Democrat Party, Slavery and Segregation

Discussion in 'Politics' started by wellwisher, Sep 18, 2014.

  1. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    And so it goes, in circles.

    And the years 1935 until 1985 never happened.

    Which is still an improvement over those rich people just sending their own armies to do their confiscating and robbery.
     
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  3. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    Don't worry, you're getting more State. Each and every day more regulations are written and more regulators are hired. Each day we lose more civil liberties.

    OMG no it's not. Jesus... do you think anything through or simply post-hoc bias confirm everything you're normalized to? When the rich sent their own armies they had their own assets on the line - THEY stood to win or lose. Those were the days when the rich got rich by stealing. It's called Win-Lose. Those in their Armies stood to gain as well as the loot was doled out. Winning was paramount as there was ONLY: Win or Lose. As a matter of fact, that Win-Lose relationship is why you see the 'rich' and think of them as having 'stolen' from you. Even if it's just a neighbor with a nicer car. Its just assumed that if they have 'more' then someone else has 'less'. That's not true in a free society, with free-markets. In free societies, the only trades that are made are Win-Win. Or else the trade would not voluntarily be made.

    Of course, we no longer live in a free society. We live as Tax Chattel in a hyper-regulated society/Tax Farm. Thus, yes, many of the 'rich' today - are rich thanks to the simplton Tax Chattel of the 1800s thinking they were going to make the 'Rich pay their fair share'. All that has happened is the middle class pays to keep the rich rich and the poor poor (while joining the ranks of the poor). It's like pitting a scrawny little peon with a spoon (middle class dumb-arse) up against a gladiator with a double bladed battle ax (rich sociopath). You're never going to win. They will kill and eat their own mothers if it means more power. You simply do not have the stomach for the evil they're at easy with perpetrating against you. They're insane.

    The ONLY way to beat the rich is to not voluntarily trade with them unless they provide you with value without violating basic common law: do not steal, no fraud, cannot initiate force against innocent people with an agreed upon currency of trade. That's the only way. These people start wars for shits and giggles. Unless you're the type of person who murders people for fun - you're not going to beat them, because they will.

    Which is why the Rich love the State - because it's right back to Win-Lose. The Richest and most powerful and owners of Murder Inc couldn't give a rats arse if the wars are won or lost. Why would they care? So long as the State buys their Murdering Devices - all is good, FOR THEM. What do they care if countless Tax Chattel are sent to die? The wouldn't and they don't. The longer the Wars go - the better for the rich. It just makes them richer. And the Peon tax-chattel can wave their silly flags all god damn day long - so long as they pay the State a tax on each and every hour they work and the State pays the rich. It's a Win-Win FOR THEM.

    Oh, and yes, 1935 - 1985 was the great expansion of the Military Industrial Complex. During it's rise we firebombed much of Europe and nuked Japan and went on to invade Korea (and lose), invade Vietnam (and lose) where the few woman and children not raped and left to roast under clouds of napalm where coated with Agent Orange and left giving birth to half-American children missing arms, legs and heads, not to mention as well as giving birth to their own cancers.

    And then we went on to support dictators in the ME (Saddam, the Sultans) as well as Latin America - and finally invaded a few more countries in the ME (and lose) so the American Chattel Class could rape and murder women and children, steal their natural resources and satisfy their blood lust.

    Yes iceaura, those years set the foundation of the Warfare State. They also gave rise to the generational Welfare State where 5 generations of children suffocate in a could of poisonous government services before being shat out of a broken Government School system into the hyper-regulated markets that maintain the rich oligarchies. Here, if they're lucky, they may find work as a laborer - maybe greeting other Chattel into and out of pink-slime factories.... Yes, by 1985 American women were moving into the workforce in droves in an attempt to pay for the massive Warfare/Welfare State they had the misfortune of inheriting.


    And thus here we are today. So, don't worry, you're getting more State. Each and every day more regulations are written and more regulators are hired. Each day we lose more civil liberties.

