I hear this a lot from a few members here. In a recent private message with one of the culprits from the thread next door on the Whithouse-ET debates, the ''Roswell case is Debunked.'' So, since when has the Roswell Case been debunked? Considering the overwhelming witness testimony, the fact the Military changed their story three times and considering I haven't read any absolute discolure on the subject, how is it debunked exactly? Also, I feel a strong need to mention the Special Agent Guy Hottel Memorandum yet again. Surely this memo released by the FBI proves that the Roswell debate is far from over. But of course, we are cranks with no intelligence whatsoever, so what we would know right? I'd like to see this evidence that the Roswell Incident has been debunked, thoroughly. :shrug:
Here ya go, read these: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...yN26Dw&usg=AFQjCNEQgXye4RO7LIt6DyahLlgjwX5xJA http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...yN26Dw&usg=AFQjCNEClQ8X5ZKIsemK-t4k-CkL6NlG9w http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...yN26Dw&usg=AFQjCNHFnsEINs8eq9mA_p7mia9jUfSmaw
@Mister -- It's Arioch, the Prince of Chaos, here to sow discord once again! MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Wait, you mean that memorandum which doesn't even mention Roswell? That memorandum which you can only link to Roswell via the words "New Mexico" and "flying saucer" while ignoring all of the other sighting in New Mexico that the document might have been about? Is this the same document that obviously can't be about Roswell as it states that there was "no further interest" when there was obviously a lot of interest over Roswell given that it could have potentially led to a war between two nuclear superpowers? That's the one we're talking about right? This one right? We're talking about the document that even [urlhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Maccabee#Recent_articles]this guy[/url] says is based on a hoax, correct?
Tell me why this ''debunking'' story sounds awefully similar to the coverup statement by the Military... Oh that's right, because it was the Military who first elaborated on the weather balloon explanation... ...in fact, it wasn't even the first statement. They changed this statement three times before settling with this one. I am sorry, I thought when someone said that Roswell was debunked, I was hoping for some previously classified information. Not a well orchestrated story, which was first grown from the soil of Military manure. There is no absolute proof that the Roswell case is debunked in any shape or form. Not from what you have shown me.
This would have been more productive for my eyes. The quality of those last links where diabolical. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Force_Reports_on_Roswell_UFO_Incident
I have noticed already, reading this link, that the air force reports on the two documents where ''published'' in 1994. Why do I feel skeptical still? Well, I would have felt happier if the air force would have just released some classified documents on the case (the Roswell Case). Them publishing something and saying it is the explanation just doesn't cut very easily, considering how good they are at fabricating stories any way. How do we know that these rather late publications on the subject is just another coverup to keep the growing demand of the public at bay? I don't doubt for one moment that there might have been a project called, ''project mogul,'' but what evidence is there that the Air Force have simply not used this project to their advantage? These are serious questions. Apart from them saying ''this is what happened'' what evidence is there really, because in all honesty, I don't trust any arm of the Military.
I might be gullible, but I am not a sucker for a bad coverup... and neither is Stanton Friedman ''Critiques of the report Critics of the report pounced on the apparent implausibility of events occurring many years later accounting for the 1947 event. “One of the silliest official USAF stories is the crash test dummy nonsense… None were dropped anywhere near the two crash sites and none were dropped earlier than 6 years AFTER the 1947 events,” said Stanton Friedman whose interviews with Jesse Marcel in 1978 sparked interest in the Roswell UFO incident.[21] “They used a crazy explanation for the red-headed officer observed independently at the Roswell Base Hospital, and in the Plains of San Augustin. World class pilot, Joseph Kittinger, was a redhead and was at the Roswell base hospital after a ballooning accident. But it was twelve years later! If the explanation doesn't fit, one must acquit.” Other critics had more objections, such as using witnesses like Gerald Anderson who they saw as being discredited while ignoring witnesses like Frank Kaufman who they saw as being more compelling. “It was, most likely, not included because it is impossible to suggest that Kaufman could be confused about events in which he participated and for which he took written notes,” said Mark Rodeghier of the Center for UFO Studies.[22] Testimony of the witnesses was used selectively, critics charged. For example, Jim Ragsdale’s descriptions of an object flying at high speeds and of unusual debris is ignored. Also, for the Air Force explanation to fit, witnesses should be remembered at the recovery sites. Yet none of the witnesses can be placed at the scene at any of the dummy recoveries they were alleged to have been at. Further, dummies recovered at the sites were too large – each about six feet tall – to account for reports of 4-foot-tall (1.2 m) aliens. In reference to the Glenn Dennis testimony, it is “preposterous” he could have confused burned airmen with aliens, or have mistaken their autopsies done years after 1947 at his funeral home with the Roswell base autopsies, says Rodeghier. As for the long list of disparate events and people combined into a single “mistaken” memory, “The reader is left to judge the likelihood of all these unconsciously being combined into one event by a sane, competent witness, one who cannot even be proved to have been at the hospital in 1959, or to have known or met any of these military personnel. “One can only conclude that it is simply another government whitewash attempt, or worse, a clear case of incompetence and waste of taxpayer money.” ''
Why is it, that when Roswell is mentioned, you really do find what comes out from underneath the sciforums woodwork, yet, I make threads on the Washington 1952 and hardy next to no one answers? Skeptics really pick and choose which arguements they like to interact with don't they... hmmm... I wonder why?
