Liars... liars... filthy American Liars

wesmorris, was it green_world?

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here is my veiw on it in a nut shell:

1. America is attack at 9/11
2. Bush declares war on anyone that would make a good scape goat and make it look like bush is actually doing something.
3. Saddam actually had the balls to stand up to the USofA and cut oil unlike is comrades, as a result he really pisses the Bush administration off.
4. So we invade with made up reasons like Iraq has WMD and Iraq funds terrorist (who doesn't in the region?!?)
5. War profiteering and lots of free oil, good for bush.
6. The American people cheer because we are so stupid now, at this rate of failing intelligence it won’t be long before most Americans die from drowning when they staring into the rain with their mouths open!

 

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Wes :
Boy you remind me of someone else from this board... what's his name again? Can you guess?

I see sherlock has put on his glasses

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I'm not sure what you meant here. Is it "hey you passed phase 2 as well" or "oh you idiot, back to phase 1 for you"? My inquiring mind must know..

Yea well it was formulated horrobly and it confused me as well I dont even think it was any logical .

Anyways , no you didnt pass fase 2 , thats understanding terrorism hasnt got shit to do with anything either , just like wmd . But you are advancing though .

- people seem to feel just a little better having something to think of as an enemy and thusly someone to destroy for jacking around with their sense of security. no it's not fair, it's just how a lot of people think.

Ok , thats a very good reason . But then we deal here with terror in peoples heads right , psychological instead of physical correct ?
Then I say thats silly to solve because your government caused it , I dont think their aim would be solving it .

- countries in the middle east have been shown that dubya is insane. though that inherently ups the risk of volatility for the entire planet, if it works, it shows people that the jesus freak is just crazy enough to do jack them up. in some ways I find that comforting. in others it pretty disturbing.

You're right , problem however is that those who are supposed to be scared according this "war on terror" , arent scared really . Only conventionals are scared , but mosty of those conventionals scare the shit out of you as well (NK,Iran)

- sadaam was very very likely to be condoning any and all actions against the united states more than any person on the planet... and he had massive resources

See this is how you are totally misinformed , and I think this deals with you not questioning your information enough . You see Saddam was actually the last guy on the planet that would want to wage war on US , let me tell you why . After the war was finished , Saddam claimed VICTORY . This victory was claimed so immense and through his propaganda his peoples bought it , and in this sense he was a hero . Ofcourse he didnt defeat shit he got chased out of Kuweit and left alone in Iraq , but as he struck down the Shiaa resistance , he showed power propagated victory . You had no problems with the USA , to him and Iraqi that battle has been fought .

I do want to mention some nations who actually did have serious problems with you , North Korea .

though who the hell knows what he's up to now, the concept may well backfire in a horrifying manner.. only time will tell

dude either they made a deal or he made a deal himself with $ and sits somewhere in the Emirates .

westernitis-easternitis

You can call it westernitis , I call it western imperialism . As far as eastern imperialism doesnt have something to put up against western , its really irellevant . I dont think its such a theoretical cultural concept as you put it , but rather a simple reflection of how the power is divided in the mid-east .

I dont really understand what you mean with :
Every man/culture has his/its peg fashioned in the past, but it seems he often doesn't notice that it's square as he tries to put it in a round hole.

I do know resistance is an obvious effect of serious opression , the fact its religionized into Islam is aside the point , same as communism . If you wnat to know the root of Islamic terrorism ask the terrorists why they have problems with the west and especially USA . Its not that complicated , really . You dont even need to ask , as they have answered a billion times . It is totally clear .

Jacked with their financing and taken away their biggest fan.

I dont see how you jacked their finances .
And Saddam was no fan of them , USA much bigger fan in the sovyet time .

Changed the playing field in the region.

Like I explained you changed it into their benefits , you have actually made it easier for them to have a shot at Iraq .

Given ourselves reason to have a potentially large 'presence' there

Large presence there doesnt effect them in any way , what it does is make more peoples recruit .

along with whatever else the US deems necessary for the area in the future.

Dont you understand that it is this very attitude that has made the USA so hated over the years ? And what are you doing , you're getting worse , for what , for 3000 deaths ? Its totally ridiculous , and I cant understand how a bright person like yourself cant see through it .

Really? Can you show me something credible stating that? Ack.

No I cant , because Im not Mossad , Im sure Mossad has serious numbers on it . Infermotian like this doesnt come from articles , it comes from living in a Muslim community in Europe and keeping your eyes open .

Stronger numbers makes them easier to see.

Go to Kashmir or Chehcnya and you will find thousands , you're problem isnt not being able to see them . Your problem is not knowing those who DONT get recruited to go into war , them you wont see , they're numbers depend on their interests , they prefer Islamic states over western assaults

It would also be an excuse for the military to get involved again if the washington club deemed in necessary.