    Enjoy the New Economy of bailing our the Rich - it isn't going anywhere, the Tax Chattel would never allow to. If there were no Farmers, who's hand would they lick? Who's pen would they live in? Who'd Regulate their lives for them? No, the New Economy is here and it's here to stay. Let's see what the Regulators and the Rich (who own them) drum up for their Tax Chattel. Maybe a War? Maybe a Depression? Maybe just a slow decade-long normalization to life under the Rule of their State.
    That last one is my guess.

    No 100 years ago could imagine single mothers would use IVF to create life - and then shovel said new born human into long-term 6am - 7pm Day Supervision Factories from age 6 weeks. Totally trusting strangers (many of whom are abusers) working on minimum wage to 'care for' their children. I guess they'd just never met the modern Chattel Class Amoorikkkan.

    New Economy for all....do enjoy.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2014
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  5. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Except your prognostications have been consistently wrong, which isn't surprising because your facts are wrong or cherry picked and misrepresented.
     
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  7. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah, I noticed. That's why I prefer government - it can set up markets, and we can have trade rather than piracy, and Win-Win becomes possible.

    Unless you tax their incomes heavily, as the US government did a fairly good job of from 1935 or so until Reagan. Take a look at the income and wealth distribution in the US over that time - Win-Win.

    And by "we" you mean of course capitalist industrial operations operating in other countries where the local governments could be dominated, outside the regulation of their own governments, like AT&T in Chile or Exxon and Halliburton in Iran and Iraq.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2014
  8. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    When Government is Limited - ours is anything but Limited.

    It's the largest Government in human history. Our Government imprisons more non-violent humans than any other nation, in history. Our Government wastes more limited resources than any other Government on the planet - in history. Our Government is the largest polluter - in history. Our Government repeatedly starts phony wars, wasted $100 trillion dollars on the cold war, invades and occupies countries all around the world. It hyper-regulates nearly all aspects of our lives. It now spies on 90% of it's Tax Chattel - the FBI alone has legal files on 1 in every 3 Americans, for 'our' safely of course (WSJ).

    Don't worry, we're getting more Government - a LOT more. And we'll become a lot poorer.
    You'll see.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2014
  9. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    Given the Government just conjured $2.5 TRILLION dollars to bailout the rich - you think it's going to turn around and tax them? Are you smoking Spice over there?!

    The State creates it's own currency. It doesn't 'need' to tax anyone. Tax is used by the State, and the minions who populate it, primarily to alter behavior. So - do tell me how the State 'taxing' the rich is going to alter their behavior in a manner that benefits the Peon Class? Yes, do tell. The bureaucrats in the State are totally incompetent and next to clueless - which is why they have jobs for the State. If they were creative they'd have created something. They aren't so they don't. Sure, they can give tax incentives to the Chattel Class to buy a home (as they do in the USSA) or they can give tax incentives to rent homes (as they do in AUS) and in so doing that can create a humongous Housing Boom and Bust leaving the average person unable to afford a home. So, yes, they can (and do) cause destruction. But they cannot, what violence simply will not give rise to - is virtue. They can not use tax to inspire that sliver of humanity that is creative to go out and create goods and services that people want. That comes from living in a FREE society and being allowed to offer value for value freely. The most they can muster is Murder Inc or Welfare ghettos.


    So, if you think the State is going to inspire - think, again. Life in our hyper-regulated society will see much less innovation and much more regulation. As an example, there's a profit-making corporation with a monopoly called the USDA, it's run by an overpaid bureaucrat who is continuously looking to expand into markets and make more in his bonus at the end of the year. AND he and has the full backing of the Police State to ensure he forces competition out of the market (see: private Organic Certification companies). Thereby destroying Win-Win created jobs, while simultaneously replacing them with this growing as the cancer called the State/Win-Lose. Thus, requiring more taxes - any shortfalls are made up by sweetheart deals with Big Agro (like the word "All Natural" which is now meaningless), forced licensing fees, contracts, land agreements, etc.... This all requires MORE Police State. More tax. More violence.

