How do you solve a problem called....Tony

What will that take? It will take a shedding of our formal definition of Christian. Lets go back to the disciples of Christs actuall definition...."brethren," "the faithful," "elect," "saints," "believers."

Tiassa do you believe that you are more than biological function? I surmise fom my brief interaction with you that you do. We are all eluded by man made definitions and interpretations. I boldly state in the precence of "El" and all present that you tiassa not only know that you are more than the sum of your molecules but that you believe you and ALL of us should be aware and reverant to that fact and have some respect and honor for that creation and be in awe of the cause of such a vast and miraculouse thing as life. I have yet to witness you denying the existance or need of such revelation, just a differance with the terminology or "box" that so called Christians have given it. And a dire need to point out the hipocracy of such christians. You are not wrong tiassa, you would in fact pointing out what is painfully obviouse to any believer that we are more than the sum of our parts. And that we are above ALL equal in not only our ignorance of knowledge but in our search for such knowledge.

I am not so much a statistical deviation if you look at the larger picture of men, theologians, scientists, and so labeled pagans and other meare mortals who hold to the same beliefs under different termonologys. It is time that true believers stand up and go against the status quo and speak the truth. Too long we have alowed ourselves to be equaled to the false indoctrinations and allowed the name of God to be associated with irrational and absurd teachings.

 

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Elbaz,

Your thoughts on this matter are admirable and definitely worthwhile. However, I think you are overdramatizing what is happening here. This is not a collective condemnation of Tony1 due to his offences for all eternity. As a matter of fact, the door remains and will always (I hope) remain open for him to re-enter the forums as a civil, thoughtful and empathetic participant.

But he does deserve a slap on the butt for his behavior. Though he is demonstrably not a child, the analogy I believe is appropriate: mere admonishments and moral lectures do not always work on abusive children. Sometimes, it is appropriate to palpably demonstrate the personal ramifications of antisocial behavior when it comes to relationships with others.

You can go on and try to have mutual exchanges with him. Sooner or later, I'm willing to bet, you will come to the same conclusions.

Good luck.

Taken,

You are right of course with respect to learning from life. However, personally I'd rather not have such lessons to learn to begin with. It is one thing to stumble upon something that is manifestly new and therefore remarkable and worthwhile. But in this case, a person joins conversation while simultaneously breaking (it seems very deliberately) the very rules of conversation. It would have been ok if his point was to question the rules; however that is not the point. The only point, it appears, is to destroy. I should know; I entered that very mindset a while back and pelted him with his own medicine all over these boards for a couple of weeks. When I finally realized the futility of it and stopped, he was disappointed. He actually complimented me on producing "good" stuff and called out for more. Well, not from me thank you very much. The bad taste is still lingering in my mouth.

 

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I'm in!

I also think that this should be a two week peroid.
In progress.....

I agree mostly with Cris's stance.
Tony1 shouldn't be cast out, nor any valid arguments he makes discounted.
What I believe is that while he's entitled to his views and opinions, I don't have to answer them, especially when they're just out of context quotes used to divert the path of our arguments.

Cainxinth, well done for bringing all of this to the fore!

 

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Firstly, thanks for the compliment, Taken. But there is nothing to be ashamed of. I know lots of kids my age who act stupid, so you'd have good reason to assume the intelligence of an adolescent based on statistics. But I'd like to take it far deeper than that.

People are more than they show on the surface. Just like Tony1, and his behavior, adolescents are often misunderstood. You all have to look back to your teen years. When you walk into a store with some friends, the clercks watch you like you're going to steal something. I take from what I've seen that Tony1 is quite a disturbed person. All this fear of going to hell or what not, and brainwashing his parents probably gave him, led him to his present behavior. So we stereotype him as a narrowminded, adolescent, christian, where even religion shouldnt be dragged through the mud.

My point is, I dont care how he acts; i dont have to like him or even read all of his posts. I wont Judge anyone, its not place, I just trust proven virtues, more than sudden whims. I dont really like the guy, but I'll give everyone as much respect as I want to get back. Like, if I stereotype people, than I'd better expect someone to stereotype me.

Its nothing to do with tony1. Its not about anybody, but myself. If I want to improve myself and the world I will one day play a (hopefully) much bigger role in, then I gotta live with full awareness of the world around me, and give what I want to get back (I dont have to ramble on about ghandi). Its not for us to decide if he deserves a slap on the ass, we arent his parents.