Involved where , you cant even controll Afghan and they are right there .

I don't know much about all that... it's hard for me to fathom how something might have been easier to "work out" with sadaam in power... but maybe you can explain it to me.

I was aiming at the fact that the region was easier accesible for Islamists , without Saddam there and with the Shiaa who dont wanna stay still and obey . With Saddam there was no possibility to that , congrats u created a potential islamist state ......and thats what i meant with working out , they are more likely to work out something with the Shiaa than with Saddam . You took Saddam away , they're happy about that .

That's bullshit, he probably feels some form of connection to his "arab brothers", but not quite like "anyone else".

He feels only connection with his lil' clan , and interest collide with the Sunni , he doesnt care for his arab brothers , he is one of the most hated Arabs EVER , and shit YOU picked him .

he would never be our bitch again. He couldn't stand it. That's one of the reasons he needed to get put down. I only hope that he was because I'm somewhat concerned about what he might be capable of if he's still alive and laying low.

He's not idealistic enough , he sits on a beach with his cocktail , little chance he pops up .....maybe if the USA would need a reason to fight the peoples they might bring in him as an imaginary excuse , and if they know where he is ...maybe they'll actually put him in some army suit and throw him back in to hunt him down .

Yeah that sucks. Sounds like it might escalate again eh? I hope it doesn't get too ugly (I know for some it already is).

I think its gonna get really ugly sooner or later .

It didn't have to be. We're not used to getting attacked like that, it's still on everyone's mind just a little.

They didnt need to do much no , but you even got that color system its totally ridiculous , they cna choose a moment to scrae you whenever they want , for whatever reason they seem fit .
You're getting screwed over all the time

Don't you think that one way or another something will be found?

well whats something , chemical , bilogical , wmd ? I think they can find always something they put there themselves , although i dont understand why they didnt already . Anyways , biological and chemical is pretty irellevant everybody got that , but wait same goes for wmd

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(on a lower level though)

Out of sight, out of mind. Sadaam was not out of sight.

I understand the way it worked in peoples minds , thing is Im not always aware weiother you are describing a situation as happening , or defending the correctness of the situation or development .

does seem like that area of the world is rich with people who want to train to blow up things in the US,

Not really , rather Israel . But its all for good clean fun , nobody actually does something .......

so by "putting the fear of god into them" we send the message "play ball with our war on terror or you might not like it,

Not really , because those who are willing to blow themselves up care little what your plans are . Thing is because of your agression more feel like blowing themselves up . Its not government or state you deal with , its individuals .

In some ways, that is the best possible message the US could communicate and they did so in a manner that clearly communicated that point and can be seen as very advantageous in terms of raw power (while it also increase the associated risks).

You should get out of this viscous circle that the cold war has brought you in , this is the age of terror conventionalism is done with . Nobody cares about your raw power , you cant prevent from one bomber entering that raw power . Your we are big and strong strategy may have worked for the sovyet , but thats only becaus ethey were big and strong as well . They are not , they are simple people who have already lost . Your worst enemy is one who lost already , Sun Tzu mentioned something like this in Art of War , something like let your enemy know he has hope otherwise he will fight at his max , or something ........

Either way , those you fear have already lost , they already have chosen to die ....... how will your raw power stop them ? They dont fear it .

It is the perception of most people I know what pretty much all of the middle eastern countries are potentially dangerous because they are muslim states and muslims states hate the US.

Most states really dont , peoples do .

I subscribe to this resultant for slightly different reasons. IMO, I think the idea of fundamental muslims and the existence of the US is mutually exclusive

History proved different .
And theoretically it would prove different as well .

One will not be satisfied until the other is essentially gone. I

I think Israel or the other places of struggle are much more relevant than the USA .

I'm confused. Did you just say that strategic things don't matter when invading a country? I think they do.

Sure they do , but not as a motivation . And although you have been giving me some nice strategic benefits , there hasnt been any argument that would motivate invasion .

I think they have been strengthened for long term balance. That might be exactly backwards. Obviously it is a question that only time can answer.

As far as this war on terror goes , it has been damaged much more than it has advanced . Sure no Saddam is always better than Saddam (well in this time) , but not better enough by far to compensate the immense hate it has caused .

Hmm.. that sounds threatening. I'm sure it's just an observation, but boy isn't your glass half empty.

Well ...... you obviously will have another assault , I mean Im sure you are aware of this as well . But how is my glass half empty ?
Because Im being realistic ?

Hell I'm not sure if your glass has any water in it at all. You must be thirsty. Here, you can have some of my water, but I'll have to keep the cup half full, just as a matter of principle.

