Paranormal encounters

Discussion in 'Free Thoughts' started by Magical Realist, Oct 13, 2015.

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  1. Magical Realist

    Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    I don't know about your own mind, but mine is quite reliable. Things that happen to me are very memorable and accurate, particularly when they involve heightened emotion:

    http://www.loc.gov/loc/brain/emotion/Mcgaugh.html

    We don't know the condition under which such paranormal experiences ARE repeatable. One night something happens. The next night nothing. Like ball lightning or an earthquake.

    No it doesn't render them scientifically suspect. It only renders science limited and inadequate in studying this phenomena in a lab. That's why we have paranormal investigators going out on site and in the field gathering evidence directly.
     
    Magical Realist, Oct 13, 2015
    #21

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  3. spidergoat

    spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    Well then, you lie.
     
    spidergoat, Oct 13, 2015
    #22

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  5. exchemist

    exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    ......Or he is just rather arrogant, or shallow in his understanding of himself. Sounds like a teenager's attitude. But I speculate.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2015
    exchemist, Oct 13, 2015
    #23

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  7. Magical Realist

    Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Insulting when you have no argument. Typical...
     
    Magical Realist, Oct 13, 2015
    #24
  8. Magical Realist

    Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    “If you want military ghost stories just ask any military police that’s been around a while. We tend to see really weird crap late at night. Especially around places were there has been a lot of warfare and death. Like in Germany and in old hospitals. In Babenhausen, around the elementary school, there was always this particular area around the rear that would creep me the hell out when I would walk around doing security checks at night. It always seemed as though I was being watched.

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    In 99 I found a side door to the school open. I radioed for another unit and backed up several feet to a corner to observe the door. It took 20-30 minutes for my backup to arrive. I had a wall to my back and could see down the side of the building to the corner, about 70 or more feet. I was staring straight ahead and saw a figure appear at the far corner. It didn’t come around the corner or anything. It just appeared. It was a young female, 9-12 years old, wearing a red jacket or cloak of an old style. Maybe 20’s thru 50’s style. It must have been about 0200 or so. I started forward and told the figure that it was late and she needed to go home. And she just vanished. I sprinted forward to the corner to see if she had run around the edge. The area was open and I got there less than ten seconds after she disappeared and she was nowhere to be seen. I shined my Surefire around the building and didn’t locate her.

    I went back to my position, and when my backup got there they cleared the building. They said they had heard noise in the gym like someone bouncing a basketball but no one was inside. They did find a basketball in the gym though. I told them what I had seen, and my team leader just laughed and said a lot of stuff goes on there at night.”====http://ghostsnghouls.com/2012/07/07/real-ghost-stories-from-the-military/
     
    Magical Realist, Oct 13, 2015
    #25
  9. exchemist

    exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    I've already made my argument. You chose to think you were above it, with your superhuman powers of objectivity, apparently.

    If you are incapable of seeing my point, it is not worth my while spending any more time on this.

    But other readers may see the force of what I'm saying. So may you. In time.
     
    exchemist, Oct 13, 2015
    #26
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  10. spidergoat

    spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    We are in no position to evaluate the data. So why keep telling these stories? 100 of them are worth no more than one of them.
     
    spidergoat, Oct 13, 2015
    #27
  11. Magical Realist

    Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Claiming people are misremembering their own experiences isn't an argument for anything. It's a claim based on zero evidence. You weren't there. They were. Therefore their eyewitness account holds more credibility than your own account which is merely an attempt to deny the existence of the paranormal. You're dismissing people's firsthand experiences based on your belief that ghosts don't exist. And that's intellectually dishonest.
     
    Magical Realist, Oct 13, 2015
    #28
  12. Magical Realist

    Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    They're eyewitness accounts of the phenomena. That's validation of the phenomena. And the more the better.
     
    Magical Realist, Oct 13, 2015
    #29
  13. spidergoat

    spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    No it's not validation of phenomena, it's a dude telling a story.
     
    spidergoat, Oct 13, 2015
    #30
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  14. Russ_Watters

    Russ_Watters Not a Trump supporter... Valued Senior Member

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    We've had discussions where the faultyness of human memories were shown with scientific studies. You were part of them. So that is the evidence that your claim of a "reliable mind" is false. Based on the ironic self-contradiction that if your mind is even somewhat reliable you must remember that, this claim of yours can only be a lie.

