At Last - Washington state has a Governor

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Tiassa, Nov 24, 2004.

  1. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    37,893
    You'll not hear me complaining about this one, barring an independent finding of fraud, which is unlikely. As for now, this is what politics is made of.

    Washington state has finally elected a governor.

    Really, we didn't know who won until just minutes ago. As of this moment, the Seattle Post-Intelligencer has a box caption up on its front page, but no story content to link to.

    The result is that Dino Rossi (R) has won the office of Governor, the first Republican to do so in over twenty years. I will most likely learn that person's name when it's printed in the upcoming stories aobut Rossi's victory.

    We've already been through a recount, though the margin may warrant another.

    That margin? Forty-two votes.

    That's 42 votes.

    We'll get the denominator in a bit, when the statewide numbers are released in full.

    Let me reiterate:
    Dino Rossi has won the office of Governor of Washington state by a margin of 42 votes.​
    Congratulations to Rossi and the Republican Party. It's quite an accomplishment, and the margin is impressive.

    Perhaps his first official act in office can be to send fellow President George W, Bush an aerial picture of the Ports of Seattle and Tacoma, with the caption, "Container ships?!"

    Aside from that, it's a new adventure, so we'll see what comes.

    Forty-two. I wish ... no, never mind. (Just raise a glass for Mr. Adams. Sorry, it's an obligatory toast in my circle.)

    And as a leftist often called upon by my counterparts at Sciforums to say something nice about Republicans, let me simply say that I was no fan of Governor-elect Rossi's Democratic opponent, and would have preferred another candidate. All she ever did was press tobacco companies and blame Canada for the really good dope in Washington. Don't get me wrong, B.C. sends us wonderful product, but nothing bugs me more than blaming Canada when their best contribution is mitigating the dirt weed coming up from Mexico and southern California. While that's no small accomplishment, how dare she write some of the world's finest, kindest dope off on the Canadians. Be proud. With Rossi I get a generally blank slate. And that's no small thing. He has as much credibility as any politician gets from me at the outset, and its his to squander or invest wisely. This is the field upon which he gets to establish himself, as far as I'm concerned. It's a better feeling to see the office go to this man than celebrating a victory for a Democrat I don't like. Admittedly, I won't be surprised if he "gops out", but neither am I surprised when a Democrat rolls over and plays butt-boy to the very things Democrats despise.

    Ah ... the content has arrived.

    42 ÷ 2800000 = .0000015 (I think).

    It doesn't get much closer than this. And yes, yet another count is likely.

    And, yes, we have idiots up here, too:

    _____________________

    Notes:
    Ammons, David. "Republican Rossi wins recount for governor; new count likely". Seattle Post-Intelligencer, November 24, 2004. See http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/aplocal_story.asp?category=6420&slug=WA Governor Recount
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2004
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  3. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    What the Hell is Going On?
    Washington Governor's race highlights the troubles of modern democracy

    On the one hand, I comfort myself by reminding that these are probably common problems that have only come to light because of the close race in an incredibly divisive election cycle.

    To the other, the same issue troubles me. How many people have been excluded in prior years when vigilance was not at a premium?

    After a regular recount, the state began a hand recount at the insistence of Democrats; their candidate trailed by forty-two votes. That margin opened to around 120.

    However, some 573 ballots from King County (Seattle area) turned up as inappropriately rejected. The GOP has attempted to block the opening of the ballot envelopes. Rossi's lead has, in the meantime, been trimmed to less than 80 votes.

    Now there's 162 ballots missing. This morning, county officials will attempt to locate them. Apparently, after the examination of 573 ballots rejected as unsigned or otherwise inappropriately completed, the Seattle Times followed up on five absentee voters not included on the list of rejected ballots. Computer files revealed as many as 162 ballots missing. In the roster of 573, there were no last names starting with "A" or "B", and only two starting with "C".

