Four magnets (of spherical shape)

Discussion in 'Physics & Math' started by jayC, Nov 27, 2011.

  1. jayC Registered Member

    Messages:
    4
    Three magnets (of spherical shape) are placed so as to minimize the energy configuration; that is, they form a triangle; 1) Is the resulting magnetic field entirely in the plane occupied by these magnets?

    2) If a 4th magnet is placed on top of the three others, will it be displaced? held in place? or readily removed?

    3) Why?
     
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  3. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

    Messages:
    39,421
    No.

    You'd need to know the details of the alignments of the magnetic fields of the spherical magnets.
     
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  5. jayC Registered Member

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    4
    alignment of fields

    The fields lie primarily in the same plain as the spheres. They form a triangle in the plain. I need to know what the components of this field look like above and below this plain.
     
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  7. RoccoR Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    144
    jayC, et al,

    (LAYMAN's INQUIRY)

    Has this experiment ever been done?

    Would the Magnetic Field Lines of the Earth upset the balance; should such a balance point exist?

    Is it possible to have 4 identical magnets with the exact same field strength to perform the experiment?

    (QUESTION)

    What is the correct answer?

    Most Respectfully,
    R
     
  8. el es Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    322
  9. RoccoR Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    144
    el es, et al,

    These, and the others, are amazing. They are quite beautiful and wondrous.

    (COMMENT)

    Besides being a form of art, do we see these magnetic field line patterns elsewhere in the universe? If these shapes are spinning, do they generate any unusual energies in the spectrum?

    Was anyone taken these marvelous shapes and applied electric currents to them?

    Most Respectfully,
    R
     
  10. Vern Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    695
    I have a set of magnetic spheres and I just did your experiment. Three magnets go together very well to form a stable triangle. However, no matter how I introduce the forth magnet, the three snap out of the triangle and form a line with the forth.
     
  11. Farsight

    Messages:
    3,492
    Hi Vern. I've got a set of cubic magnets that I can arrange in a Halbach array. It isn't easy. They have to be held tightly in a long open-topped aluminium box, and you really have to work hard to get them in.

    While we're talking about magnets, I thought it was worth mentioning the floating magnets section of Models of the Atom by Michael Fowler:

    "In 1878, Alfred Mayer, at the University of Maryland, dreamed up a neat demonstration of how he imagined atoms might be arranged in molecules. He took a few equally magnetized needles and stuck them through corks so that they would float with their north poles all at the same height above the water, all repelling each other equally. He then held the south pole of a more powerful magnet some distance above the water, to attract the needles towards this central point. The idea was to see what equilibrium patterns the needles would form for different numbers of needles. He found something remarkable - the needles liked to arrange themselves in shells. Three to five magnets just formed a triangle, square and pentagon in succession. but for six magnets, one went to the center and the others formed a pentagon. For more magnets, an outer shell began to form".
     
  12. Vern Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    695
    Hi Farsight; the OP asks the question, why? I suspect the North and South poles of the spheres seek their natural relationship and that pops them into a string.
     
  13. Farsight

    Messages:
    3,492
    I guess so Vern. The best i could do was dig out some "stix & balls" magnets and arranged them into a triangle. It was fairly stable. However when arranged them into a square the stability was knife-edge. One touch and clack I had two pairs of magnets lined up NSNS. It made me think of bond angles. I seem to recall doing something similar with elastic threaded through hollow rods.
     

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