Judeo-Christian Bible--Proof, Divinely Inspired

Dywyddyr:

Your argument (bolded in red), is rebutted by the quotation from Isaiah. Notice the quotation again. This time, focus on the words that are in all caps and bold.

"There is One who is DWELLING ABOVE the circle of the EARTH, the dwellers in which are as grasshoppers, the One who is stretching out the heavens just as a fine gaze, who spread them out like a tent in which to dwell," (Isaiah 40:22)

QUESTION #3 to DYWYDDYR: Are you telling this forum that "dwelling above earth" is not the same as "outer space"?


I can't wait to hear your answer to that one.


Alter2Ego

 

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Dywyddyr: You are contradicting yourself. A claim cannot be "unsupported" and at the same time "happened to be close to correct." An unsupported claim is proven to be entirely wrong.

MERRIAM-WEBSTER THESAURUS: "UNSUPPORTED":
"having no basis in reason or fact <an unsupported claim that the structure was built by Vikings>
Synonyms: baseless, foundationless, invalid, nonvalid, unfounded, unreasonable, unsubstantiated, unsupported, unwarranted"
http://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/unsupported

None of the above synonyms allow for something that "happened to be close to correct." In fact, those synonyms directly contradict your use of the words "unsupported claim," since 20th century astronauts have confirmed the viewpoint description given by Moses.

"He [God] is stretching out the north over the empty place, hanging the earth upon nothing;" (Job 26:7)

Only someone in outer space could have seen that particular viewpoint of earth at that time in history.

Alter2Ego

 

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bible is written by people.

 

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Hmmm. Joshua too was divinely inspired, what with his divinely inspired genocides. Abraham too was divinely inspired when he abducted 32,000 damsels AFTER a complete massacre of their kins.

 

bible, talmund they all are rip offs of vedas.
The Abrahm is Brahma in Vedas.

 

Do you take this to mean that the vedas are true or is it just that they are all made up by man?

 

Vedas are made by people. In India the concept of god is Super consciousness not a personality. Lord Shiva and his wife Devi Sati are not sky Gods but Tamas and Rajas ( Yin Yang).

 

Alter2Ego, it is quite possible for someone to make a claim that is correct while making that claim with no support whatsoever. Nostradamus was quite famous for it. It is quite possible to support a claim that is incorrect, as well as not support one that is correct:

If I suddenly start to claim that there is a wolf in my kitchen drinking coffee, and I am 2,000 miles away with no feasible means of substantiating my claim, it would be deemed - and would indeed BE - an unsupported claim.
Whether it is supported or not at the time of the claim is irrespective of whether it turns out to be correct.
Once I can support the claim, such as having a friend take a picture of it, then it is a supported claim.

By the same token, once I have the picture I might make the apparently supported claim that there was a wolf in my kitchen. The photo would be my support.
However, if that photo turns out to be of a wolf in someone else's kitchen that just happened to look like mine, and there was never a wolf in mine, then I have honestly supported my claim, but the claim is still wrong.
And as soon as it becomes aware that the photo is not of my kitchen, my claim would be unsupported again.

Simples, really.
And no, an unsupported claim is not one that is proven to be entirely wrong... it is just a claim for which the person making it provides no support in its favour, and argues instead from mere confidence in its veracity.

 

God was quite often thought of as dwelling above us... but that is far from meaning that he was in "outer space".
As you require of others... look at what is written: "There is One who is dwelling above..." - i.e. God lives above us... whether that is in the sky, in outer-space, outside the Universe, or is meant in a purely metaphorical way is not stated.
But it is from such quotes that some get their "sky-daddy" concept of God... living in the clouds.

Now let's imagine you were at the top of a mountain... the dwellers below would be far smaller than grasshoppers - and in fact possibly not be able to made out... so if we want to take the quote as you do, that would place God's dwelling height as somewhere within our atmosphere for sure.

Also, if you were atop a mountain, your view, your perspective of the world, would be as if it were a circle. Not a sphere. A discworld, so to speak (although whether sitting on top of four elephants who are standing upon a giant turtle would be something you could only fathom if you travelled to the edge!)

So, if you read the words in caps, in context, I think the meaning is quite clear.

But hey, we can always take such things metaphorically if it suddenly transpires the literal interpretation doesn't fit our agenda. ;

 

Yes, look at what you emboldened.
It does not say that the Earth appears as a circle to someone "dwelling above"/ in space, it states that the Earth IS a circle.
Evidently rationality isn't your strong point.

Wrong again.
An unsupported claim is simply without support: it may turn out to be correct, it may turn out to be incorrect (meaning you were wrong in saying " An unsupported claim is proven to be entirely wrong."). It simply has nothing to justify making the claim at that time.

So now you're claiming that he SAW the Earth "hanging on nothing"?
This is, again, another unsupported claim.
I note that you've carefully ignored the quotes I gave that directly contradict the claim of "hanging on nothing" and mention pillars. Would you care to address that?

 

I used to know a guy who was a Jehovah's Witness. Good friend, good guy. He once told me that all the prophecies in the bible had been fulfilled, except those that had not yet come to pass.

He didn't find that statement as humorous as I did. He even took offense when I laughed.

 

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Ancient world cosmology.
No vast universe. This is it.
All of it.
In their view, the earth with the sky above containing the sun and stars, and the waters beneath, were everything that was created.