    Add to the mix that the former Secretary of State for Washington, Ralph Munro, has called for a new vote in order to determine a clear winner and restore voter confidence. Munro, who oversaw the election system for twenty years before retiring after the last major cycle, happens to be "a key supporter of Republican Dino Rossi", the candidate currently leading the vote.

    Democrats, of course, see fear: spokeswoman Kristin Brost said, "Last week the Republicans were saying we need to resolve this as quickly as possible. This week they're saying we need another election."

    Surely enough, and regardless of Brost's interpretation, state GOP chair Chris Vance sees potential in the idea, and the current Secretary of State Sam Reed (R) said that a new vote can be done, and may be worth considering.

    King County, where as many as 735 votes have been handled improperly, is Democratic turf.

    The best advice so far may have actually come from a Congressman. (Who would have thought?) U.S. Representative Jay Inslee (D), said, "We really think both Democrats and Republicans should take a deep breath, relax a little bit and let everybody's vote be counted, and we can have a new governor by Christmas."

    Voters, however, are not exactly prepared to take a deep breath. Especially those whose ballots are in question.

    Zach Oaks, a Gregoire supporter, asked, "What makes my vote any less important than anyone else's? I did everything right. It's really pretty ridiculous."

    Charlotte Weaver, a first-time voter, said, "I did everything I needed to do to get my vote counted .... I figure every vote should be counted, whether I win or not."

    The controversy of the original 573 ballots was sparked when King County Councilman Larry Phillips saw his name on a list of rejected absentee ballots. How embarrassing would it be if a county councilman cannot fill out a ballot properly?

    Really, I'm just trying to deal with the fact that my side lost. I actually can't believe that it all comes down to this. Even if the Democrat wins, it's merely the other side of a dirty coin. I do care about the governorship of Washington; after all, it was a Democrat who wanted to use part of a tall surplus to end a justifiable teachers' strike in the 1980s, and the GOP that sought to block the maneuver in order to save the money for a rainy day. Odd politics, since the Reagan economy (especially under Clinton) has depended on rampant spending throughout. (As a side note, it's worth adding that you'll hear conservatives at the federal level talk of the importance of savings right now in order to push Bush's Social Security plan.) So yes, I'm comfortable with a Democrat in the governor's mansion. But I'm not even a Gregoire fan; I reiterate my disappointment that she wrote off Washington's "marijuana problem" (and our marijuana) onto Canada. That minor exchange of words and finger-pointing was disgraceful. Beyond that, she doesn't impress me as a candidate at all. Her only plus is that she's not a Republican, and more than the GOP itself, it's conservative voters in Washington (as well as Libertarians) who are more problematic to my political agenda. It's the voters who stage tax rebellions against schools, emergency medical services, and the like. It's the voters who cut the government's throat yet demand the sun, moon, and stars. If Rossi's four years go badly, or even bring a zero-sum, the people will fall back to the Democrats, with whom the biggest complaint is that progress is merely too slow. So I don't fear a Rossi governorship the way some might.

    So how is it that botched vote tallying in a vital election cycle might bring my candidate to office through a second election? Or, even, a first so problematic as this?

    Oh, well. It's entertaining on some level. The price of freedom is vigilance, and sometimes that eye perceives morbid comedy. Such is life. At least the effort is being made to find and count every vote. That's perhaps the only real plus coming out of this fiasco.
    ____________________

    Notes:
    Cook, Rebecca. "Republicans to sue King County over 573 ballots". SeattlePI.com, December 16, 2004. See http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/aplocal_story.asp?category=6420&slug=WA Governor Recount

    Ervin, Keith. "Up to 162 ballots misisng". SeattleTimes.com, December 17, 2004. See http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2002122510_ballotmystery17m.html

    Thomas, Ralph. "Former Secretary of State pushes for new vote". SeattleTimes.com, December 17, 2004. See http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2002122517_recount17m.html

    Devericks, Eric. "How Passe". SeattleTimes.com, December 8, 2004. See http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/editorial/cartoon/2004/120804.html

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    How times have changed: Only nine days ago, perspectives were different. (Eric Devericks, Seattle Times, December 8, 2004).​
     
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  5. zanket Human Valued Senior Member

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    3,777
    I read somewhere that 2% to 3% of the vote in every US state is estimated to be miscounted. That seems pretty ridiculous. Apparently the election boards have been counting on races not being that close. Now that the problems are apparent to all, every close race is going to go to the mat to resolve until the root causes of the miscounting are fixed. The root causes seem to revolve around bad planning (like letting absentee ballots trickle in after election day), disorganization and inadequate audit control.
     
