Friendship: yes or no?

Discussion in 'Human Science' started by Treval, Dec 11, 2009.

  1. Treval Banned Banned

    Messages:
    51
    Hello

    Me and my 'friend' have been 'friends' for 5 years but I know there is something about him I hate, which is a deal breaker for me.
    It has come to discussion before, but now he provoked me again:

    He came telling me that he is very happy that Belgium stopped providing support for foreign homeseekers. He keeps complaining that foreigners keep coming into Belgium and 'steal' their jobs and their 'rights'.
    Q. "They have more rights than us Belgians ffs!! To hell with them, get them out! OWN NATION FIRST!!"

    Listen to his dirty facist words..
    He even votes for the most facist, most inhuman party who is in favor of Hitler and applies his rules..

    I tell him: "Come on man, if you were homeless and you were kicked out of your country for whatever political reasons and you would come seek a home in my country, would you like that?!" whereas he replies:
    "They don't have to fuck up their own countries in the first place and then come beg here. FUCK them. OWN NATION FIRST! OWN NATION FIRST!".

    Then he claims "people have their own views on things".
    Well as it happens to be, I don't want to be friends with such a fucking facist.
    He lives in a fucking mansion and his family has 4 fancy cars and he thinks he lives 'basic', while I have much less than him.

    A normal person doesn't have a mansion and 4 cars. FFs.
    Nor does he/she live in the beautiful countryside.
    My friend who is a programmer can BARELY afford an apartment on his own.

    What a jerk off..
    The question is.. should I be friends with this guy and accept his view or just kick him out of my life?


    Sincerely,
    Treval
    (oh yes, I'm a foreigner (Latin))
     
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  3. Enmos Valued Senior Member

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    Obviously (from your story here), you don't want to be his friend anymore.
    Do what you feel you should do.
    Have you told him how you feel about his views and how it may affect your friendship? Not that I'm suggesting you should 'blackmail' him, but he might tone it down a bit in your presence if that's enough for you.
     
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  5. Treval Banned Banned

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    I don't really know.
    This kind of people is unconvincable.
    What does it matter if he tones down,
    while I know I am being friends with such a person..
    A facist..a Hitler.. a nationalist..
     
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  7. Enmos Valued Senior Member

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    Well, seeing that you can't live with it even if he doesn't confront you with his views and that he's not going to be convinced otherwise, I'd say break off the friendship.
     
  8. draqon Banned Banned

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    35,006
    give him a chance a month or so maybe more and give him a deadline, persuade him to change his views...find a movie which would show the struggle of these people, go to a museum perhaps. If he stand on his viewpoint and you def. disagree with it to the point that it bothers you more than just a nuisance, than leave him.
     
  9. mike47 Banned Banned

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    2,117
    Although Immigration should take in consideration those with serious problems home arising from their political, religious or humanitarian reasons, I believe that every nation should control their borders according to their resources and how much they can help . There are some genuine refugees and there are lots of fraudsters who claim anything just to get allowed into the country . Immigration policies became a real joke as many who deserve to be in are kept out and verse versa .
     
  10. visceral_instinct Monkey see, monkey denigrate Valued Senior Member

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    Just kick him out of your life.
     
  11. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    11,529
    Be friends with him. I'd love to have a friend like that.
     
  12. visceral_instinct Monkey see, monkey denigrate Valued Senior Member

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  13. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    Disciplined and honest; why wouldn't you want a friend like that?

    And he shares my political views.
     
  14. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    24,690
    Friends don't have to agree about everything. That would be impossible anyway. The best they can do is treat each other with respect. Do you have respectful discussions about this issue, or does it degenerate into yelling and snide remarks right away?

    One thing you might do in order to get the discourse back into a civil mode is to try to find out why he feels the way he does.
    • Is he just repeating what his parents have told him? That would make him rather immature (kind of like the way religion is passed down through the generations), but you can help by asking "why?" every time he says something without backing it up.
    • Is he afraid of something? In what way does he think these immigrants are going to affect him personally? It sounds like he doesn't have a job to worry about.
    • Is he simply a racist? Is he really a neo-Nazi who hates everyone who is not "Aryan"?
    Then you also need to examine your own views. Surely you understand that people who worry about immigration are not all assholes. There are some real issues that generate fear. In Europe I think most of the immigrants that people worry about are Muslims, and if you keep up with the news you can understand why they worry. It only takes a small portion of an ethnic group acting badly to give them all a bad name, and that's what's happening to the Muslims these days.