    The same is true of Government Schools that try to monopolize education - using the State to force Charter Schools out of business. The same is true of all aspects of our society. We live in an ocean of State violence.

    Who knows iceaura, maybe there'll come a day when the State will issue you a Burka and you can hide in it all nice and safe like. Finding comfort in the fact the State's Sociopaths are "taking care" of you - it just costs you a bit of freedom and dignity. But that's OK. You were never all that good at Win-Win trading to begin with.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2014
  10. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    You mean like your "Great Recovery" that we're all enjoying? Following the "Great Recession" that was a result of Alan Bubble's Greenspans' "Great Moderation"/ everyone run out and get a loan to become a slumlord quick quick before time runs out!
     
  11. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    When a reporter for the United States Army Training and Doctrine Command interviewed Frank Zappa for the commands news syndicate, the story was held by a superior who demanded that Zappa – who had been rather hard on the army – answer one more question: just who does he think will defend the country without the army?

    Zappa’s reply: “From what? The biggest threat to America today is it’s own federal government…. Will the Army protect anybody from the FBI? The IRS? The CIA? The Republican Party? The Democratic Party?....The biggest dangers we face today don’t even need to sneak past our billion dollar defense system….they issue the contracts for them.” The interview was not run.
     
  12. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    Which establishes your level of economic sophistication.
    The way it did, a mere generation or less in the past, in the US, for fifty years (and in some respects a century or more).

    We have had, in the US, a working multigenerational example of a State operating in ways you claim are impossible.
     
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  13. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    No, we've never had the Unlimited level of State we now endure nor it's hyper-regulations. The modern Amoorikkkan is not the person who lived through the central banker caused Great Depression and WWII. The world is also different. There's no bombed out Europe and Japan. There was no capitalistic China.

    A couple examples of Chattel Class Amoorikkka:
    - A man sells single cigarettes to adults for 0.50 cents in New York and is literally strangled to death by criminal thugs working in the militant arm of the State. Not a peep from the Chattel Class.
    - The Vietnam War is started over a lie, actual humans are forced through the draft to go fight and die for the State's Murder Inc. Does the Chattel Class demand the Military Inc be reduced - nope, it's expanded and new never ending wars are drummed up for them to go off and die in. Classic Chattel Class mentality. You can literally lead these dumb f*cking by the nose to the milking or slaughter houses and they happily step in either.
    - The AMA is given monopoly over Rx, which they use to rent-seek through regulatory capture and now medicine is totally f*cked with 480,000 (or more) of the Chattel Class killed off year after year after year by medical error. A peep from the Chattel Class? Nope. If anything, they want MOAR FREE Disease-care. And so, they're easily bought off by 'free' OblahmaCareless. Oh, and as a bonus, the AMA now says they massively underestimated the number of MD's that would be needed (as your Regulators - they Regulate the numbers) to take care of the Baby's Generation - so, your option? Go kill yourself and stop hogging resources. You know 'for the Good of Society'.
    - The State monopolized Goobermint Schooling Factories now graduate and award diplomas to graduating cohorts comprised of 20% functional illiterates. All the Chattel Class wants to know is if "their" kids free Government School ranks high on the 'National Standardized Tests' - you know, so their children can get the permission slips from the State Universities to function as a Labor Cog in one of it's hyper-regulated markets. Those permission slips are now running hundreds of thousands of dollars - which the State's hyper-regulated banks are happy to lend to you.

    In modern Amoorikkka Tesla is not allowed to sell a car directly to someone in Michigan and must instead use a middle man. Why? Because Amooorikkkans are f*cking retarded Tax Chattel. Led around by the nose like any other the dumb beast of burden. They have no qualms with the Nanny State dictating every aspect of their lives even when it's blatant outright gouging theft as in this instance. Oh, and they even sign up in droves to die in the State's phony wars. A more pathetic example of a 'society' would be hard to find across all of human history.


