90 year old man (and two pastors) arrested for feeding the homeless

Abott isn't giving money though... he's giving them food. You can live without money... it's kind of hard to live without food...

 

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No , like putting them in a HOSPITAL which I did mention.

They could leave anytime they want as long as they aren't trying to harm themselves or others. Once they leave they can't return if they are drunk/drugged or injured.

Nothing is "wrong" with me whenever I state an opinion for I'm given rights to do so just as you are. Just because we don't see eye to eye on something doesn't mean there anything wrong with either of us.

 

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I can't agree with you more. And I failed to mention county ERs as another place the poor also congregate, as you well know. I think youreyes is illustrating the attitude that obstructs the goals your logic leads to.

Nothing is more outrageous than blaming the victim, or to assume that someone deserves poverty and despair.

In fact recently I was speaking with a homeless guy who seems to have gone from the Bohemian lifestyle to a menial federal job. For some reason he decided to go back to Plan A. I suspect he may be a light occasional drug user, so maybe he wanted to get away from drug tests. But he is educated and well read, and can expound on this topic better than me. Sure, he's in the minority, but with a wave of aging Baby Boomers we may see some increase in this class of homeless people. After all, one reason people become unemployable is that age discrimination is alive and kicking.

Funny, isn't it, that the Manuels of the homeless world could probably make a killing in sales or some corporate executive position. If they could just function a little better and get their foot in the door.

I turned to public assistance just as I was nearing my BS degree, when an administrative error interrupted my loans and grants. I was surprised how much the caseworker worked to increase my benefits. I said "I thought your job was to trim costs". And I'll never forget, she said "I am. When you get your degree and enter the workforce your taxes will pay this back many times over." And of course she was right.

You would think common sense would be enough to figure that out. I have detested Conservative ideals all my life even though I run my own affairs conservatively. The adage that comes to mind as far as the cost of action vs inaction is Franklin's "penny-wise vs. pound foolish". Ironically this is one of the heavily applied ideals of fiscal conservatives in regard to business decisions.

 

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Drug or alcohol addiction stemming from childhood sex abuse is not an excuse. It's a serious mental health issue. Many victims also commit suicide.

Your confidence in your self-sufficiency will wax and wane with your physical and mental health, age, number of dependents and external pressures which will vary over time. Nothing lasts forever, other than human misery and deliberate indifference to it.

Yet you are bragging that you are self sufficient. By contrast she brags about nothing, nor does she complain. I extracted her life story by interviewing her. She was not trying to advertise anything. The only pride I noted in her is that she refuses to sink to the last resort of many women in her situation, namely, prostitution.

You don't know that. Once a person's self esteem has been irreparably damaged they can no longer be measured by your ideals of guilt and innocence.

Escape from intractible pain is not "the high life". Often it's an alternative to suicide. "The high life" pertains to, say, coke and alcohol users living in resorts. We are talking here about people who are dirt poor.

And that attitude would disqualify you as a juror.

I don't know him, nor am I a party to the facts, so I am not in a position to judge him. But I have worked with people who woke up in jail out of a chemical stupor to discover they had done something heinous while they were not competent to be responsible for their actions. Some went on to serve life in prison, for a brief lapse in judgment.

Unfortunately sensational cases like the death of a young woman are often tried in the press. Now make the victim a middle aged Pakistani man and no one cares.

So you think poverty is a flaw. That too is counterproductive to the ends of this thread.

Your feelings of self worth are ephemeral. You will not be the same person forever, and if you live to a ripe old age, or suffer an injury illness it disability then at some point your feelings of invulnerability will change. Most likely you will have to stoop to the indignity of depending on help from family, friends or medical providers.

You seem to be expressing loner syndrome which is a precursor to the same criminal flaws you are complaining about. Of course about half of all inmates are not loners and stay emotionally connected to loved ones while incarcerated. Thus, when you start raining brimstone and fire on the folks you want to lock up, you punish their children, their mothers, and everyone else who cares about them.

But I guess you're OK with that as long as it makes you feel good. After all, this is all about you and your feelings.

The woman I discussed is living by salvaging discarded goods. She doesn't fit your characterization at all other than the fact that she is a drug addict.

That's why it's called recovery.