((((BTW, I realize my posts are often emotional and sorta wordy, but thats just how I express myself the best, with emotion.))))

About the thing that people are more than just molecules, I have something I think I can add.

Now I am no scientist, but from what I collect of all these ghost and paranormal phenomena, which I've experienced myself, I'd say there is a form of energy not yet discovered. Lets call it life energy.

The reason it hasn't been discovered - science and society is still young. A hundred years ago we didnt have computers. It would have been nearly impossible for us back then to postulate the highest prime number, we need computers for that.

We knew very little about space, people still believed in the ether. Well you get my point. This 'life energy' manifests itself, in my opinion anyway, in the form of living organisms. From the most intelligent at the top, down to plants and bacteria. This probably ties in one way or another to evolution and all that but I dont want to get into a conversation about that. Its a huge topic.

Peace.

 

Now you're talking.

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Religions which tend to discover that life force are Neo-Paganism, Paganism and Budhism. Not in a scientifical way, but spiritual.
I myself prefer both methods combined, spiritual and scientific. They should give the best results. Mainly because the other side warns If I have gone too far in assumptions not facts.
It's an interesting thing to do-search for supreme life force and I beleive tht in ancient times people discovered tht, but we have forgot. Ar it was entirely a different culture[Atlantis]
[building of piramids, stonehenge, energized spots, Machu Pichtu, and many other places we can not explain.
Some have a version about aliens. It could be so. I think that there is nothing to argue about. You know - one side against another- who is right. The path to discovering those facts is more interesting than the results, so I think people need to stop fight about their differences and get to business.
Christianity, Islam and partly Hindu are blocking these processes.

I'll return to this later, have to go.
Bye!

 

It would not be so difficult if he were to use your exact statements when quoting, not the statement minus its meaning. Were he to use facts I might feel more compassion for him. He is very blatant in his deception and for this I must at least relent. He makes it so darn easy.

 

Toward the heart of the matter

I think you've pretty much nailed the most glaring trend. He's been called on it in the past, and has expressed that he feels he is answering your intent instead of the dictionary definition of the sentence. The presumptuousness of this is ridiculous: he claims in effect to know your sentiments better than you, just as he claims to know the thoughts and processes of God by proxy of his assurance of his salvation and his declarations of demonic possession. He mentioned, even, that he feels he's trying to inject humor into the topics. In this sense, it would be that much more apparent if he was actually basing his humor on something real in the topic, and not some imaginary tangent. All in all, Tony1's excuses don't suffice.

Again, Teg, you're pushing toward the heart of the matter. I fully understand the notion that the faithful think of the Bible as factual, and that's well and fine in and of itself. (As an abstract and independent concept, sure.) But we see in his lack of any real insight the paucity of that reliance. He presumes that everyone reads the words the same, or else that they should. But when he puts a bowdlerized Biblical quote and a couple of sarcastic digressions up, and expects his fellow posters to simply guess how the diversion is supposed to be relevant, we can only take his words according to what he presents. It hasn't occurred to him that perhaps certain sentences bear different weight for different people. It seems obvious to most of us: there are many, many Christians, and just as many interpretations of how those individuals relate to their chosen God. I just don't understand the apparent presumption on Tony1's part that we all interpret subjective ideas the same way. Nor can I accept the presumption that the same way that everyone should be interpreting subjectivity is coincidental to the prejudices of a narrow-minded supremacist.

And there we see a fundamental problem of supremacist notions. As far as I'm concerned, one can believe whatever the hell they want. Certain things, though, like supremacist philosophies, require the invalidation of the very liberty that allows their value. He can be as supremacist as he wants in his own mind, but if he can't explain that supremacy in coherent terms, he really shouldn't be using it to drag topics into the muck. In this case, if he could factually back his supremacist philosophies, they would at least bear enough merit to respect. It's really hard to invalidate a certain, inherent respect owed any human being, but consistent supremacist disrespect toward others is one of the quickest forfeitures I can think of short of crimes against a person. It's not that his human worth is any lower because of his spite, but his intellectual worth is demonstrably limited and that inherent mutual respect 'twixt persons is apparently best embodied--to judge according to his posts--as naked distrust and hatred.

