I actually prefer music without lyrics and, if lyrics are unavoidable, then I prefer to listen to really strong and original singers even if they're in a language I don't understand. Musically, I came of age in the 70's and the bands that inspired me, that made me laugh and made me cry, mostly, had NO lyric interpreters, I'm talking about Weather Report, The Crusaders, Brothers Johnson, Herbie Hancock, Pat Metheny, Milton Nascimento (an exception) and others of that ilk. The thing I find fascinating with Rap and Hip Hop, is that kids refer to it as Rhythm n Blues, which is funny, because it hardly bears any resemblance to the Rhythm n Blues I remember from the 60's. What is also ironic, is that the kids who are into it in my country, Cyprus, where there are no blacks to speak of, are white, very family oriented and very middle class and it's just so funny to see them nodding their heads to the beats and getting into the lyrics gloryfying street life, gangstas, pimps, ho's and drugs; in fact it's totally bizarre.
really interesting TABLARIDDIM......and i ddn't know you were from Cyprus Do you mean they dont uderstand the language about te gangster references? the rap i like is the stuff that challenges te gangstacrap
Tablariddim, you obviously dont know anything about hip hop or rap. Nobody refers to it as rhythm and blues, thats R&B music, you getting your genres mixed up. Hip hop isnt just black music, it was started by blacks and hispanics but that doesnt mean its exclusive to those races and for you to say youre suprised white kids in Cyprus listen to it is ignorant. Almost as ignorant as saying that only people that come from poverty and/or broken homes can identify with hip hop and rap. Heres the thing that gets me, and you and others in this thread are the perfect example. 99.9% of people who argue against hip hop and rap have no clue what hip hop and rap is all about. Youre whole argument is flawed from that simple point. Thats like me arguing about car motors with a mechanic though I have no idea what im talking about. If you dont like the music dont listen to it, simple as that, but whats the thought behind trying to shit on anything who does recognize the beauty of hip hop. I personally, could care less about country music, but im not gonna try to convinve someone that actually listens to it, that there style of music is garbage. That is just beyond stupidity, you will never understand the hip hop culture so why even argue against it, making yourself look stupid.
I actually like a lot of rap and hip-hop. It's still crap. As is country, jazz, r&b, and light rock. Does it look as if we give a shit if we come across as stupid? Who gives a flying fuck? We are all stupid. We are all idiots. Who gives a shit? Only those that think anything they do or say is relevant, worthwhile, meaningful or some other stupid thing.
Sure they call it R&B, not rhythm n blues that's true. Rap and hip hop is predominantly black/Hispanic in any case American street music. Yes I do understand it and where it's coming from and that's why I find it funny when totally unhip people groove to it, but it's all to do with MTV.
Duendy, I could never explain to you in a way to make you understand what it is if you have never lived it. Almost like how do you explain color to a blind man? I could never explain the feeling of actually hearing someone like Nas and the way he rhymes that almost makes you feel like you are living inside that moment he is talking about. THe feeling of anticipating the Wu Tang Forever album for months in advance, going to the local CD store at midnight on the day of its release just so you can be one of the first to get a copy, and not just that but all your expectations were exceeded (sp). I could never explain the feeling of playing a classic CD all day long for months at a time and never getting bore of it, and everytime you listen closely you pick up another gem that makes you realize what true hip hop really is. I could never fully explain these feelings to you unless youve lived through them. Then you would know exactly what im talking about. Hip hop isnt some music video countdown show on basic cable. Hip hop isnt wearing baggy pants with a medallion on, thats what the media has made hip hop out to be. Of course its part of it, but wearing the latest fashion trends or talking in slang doesnt make you hip hop. I understand what some of you are saying because truth is, if I was only exposed to the more commercial side of hip hop then i too would dispise it. My whole thing is this.....if you wanna argue against hip hop, at least do your homework. Understand who the pioneers of hip hop are and the reason behind its creation. Understand that Tupac and Biggie arent the start or ending of hip hop. Understand that hip hop is about hope (which may be a good or bad thing). And most importantly understand that most true hip hop heads dont like the same things you are talking about. The people who have been down with hip hop since day one know that a platinum selling album doesnt equate to skills (50 cent). Just like we know to many gimmicks are created just to appeal to a broader audience, because rap is a business, but dont forget that hip hop is a culture. If you gonna argue against it, arm yourself with knowledge so you dont make yourself look foolish.