    Private/Voluntary -vs- Public/Force
    Here's an interesting anecdote. The SFO is the only major international airport in the USSA with a private profit making security. All the others use the TSA. Surprise surprise - on ALL metrics measures: price, quality, efficiency, customer satisfaction, job performance etc... the PRIVATE security blows the f*cking TSA out of the water. The TSA is complete shit, complete shit, in comparison. But, ask the modern Amoomoorikkkan about 'privatizing' security and handing 'international airport checks' to GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASP profit making 'corporations' and 99% moo moo moo they want their Government to provide this service NOT a for-profit corporation.

    This is how f*cking stupid Americans are. They cannot help themselves, they're simply THAT stupid. Give an Amoorikkkan a choice between free (private) and forced (public) interaction and they (like you) will choose violence each hour, of every day of the week. It's simply the way you're made. It's the monkey brain. Bash monkey steal banana.

    Chattel Class Amoorikkka happily bails out their Farmers and then turns around and whines they don't like the whip?! Tough titties. Back to your milking machine - your Farmer needs his milk and meat, he's invited plenty friends over to dinner to enjoy you. Hurry along now. Stand in line. Do as you're told. The last thing you'd want is to piss a Regulator off.



    For 50 f*cking cent cigarettes - they strangled that man to death. His life was worth 50 cents to the State. If that. Don't worry. We're losing many many MANY more civil liberties and we're getting a lot more Police State. Enjoy the New Economy - it isn't going anywhere. Not in your life time.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2014
  14. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    Which establishes your level of reading comprehension.

    Every single one of them was factually inaccurate. As always, with you.

    This is far more than stochastic error, the brain glitches we all suffer - you dwell in an organized, whole-world fantasy that actively imposes error and fiction on everything you see. An ordinary person knows, for example, that the private corporation based capitalistic health care plan the Republican Party promoted to block socialized medicine from gaining favor in the US - you call it "Obamacare", for some reason - doesn't give people health care for free. They have to buy it. That's the biggest problem with it right now - American medical care, with its extraordinarily inefficient private capitalist setup (bureaucratic overhead estimated at 40%, about ten times what single payer setups pay) is far too expensive for most Americans to buy for themselves.

    And anyone with an internet connection can briefly check and discover that private security services are employed by many airports, and more than one US international airport uses TSA contractors (rather than TSA itself) to do passenger screening, as SFO (a government owned airport) does. TSA is of course more or less worthless, overall, but so is almost everything else set up by the corporate capitalist rightwing W/Cheney administration.

    And so forth.
     
  15. wellwisher Banned Banned

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    5,160
    The original topic was about the history of the Democratic Party and Slavery. The Democratic party was the party of slavery before the Civil War. After slavery ended it was the party of segregation. Big government with high taxes, lots of regulations and huge debts all impact the middle class, and creates a larger dependency class. More have become dependent on the Government planation instead of living free from master.

    Diversity is a very clever way to convince people to segregate themselves, based on color, race and ethnicity. The preservation of third and fourth world cultures, within a first world culture, makes them permanent slaves at the mercy of the big government plantation. Assimilation into the first world was always the path of freedom. The clever diversity lure has not helped the blacks, to become free at last. Rather it has made more black migrate back to plantation of dependency, where master gives them food and shelter in exchange for work/voting.

    In this current Administration the bright spot in the economy has been the stock market which is not the playground of the poor and middle class, but of the master; money. While the power of government gets more slaves of dependency, with some thinking birth control pills are the most important thing in the world, with government the pusher man. You need to dumb people down so they choose to be slaves, since you can't force them.

    The strategy of pitting groups against each other , like in the civil, where brother divide based on an irrational differentiation is still the democratic party tactic. They start the war against women to create a civil war. What has changed other than moderation of tactics?
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2014
  16. PhysBang Valued Senior Member

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    2,422
    No. Look, while Republicans have been trying to erase history from textbooks, there are lots of sources you can go to. All the Democratic party members in favor of segregation left that party in order to join the Republican party, where they were welcomed and made the center of a strategy to gain votes through appealing to racism in white voters. This is not a controversial historical position.