And that, to get back to a point discussed by Elbaz and Bambi, is exactly why we're taking this topic to examine the issue as a posting community. It is not necessarily "pushing somebody out of the group", and, as Bambi noted, it's not for all time. To wit: We cannot push anyone who can still post out of the group. But if, for instance, Oxygen chooses to run a moderated discussion on something, is there any violation involved in excluding irrelevant and disruptive posts? The portion of the posting community that spends its efforts in the Religion forum seem to be discussing cooperative moderation here.

The problem is that these are not moderated discussions; well, that's not the problem in itself. But, as noted, Tony1 makes it really easy to light up his posts by the fires of scrutiny. In that light we see nothing but evasions, sarcasm, and condemnation. What, Banshee is in the thrall of Satan? So why not just note that Tony1 is just another Nazi in sheep's clothing? Think about that: from zero to condemnation in 2.2 seconds, and, as you noted, Teg, no facts to back up his smarmy bigotries. It is Tony1's right to insert himself in discussions however he sees fit, and we as a community have come around to discussing what to do about it. As easy as it is to smash your head against the brick wall he offers in lieu of a point, we must do something to preserve our more relevant topics; it's too easy to join this Christian in his mad quest to destroy communication and learning. (What? He's even said he would be ashamed of himself if he ever had a new idea--e.g. if he ever learned something new.)

And looking back, Teg, it seems I've addressed this post more generally than specifically. Admittedly, I'm too lazy at this moment to go back and pull the specific references to you directly, so let me say thank you for the springboard ....

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thanx,
Tiassa

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Two hundred years or so ago this kangaroo court might have
debated the same fate, but that time the debate would have been
whether you wanted a ‘nigger,’ to be-a-writin on this here board.
But times are-a-changin and now the fingers are-a-pointin at folk
who believe in the all-evil-murderin, low down dirty god. How dare they express they feelins, on this a religious board.

Hehehe... This is the funniest thing I’ve seen on this board yet. You want to boycott another person because he gets up your nose.
So you form some sort of a government to decide his fate.

I suppose you could call it ‘democracy’ but I call ‘demo(n)-crac(z)y.

I can understand that he gets on your nerves, but this takes the biscuit.

Have you read some of your own posts?
I fail to see the difference in terms of insults and lack of information, to back your claims.

Originaly posted by Cris;
And this should not be seen as a dispute between ‘believers and non-believers’. Tony1 is largely indiscriminant with his incivility. Although I am sure the religionists may well feel reluctant to join this fray.
So have fun.

This is the basis for a democratic society. In the extreme we have Usama Bin Laden who has exhibited inappropriate behavior and he will be likely killed for those actions.
Cris

Of course it should not be seen as such, perish that thought.
I will try and have as much fun as I can.
I hope this sucker squirms.

Hey don’t just stop at bin Laden, what about all the stranded people, they shouldn’t be allowed to get away with his actions, after all, they do look a bit like him.

I'm sure, deep down, tony1 actually wants to believe creationism and CRAP, because religion is where he finds comfort, but blocks out the sheer relevance and truth of evolution by refusing to learn anything about it, or diverting the subject constantly.
Elbaz

Hmmmm! I know there’s an insult in their somewhere. But I guess as a creationist I’m just too dumb to find it.

And while the awesome power of fanaticism is manifest of late in the very tragedy of 9/11, perhaps it is more productive to drain the swamp instead of chasing after mosquitoes.

Bambi

Fancy not thinking like the rest of the pack. And especially with 9/11 and the possible threat of more attacks.

Hmmmmmmm........!

Yeah, you are probably right. this could lead to some serious word play, I say lets shoot the bastard, before its too late.

Loooone nut I just knew that Sir Loony Tune craped all over the thread!!.

Godless.

Loone, if I was you I would git the hell ouda town, we don’t want your kind here mixin wid us good ‘onest folk. And if we hear you bein all peacefull and talkin bout god on this religious forum agin, you will get the same treatment as terrorist Tony1. You are eider wid us or agin us.


I think it is a pathetic idea and microsm of the present day world at large.

Please feel free to boycott me.

Love

Jan Ardena.