    So I disagree with exchemist and agree with Spidergoat: You're lying (and therefore trolling).
     
    Russ_Watters, Oct 13, 2015
    #31
  15. Magical Realist

    Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Faultiness of medical diagnosis is no evidence that a particular medical diagnosis is faulty. Just like medicine human perception and memory are certainly reliable enough to enhance our survival and get us thru life. Claiming it isn't because you don't want ghosts to exist is patently disingenuous and dishonest.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2015
    Magical Realist, Oct 14, 2015
    #32
  16. Magical Realist

    Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    "We have a white figure that has been seen in the medicine room, sometimes the carts are moved down the hall while you are in a room giving meds, etc. One of the male CNAs reported seeing a very tall black figure going from room to room several times. We have all seen balls of light floating around. From what we have been able to gather from old pictures of the property that the nursing home is on there was a mobile home park at one end and a cemetery at the other end of the building. Everyone has seen a little boy walking around but the freakiest part was when they saw wet children's foot prints coming down the hall and followed them to the wall and there were footprints in the snow outside that came right to that place in the wall."====http://allnurses.com/general-nursing-discussion/whats-your-best-108202.html
     
    Magical Realist, Oct 14, 2015
    #33
  17. Magical Realist

    Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Like all history is. That's why it's called "his story"..
     
    Magical Realist, Oct 14, 2015
    #34
  18. Russ_Watters

    Russ_Watters Not a Trump supporter... Valued Senior Member

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    You're ignoring your lie, which I take to be an acknowledgement that you were caught. Moving on: A medical diagnosis is not eyewitness testimony (you know that as well), but the point remains: with eyewitness testimony you need corroboration because of the inherent faultiness of memory. That's your burden of proof, which, as always, remains unfulfilled. You know that as well. With your ironically claimed flawless memory, you know all of these claims of yours are false. So each one constitutes yet another lie. As is that last part, which bears no resemblance to any claim anyone has made: With your ironically flawless memory, you know no one has ever claimed that. So absolutely everything you are saying is complete BS/lies and since you know all of this and are doing it on purpose, trolling.
     
    Russ_Watters, Oct 14, 2015
    #35
  19. Magical Realist

    Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Exchemist: "Of course one's mind is unreliable. That is obvious, from everybody's everyday experience."

    Nuff said...
     
    Magical Realist, Oct 14, 2015
    #36
  20. Joshua Cotton

    Joshua Cotton Registered Member

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    As with any other non-publicly accepted idea, And one especially that has had so much faked evidence, this idea that there is paranormal activity will not be accepted by most. Given that most have not had a personal experience with it and that even if they have society would pressure them into doubting themselves, makes for a very shaky testimony from anyone that might actually have or have not.
     
    Joshua Cotton, Oct 14, 2015
    #37
  21. spidergoat

    spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    That's not at all true.
     
    spidergoat, Oct 14, 2015
    #38
  22. Bells

    Bells Staff Member

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    Wrong.

    Experiments conducted at Cornell's Memory and Neuroscience Laboratory show that experiences that excite negative emotions are very bad for the accuracy of children's memories and worse for adults. When an experience has negative emotional qualities, true memory levels are lowest and false memory levels are highest.

    The researchers tested children, ages seven and 11, and young adults, ages 18-23, by exposing them to mild levels of emotion using a series of word lists. Specifically, they were exposed to closely-related emotional words such as pain, cut, ouch, cry, injury and so on. But with each list, certain related words were missing such as "hurt."

    When asked to recognize words from the list, respondents would mistakenly remember "hurt" as one of the words. These mistakes allowed researchers to determine the level of emotion-induced false memory at each age.

    "Our experiments allowed the distortive effects of emotion on children's memory to be studied ethically," said Reyna. "To avoid concerns about exposing children to levels of emotional intensity associated with crimes or other everyday events, our design exposed children, adolescents and adults to mild levels of emotion with word lists."

    "The study showed that the ability of negative-arousing events to stimulate false memories increases considerably between early childhood and young adulthood," added Brainerd. "This is remarkable because common-sense and most theories of development expect that if emotion distorts memory, children ought to be more susceptible."

