75 yr old woman sentenced to 40 lashes for mingling.

Mod Hat - Civility

Mod Hat — Civility?

I have deleted six posts from this thread that constituted a digression rooted in insult.

Members are reminded that we do demand a certain, basic civility in our discussions. Further issues in this thread will result in its closure; continued insults in this or any EM&J discussion will earn more direct sanction, including warnings and (eventually, if necessary) temporary suspension of posting privileges.

We all clear on that?

Good.

Thank you.

 

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Tiassa, it's your forum, you can delete whatever you like. But since there are no clear rules on what constitutes being uncivil, the line between civil and uncivil is rather vague. I have noted that on more then one occasion using the f word on a person will get you to act. I happen to know what the root post is you deleted and also know that the f word was, indeed, used against someone in that post (I definitely didn't do it for those watching). Since that's the only pattern I've seen, I will assume that word and its derivatives when used against someone may result in the actions you've mentioned.

 

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It's only a word. I think it is sometimes better to come right out and say what you think instead of using a clever\devious workaround.

 

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I guess I just have a fanciful notion that no one deserves such insults. The only time I think such insults may need to be used is along the lines of what Mark Twain once said. Basically, to avoid even worse outcomes then hurt feelings (such as physical violence).

 

No one is talking about physical violence and i personally have never been in a physical altercation because the situation never arose where i was physically attacked by another person.

I just dont give single words much power. If you think about it it is pretty comical how people get insulted by one word but i suppose it is understandable. People can call me whatever they want and i dont really get insulted by it because i just take it from where it comes.

 

Mod Hat - Response

Mod Hat — Response

It isn't actually that complicated, Scott.

Now, maybe I'm just old. I accept that possibility. But there was a time when people could figure out certain conventional boundaries. It's not so much that we want to be Frasier, but we were hoping for something better than Dharma & Greg meets Designing Women.

Sometimes people just need to stop and think. Others, they seem to think too much for their own good. Diversity amazes: I can't tell you how many ways I've seen people miss the point over the years. That's something I never would have gotten anywhere else but an internet bulletin board. I mean ... holy shit.

The thing is that it's not that tough to figure out. Obviously, it's the way the word is used. And there is no question under the sun that the root post was beyond the pale. No matter what sympathies I might have with various sentiments expressed around this website, I cannot in any decent conscience permit those expressions to stand. Even by our vague rules, some things are just obvious.

And our rules have always been deliberately vague. What rules we have exist because people can't figure it out for themselves. You might have noticed that lately.

 

It always comes from another human being. I may disagree with others, but I always respect them, even if I think they're mentally disturbed; and as long as a screen separates us, there is essentially no risk of an immediate physical altercation, so I see absolutely no reason to engage in certain toxic insults.

 

Not really that familiar with those last 2 shows.

Think too much for their own good? Can you provide an example?

Which 'word' is that? You may believe that it's simple and that there was a time when people 'got' it, but I certainly don't think it is and wonder if there ever really was such a time. The closest I've come is that when people use f word derivatives against someone else, you act. You haven't negated this so I will continue to operate under the assumption that f word derivatives used against others are a reportable offense. You've deleted posts that didn't have f word derivatives in them, however. In cases like those, I really have no way to predict when you'll delete a post; perhaps if you believe it'll stir up too much trouble, but again, it's your yard stick and it'd by necessity keep everyone guessing as to what would constitute such a post.

I remember he used the f word derivative against someone.. so if that's what you consider beyond the pale, ok. I too agree that that type of insult shouldn't be allowed, but I just wanted to ensure that I knew what you considered beyond the pale, if you will.

Tiassa, it's only been after many months that I can now generally say that the f word and its derivatives used against a person is a reportable offense. In no way did I find that clear at the beginning and I have a strong suspicion that that even that rule doesn't apply to all the forums equally.

Why?

Yes, but I would also contend that the reason some can't figure it out is precisely because the rules are so vague.

 

Strange bedfellows indeed. I am in agreement with Scott.

Tiassa, I have no idea if some/all of the deleted posts were mine. I have no ****ing idea if I used the ****ing f word or not. My posts are cruise missiles - launch and forget. So how am I meant to know what behaviour of mine was unacceptable in this thread if the evidence is gone?

As to Scott's notion that the f word is unacceptable I have used it in its ****ing censored form and quite raw in many posts and not one of those has been stomped on. I have deliberately checked the boundaries of acceptability and found them more fluid than a laxative induced dump.

There is no consistency anywhere on this forum. That's fine. It provides a place where I can let off steam. Fewer than 10% of my posts deliver anything of substance. Hell, it probably less than 3%. Why? It's not me directly. On three other forums - under different names, where reputation points are awarded, I have the highest or one of the highest rep points/post of anyone. I can deliver. But here! What is there to deliver to here?
A trip to Bedlam affords the opportunity to scream at the top of your lungs without anyone noticing.
Policing such a thing is not a vocation, it's a self deluding fantasy.

 

India seems to be doing much better than Pakistan. Its ashame they assassinate his wife instead of the jerk they elected president.

Which country do you think is mine anyway?

You seem to be hitting your head too hard when you pray. You should join SAM in refraining from such activities.

 

I suggest you research yourself why your own ancestors actually "embraced" islame.

So now you worship black pebbles and a book. Big step forward.

My ancestors worshipped war and trade. Its hard to say if they've actually found sanity yet, but they do know how to kick ass and make money.

I find it amusing that you think I'm Indian. I feel quite international since I've also been mistaken for an Australian.

 

For once, we're in agreement.