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  7. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    37,893
    Source: SeattlePI.com
    Link: http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/204349_governor18.html
    Title: "Judge: Don't count 735 ballots"
    Date: December 18, 2004

    So it is now official: if you fill out your absentee ballot correctly, and somebody makes a mistake and says you didn't, your vote won't count.

    I admit, this is not a turn I expected. I figured the votes would be counted and then the serious lawsuits would begin.

    I wonder how much a class-action civil rights suit against King County and the State of Washington will cost the taxpayers? Because frankly, one may be warranted.

    These aren't "bad" ballots, but proper ballots improperly disqualified. The error originates within King County's election officials.

    However this episode closes, I do think the one thing the epilogue needs is a stiff, billion-dollar class-action lawsuit against King County, including the demand that those responsible be held criminally responsible for whatever civil rights violations can be established.

    This isn't just a "mistake". This is an egregious offense to all Americans.

    What a horrible note for Rossi's governorship to begin on. Regardless of what the real count actually is, he will enter the office under the stain of the GOP's inability to face an election without refusing people their right to vote.

    Why is it that when the GOP wins, the people lose?

    I would call on Governor-elect-apparent Rossi to publicly denounce this court decision and demand that the votes of his constituents be counted. After all, the governor just doesn't represent the people who share the same letter in parentheses after their names. He can turn this thing around by standing up for the people of his state.
    ____________________

    Notes:
    McGann, Chris. "Judge: Don't count 735 ballots". SeattlePI.com, December 18, 2004. See http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/204349_governor18.html
     
  8. zanket Human Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,777
    Elections staff may have not followed county protocols because they were bribed to not do so. Unlikely that possibility will be investigated.
     
  9. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    37,893
    Source: SeattlePI.com
    Link: http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/204469_gov20.html
    Title: "GOP chief accuses election office of misleading public on absentees at issue"
    Date: December 20, 2004

    Another day, another round of rhetoric and tempers.

    As usual, the GOP rhetoric faces a challenge. To be more direct, it refuses to face a challenge.

    Mr. Vance holds up evidence that the county attempted to confirm certain signatures. Mr. Vance says this answers the issue. Mr. Vance has not yet addressed the assertion that procedures were not followed. Essentially, what Mr. Vance is saying is that due process is fulfilled by the passage of time.

    The GOP claim that it is "too late" to count these ballots bears a grain of technical truth, but that is all. It depends on an affirmation that due process should be canceled by bureaucratic errors.

    Such a state of affairs seems absurd, and as County Executive Sims pointed out, Mr. Vance's opinion of the election system has changed drastically as the situation has progressed.

    The end result is that the GOP is asserting that people do not have the right to vote. That is, they can cast a ballot, but there is no compelling reason that a proper ballot should be counted.

    The GOP needs to address this rhetorical position. That people's legitimate votes are not being counted is a far more important issue than who wins or loses.

    Of course, perhaps "middle America" disagrees. We wouldn't want to seem too elitist, you know. I mean, how repugnant that every proper vote should be counted!

    Standard GOP fare, indeed. Perhaps this is something to be included under the "What America Voted For" discussion.
    _____________________

    Notes:

    George, Kathy. "GOP chief accuses election office of misleading public on absentees at issue". SeattlePI.com, December 20, 2004. See http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/204469_gov20.html
     
  10. zanket Human Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,777
    A good assessment of the situation, which is really interesting. I think neither side is being too sleazy here; they’re just making the best arguments they can to get their way. Bottom line is that King County elections staff blew it (and it's easy to theorize that Dems are similarly hurt in major cities in general--small towns, synonymous with Republican towns, can afford a higher quality count the first time). If the GOP wins with the court so that some voters are held to pay for the election staff’s error, then it will get even more interesting.