    I'm an old hippie and about as tolerant as they come, yet even I am concerned about the massive immigration of Muslims into America. All previous waves of migration consisted of people who basically wanted to become Americans and get a piece of what we had. But many of the Muslims are qualitatively different from the Irish, Germans, Chinese, Italians and Mexicans who were originally hated but now have been assimilated so easily. They want to change America to be more like the place they left behind. Naturally that doesn't sit well with us. If you want to come here, then become an American like everybody else. Otherwise go home. I'm sure people in Belgium and the rest of Europe feel the same way. If you liked the way it was at home, then why the hell didn't you stay there and try to make it a better home?

    You should try to stop the hostility and get an honest discussion going. You might both learn something. One of the basic premises of civilization is: Reasonable people can disagree. I think this argument has gotten both of you to move further into the extreme end of your position, rather than coming closer to the middle to see what you might have been doing wrong and what you might have in common.

    There are lots of good reasons to end a friendship, but it's a real shame if it's only due to politics. In five years the world will change and you might both feel different.

    Try to argue like scholars. Subject every sentence to review and criticism, and respond to the criticisms. That's what friends are for.

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    If you've been here very long you probably already know that I'm one of the most uncompromising atheists you'll ever meet. Yet one of my dearest friends is a fundamentalist Christian: one of those guys who insists that the Bible is the literal word of God and wouldn't recognize a metaphor if he tripped over it. We argue all the time but we do it respectfully and then we go have a beer.
     
  15. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    Fraggle Rocker makes a decent point, though I add this: there is no obligation to be tolerant. He is quite right in saying "OWN COUNTRY FIRST"; what else could be expected?

    He is a patriot and disciplined, if nothing else. It is only natural for him to feel this way, seeing his country being brought down by immigrants and alien ideas.
     
  16. christa Frankly, I don't give a dam! Valued Senior Member

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    to the OP, it sounds like the ppl here.. lol!! But for the mexicans... with us living on the border, and with people illegally comin in here, they do take alot of our jobs.. because the ppl here want more then 10$ an hr to work in the hands field(oil, construction, things like that)..but apparently I heard on the news last night that illegals can get a drivers license in our state with no problem..

    here is the story thingy..... oh and sorry its alittle off the topic, but I see it as the same thing, but in a different part of the world

    http://www.kob.com/article/stories/S1305263.shtml?cat=504
     
  17. mike47 Banned Banned

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    Own country first so get the hell out of Iraq and Afghanistan now and stop supporting the tyrant occupation .
     
  18. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    I don't support it anyway.
     
  19. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    The question boils down to that: Is the country really being brought down? It's a difficult discussion to have, because people have screamed that foreigners and aliens were bringing down their country for hundreds of years. Just look at what the Jews had to endure and on the balance they were surely a positive force in most of the places where they were reviled.

    Americans absolutely screamed about the wave of Irish immigration after the Potato Famine. They may have been anglophones but they were members of a church that was regarded as vaguely un-American, and the Brits' ugly stereotype of the Irish as thieves and slackers preceded them. Today they are so well assimilated that it's hard to figure out what the fuss was about, and we celebrate St. Patrick's Day like it was our holiday!

    The Italians who started coming over at the end of the 19th century were "Greasers," lazy people who drank too much, talked too fast, and were too prone to violence. They were all regarded as members of the Mafia, hopelessly committed criminals. Today in the Northeast Italian surnames are almost as common as English, and people can't even trace their family trees to figure out where they came from. Pizza has become America's national food.

    And do I even need to mention the Chinese? We actually passed special laws to keep them out! Today we regard them as smarter, better educated, more industrious, and more committed to traditional values than our own people. And oh yeah, our other national food is chop suey.

    And the poor Mexicans: they were here first, yet they assimilate faster than any other ethnic minority, to the point that most of their American-born children can't speak a word of Spanish. They've always done some of our dirtiest work, and they gave us salsa, which now outsells catsup. They were discriminated against monstrously as recently as the early years of my life. But the last time I was in L.A. I heard a Redneck say, "Lookin' 'round at all these here furrin faces, Ah thank it's time to call the Messicans 'honorary white people'."

    So when somebody starts talking about how the latest wave of immigration is going to destroy our country, it's really hard to take him seriously.

    Even if it's me.

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  20. nietzschefan Thread Killer Valued Senior Member

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    Can I have your friends number I like him.
     
  21. codanblad a love of bridges Registered Senior Member

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    your political views are so filled with flaws i didn't think there'd be room for xenophobia. voicing a controversial opinion doesn't make you disciplined.
     
  22. visceral_instinct Monkey see, monkey denigrate Valued Senior Member

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    Why own country first? Why not "merit first"?

    I'm in Ireland. I know of Irish people who are lazy fucks and Poles who are ferociously hardworking.
     
  23. mike47 Banned Banned

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    Do you think it is a good idea to have a world with no borders or a world where every country has its sovereignty and its preferences with their prejudices too ?.
     

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