 

It's horribly rude of me, but I've not really noticed if we have been in disagreement before. I respond to what is written, not who is writing it.

I just read what I'd written for the first time and for a wholly unedited piece I think it comes across rather well. On that note I think I'll go to work.

 

Mod Hat — Response (final)

Mod Hat — Response (final)

If I was worried about the behavior, I would have said something.

As it is, what is gone is a string of six posts all related to an insult. When we edit content or delete posts, we also try to remove subsequent references to the offense. The entire digression is peripherally related, and only existed in that context.

You haven't done anything wrong. I'm just cleaning up a little mess.

So, physician, calm thyself. It's not the end of the world.

 

In doing so, I would argue that you make it all the more difficult for anyone to learn what constitutes offensive posts and you can take away some good points as well.

You seem to be suggesting that 5 posts were deleted for the sake of one. I have all 6 posts on my hard drive (I've gotten used to this type of thing happening on occassion and I dislike not being able to see what fusses are about when I have actually written one of the deleted posts, so I tend to save a lot of pages where I've written something on my hard drive).

I'm hoping that I can atleast briefly outline what the posts had in them in order to make my point. I won't mention the names of either the insulter or the insultee. Here goes:

The 1st had the insult and insulter in question. The 2nd involved the insultee correcting the spelling of the insulter and then going on in his usual inflamatory style. Ophiolite, who I suspect especially likes to correct spelling, joins in on the correction of spelling trend in the 3rd (no f words were involved). The 4th involved me correcting a spelling mistake of Ophiolite's

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. The 5th involved me finding 2 words used by the insultee's inflamatory part of his post to be particularly amusing when the rest of the sentence is removed and the 6th involved me responding to the meat of the insultees' inflamatory part of his post.

Post 1, I think, should have been made an example, not deleted- as in, this is what you should -not- do. Post 2 was inflamatory, but as you seem to be implying, within acceptable limits, as you only mention the initial post as the cause of all the trouble. Post 3 and 4 were fluffy posts not really concerned with anything but spell checking and relatively harmless. Post 5 may have been somewhat humorous but I think that it had a very good point to it as well. And I feel that post 6 had some very good points indeed (what can I say, I wrote it ;-)). And all gone because someone used the f word and used another lesser insult for good measure. I'd like to believe that your relative silence when I've mentioned many times that the f word was probably the cause of the initial post deletion points towards the fact that the f word used as an attack is generally unnaceptable. That, atleast, would mean that something was actually -learned- here instead of a bunch of posts being deleted because you felt that something in the first of the bunch had something 'beyond the pale' (which I agree with, although I happen to know that you've used an f word derivative insult against a poster in the past, although you were speaking of him, not to him in the past, and pointed out to you that I felt you were going a little over the top) and the rest of the posts (only the first of which was even responding to the insulter in question) must therefore be wiped out as well.

 

Was this 'spelling mistake' the substitution of 'there' for 'their', or vice versa? If so, it was no mistake, but a deliberate tongue in cheek 'error'. If that is what is gone then I am annoyed. I planned to capture all my forum contributions in a leather bound volume for any great-grand children so they can see what a prat their ancestor was. Now that particular gem is gone forever.

 

Lol

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. Yeah, it was 'their' and was supposed to be 'there'

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.

 

Mod Hat - Review

Mod Hat — Review

Scott, do you really think I care?

Now, perhaps because you spend your time advocating issues other people find controversial, you've adopted a form of inquiry and argument specifically tailored to reduce or eliminate the complicating offense of your presentation. I recognize this. And so far as you're determined to stick by it, I can see why you might think it works.

But it does not mean you get to stand there and muck up this or any other thread under my jurisdiction arguing against the green link. If you do not like my decisions as moderator, you are free to contact me via private message. If you are unsatisfied with that outcome, by all means contact Stryder, James, or Plazma. And, furthermore, if this is unsatisfactory to you, then do what everyone else does, post a thread about it in SFOG; even if I don't bother paying attention to it, at least you won't be distracting this or any other discussion with the complaint.

Some moderators have gone back to issuing warning cards. There are two problems with that. First, the members voted it away for the aspect of being pilloried. Secondly, and contradicting the first, people are prone to ignoring those little yellow cards. That we have seen and dealt with the issue doesn't stop people from digressing into stupid distractions from the thread based on something in the flagged post.

So when we start deleting content, we delete as many derivatives of that content as possible in order to prevent further digression. This, as you may have noticed, does not always work.

Furthermore, there are a good many posts deleted as being off topic that commit no other offense. This is what the Action Notes are for. If I don't make some sort of specific statement, either publicly or privately, I'm not particularly concerned about the behavior. That judgment is within the purview of any moderator, and when a topic digression becomes, in our judgment, severe enough to warrant action, deleting the entire digression is within our right. It would seem silly to tell people to not make any jokes or mutter aside. But I could, I suppose, always do that. I could tell myself that if I don't allow you all a sense of humor, that there will be fewer digressions. But in the first place, I don't believe it, and to the other it seems just a bit severe.

In this case, there really wasn't anything for you to worry about.

But, as you insist on this occasion, I'll happily prescribe a lesson: When you see something that is quite obviously violative, leave it alone. If you can't tell the difference, learn.

This thread has very little time left to get back on track.

 

Tiassa, my difference of opinion with you wasn't large. You seem to be suggesting that the rule is to respond to green lettered posts of yours via PM. If so, I wasn't aware of that rule but I will do that starting with your last post.

 

Tiassa, i really think the Mods need to 'grow a pair' and start deleting threads and posts that a normal person would find repulsive. I really dont see the problem with that.