    Brainerd and Reyna predicted the results based on their previous memory studies involving something called fuzzy trace theory. Fuzzy trace theory argues that children depend more heavily on a part of the mind that records, "what actually happened," while adults depend more on another part of the mind that records, "the meaning of what happened." It appears that meaning and emotion are connected to memory in ways not anticipated by memory theorists before now.

    "We need to jettison the old idea that experiences that are negative and arousing are less prone to distortion than other types of events," said Brainerd. "We also need to jettison the related idea that children are more susceptible to memory distortion from negative experiences. Instead, the message is the opposite: negative-arousing events are probably more memory distorting, especially for adults."    ​


    People see the same thing and pretty much each one will interpret it differently and their account will differ.

    A prime example of that was seen recently in the Michael Brown shooting and the differences in the testimony of the many eyewitnesses who saw the event. The differences vary from when Wilson shot his gun, to whether Brown was running away from Wilson when Wilson opened fire. Eyewitnesses testimony varied widely to what they actually all saw.
     
    Bells, Oct 14, 2015
    #39
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  23. Bells

    Bells Staff Member

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    Wow.. Really?

    What utter rubbish are you spouting now?

    The word history comes ultimately from Ancient Greek ἱστορία[12] (historía), meaning "inquiry","knowledge from inquiry", or "judge". It was in that sense that Aristotle used the word in his Περὶ Τὰ Ζῷα Ἱστορίαι[13] (Perì Tà Zôa Ηistoríai "Inquiries about Animals"). The ancestor word ἵστωρ is attested early on in Homeric Hymns, Heraclitus, the Athenian ephebes' oath, and in Boiotic inscriptions (in a legal sense, either "judge" or "witness", or similar).

    The Greek word was borrowed into Classical Latin as historia, meaning 'investigation, inquiry, research, account, description, written account of past events, writing of history, historical narrative, recorded knowledge of past events, story, narrative'. History was borrowed from Latin (possibly via Old Irish or Old Welsh) into Old English as stær ('history, narrative, story'), but this word fell out of use in the late Old English period.[14]

    Meanwhile, as Latin became Old French (and Anglo-Norman), historia developed into forms such as istorie, estoire, and historie, with new developments in the meaning: 'account of the events of a person's life (beginning of the 12th cent.), chronicle, account of events as relevant to a group of people or people in general (1155), dramatic or pictorial representation of historical events (c1240), body of knowledge relative to human evolution, science (c1265), narrative of real or imaginary events, story (c1462)'.[14]

    It was from Anglo-Norman that history was borrowed into Middle English, and this time the loan stuck. It appears in the thirteenth-century Ancrene Riwle, but seems to have become a common word in the late fourteenth century, with an early attestation appearing inJohn Gower's Confessio Amantis of the 1390s (VI.1383): 'I finde in a bok compiled | To this matiere an old histoire, | The which comth nou to mi memoire'. In Middle English, the meaning of history was "story" in general. The restriction to the meaning 'the branch of knowledge that deals with past events; the formal record or study of past events, esp. human affairs' arose in the mid-fifteenth century.[14]

    With the Renaissance, older senses of the word were revived, and it was in the Greek sense that Francis Bacon used the term in the late sixteenth century, when he wrote about "Natural History". For him, historia was "the knowledge of objects determined by space and time", that sort of knowledge provided by memory (while science was provided by reason, and poetry was provided by fantasy).[15]

    In an expression of the linguistic synthetic vs. analytic/isolating dichotomy, English like Chinese (史 vs. 诌) now designates separate words for human history and storytelling in general. In modern German, French, and most Germanic and Romance languages, which are solidly synthetic and highly inflected, the same word is still used to mean both "history" and "story".

    The adjective historical is attested from 1661, and historic from 1669.[16]

    Historian in the sense of a "researcher of history" is attested from 1531. In all European languages, the substantive "history" is still used to mean both "what happened with men", and "the scholarly study of the happened", the latter sense sometimes distinguished with a capital letter, "History", or the word historiography.[13]    ​

    Please get your facts straight before spouting rubbish.
     
    Bells, Oct 14, 2015
    #40
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