Science Prolific....Riiiiiight Onnnnnn loved the way you love Hip Hop and te way you tell it i Love Nas....i had a shroom experience getting into his 'I Am' CD....I advise strongly everyone here to do same....Z lot of blocks are due to preconceptions.....blo em away, even for several hours. you will feel it right in the soul
"Duendy, I could never explain to you in a way to make you understand what it is if you.....I could never fully explain these feelings to you unless youve lived through them. Then you would know exactly what im talking about." don't wanna be devil's advocate here but what you just said here can apply to most music especially when you have superficial knowledge of musical structure, you don't mind being more specific? Also when you said "Heres the thing that gets me, and you and others in this thread are the perfect example. 99.9% of people who argue against hip hop and rap have no clue what hip hop and rap is all about. Youre whole argument is flawed from that simple point. Thats like me arguing about car motors with a mechanic though I have no idea what im talking about." Well how can you say we don't know what its about, a lot of our friends and family listen to it and offer us samples, its on almost on every music channel and on the radio, to say we have no clue is quite absurd. I don't know what kind of rap or hip hop you like but as far as I'm concerned anything with crap like "blame it on whitey", hoes, bling, drugs, secret police, "ridez", ghetto glamour, repetitive and simplified music with excessive bass. If you like anything else then that's fine but we're criticising what the majority of hip hop fans like, to be honest I was actually quite surprised when you guys said you didn't like Eminem or 50 Cent because as far as the majority of hip hop fans are concerned they are pioneers in rap. Another thing, when I asked wether you guys think good music has to have lyrics, I asked because bands like Rage Against The Machine who spew some of the dumbest bullshit to be burned on CD (its not the rapping but rather the content) have (via Tom Morello) produced some good riffs which outweigh any pollitical rubbish they have to say. Also the Metallica songs Call Of Ktulu and Orion are brilliant masterpieces which have no need for lyrics likewise with some of the stuff done by Joe Satriani and Yngwie Malmsteem.
Listening to scraps of hip hop here and there doesn't mean that you know about it. The typical "it's all guns and hoes" line you dropped shows your ignorance. I don't bash country music on musical grounds, even though it annoys me when it comes on the radio. Why? Because I don't know anything about it.
This is a pointless thread. Why are you mo-fo's so fucking concerned with this shit when there are so many other, more important, things, happening, that REALLY, need your attention? Are you brainwashed by the "system?" Are you just "morons" to think this rap/r&b shit matters at all compared to other more "life and death" matters? Are you so shallow? Do you fucking imbeciles think that your rap is more important than people being abused, exploited, and marginalized? Can't you see that you are about to be abused, exploited and marginalized in the same manner? You want to live a god-damned "blessed" life? Then wake the fuck up! You are all losing it! You are about to be left behind in the dust of the rich and the greedy!
qiani_q, thats my whole argument, and in a way you are making my point for me. Hip hop isnt what you hear from the radio and music television. Of course thats all you are gonna know about rap and hip hop if you make your argument against it from just what people let you hear or see. Like I said, most true hip hop fans feel the same way as you when it comes down to it. BEcause they kow hip hop isnt about the guns or the hoes or all that other bullshit that is spewed and then attempted to be passed of as hip hop. Panopticon707 said it best, just because you listen to scraps of hip hop here and there doesnt mean you know anything about it. The truth is most people at least the younger generation, who listen to hip hop dont have a clue what hip hop is all about. Partly because they just go along with what gets radio and video play. Most of these kids have no Idea who Id be talking about if I started talking about Dj Kool Herc, Rakim, BDP, KRs-1, public enemy,Grandmaster THeodore, etc. Like you said there perception of what hip hop is revolves around 50 cent and eminem, mainly due to the fact that is what sells, but its mostly an image. Like I said before, most true hip hop listeners are able to distinguish between who is real and who is just a gimmck made by the record labels just to sell records. To answer your other question. No, I dont think good music needs lyrics at all. Beethoven's Moonlight sonata gives me the chills everytime I hear it. He doesnt say anything as far as lyrics go, but at the end of the day good music is good music with or without lyrics.
I guess topics closed then, i pretty much agree with silence, but to clarify things about "Gunz and Hoes" I doubt you guys havn't heard Gunshot by Akon but if u dnt listen to dat crap den ders no prblem. As for country music there isn't actually a lot to it which pretty much explains its crappyness, I used to learn kenny roger songs on my guitar because they use to be real easy for begginers with its repetitive open chords. Didnt public enemy do that song with anthrax? I forget what its called.
Silence, I agree with you most of the way, but I'm tired of hearing that stuff on the radio isn't real hip hop, real hip hop is little brother, or tribe called quest, or whatever. What's one the radio is one genre. What you like is another. I happen to like both. It's like saying that punk isn't rock music, heavy metal is rock music. I think people get confused because they don't realize that hip hop has several genres. And fans of underground get understandably annoyed when people assume they like gangsta music when they say that they like hip hop.
That is true, panopticon. There are many genres of hip hop from gangsta to more conscience type hip hop. There are alot more gimmicks in commercial hip hop just because its made to sell an image as opposed to sell hip hop based in skills. Not just radio either but television also, the other day i reading an article in which BET said it wouldnt play Little Brother's new video because "It was too smart for there core audience" in other words, it doesnt have some female shaking her ass throught the video therefore it gets no video play rotation. Of course there are some cats in mainstream who aren't just some hip hop version of a boy band made by the industry to sell. I think the main beef with underground fans is that people like 50 cent and Nelly and many others are getting love while cats like Chino Xl, Gza, Gangstarr, GHostface, etc are being ignored despite having more talent than those I previously mentioned. I listen to some mainstream commercial hip hop, I cant denie liking some of it, like I said before, good music is good music. I just brought up the conversation of mainstream hip hop versus underground simply because it fit into the discussion that there is more hip hop beyond what gets radio play. And in order to argue against hip hop with some intelligence, people should recognize the other sub divisions of hip hop before making a blanket statement like "fuck hip hop its all about guns bitches and hoes"
i love real rap but hate what it has become. some people have stayed real the new breed of MTV bitches is pathetic there not what they say they are. respect to the real D-Block lox ruff ryders papoose murder mook and others that havent been warped by that gay bling bling immage that hip hop has turned into.