Oh come'on the governments behaviour is obvious , Im sure you have more knowledge on how the average american feels than I , but be honest ....... all this terror-talk and the way peoples try to protect themselves is pretty crazy dont you say ? I say you take a good look at Israel and how they are dealing

Do a degree I'm positive you're correct. It's likely I'll never know to what degree. *shrug*

To the degree that i am aware you are a familyman and want only good for yours , and that the way your government is behaving isnt really that wonderfull . Your interests dont collide with your governments , but if you keep letting them fool you like that ..........

 

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wes
Allah's Mathematics thinks the glass is oppressing the water.

LMAO

Yea well ............ say as you wish , I havent seen you ever refute opression so .........

Man I'll tell you, if you think the US government is fascist now, nuke a military base full of US soldiers in Iraq and see how much of a bunch of fascist freaks they become.

Yes the effects would be quite serious .....

. Man I hope that doesn't happen

I dont hope it either

Fetus
wesmorris, was it green_world?

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3. Saddam actually had the balls to stand up to the USofA and cut oil unlike is comrades, as a result he really pisses the Bush administration off.

Thing is this never happened .

at this rate of failing intelligence it won?t be long before most Americans die from drowning when they staring into the rain with their mouths open!

LMAO

 

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Xtra Credit

 

Honestly I don't know history well enough to disect it. I know you think we have to, but I just don't care enough about the past. I mostly worry about today. A little about tomorrow. Don't much care about yesterday except for the entertainment value and the nostalgia.

If you want to solve all the problems of the middle east, get everyone to quit living the past. Sure I'll stop whatever israeli oppresion that can be proven, everyone else stop blowing everyone up.

Oh, and I've noticed you've never refuted my negation of your nihilitic fundamental premise.

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The name 'Allah'

Big-Ups for Wes

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Honestly I don't know history well enough to disect it. I know you think we have to, but I just don't care enough about the past. I mostly worry about today. A little about tomorrow. Don't much care about yesterday except for the entertainment value and the nostalgia.

Well .....I think its relevant to care about the past if you care about today , its the past that has caused the present .

But I dont think we really need to know THAT much about history to disect matters , I say 35.000 peoples starving everyday is quite obvious , you would discover many who surround them dont really starve , you'd discover than one causes the other , and if you trace where their money comes from its all quite clear who's the opressor and who isnt . For one to be rich another needs to be poor by definition , if there wouldnt be a first world there wouldnt be a third either .

I think knowing somuch about history isnt really that relevant to understand who's being opressed and who isnt .

If you want to solve all the problems of the middle east, get everyone to quit living the past. Sure I'll stop whatever israeli oppresion that can be proven, everyone else stop blowing everyone up.

The opression comes from multiple angles , as for the Palestinians , stop looking at the past means giving up , thats not right man ....then everything has been for nothing .
That situation isnt so simple in Israel , they're not opressing only because peoples blow themselves up , thats just new , peoples blow themselves up because they are opressed . There are some threads where this situation is thoroughly discussed , if you would read them im sure you'd understand how its not just this simple trade (who is difficult already) .

As for mid-east in general (yes the regimes oppress the peoples) , thats a totally different matter , although I think the Arabs are to blaim for this as well as they arent engaging that much , there arent that many possibilities , Arabia is filled with Saddams , every country has a few , and they run things .

Oh, and I've noticed you've never refuted my negation of your nihilitic fundamental premise.

First of all its not fundamental for this issue one bit , if it was nothing would matter now would it ?

But you're right I havent responded yet , as for refuting it , your essential point isnt to be refuted , but Ill get on it , you'll see .

 

Jihad My Ass

Jhiad,

What a bunch of loser pussies. All mouth, no brains, all puffed up like your somebody. You ain't shit.

The more the merrier. Lets get all the assholes together and get it over with.

BTW Isreal ain't shit either. I'd kicked their ass long ago as well.

I really hope you idiots grow up because we are not going to put up with your ass and a lot of innocent people just might have to get laid out to quieten this shit down.

Are you really so stupid to still believe your Allaaaaaah, is going to protect you. What a bunch of crap "Jihad" indeed. Seems he has been on vacation so far.

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/04/09/world/main505687.shtml

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/1368913.stm

 

Re: Jihad My Ass

Abdulla: Let's just say that after WTC Se~nor Allah went on vacation, taking O' Sammy bin Laden, with him!

Note: Hey, MacM, you seem to have a short and very "tart" vocabulary, ever try your local library to see if they have a theosaurus you like?

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Abdulla....

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Whhooo heee cowboy, mighty big shame you aint got no english learning

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Seriously though, what is your point exactly. I can't decipher the meaning behind all the trashy dialect, sounds like it's from some Eddie Murphy film.

 

stu, I hate to go correcting you, but to properly brutalize english you should have left the 'g' off of 'learning'. When speaking hick, 'learnin's the only way to get schooled'.