    Not really. It depends on how the taxes, regulations, and debts are structured. This is basic economics that you seem to fail.
    Given the huge cutbacks in USA government spending on social programs for the last four decades, this seems unlikely.
    You are saying that a strategy to make as many things unsegregated as possible is a strategy to make things segregated. That makes no sense.

    What does make sense is that you fear sharing power and responsibility with people who look different from you.
     
  17. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    Are you attempting to make an argument that Government run single payer healthcare is more efficient than the Fascistic private-public disease-care we currently endure? Go ahead. Maybe you're correct. Maybe not. I'm sure taking all children away from all parents and shoveling them into single-parenting Government run Spartan-style barracks is an 'efficient' and 'affordable' means of 'parenting' children. Much cheaper than leaving it up to individual parents. But will it provide a 'quality' childhood? Is Single Payer more efficient? In theory.

    I have an idea, if you think Single Payer is efficient, go open an Insurance Company and get the 51% of Americans needed in a DEMOCRACY to join it. See how it works out for you. You needn't wait. Just open the business and start serving up all this 'money saving efficiency' that's going to provide this 'wonderful healthcare'.

    Do it.

    Oh, that's right - the Chattel Class want the healthcare, but they don't want to pay for it. The Chattel Class like the 'idea' of cheap and affordable high quality healthcare. What the Chattel Class do not like is trying to provide it to one another voluntarily. That's NEVER going change. Ever. Never. The days of sticking your bills with the next generation is coming to an end. There's no children left to sell debt on.


    The first step in providing high quality low cost healthcare is removing the AMA's monopoly. This can only happen after the Government has run out of the money needed to maintain its own Mafia-like control over the State it runs. When will that happen? Only after the US Federal Reserve is ended and income tax repealed. That isn't something that's going to happen any time too soon. So, no cheap healthcare for Chattel Class Amooorikkka.

    Stawman much? I stated 'MAJOR international airport'. Not 'all piss-ant' airports across the U.S.S.A. The SFO is the only major international airport to use private security and on ALL metrics measured they do a much better job than the functional illiterate Government Schooled thugs that comprise the TSA.
     
  18. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Michael,

    After the evil Federal Reserve is abolished and income tax is repealed in the Fabulous Peoples Republic, with President Michael as its revered leader, who will pay for the traffic lights, the upkeep on public parks, the street sweepers, and so on?

    Just wonderin'
     
  19. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    Believe it or not James, but the USA had electric street lights BEFORE we had a Central Bank, Fiat Currency or "Progressive" Income Tax. I know, hard to believe. We even had running water, roads, schools, medicine, movies, trains, international shipping, trolleys, electric motors, light bulbs, X rays, the radio and *GAAASP* all prior to a Central Banking cartel. All without the rich having the ability to bail themselves out using fiat (by decree of the State) 'currency' backed by a Progressive 'income' tax on the backs of the laborer and the laborer's children. Yes, somehow a LIMITED State and free (win-win) voluntary trade all alone was able to usher in the post-modern era. All that was required was a SMALL State and laws that protected private property (beginning with one's body) and sound money. All this, without micro-regulations determining who can and who can not cut hair and sell arranged flowers. All without needing a State permission slip to conduct trade. I know, shocking isn't it? Most people couldn't imagine there was a day when a veterinarian could perform surgery on a dog without requiring permission from the State via it's rent-seeking licencing schemes. And without regulatory capture, competition and a free market alone were able to kept quality up and price down (for a modern example see: Zune vs iPod). Somehow people used to feed themselves and wipe their own arses without their Nanny State. They even learned to read BEFORE they were allowed into the first Public Schools - now 20% of Government School graduates are functionally illiterate!

    Who said we need a President? We don't. The President is vestigial organ in the form of a pseudo-alpha male. As a matter of fact, the State IS a return to the tribe. A return to the jungle. A return to might makes right. It's why the monkey electorate LOVE the State that way they can indulge their monkey-like morality while they wave their flags for Dear Leader.