    My prediction is that the court will side with the GOP, if only because the opposite decision will make them look wishy-washy. If so I’d like to see the Dems take it up to the highest court, but just to make a point since we already know how that would go.
     
  11. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    37,893
    If the GOP wins, though, how big of a class-action suit will be brought? There are lawyers in town right now who can't eat dinner in front of their children because they're salivating enough to wreck the family-dining experience. If only Pavlov was alive, he could have weeks worth of human-subject observation.

    I was willing to accept a Rossi win if it got the state out of this with any dignity, but that chance is blown. Might as well root for the Democrat, now, since the GOP is willing to throw out people's right to vote in order to ensure their win.

    Again, I ask: Why is it that when the GOP wins, the people lose?
     
  12. zanket Human Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,777
    Funny! I hadn't thought of the class-action possibility. But how could any monetary damage be assessed?

    The last question I assume is rhetorical.
     
  13. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    37,893
    More political than rhetorical, but it's almost the same thing.

    I figure a billion-dollar class-action suit would suffice. Assuming for the sake of argument that all 735 votes in question are legit and therefore improperly cancelled, I think an award of $1 million per person with the rest divvied up among the sharks should suffice. Perhaps that's excessive. Maybe $100m.
     
  14. zanket Human Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,777
    The fair class would be all Democrats, as all will be affected if Rossi wins due to the election staff's error. After lawyers' fees are deducted I expect my penny check in 2009. I'm part of a class action that was decided in 2001. I'm still waiting for that check. I read about a guy who submitted all the forms to be part of a class action. He got his $3 check a few years after the court decision. He deposited it. His next bank statement showed a $5 fee for processing the check.
     
  15. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    37,893
    At that point it would be everyone in Washington, and I don't know what court would accept that claim. While the courts are perfectly willing to let a person be sued into bankruptcy, they hate letting corporations go through the same, and the thought of breaking a government is almost beyond reach.

    Improperly-canceled voters from this bloc definitely have a claim. Beyond that ... well, I think it will be enough if the county gets donkey-punched on this one for those votes. This could still end up at the U.S. Supreme Court. At stake is nothing less than one's right to vote. If King County isn't held accountable, we have seen the future of voter fraud: administrative mistakes.
     
  16. zanket Human Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,777
    We saw the future of such vote fraud in Ohio already. All you have to do is have the Republican election commissioner understaff the urban precincts. Those investigating what happened in Ohio may never know how many people walked away from the 5-hour-long lines.

    It is likely that state law prevents election staff from being sued for disenfranchisement.
     
  17. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    37,893
    (Endless nameless?)

    Wash. GOP Divided Over Duty, Politics
    Secretary of State: County has right to fix error

    Attorneys for Republican Secretary of State for the state of Washington, Sam Reed, have filed papers with the state Supreme Court advising that King County must be allowed to fix the procedural errors that have improperly rejected ballots from being counted.

    It would seem to most that Reed is in fact doing his duty, pursuing the ends of his office. Yet state Republicans continue their press against counting ballots, claiming that recognizing people's right to vote could bring mischief:

    The split between Reed's office and the GOP's legal filings is new. During oral arguments last week in a lawsuit before the state Supreme Court, attorneys for Reed, King County, the GOP, and Governor-elect-apparent Rossi all opposed a Democratic request that counties be ordered to reconsider rejected ballots in the recounts. The argument went that a statewide order was not necessary, that counties have the discretionary power to recanvass ballots.

    When, on Friday, Pierce County Superior Court Judge Stephanie Arend granted a temporary order preventing King County from including the disputed ballots in any recount, she did not mention the discretionary power. Arend read the prior Supreme Court order to mean that no reconsideration of the ballots was allowed. Secretary Reed's office disagrees, claiming the judge misread the Supreme Court order.

