, so that I can glean the true meaning of the acronym CMA?

Not at all, since in big letters in the top right it says

Official Site of the COUNTRY MUSIC ASSOCIATION

And of course, it does have the copyright notice at the bottom of the web page:

©2011 Country Music Association

http://www.cmaworld.com/membership/membership-levels

Sorry if that was too difficult for you.

**parmalee** · 01-19-12, 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by adoucette

Not at all, since in big letters in the top right it says

Official Site of the COUNTRY MUSIC ASSOCIATION

http://www.cmaworld.com/membership/membership-levels

Sorry if that was too difficult for you.

It actually doesn't on my computer--but it does says that on the other pages of the site. The page to which you linked doesn't load fully (apparently) for whatever reason.