 

Jan you make some valid points, but Tony1 is just a d*** plain and simple. Read his posts, he’s universally argumentative, he has poor manners to say the least, he constantly uses quotes out of context, and he’s just generally an annoying and obnoxious person. If you met someone like him in the real world you would keep your distance. Unfortunately in an online forum we don’t have that luxury. So, I took the initiative to exclude this jerk from the discourse of people who are interested in amicable and mutually beneficial debate, and frankly I think I made the right decision.

 

ROFLMAO

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...Good one! Point made very well indeed.

 

damn right, taken. why is it funny though? Do you normally hang out with jerks?

 

Sorry, we must have posted at the same time, I was laughing at Jan Ardena's post.

 

Jan, I'm curious: do you have children? What does one say, then, to a child who will not permit its parents to discuss something? What does one say when Mom and Dad are talking about where Dad's next job is going to come from and all the kid wants to do is sit there saying, "Daddy's the Devil! Daddy's the Devil!"

Will you ask the child to be quiet?

"No! You be quiet!"

What do you do?

Apparently, attempting to reason with the child, or adopting the stance of ignoring such deviant behavior is pathetic. It looks like we're back to woodshed parenting? I hadn't thought of that solution, but it might be worth it to fly out to where Tony1 is and thrash him with a block of wood.

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So what is a democracy, Jan? One where everyone sits around taking abuse from the village idiot?

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Seriously, man ... what, is a public library demoncrazy because you're expected to not scream at the top of your lungs the whole time you're inside?

Given that you see an insult in classifying Tony1's beliefs as "creationism and crap", I might ask you what you would call it. It's anticatholic bigotry with no basis aside from his own spite (his interpretation of the Bible is his only justification for his obssessive hatred for Catholics); his "science" is not science at all, but rather pointing out an incomplete data set and claiming that to be definitive evidence of falsehood ... where does he employ any affirmative argumentation? Where does the creationist in him offer any science to justify creationism as science? When does he offer any real evidence that Catholics aren't Christian? Opinions are not evidence.

You said you're a creationist: Can you show evidence? Or are you going to sit around like other creationists and tell the scientists what you think they're doing wrong?

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It's starting to be a disturbing trend: dismissal, accusation, dismissal, condemnation .... Do you realize that the biggest problem with Tony1 is that he portrays the worst in Christianity? If an atheist were to assert that such Christians exist in the world, s/he would be condemned as a bigot. Yet here we see it, a representative of Christ who aims to chase people away from salvation based on a solemn distrust of everyone. A pseudo-compassion that wants to elevate people's spiritual status to bitter and condemning--some elevation.

Tell you what, Jan: pop on over to the Religion and Human Division thread. Buried in there is a massive post outlining one of Tony1's patterns and digressions. He has chosen not to defend against the accusations, but to counter-accuse. His most vocal support has chosen not to demonstrate the errors of the outline, but instead to counter-accuse. And when, ever, do we see documentation of what is being complained about or commentary on why those points are problematic?

Why don't you pop on back through the nine-plus months of his posting history and tell me what you see.

You, even, chose to stick with the counterattack philosophy. Why? If you think the behavior is unjust, go ahead and condemn it, but be prepared to do better than the same sort of crap that has people upset in the first place.

You could show how one of Tony1's dismissals of history is proper. You could show how one of Tony1's accusations that people are in conspiracy against everything good (demon accusations, Satan accusations) is appropriate. Do you understand that's like me consistently referring to you as a child rapist because I decided it was the way I wanted to refer to you? Think about what Satan represents to Christians: this evil is what he accuses. And yet you would sit here and defend it? Should I hold you in league with those who would oppress and destroy cultures based on a delusional religious mandate? After all, Torquemada, it's what you're attempting to preserve with your counterattack. (I don't want to see word one about the excesses of calling you a mother-raping, child-burning, dog-kicking, insulin-stealing post-Inquisitorial Nazi because it would be hypocritical of you to protest in my words what you defend in Tony1's.)

Would you like me to take the Tony1 tack? I can do that:

You need to shut the hell up, Jan, because you're not actually talking about anything. You aren't actually writing about the topic or any of our debates, just some stupid lie you've made up to call the topic or call a debate.

That is the "debating" tactic you're supporting.

A part of this community is sick of Tony1's crap. They've chosen to spend some time examining the problem. Tell me, Jan, if a drunk man is standing on the streetside, shouting insults and condemnations at your family, you'd permit this to go on? You would allow some dude to follow your wife everywhere you go and tell her she's possessed by the devil? Or would you take active steps to prevent that kind of harassment?

