Should the U.S. troops leave afghanistan ?.

There is no discussion.

He's just ranting and raving and saying ridiculous statements (many of them demonstrably inaccurate) that he can never hope to back up. It borders on trolling, but of course, you would defend him.

 

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Why do some people prefer wars and destruction instead of peace and justice ?.
As humans , we ought to support what is right even when our governments are wrong .
If we just follow our wrong Administrations then we become a bunch of robots and good for nothing . We as humans should not tolerate ourselves, our government and others to take the rights and freedoms of any person . We ought to stand for something : fairness and justice .
A human being is a human being regardless to religion, culture, way of life, nationality, status, colour......etc........

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Some substance to try to refocus the thread.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/8215612.stm

 

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Because we are humans, and there will alway be a Alpha.

 

NO

finish what you started

ever seen the move " Wilsons War "

at the end of the movie is very telling how simple , stupid and the lack of for-sight Americans have

not him , but those he tried to convince to rebuild Afghanistan in the end

Americans didn't

now where are they ....? back in Afghanistan

reminds me of Vietnam

 

Vietnam ?.
After losses in money and lives the US left this country and it is a very sad saga in the US history . Some politicians rush to wars as if human lives are mosquitoes lives . Supporting such politicians is a state of insanity .
The sooner the US and their puppets followers NATO get out of both Afghanistan and iraq the better it is for the people of the US, Afghanistan and Iraq . Wasting money and wasting human lives has never been a good politics .

 

What I post, (for those that bother to read said) is solid information, based on factual analysis, and in support, of points that I am making.

It is undeniable, given the constant application of double standards, that mainstream, corporate media is biased towards national interests and thus reporting and editorial opinion is clearly skewed. In today`s information age, it is simple to achieve a broader view. This does not necessarily equate to "fringe".

Fair enough.

Yes.

(And general global hegemony) OK, they care. Why? And if they do care, why do they care selectively?

I think that is naive. There is a huge Geo-strategic game being played to maintain global hegemony and acquire directly or via influence/territorial domination/proxies, strategic resources, and access routes, gas and oil being the foremost. Hugely expensive US military forays into Afghanistan, Iraq and Pakistan are clear examples of this. Terrorism, democracy, human rights are the justifications used to give the whole game an acceptable aura.

Do you really believe fighting "terrorism" and promoting "democracy" explain the astronomical financial and human outlay?

Benefit? How?

Of course it does.

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Its a simple to follow list of US military activity, and exposes in a nutshell, a long and unbroken record of US military and CIA foreign meddling.

The list is a telling confirmation of activity. To post said contexts here would overload the server. Feel free to further research any item on that list.

OK. The Nation of Afghanistan and its government of the day, did not declare war on the US or anyone else.

No. The tragedy of 9/11 is irrevocable. The US had every right to be provoked by 9/11. The US also had OTHER avenues available to seek justice for this. Invading a sovereign nation should have been the LAST resort. Instead, it was the FIRST.

NO. That is crap. The US is militarily and politically, inserting itself by CHOICE, into a foreign nation. This war today, is a war by the Taliban, or Afghan resistance fighters, against an invading force.

No, its ALL because foreign troops are in Afghanistan. As they have been for centuries.

Allegedly. As stated before, these connections are far from clear. And still no justification for a full scale invasion and destruction of a sovereign nation.

Yes, agreed, if it could be proven beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law. Show me the evidence that the Taliban knowingly allowed or assisted Al Qaeda/Bin LAden to perpetrate the crime of 9/11?

 

Are you surprised?

 

You invoke the word "sovereign" frequently, but I wonder if you've given much thought to its meaning.

For starters, there is no such thing as a "sovereign nation." It's states that possess sovereignty, not nations.

Next, would it have been okay to invade a non-sovereign state? If not, why the qualifier?

Sovereignty means simply the ability to exercise control over the activities in a territory, specifically through legislative means. It does not, as such, imply anything about legitimacy. Do you consider the Taliban to have been legitimate rulers of Afghanistan? If not, what was the value of their sovereignty, and why should others have respected it?

Was not Al Qaeda's exploitation of the Taliban itself a violation of Afghan sovereignty? To the extent that the Taliban possessed sovereignty in Afghanistan and were not at war with/attacking the US, Afghan territory should not have been involved in attacks on the US. The fact that it was, then, indicates that either the Taliban were not sovereign (in the crucial sense of controlling whether groups in your territory provoke wars with other states), or did decide to wage war on the US. Take your pick.

 

What exploitation?

 

The State of Florida had more involvement with 9/11 than the State of Afghanistan. If involvement is your criterion.

 

Words like sovereignty, colony, freedom, liberty are well known words to all people .
The US and their puppets and followers NATO invaded a sovereign nation and made it a colony for goals NOT shared with their own people . This occupation is for military bases, resources and fighting Islam . This occupation has nothing to do with the good of the poor Afghans . The propaganda machine keeps on bringing scores of pretexts BUT only brainwashed folks believe them .

 

What's good for the Afhgans? The US leaving and the fucking Taliban taking over? They will end elections and institute an oppressive version of Islamic law that suppresses education and freedoms of all kinds.

 

I have no issue with the implication that Florida has a serious sovereignty problem.

 

And it's easier, cheaper, more likely beneficial to invade; if US security were the goal.

 

No arguments here, other than to note that the two options aren't exclusive.

 

yes leave

 

And then what? Who will stop the Taliban?

 

The Afghan people. Why is it the responsibility of the United States to intervene on this situation and not in others? Like for example the U.S didn't have a problem with Indonesia's genocide of the people of East Timor, in fact they even help fund it? Let us not pretend that the U.S isn't being purely self-serving by entering into Afghanistan, the administration could care less about the Afghani people.

 

Hopefully that`s cleared up.

Of course its not OK. Semantics. I think the implication is clear.

Fine.

Of course. Perhaps not a model of Western style democracy, but they enjoyed the support of the people and administered reasonably effectively. Most importantly, the internal politics and process of Afghanistan, were, and are, no business of foreign nations. Others should have respected it in exactly the same way as the US, UK, Russia, Tonga, China, Myanmar, North Korea or any other state should be respected. What in the world is the difference?

A long shot, but not practicable. There is no evidence showing the Taliban was involved in 9/11. You are making a number of assumptions based on Media disinformation. Firstly, war against other states? The actions of Al Qaeda were arguably a criminal act, not necessarily and act of war, as hyped by Bush and Media co - "War on Terror". 2. You are assuming the fact that the Taliban and Al Qaeda are linked in complicity. No such evidence exists.
How exactly did Al Qaeda "exploit" the Taliban? How can a government possibly be held accountable for criminal activity perhaps originating from their soil that they were unaware of?
Crucially, the best available evidence links the perpetrators of 9/11 to Saudi Arabia, and not Afghanistan.