No, addiction is not a choice, not once the first bad choice was made. Besides, many addictions begin with a doctor's prescription.

And no, she will not live by your idealized model, nor will she live much longer. If her illness doesn't kill her quickly she will probably kill herself.

 

Oh really addiction is not a choice? Than how did it all start for her?

And saying she will probably kill herself, is like expecting her to commit suicide and doing nothing about it...

Why are you acting like a marshmallow? people have strength and power of will and the ability to overcome any problems they face.

As people get old so will I get old, sure. But will my fighting spirit die in me? NO.

 

What I said was addiction is not a choice, not once the first bad choice was made. Besides, many addictions begin with a doctor's prescription.

I don't know. Most likely she grabbed the first feeling of euphoria made available of her, to kill the pain of being raped by someone she trusted, in the wake of grieving the loss of her mother.

That's why I say you can't assume that poverty and despair is self-inflicted. You have to treat the systemic causes. If you want to separate established and homeless people according to guilt and innocence, then the world would be turned upside down. In this case her abuser would be punished by homelessness and she would be fully healed and living as an established productive person.

Addicts do irrational things when the pain becomes intolerable. Like getting more drugs. Many resort to burglary after they have nothing left to trade for drugs.

In her case she has attempted suicide in the past, and in all probability she will try it again. As she approaches the expected date of her demise, I think that decision will be mitigated by the hospital tending to her final care. But they will deny her the illegal drugs she needs to stave off the pain of withdrawal. My conclusion then is that rather than face a final term of confinement to bed suffering from withdrawal, I believe she will probably pull off a successful suicide. I say this because she has thought about why her past attempts failed and how to do it differently to assure "success".

There is nothing anyone can do to change her, short of kidnapping her, strapping here to a table against her will, and inserting a feeding tube. That plus something like electroshock therapy, to try to erase her memories.

I have no idea what you mean by that. I expend enormous personal energy helping people like her.

If that were remotely true there would be no misery on Earth. Every concentration camp inmate would be hale and hearty and full of cheer and the walls of the gas chambers at Auschwitz would not be abraded by a million human fingernails. All of the wars and atrocities of history would have cowboys riding off into the sunset at the end and we would all have Beaver Cleaver as our next door neighbor. I mean even in Darfur or Somalia or Syria or any other hellhole you name. Of course they would be picture perfect places with nicely manicured lawns and white picket fences. So we would be calling them heaven holes.

Bully for you. Now watch how you hold up to rape, incarceration, genocide, torture, or any of the equivalent misfortunes more likely to be visited upon the people driven into homelessness. Start looking at the real world, which crushes people like bugs when it's "in the national interest" or whatever the excuse is.

Of course: you're special, and the less fortunate homeless are not, right? That's what I meant when I said this is all about you. That's being a marshmallow. Now try making it all about them. That's the part that takes the guts you say you're made of.

 

There are more alcoholic homeless than drug dependant ones because wine is very cheap but some drugs cost quite a bit. I've seen where the homeless shelters will not allow them into their shelter for fear of fights, sleeplessness and general bedlam that they bring with them.

 

don't do maths with feelings. if you feel give food and no more thoughts.

 

wat?

 

means dont calculate the goodness and badness in every action. Be spontantenous.

 

Spontaneous? Are you kidding me? Everything must be calculated, all the scenarios must be predicted, all the negative aspects must be mitigated.

 

kidding is also spontaneous. the lack of trust is due to fear, accept death, not the physical but personal, as old friend, be free

 

pretty words with no substance. Fear is there to protect us, it is up to use however to let it control us or have us control it.

 

to protect from, who, a enemy ? what did to him ? the fear is fuel of protection.
control is because of fear.
i am a hypocrite. i write without thinking.

 

in india almost every shrine has free meals on celebrations. the Gurudwaras for the whole year provide free meal to all the people without any bias.

 

the freedom of expression of compassion is being curtailed. fight back.

 

Notice the difference. In India, food is dispersed as part of a deep cultural traditional ceremony that is used to unite the people and to guide them through spiritual world so that they can live happily in the material world.

This is not the case of what this Abbot priest is doing. Food with no substance is a message without meaning.

 

next time take the homeless person as guest, eat with.