Judging by your post, I sincerely hope you have neither a spouse nor children. I'll bet your neighbors are real fond of you, too: do you prevent them from calling the police when there's some civil disturbance about? What about the kids across the street playing Satanic heavy metal with the volume cranked to 11?

But yeah, Jan. Get into the search engine on the site and pull up Tony1's posting history. There's nine months worth of his crap in there, and I'm curious to see what your assessment is. Don't worry about actually doing it, though: nobody else who defends Tony1's spiteful behavior has bothered to do that, either.

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Here, I'll help you: an early debate I had with Tony1--I love this one because a couple pages in, you'll hit Tony1's med-school bender. Remember, your body doesn't do anything to heal; healing just happens

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http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?postid=37886#post37886

Or here's another one: http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?threadid=2571 For this topic, tell me please what his contribution is. At this point, he was tolerable in the sense that he largely ran around in circles, but you're going to have to tell me what looks so noble about his manner. The most part of his posts are diversionary at best, and one of my favorites is when he resorts, on 4/7, to the line that Catholics aren't perfectly wrong. Even back then, it would have been nice if he had anything to contribute to the topic.

Really ... just go to the search page and enter "Tony1" to search by user name. Follow his posting career and let us all know what you think. I well understand that in your two-plus months positng with us, Jan, you've seen a lot of hostility flung around the board. But then again, we might point out that it's only two months and already you're frustrated with things you see at the board. Give it another seven and let me know how it feels.

Anyway, I look forward to your assessment of Tony1's 1430 posts and the discussions he's chosen to involve himself in. It should be a bang-up review, no matter what you conclude. Ah, and one last thing: You may have noticed that some Christian posters here like to respond to citations that don't technically exist. I know it's a lot to ask when you're surveying that many posts, but if you're so compelled to cite and abridge sentences to comment on, it would be appreciated if you did not undertake the pattern we've come to know and love in Tony1, and which his vocal defender(s) seem to prefer. Specifically, don't rewrite sentences in order to accommodate an anemic, stock answer. I can't recall that you've done this yet, but I imagine it's tempting to do that in light of a paucity of evidence.

And somewhere in those 1430 posts is Tony1's admission that he doesn't have anything to contribute to the topics he disrupts. Let me know what you think of that sequence.

In the meantime, this congress of posters will continue to murmur until we either devise a solution or decide to not give a damn what Tony1 has to say. You'll note that Bambi even reminded that this isn't a permanent thing, and I'll reinforce that it's not really much of anything. It is, rather, people choosing not to continue destroying topics trying to communicate with him.

Well, if you insist. But why should we? You're known enough for posting reasonable and coherent topics at least; I'm curious why you've resorted to shooting back. I'm quite sure you're capable of expressing yourself more clearly than you did--we actually know this. So why shoot into the counter-accusing mode? Is it that you didn't read the posting history and don't know what the source of people's impatience is? Is it that you've ignored the direct inquiries as to his digressive nature? Really, if you're not ignoring the situation, and if you're reading the history, I'm sure you can give us a better condemnation of our hideous victimization of such an innocent and loveable persona.

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Seriously ... what have you got other than an anemic counterattack?

We're waiting.

thanx,
Tiassa

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I dont like Tony1, his tactics, or his beliefs.

Whoever does, like tiassa said, doesnt know him well enough.
I've seen all the crap he's posted and how stupid it is. Truthfully, I dont read all of his posts, I skim 'em sometimes, but thats beside the point.

Its his right, to have an opinion and beliefs, no matter who the hell he is or how stupid he is. Every person was born into the world with the same rights. Not necessarily on a level playing field for other qualities (eg intelligence), but rights. And I believe in preserving them for everybody. This guy has a right to, and we can tell him to tone it down, if he has a good bone in his body. Thats alright. And let me make it clear I knkow its not permanent, its not banishing him. Its all about the self. What kind of people we are.

I dont want to really get into this. But we should act like the better people, the adults. Deal with it head on. Tell the guy what we think of him and that we want him to stop. We dont have to act like little kids in old school.

Like that commercial. What do ya do when your kid has a tempertantrum in superstore? will ignoring them work? nope. Hitting them? nope. You gotta deal with it head on. This thread has definately accomplished that. Getting all the feelings out in the open. How we all feel about him.