    We're getting more State - and you're not going to like it.
    You'll see.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2014
  20. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Ok. Thanks for the clarification, Michael.
     
  21. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    And in your opinion, should those things be reserved to the rich? Or are you prepared to pay a barista a hundred thousand a year?

    Furthermore, saying the modern state is a return to the jungle and tribe is a bit like saying a human being is a return to the animal kingdom.

    Additionally, we might also wonder at the "return to might makes right". When did the species ever leave that behind?

    What makes your tinfoil so mundane is that it's all complaint and no solution.

    And I asked you a similar question to what James asked, a couple years ago. And you didn't answer then.

    In truth, I think you don't have a clue, and this is all about complaining in order to make yourself feel better.

    I'll tell you what:

    Devise some sort of hypothesis to explain this outcome, and please be sure to account for what happens when a society deliberately shortchanges the obligations it undertakes. To wit, in the 1990s, it was popular to demand "accountability for teachers", a catch-phrase that translated to, "Show us that you can do the job without adequate funding, and we'll consider writing the checks."

    Twenty years later, we have teachers teaching for the test, not for literacy.

    And I think it was in Kentucky that they once felt the need to pass a law requiring citizens to bathe at least once a year; you sure they all knew how to wipe their asses?

    The thing is that for all your libertarian zeal, your policy outlook is plutocratic. It's almost like you're asking for a society you can complain about even more.
     
  22. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    Right, that's why Henry Ford was able to sell cars to the common person. Yes, the automobile also predates the Central Bank and Labor Tax amendment to the US Constitution.

    Not the modern State - ANY state. Any group of people, elected or unelected, who has the legal ability to initiate force against innocent humans is a return to the jungle. It's an oxymoron to suggest the State is anything other than inherently immoral. The State is a reliance on might makes right. This is why it was LIMITED. The first 10 amendments protect us from it.

    If barristers are selling their services at 100 grand a pop, then this means there's a shortage and the market needs more barristers. In a FREE market that price is coming down, and coming down fast because people will want to be barrister.

    In a regulated market OTOH a private cartel develop and if the State is there, it will use that State to create licencing schemes to rent-seek the market through regulatory capture and thus keep their prices high. This IS what IS happening.

    Imagine how much it would cost to do business on the internet if there were a State determined limit to webpages and you needed a licence to make one and had to pay a yearly fee to the State along with tons of tax and paperwork to keep it open. You needed to demonstrate there was a 'need' for your webpage - BEFORE you even started. Oh, and you needed to get lucky enough to enter a webpage school that set the limit on licences at 150 per University cohort per year. And a private group of webpage owners set the number of new comers and regulated competition.

    Welcome to medicine.

    You're the one wearing a tinfoil hat. You simply think everything you've been normalized to IS actually normal. It's not. It's anything but normal.

    If you think truly rich evil people exist in this world - then the very very LAST thing you would support is a State. Because they will use it against you. And they are. They just bailed themselves out by the State and are working hard at destroying what's left of our civil liberty and privacy.

    I already stated my solution - if you want to call it that. Educate your children yourself, never hit them - ever. Do not yell at them. Speak to them rationally and when important using data derived from empirical analysis. Teach them logic (if you can). Sell your TV if you bother with one. Try to have as little to do with the State as is possible. Work within your community providing value for value. That's it.

    There's no superman flying from Planet Krypton that's going to save you. You're not going to vote functionally illiterates into a literary masters. This isn't happening. You're not getting the free high quality medical care you want. This stuff isn't just waiting there, just waiting for you to get the right politician in and *poof* suddenly the milk and honey you just know is there waiting for you starts flowing in. It's not there. There's no milk. No honey. Most teachers should be fired - they're NOT teachers.
    America spends more per student than most first world nations. A pencil and paper are all that is required to teach reading and arithmetic. All information needed for a decent education is freely available on the internet.

