Bush wins the election

Anyone visited http://www.michaelmoore.com/ to see his tribute to the elected president?

 

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David F.

Let say I want to kill someone, why should that be wrong without the worry of eternal damnation by some deity you ask. Quite simple philosophies in fact can be derived to make laws. For example a philosophy of social survival proclaims that killing people will cause others to kill you, “be bad others will be bad to you” and examples of anarchism can be cited as to what happens when laws are not made. Socialism proclaims making laws and government so that everyone can live well. A moral right or wrong can be determine of such philosophies: it wrong to kill because other will kill you, it wrong to kill because it influences the society negatively, ect No need for a “it wrong to kill because my deity said so”

As for separation of government from religion, what happens when two or more religions influence a government’s polices at once? The separation of government from religion is to prevent placing religionist views that conflict with others religious views as law. As what was happening with the Americans by Europeans at the time of the revolution. Surely the founding father were Christian and there christen tendency remain entrapped in are constitution, also religion does in fact affects our polices and laws but using religion to make a law causes many conflict and at many times have later been found wrong, horribly so.

 

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Again absurd equivocation.

Congratulations. It'll do you some good.

 

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I would agree with WCF, religion is not the basis of moral values and laws. At least not until you call common sense your god.

And about religion and government, I do not think that it is a good thing to not have them seperated. It will only cause more bias and struggle. Middle eastern countries have been attacked on the basis of their state religion... why should that be different with a christian government. Also, what good are gods laws if no one keeps to them?

 

My comment about respect was simply intended to highlight incompetent, biased moderation. Perhaps if you were as literate as you ask everyone else to be, I wouldn't have explain such a simple point to you.

Your conjecture is demeaning and way, way off-base (as usual).

No I didn't actually, you see I was really just trying to expose some hypocracy and partisanship.

That you would assume one must "stoop to accomodate me" based on your clear ignorance and misunderstanding of my words, is clear evidence of your hatred and disgustingly elitist attitude.

What? Such smarmy little lies. If you were trying not to mention it, you wouldn't have. I suppose you "couldn't help yourself"? So you lie about not wanting to present it and then lie in its presentation?

Posting out of context lines from a private message is despicable. If you're going to post it, why not keep the context so as not to distort it. You are absolutely disgusting.

Since you want to expose me for the stupid, illiterate ignoramous that I am, here's that message in full.

LOL. What about YOUR confessed hatred that you defend as "too complicated for me to understand". My god man, you are a nut case. You should seriously seek help.

You're a nutjob. I simply don't give the slightest care about your opinion of my posting history. Have you taken a look at your own? Man you're fucked in the head dude. What's your diagnosis? I'm guessing you should be taking lithium, but the pills dry you out so you stop taking them after a while, slip back into your paranoid delusions, get rounded up - then start the cycle all over again. That's a tough life.

You have really hit bottom of the barrel here. You employ the tried and true tactic: I know you are but what am I? WTF? Man come on don't you have a single, substanative anything? You make me want to puke.

This hypocracy is madness. I see it clearly now. You're simply insane. You accuse me of no facts, without presenting a single fact, and posting out of context PMs... oh man. You're making my head explode. Well, good luck sorting out that whole mess you've created for yourself. Just don't spill it over on my lawn.

So now more "I know you are but what am I"? What a lost cause you are. I used to think you had something usefull to say. You must be in the "off the meds cycle". I hope you get rounded up soon and back on the meds so you can go back to some actual useful analysis.

It's really not cool to edit my words to suit your taste. I don't imagine you care.

What would your insane ass know about where I'm going? man you're something else.

LOL.

Justice: as Brian knows it. (who cares what america thinks)
Termperance: as Brian knows it (who cares what america thinks)
Freedom: as Brian knows it (who cares what america thinks)
Equality: as Brian knows it (who cares what america thinks)

In fact, damn america for contradicting your obviously superior ass. They'll get what they deserve, you just watch. Brian says so!

Disgusting.

 

I think this topic of how much religion should influence governments should be moved to another thread, but instead of try the daunting task of splitting it off, I just going to start anther thread to continue the discussion: http://sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=42131

 

Pro or con, this is plain stupid:
Woman sheds T-shirt to vote

By MICHELLE MacEACHERN - Staff Writer

Irma Arroyo-Long voted in her bra Tuesday, after being told that she couldn't do so in her political T-shirt.

Poll workers called police, but Arroyo-Long said she wasn't arrested or cited. But she is thinking about suing over it.

A 42-year-old stay-at-home mother, she said she showed up with her husband, Jim Long, to vote at about 1 p.m. at the CARD Community Center on Vallombrosa.

There were a couple of people voting, and no one behind them. She had her ID in hand when a poll worker said she couldn't vote in her shirt, which had a picture of both the first President George Bush and his son, President George W. Bush, along with the slogan "dumb and dumber" in bold white letters.

"I went to go vote and they told me I couldn't vote in what I was wearing, it was electioneering. The woman said you can't wear that.' I said since when', I've always worn political T-shirts to vote before," she said. "It's my way of being patriotic."

The poll worker said there was a law against electioneering, or advocating for or against a candidate or measure, within 100 feet of a polling place. County Elections official Candace Grubbs confirmed the rule, but wasn't present at the incident.

Arroyo-Long said poll workers told her it might be intimidating to those who didn't share her opinions.

