02-12-11, 03:00 AM #141
As for the rest of you people trying to offer explanations like spider with that picture- I hope you take in all the info I stated before you state something as an explanation because right now I am just having a laugh at all your explanations.
Like for example, spider's picture can be subject to the 'explanation' that it was written by a plane. While in my experience there was no plane and the text was transforming into different PHRASES.
You guys don't have to offer any explanation anyways. Just believe that I am lying and if not lying, my whole family was on drugs hallucinating. There isn't really any reason for you to believe anything I or anyone says so no reason to go on the offensive (or defensive?) by offering explanations.
Peace be unto you
02-12-11, 03:23 AM #142
02-12-11, 03:32 AM #143
Peace, and I wish many cloudy days for you and yours to read that which is writ large in the skies.
02-12-11, 04:19 AM #144Obviously i dont expect this story to change any non believers hearts because I cannot teach faith to anyone, nobody can teach faith to another. but i tell you truly this story is not made up it is real.
One way or another - given that we are talking about clouds - you'd expect someone to have filmed it.
02-12-11, 10:19 AM #145
i have heard 'writing in the sky' stories alot and my comment on aramaic writing sums up why i can believe it,(and request for pics) i have never seen words in the clouds in the sky just the occasional duck,or dragon..but then again i do not know aramaic.
(i vaguely recall a similar conversation in another thread about writing in the sky and someone had posted a pic.)
02-12-11, 11:16 AM #146
Originally Posted by NMSquirrel
As for the rest of you people trying to offer explanations like spider with that picture-
I hope you take in all the info I stated before you state something as an explanation because right now I am just having a laugh at all your explanations.
You guys don't have to offer any explanation anyways. Just believe that I am lying and if not lying, my whole family was on drugs hallucinating.
What you are reporting sounds like a report of a miracle, a divinely generated violation of the order of nature. That's going to be an unlikely event by its very nature, from the simple fact that it is a violation of the observed order of nature. I don't intend to insult you by saying this, but it's just a fact of human experience that people making untrue assertions (for whatever motivation) is a very common occurance.
So in terms of simple probabilities, it would be more rational for other people to think that your report has a naturalistic explanation than it would be for them to accept that it was a miraculous confirmation of Islam.
More generally, the philosophical point in all this is that in the case of miracles (of any religion, it doesn't matter which) there's typically going to be a natural explanation that's more likely (more consistent with the observed order of nature in other words), and hence more rational for people to believe, than a unique supernatural violation of that order would be.
That doesn't necessarily prove that miracles are impossible. But it does mean that it's rational to be skeptical about them.
(David Hume made a similar argument in his essay, 'On Miracles'.)
02-12-11, 03:16 PM #147
02-14-11, 12:44 AM #148
I don't take pictures of these things to show to people- as I don't believe in showing this to anyone, not to mention I was 10 at the time with no camera. And secondly I'm not going to 'google' one for you, because I don't know the authenticity of them. The only 'authentic' source of this is ME for myself-
I don't believe in using these things as 'proof' for Islam or anything, I just thought I would share my experience nothing more as it was a relevant topic. In a discussion, I would not use this as 'proof' for anything. It can be 'proof' for me but that is pretty much it.
I would rather have people become Muslim because they recognize God than to look at a cloud, so I don't show anyone this. When I was in middle school, I saw Allah (in arabic) written, very very clearly and cleanly, no clouds were even near it and my friend (a Catholic) was with me, I chose not to tell him to look at it even though I was trying to convert him (I had many discussions with him on religion). I don't know if that was a correct decision or not, sometimes I think I should've shown him, but I don't believe in doing this to convert people.
I'm not the kind of person who uses these things to 'prove' a point. If you're asking me for proof that arabic is written in the sky, I have none. Just take my story as my experience. That is all.
Peace be unt oyou
Last edited by 786; 02-14-11 at 12:50 AM.
02-14-11, 10:40 AM #149
02-14-11, 11:02 AM #150
02-14-11, 11:05 AM #151
02-14-11, 12:16 PM #152
I wouldn't necessarily call my experience pastime but I can understand your opinion.
Peace be unto you
02-14-11, 12:21 PM #153
02-14-11, 12:32 PM #154
I'm just saying, in Japanese they probably see Japanese characters, in Disneyland they might see cartoons, I like to recognize faces in the clouds, we see what we expect to see, it's like a Rorschach test.
02-15-11, 04:00 PM #155
If he's real, then something like that would save my life. He must want me dead. Do you realize how many people are not saved simply because they don't believe. They are righteous people, probably more than you. Good people who theists would claim them dead to god because they didn't believe. What is that? How is god a just god worthy of your praise to let your brother die, and yet give you the sight beyond sight. And not because your friends were bad people. No, just because they didn't believe...because god chose not to act to save the soul. What, is he shooting craps up there to decide who will see and hear him?
God may as well finish us off, because we will fight him as he is evil. Are we atheists just tools to help train you. Are we spilling our blood to defend the meek and working to heal the sick and feed the hungry just to die because we don't believe. Bullshit I say.
02-15-11, 05:47 PM #156
and to address snake's suggestion to call the evening news...
if you see it, you were meant to, and if you don't, you weren't.
and if you see it and it means something to you, then that's what it was meant for.
and if you see it and it doesn't mean jack shit to you, then you qualify as "normal".
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