    What's the solution? Competition. Chartered Schools are a start. Children who excel in an Unschooling or Montessori environment should do that. Those that do better in a homeschooling environment can do that. Those who do well in a structured environment can do that. Unregulated markets are also required so that children are taught skills that they can actually use to provide value to those around them.

    It's not that hard - end Government Schooling monopoly by allowing parents to voluntarily have nothing to do with poorly run schools. As for the tests - end them. Children under the age of 14 should never take a summative assessment and, IMO, only take formative assessment that is ungraded. This will happen as individually tailored AI driven education replaces teachers in the coming decade.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2014
  23. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    And?

    So, how will it work?

    You know what predates all this stuff? Even predates the United States of America? Corruption in business. Greed of such magnitude as to destabilize society. Thieves as landlords.

    Okay, when did we leave the so-called jungle? Was that around the time of serfdom, or later, say, during the American slave period before 1865?

    Then human society itself is immoral. That is to say, there will always be the state.

    That's usually how humans organize and stabilize their societies; eventually an authority structure emerges.

    Your economics are purely delusional. That is to say, the altruism required for a free market to behave as you propose is not evident in human history.

    And lots of barristers, or at least their American version, get a hundred thousand a year. The baristas, who pour us coffee, though? Hell, in most places in this country, they're expected to work full time and then get a second job in order to afford housing.

    Do you pretend those cartels would not exist without the state? Do you really think that a stateless free market would have produced, say, an iPhone? How about that Model A automobile?

    Your argument is entirely based in negative assertions and general evasion.

    The question is what happens to society the day after you slay the Federal Reserve.

    I would say it's funny how these tricorner tinfoil Fedslayers seem incapable of answering the question, except in truth it's rather quite ... wearying? ... silly? ... pathetic? Really, it sounds like they haven't thought the question through, as if their anti-Fed obsession is nothing more than, well, a personal, egocentric identity politic.

    Right. Because Americans vote to fund their schools properly, those schools aren't sending notes home with the kids on a regular basis asking for help with luxuries like pencils, paper, and sanitation. Hell, I live in a reasonably affluent area, and the teachers still have to beg just to keep their classrooms afloat.

    In this case, part of the dynamic you're overlooking—whether for will or faculty is an open question—is the coincidence between the people who loathe the idea of public schools in general and those who want them underfunded. This is actually part of the problem with compromise: We set ourselves a goal, e.g., public education; we compromise with the opponents, thus reducing the quality of those goals and our capability of achieving them; those who loathe public schools and want them underfunded complain about the results, and we start the whole cycle over.

    Consider that we in Washington state have such a goal. And a couple years ago it emerged that the elected legislators were shortchanging the schools by a massive amount, and rather quite deliberately; chaos ensued in the legislature. As the noise died down the argument became about sums and priorities, and all of it was just a stalling tactic by Republicans—you know, the party that pitches to voters who loathe the public schools—in hopes of winning the election. They lost the election, but had a trump card in two Democrats who rolled parties specifically for the purposes of screwing up this issue. And where is it now? Well, we're back to arguing about whether or not the schools need the money.

    This has resulted in an interesting separation of powers issue; a court has held the legislature in contempt. Stay tuned; if it wasn't for the fact of selling our children's futures, this would be a captivating farce. As it is, it's kind of like rubbernecking the corpse on the side of the road.

    Look, a lot of the problems in our society are the result of policies you and others like you advocate. And when there is such significant overlap between your complaint and your support for the conditions that give rise to that complaint, it's not so much that it's hard to take you seriously, but, rather, something of a challenge not worth the effort to not see you as playing out a sad joke.

    And if you create a generational problem, you can forestall the solution for generations.

    Charter schools? Around here, charter schools lower standards of education.

    Uh huh.

    Something about the human touch°.

    Meanwhile, we look forward to your long-awaited explanation of what happens the day after you slay the Fed.
    ____________________

    Notes:

    ° Can you believe that's supposed to be 2016?
     

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