Now I want to hear how he feels about our comments and his behaviour.

Ignoring it will just make it go back to normal in one week. only with more hate. I'll admit that now I realize what I hadnt before. We have to deal with it. I want to see tony1's feelings on all dis.

Also, look back at your behaviours, all. How would you feel if you got criticized like that. Would you like it. What would you think of the person who posted your post. Do you have any regard for their feelings and above all, rights? Does anyone see how childish this is. We shouldnt have to act this way, but I guess people just dont grow up. None of us.

 

Bigotry and such

Originally posted by Jan Ardena

Well Jan, do you recall the last time he used such a word as "because" in one of his proclamations? I think if you review my posts you will mostly (if not universally) see grounds given for my claims. Tony1 doesn't give grounds, except: I'm with God ergo I'm right. Questioning his grounds results in him declaring that a circular argument is perfectly fine as long as he believes in it. Sure, except following such an exchange I really have nothing more to say to the guy. After all, I'm hoping for someone who would reciprocate with thought (which, I hoped for a while, shouldn't be an insurmountable problem for someone that intelligent.)

Merely an analogy, for those out there who put religion as a moral guide beyond reproach. Just the other day I've read of a couple Jewish extremists planning to blow up an LA mosque and a Congressman's office. And a few days ago I've read about the Christian "Army of God" plans to send terminally ill people strapped with explosives into abortion clinics to blow themselves up (mind you, of all the domestic terrorist organizations in U.S., how many are not Christian?)

But in all honesty, I now think Tony1 is too far gone to be reached. He actually believes in miracle healings even while at the same time attacking objective science. He goes so far as to say, in full seriousness, that his ills and hurts never heal naturally but rather instantaneously courtesy of his deity. Of course, we would all love him to provide material evidence of the supernatural by getting a team of scientists to document his miraculous healings. I can tell you his position on the issue though: he considers all scientists to be morons who are in addition insane, so good luck trying to convince him that he ought to either put up or shut up. But in all sincerity, do you think such statements are representative of a sane individual? This is so far beyond creationism, it has long since ceased to be funny. And whether he really is insane or merely chooses to act like it, what hope is there for a productive debate with him?

Of course I can only speak for myself, but I'm not boycotting any religion here. Nor am I boycotting the representatives of any religion. In fact, if I didn't want to discuss religion I wouldn't be on these forums. But I am boycotting an individual who leaves me no other choice. Mind you, if he holds true to his facade he won't really miss my replies; after all he had always considered me to be an insane moron anyway.

 

tiassa,

I have looked back and read the threads to which you pointed.

Do you want my honest assessment?

 

I'm going to be risky here, and Actually point something out...

Although I too detest Tony1 for the method that my first "Serious" post was turned around and shoved back at me, and every post since I have been as cheeky as possible at him.

I can't say I totally outright think that he should curl up and die, because without his deranged babblings and quotations, the whole religion forum wouldn't have someone to KICK around.

So in away, although I dispise him, I'm sticking up for him

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I don't think he should leave the board, but admittedly you don't have to take what he says seriously, much like he doesn't take anything we say seriously.

I suppose you could say if we keep Tony1 on the forum then there is no room for any other religious fruitcake.

 

It's been a while.

I haven't been aroud these parts in a while, but I am familar with Tony1. My take is it is just another case of mental masterbation tht comes around here once in a while.

He walks up to a hornet's nest pokes his stick in and rattles it up. Then runs over to the next one and does it again. He gets mad when he gets stung and all for what? Becuase it centers the attention around him.

There is nothing you can do to stop some one from this behavior except to ignore them and push them a way. The mabye some day down the line he will realize that it is his own behavior that has caused him to be an out cast.

I think it was Taken who made the statment that he is a daily reminder of what we should not become. Now imagine if you had some near you every day of your life that was an image of what you should not do or become. After a while it would just plain piss you off.

This is why we have the ability to learn. So we don't need a daily reminder of what not to do. Though some, like Tony1, chose not to learn, but to continue "blind folded" for one or several of manny reasons.

 

Blonde Cupid

Of those and his other 1400 posts.

Whenever you get around to it.

thanx,
Tiassa

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The one thing that doesn’t abide by majority rule
is a person’s conscience.
Harper Lee