No kidding, it's amazing how often the Soviet Union gets neglected in these Roswell/fake moon landing conspiracy theories. If the US government has covered up evidence of alien contact all this time, then the entire Cold War was fake as well. On the other hand, it would conveniently explain US reluctance to fund science projects like the SHSC, or to fund similar work at the LHC Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!.
Could you elaborate on the bolded part. I've actually has trouble understanding the meaning of the entire post. :shrug:
Uhm... besides the Soviet government not having ever uttered a single peep of protest about America monopolizing contact with an extraterrestrial species and the lack of any similar incidents involving the Red Army; if it were true that technology had been recovered from an alien spacecraft capable of interstellar travel, the USSR would have had absolutely zero chance of matching US technological progress unless it was explicitly permitted to do so. To think that an alien species could possess such incredible knowledge about propulsion and space travel beyond anything physically possible in our present understanding, but know nothing about the consequences of much simpler "modern" physics beyond 1940's vacuum tube computers, indicates complete ignorance about the historical process that led us to our current understanding and abilities- an oversight of that magnitude on the part of said aliens would be far more significant than merely neglecting to invent the water closet. Hence the entire Cold War and its byproducts would have been a carefully manufactured fiction.
Isn't it obvious why? Well, maybe not obvious to some. The reason why is because top leading Canadian scientists like Wilbert Smith have been reported saying that one of the reasons for the secrecy on the subject (which is classed even higher then the H-Bomb) is that UFO's (the geniune kind) are likely to lead to a new technology. Now, even if we have came into contact and retrieved alien debris, can you imagine how difficult it will be to extract meaningful information from them using reverse engineering? If they are as advanced as many leeked scientists like to envision, then it would be like handing a stop-watch to a medieval civilization and asking them to explain how it works. In similar tone, each governement will be aware how frantically important it would be to understand an alien technology. Those who get their first, will arguably dominate the earth. This is why the Soviet are generally quiet abouut this subejct as are the US government. It would not surprise me, if this phenomenon was real, there is a real shadow operation all struggling to get their first!
It's obvious because most of the tales spread about Roswell and Area 51 involve the successful back-engineering of alien technology, which supposedly gave the U.S. a vital edge in the Cold War (when utter Soviet incompetence isn't enough on its own). If they weren't able to back-engineer anything, that would mean they didn't have much control over the situation, and if the USSR didn't have access to similar alien wreckage on their own turf, then they would have easily found out after sending a few KGB agents to check on all the wild stories coming out of Nevada, New Mexico etc., and they would have raised a $*itstorm over the knowledge not being shared, rather than do what they did and say absolutely nothing. Yet if the Soviets did indeed find UFO wreckage in their own territory, in a country where you can practically bribe security guards to let bombs onto planes, they somehow managed to keep this one a total secret and did a far better job of it than the Americans- not likely at all. As for Wilbert Smith, there's basically nothing to substantiate his claims anymore than there is substantiating that O.J. Simpson has never seen the colour of blood. However you put these conspiracy theories together, as soon as you factor in that a country called the Soviet Union existed at the time, everything becomes far more complicated and absurdly implausible. Maybe the Vietnam and Afghanistan wars were engineered by both sides in order to cover up the charade that we're not being visited from space, but from that point the logic's headed straight to bizarro world.
Well, actually I've argued if there has been any reverse engineering, I don't think it would be massively successful at all. ''As for Wilbert Smith, there's basically nothing to substantiate his claims anymore than there is substantiating that O.J. Simpson has never seen the colour of blood.'' This is where I have a slight advantage over most here. I have done my homework on these subjects. There are many declassified papers now of his work. However, the reason why nothing can substantiate his claims concerning the really important stuff is because his work on project magnet is yet to be declassified. The dep. of transport holds this information and seems likely not to give it up for a while. So you cannot jugde him fully. Not until all the evidence has been evaluated, unfortunately, may be a while yet.
Well you should announce it to all of Canada's top scientists- they seem to have missed the memo, because right now they're busy busting their butts scrambling for funding on far more mundane, real-life kinda stuff. I'm sure they'd be delighted to know that some obscure guy from the 1950's was working on something much more advanced of far greater importance to the future of mankind, and all they had to do these past 15 years was Google Canadian UFO's to read all about it (I read about it 15 years ago when I wasn't even starting my scientific training yet, and already I smelled the BS).
What makes you think the topic of UFO's aren't real life... in fact, let me rephrase the question, what makes you think Wilbert Smith's career wasn't real life? There is heaps of arguements which suggest his work was very much real.
You never got back to me on this one.... captain. I am curious to your comments and been very patient.
Mister, for the love of *insert deity of your choice here*, edit your posts instead of double/triple posting...