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I must add though that I greatly enjoyed "mighty big shame". That's good hick!

 

Dam shit man yoor right, I'm a gonna git some skool and git learnin' on that english talkin'

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Abdual...,

ANS:

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Actually, I do quite a bit of writing and often use words many are unfamiliar with. In light of the intelligence I saw in this string I wanted to bring the text down to a level that could be understood.

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theosaurus?

Is that a religious dinosaur?

 

Yep, it's a dinosaur that studies theology

 

lol

 

What a bunch of loser pussies. All mouth, no brains, all puffed up like your somebody. You ain't shit.

Hey Big-Mac , lets be serious for a moment , you're a 14 year old suburban geek , who are you kidding here ?

The more the merrier. Lets get all the assholes together and get it over with.

More doesnt mean together doofus , more means MORE . In the USA there are 7 M Muslims , what if amongst them are 100 terrorists ? Have you any clue what 100 people can do ? Why do you want more people to join the cause , and why do you want the target to shift from Chechnya & Afghanistan into your country ? Do you want it to be 1000 , or 10.000 (200 per state) ?
Why ? Or maybe you dont care you'd just wanna kill everybody

BTW Isreal ain't shit either. I'd kicked their ass long ago as well.

Sure you did , sure you can move the Yahud over no problemo , sure .... get out of here man , you BOW DOWN to the Yahud and his Israel . You better show these peoples respect , they deserve it they own you're little shit-hole , God I hope NYC would zionize , it would be legal for the Hassidics

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, then we'll see whats left of USA .

I really hope you idiots grow up because we are not going to put up with your ass

you dont understand cause-effect dont you ? Havent you heard ? Islam can make peace with death , can you say the same ? You cant stop this through force , you will loose your freedom and security over it . No you wont be occupied by Islamists , but Israel isnt either now are they ? How can you ever stop this through aggression ? Do you enjoy living under threat ? 9-11 was the first time , what when the second happens ? Who are you attacking then ? Iran + Syria ? And the third time , who then ? France ? Why not skip everybody and just bomb France rightaway , and leave the rest out of world out of your retarded logics .

Are you really so stupid to still believe your Allaaaaaah, is going to protect you. What a bunch of crap "Jihad" indeed.

theosaurus

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Fetus :

It seems that you are correct

I assumed it was about military "standing up against USA" , so I misunderstood . Indeed economically they stood up , funny how again Israel is involved . It makes oil=Israel , and thats just amazing . That way Sharon didnt even have to push that much , just whine about Saddam and his nasty oil-policy ......

 

911 DID NOT SCARE AMERICA IT PISSED US OFF!
ANY FUTURE INCIDENCE WILL FURTHER PISS US OFF!
BASIC DIFFERENCE BETWEEN BELIEVES IS YOU WILL DIE FOR YOUR CAUSE AND WE WILL KILL YOU FOR OURS!
please take a lesson from WWII Germany attempted to exterminate the Jews it failed. Japan attacked the U.S.A in a sneak attack and was defeated and occupied.

if the U.S.A ever faces defeat it will use its nuke arsenals and knock the world back to the stone age. This is covered in well documented M.A.D. (mutually assured destruction) policy, Which at this moment in time is still in effect.

with respect

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911 DID NOT SCARE AMERICA IT PISSED US OFF!

Sure , you convince yourself of that . Thing is , that for sure 5 more of those and you go nuts ......so then again , who are you getting ? France ?

please take a lesson from WWII Germany attempted to exterminate the Jews it failed.

You know little about this question I say , the way you compare it to whats happening here . Id rather remember what happened in Germany for some 15-20 years from now , when your Jewish peoples become seriously problematic for yourselves . Todays Jews do not hold position of the Ghetto-Jews , and the Arabs not of Germany . You'll be Germany ......you'll see

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BASIC DIFFERENCE BETWEEN BELIEVES IS YOU WILL DIE FOR YOUR CAUSE AND WE WILL KILL YOU FOR OURS!

Who are you killing ? A Japaneze from Peru smacks you and you shoot a North-Korean ?

Japan attacked the U.S.A in a sneak attack and was defeated and occupied.

But you cant occupy anybody you cant even see . Kepp thinking conventional and you'll end up on the loosing end , Im sorry but conventional warfare is over with for at least a couple of years , its just not relevant anymore .......

if the U.S.A ever faces defeat it will use its nuke arsenals and knock the world back to the stone age. This is covered in well documented M.A.D. (mutually assured destruction) policy, Which at this moment in time is still in effect.

Well thats great , but there are more nukes not in USA than in USA so you should expect the same for USA , so then we will all be at the stone age , half is dead and most areas are uninhabitable and everybody gotta hide in caves

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