    For Reed, the problem gets worse if the votes aren't counted. Yesterday's court filings indicate Reed's office has taken an unusual position, attempting to clarify its earlier arguments in the Supreme Court hearing.

    In other words, if this order stands, even more people throughout the state--and not just in King County--will see their right to vote thrown away for bureaucratic mistakes.

    For its part, the GOP is arguing that if Arend's decision is not upheld, the Supreme Court ought to delay action until a trial court can take testimony.

    • • •​

    It would seem this topic was ill-titled.
    ____________________

    Notes:

    Postman, David. "Reed says county has right to fix error, tally 735 ballots". SeattleTimes.com, December 21, 2004. See http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2002125837_recount21m.html
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2004
  18. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    37,893
    Shocker?!

    Shocker?! Dem. Chair Berendt Says Gregoire Takes Lead in Wash. Recount
    Party claims eight-vote margin for their candidate; 735 ballots still in dispute

    Insanity abounds in the Pacific Northwest, and finally it feels like home. The potential eight-vote margin would be the closest gubernatorial vote in state history. State Democratic Party Chair Paul Berendt stated, "We are absolutely confident that she is going to be the next governor of the state of Washington."

    While the GOP has confirmed that the margin appears smaller than a dozen votes, King County Elections spokeswoman Bobbie Egan told reporters, "I'm not going to call the election tonight."

    Democrats would be wise to hold the champagne, though. The state Supreme Court is scheduled to hear arguments regarding 735 ballots erroneously excluded from counting. Viewers in the Seattle area at least can watch the hourlong hearing, set for 9:30 am, on TVW, channel 23 on most cable networks. While the conventional wisdom says the GOP fears these ballots for their origin--King County, which favors Gregoire--there is no guarantee that, if they are counted, they will bring or preserve a Gregoire victory. This can still run afoul, and they'd better not forget it.

    I would hope the Democrats stand on principle, and don't concede these uncounted votes merely because they believe they've won.
    ____________________

    Notes:

    Cook, Rebecca. "Dems: Wash. Recount Puts Gregoire on Top". Guardian.co.uk (Associated Press), December 22m 2004. See http://www.guardian.co.uk/uslatest/story/0,1282,-4687498,00.html

    McGann, Chris, and Christine Frey. "Democrats: Gregoire wins by 8 votes". SeattleTimes.com, December 22, 2004. See http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/204800_gregoire22.html

    Thomas, Ralph. "Gregoire catches Rossi, Democrats say". SeattleTimes.com, December 22, 2004. See http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2002127176_recount22m.html
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2004
  19. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    37,893
    Still Waiting ....
    Rossi supporters: "Welcome to Ukraine"

    There is a breathless edge about the afternoon. I was just on the phone with my brother, and as we talked about the latest headlines in the Washington state gubernatorial race, he clicked in on the websites. "It's the 11:19 AM update," he said.

    Nothing.

    I slept through the arguments this morning, much to my regret. I needed the extra hour and a half, but still, this is important.

    Northwest Cable News reports:

    Nor are the judges the only ones cranky about this. Conservative talk-radio station KVI (570 AM) sponsored a rally today outside the courthouse, where 350 people gathered in support of Republican Dino Rossi.

    On a personal note, I agree that this is becoming really ridiculous, but let's take a look at it: On the one hand, some conservatives would assert that we're running equivalent to the Ukranian election, while in general the GOP's argument is that bureaucratic errors are a suitable justification for the revocation of one's right to vote. It's not polar opposites, but something about politics and strange bedfellows goes here.
    ____________________

    Notes:

    Associated Press and KING Staff. "State Supreme Court deliberates over disputed ballots". NWCN.com, December 22, 2004. See http://www.nwcn.com/topstories/stories/NW_122204ELBrecount_supremecourtLJ.3517e944.html

    (Note: Free registration is required for that link; if you are registered at a local television station website run by Belo Interactive--e.g. KING5.com--your ID and password should work.)
     