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http://www.chicoer.com/Stories/0,1413,135~25088~2510167,00.html

"You know, I was going to vote for Bush, but then I saw that scary woman in her anti Bush T shirt, and now I'm too scared to."

 

Ideally religion and politics should be seperate. But more and more they are becoming indivisible subjects in America. People don't get it - you can have devoutly religious people as leaders, who *don't* feel their personal beliefs should be imposed on everybody else. Jimmy Carter was a evalangalistic reborn Christian - but kept that very much in his personal rather than public realm.

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America today? Think Germany, 1933

 

No offense taken . . . stud. Which part was the ''stupidest fucking thing''? The part about political leaders imposing their religious views on us?

Or the Germany 1933 part? If so, can you even find Germany on an umarked map? I used to live there, and remember its history well.

Take a quick look at Germany in the 1930's and 40's. Here was a country that was finacially crippled with a massive budget deficit owing billions of dollars to the rest of the world. Just like the USA.

In the 1930's Germany was a country where the burning of the Reichstag, seen as a terrorist attack on Germany, was used to create external enemies and to exert internal control over the German people. Hitler then used the media to lie, frighten and decieve the population, allowing a bunch of vicious, extreme, right wing megalomaniacs to gain power. Just like the USA.

In the 1930's Hitler was surrounded by a group of unelected officials whose sole objective was to take control of Germany for their own ends and with the use of their military might, take control of the assets and prosperity of other, weaker countries. Just like the USA.

In 1939 Hitler embarked on a series of pre-emptive attacks on sovereign nations in the name of "freeing the people" of that country. Just like the USA.

In 1940 the German hierarchy started building special "camps" or detention centres in which to incarcerate and eventually execute those people considered to be "against" their regime. Just like the USA.

As Germany invaded the countries surrounding them during World War II, they found that far from having conquered the country and "liberated" the people, the people of that country formed nationalist "resistance" groups and used guerilla warfare to kill, harrass and slowly demoralise the occupying army. Just like the USA.

"History is little more than the register of crimes, follies, and misfortunes of mankind" wrote Edward Gibbon, the British historian in The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire. History should teach us a great many things, but unfortunately the majority of Americans know very little about history, or for that matter, the rest of the world. Don't believe me? Ask an American where Admiral Lord Nelson, one of the worlds greatest naval commanders, died or what nationality Alexander the Great was? Better still, ask an American to point to pretty much any foreign country on a map. Try North Korea.

If you know nothing of history, you cannot learn the lessons history teaches. You continue to make the same mistakes. Hitler's mistake was to wage war on too many fronts at once and underestimate the ferocity of the guerilla wars being fought against him by resistance groups all over Europe. Eventually it was Russia, or to be more precise, the Russian winter and Hitler's hubris, that proved to much for the disillusioned German troops, sick and tired of fighting and dying for a regime that they belatedly realised was illegitimate.

Hitler, in the last desperate act of a cowardly tyrant, committed suicide. Germany, defeated and destroyed, had lost everything. Those who had been instrumental in Germany's war and propoganda machine where tried and executed. Eventually Germany once agaain became a democracy, but it had taken the deaths of many millions of people to restore that democracy.

Despite Germany's huge arsenal of weapons, it had lost the war because those running Germany were right wing neo-conservatives who propogated an illegal war through lies and deception and stirred up the anger of all decent thinking people on the planet with their evil deeds.

Just like America

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You sound pretty stupid . . . no offense.

 

Well then, their (terrorists) plans sure backfired.

 

Not necessarily, terrorists are still at large, and what did the USA gain so far? If anything, they made more enemies and have gotten much more unpopular, also, they have lost a lot of money because of war and terrorism. I do not think that we have seen the end of this yet.

 

VAKEMP,

I would not really say that: as they were looking for attention to there issues and disrupting USA economy, both well accomplished with 9/11. As Bin Laden said in his last tape bring down America economical is a primary goal and is achievable if not being achieved.

 

Ad hominem attacks are always favored by those with a weak argument (or poor debating skills). Chuck has probably learned that from the master of ad homs, Rush Limbaugh.

 

If you cant answer why Osama chose US to attack and not Sweden then Houston we have a problem here...

 

Uhhhhh, how so? -- 14 of the 19 hijackers were Saudi's . . . . Saudia Arabian families/companies apparently funded it and the Cole bombing and other terrorist activity's against us. We are still buddy-buddy with the Saudi's. Al Quida and the Saudi's have long been enemies with Iraq.

Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 . . . a point that has been repeated a million times, and yet - obviously from yesterdays vote - nobody seems to GET.

Far from their plans backfiring, they GOT AWAY!

 

Its a very very sad day for America and a very sad day for the world. We need another revolution.

 

I dont think that the American people want a revolution. They had their chance but didnt use it.

Just dont understand how after so many lies, lies and more lies

 

Ever read the book Fahrenheit 451? That what is happening just not as metaphorical? Or better yet Germany 1930’s was the better comparison. *tips hat in Gravity direction* authoritarianism and singular thought are extremely dangerous.

 

What has Al Qaida gained? Osama wanted the 'infidels' out of the Middle East, and now there are more westerners in the ME than before.

Osama no longer has the backing of the Afghan government (former Taliban), and can no longer train his terrorists in the camps he had there.

This isn't a popularity contest.

The best defense is a good offense.

Me neither, but as long as Osama knows he is on our hit list, he will be less effective.

 

I know why, but my point is that Osama is now realizing that the US doesn't take kindly to threats.