Until the 20th Century, our view of the size of the visible universe was not much more accurate.
We only started to comprehend its immense size in the 1920s,
when Hubble looked through the Hooker telescope and realised that galaxies were made up of billions of stars.
http://amazing-space.stsci.edu/resources/explorations/groundup/lesson/scopes/mt_wilson/discovery.php

 

with the above facts bible is not divinely inspired.
This very concept of bible divinely inspired to God's few chosen people is racist.
Why would 'God' inspire few Middle Eastern people ?
What was the crime of rest of the world at that time, that 'God' did not bother them ?

 

The trouble with Bible science is that it seems only to tell you about things once real science has discovered them.
Why didn't Bible scholars tell scientists that the universe was much bigger than they realised?
Then they could have been proved right.

 

This happens all the time when people without perception land on such knowledge.

Actually it is very dangerous to pen down religious ideas. People become fixated and terrified of anything 'different' and hence tragedies.
Religiousness nt religion, is not a dogmatic tendency as most percieve, yet it simply ordinary. Religiousness is simply respect for thi cosmos and nothing more.
Respect is the biggest hurdle as people don't give it easily.
The innitiater of the thread, i suppose, had no idea that all ,that their are lot other books which have same knowledge.
This knowledge is based on astrology.
This 'divinely' inspired thing has painted history blood red.
Why they don't rewrite bible according to science, then they can say as much as they want it is divinely created.

 

If you read the bible, man and women were created to have will power and choice. These skills are different from the animals, who obey the laws of natural instinct. This means man/women can chose to be natural, or they can choose to be unnatural. The animal does not have this choice. Humans also have the willpower to define and enforce unnatural as natural; subjectivity. Man can also choose to align himself with God or with the godless. Those who align with God, are the ones to whom God confers the power of prophesy.

If you own a company, your most faithful and reliable employees will be those whom you will trust the most and help the most with your means. The rebellious and untrustworthy may be tolerated, but they will not receive the same level of consideration.

Liberals, based on liberal education, believe in entitlement, without having to do anything, other then blame someone as a means to recompense. This is unnatural and is not the way conditional love works.

As an analogy, say humans could find their natural instincts. This would align humans with these ancient test proven means that got them out of African to the present, under very meager means of existence. A few generations later, we add choice and will power, to this, to form a new human. These new means of choice will cause some people to experiment with unnatural behavior. These new behavior are not based on natural selection, but ego-centric selection due to will and choice apart from natural instincts. It will not be selected by nature or God.

My belief is that the oldest humans, found with fossils are better called pre-human, in the sense they were connected to natural human instincts. At the time of Adam and Eve (6000 years ago) this is when will power and choice appears. This created a new type of human who can depart from natural instinct, via willpower and choices. They both look human based on DNA but their minds were different; new operating system. This explains why civilization takes off at the time scale of Adam and Eve; more powerful brain with new capacities.

Religion appears to help the new humans stay aligned with the past of time tested natural instinct, while having the constraint of a new more powerful brain that has the choice to depart. The prophets were the most aligned with the natural path and become the spokesmen as to how to return.

 

Remember I am not an atheist/theist. I am a ordinary man not against any religion people.
I am from India and India is fact that world is far more older than 6000 years.
The muslims, christians, jews are same people. They worship same sky God but fight each other to claim the title of 'God's Chosen People'.
In India, the worshiped Gods are nothing but this cosmos. I don't know about other religions but I can say Indians(East) were first to worship the life.
The Shiva Lingam has been reduced to penis by the 'experts' like Wendy Dogneir, who think they know more than Indians.
The Shiva Lingam can be said as source of DNA, NASA has agreed that DNA came from outer space.
It was not because Indians were "Devil' worshipers, Indians worshiped this black stone as life source.
Out of all the stones Shiva Lingam is most sacred hence has high probability that it contains DNA. and it is fact that muslims guard it, kiss it, yet they call themselves anti-idols.
The story of Adam and Eve is rip off from ancient Vedas. In Vedas certain star positions are described which appear after hundreds of years cycle.
To precisely calculate it would take more than 6000 years time for an civilization to begin and set observatories.
About 6000 years ago , great tectonic movement disrupted the river Saraswati, thats one reason Aryans(Indians) migrated outside of India and some to South of India.
In India we dont have a sky God. The sky God is perverted form 'ADI SHAKTI' this is super consciousness.
Most Christians dont know that their God is not a sky God but nature( Super Consciousness) it self as ancient Indians had.
India had been slave for 800 years, in these years many ancient temples were destroyed by invaders who found way through dreadful Hindu Kush mountains.
The word 'Kush' has immense importance here as it means GENOCIDE.
About choice of being right, I can say you yourself know many genocides have been committed by Abrahmic followers, in India these Genocides almost never happened.
Their is nothing wrong in worshipping idols as ADI Shakti is every where and in everything therefore everything is divine to Indians.

Historically India has been called as Land of Plenty, all the invaders were crazy to find way to India to plunder wealth of the country.

 

NASA didn't "agree that DNA came from outer space. Two of the four compounds needed for form DNA were found. So it's an interesting discovery but it's not accurate to say that NASA says (has proven) that DNA came from outer space.

 

An Indian person made the association two years before NASA made associations of DNA and space.
Basically I imply that DNA and Shiva Lingam have lot to do with each other. Still lots of research have to be done.
One interesting fact about real Shiva Lingam is that it heavier than iron.