  20. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    37,893
    Washington State Supreme Court: Count Disputed Ballots
    Gregoire: Justices recognize "sacred American right"

    The Supreme Court in Washington state ruled unanimously in favor of a Democratic-sponsored request to have over 700 disputed votes in King County included in recount totals. As the state awaits King County's official declaration of unofficial results, the tally rumored to have put Democrat Christine Gregoire over the top by a mere eight votes will not be the last word in this election.

    Whether or not the GOP tactic of seeking after-the-fact to find ballots to dispute in a similar manner will work, or even work to their favor, is beside the point at present. After all, will they pursue that path if the King County ballots somehow turn the vote back to their candidate's favor?

    Nonetheless, the state Supreme Court has made what seems to be the only decision available to them; upholding the GOP position would have the simple effect of putting bureaucratic convenience before the rights of the people the bureaucracy is designed to serve.

    Whatever the outcome, election reform is foremost on state politicians' tongues.

    The news isn't all bad. Secretary of State Sam Reed said last month that the voters didn't seem to care about the delay in declaring a governor insofar as the process was going ahead: "The feedback I'm getting is they find it kind of intriguing, dramatic and kind of fun."

    And that's a positive sign, that watching the system work can still captivate people's attention. Far from not caring about the political process in general, the people are willing to endure a delay if it means democracy itself triumphs. We haven't crowned a caesar yet; there's nothing to take back, and only the prize itself to claim.

    As we approach the 3:30 deadline for the official unofficial, we now hear word that the announcement may not come until 4:00 pm.
    ____________________

    Notes:

    Cook, Rebecca. "Supreme Court: Count disputed ballots in Wash. governor's race". SeattlePI.com, December 22, 2004. See http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/aplocal_story.asp?category=6420&slug=WST Governor Recount

    Kamb, Lewis and Angela Galloway. "The clear winner? Most likely, it'll be election reform". SeattlePI.com, December 22, 2004. See http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/204795_governor22.html

    SeattlePI.com. "Text of Supreme Court decision (76399-2)". December 22, 2004. See http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local...tegory=6420&slug=WA Governor Recount Decision
     
  21. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    37,893
    Preliminary recount puts Gregoire up by 10
    723 King County ballots still to be reviewed; GOP preparing to challenge election in court

    At present, conservatives are furious. In the background as I type, a man rants via telephone on Northwest Cable News about provisional and absentee balloting in Spokane. The angry man is unwilling to listen to the political analyst explain the answer.

    He's explaining to the caller that it was the Gregoire camp that fought for the very ballots the man is complaining about. This is the most interesting political day in a while.

    Oh, a link. Ummm ... here:

    Associated Press and KING Staff. "Gregoire leads by 10 votes". NWCN.com, December 22, 2004. See http://www.nwcn.com/topstories/stories/NW_122204ELBrecount_gregoire_2EL.36796f6b.html
     
  22. zanket Human Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,777
    Christmas came early!

    GOP's now gonna argue to the state supreme court that a whole bunch of other voters were disenfranchised due to election staff errors in other counties, so the judge should just rubberstamp the 2nd count.
     
  23. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    37,893
    Well, if the GOP can show these problems, that's one thing. But the guy I heard hollering on the phone-in on NWCN was ranting about the ballots thrown out in Spokane, some 1,600 or more (I don't remember the actual number), but he was unsatisfied when the in-studio analyst pointed out that King County threw out over 4,000. Rossi supporters right now have a hard time understanding that these 700+ votes have not yet been given their due process. If the GOP can show other votes that have not been given due process, then I say count 'em. Furthermore, if the end result is that every vote cast according to law was counted according to law, the political system will have pulled off a rare feat, perhaps unheard-of at this scale.

    As long as the fight's afoot, let's get them all.

    One possibility is that the GOP will raise a flimsy case that fails any reasonable standard, and then complains that votes not cast according to law were not treated appropriately. And you know, people 'round Seattle, at least, once they're convinced of something, don't put up with hyperbole. This will remain interesting in the proverbial sense for a while.
     

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